"LJ909" (lj909)
10/02/2017 at 12:40 • Filed to: None
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"LJ909" (lj909)
10/02/2017 at 12:40 • Filed to: None | 1
| 49 |
Only its not. Luther Kia in Bloomington Minnesota has a brand new 18' Stinger listed on Cargurus. Its one of only 2 listed for sale in the whole country. (The other one is in Miami, though Cargurus or the dealer itself neglected to put any contact information for the dealer.).
Cargurus also seems to be the only auto buying site where you can actually search for the model. Autotrader and Cars.com dont even have the model listed yet.
So I decided to contact them about price. Unlike other Kia dealers, this one seems to have ok reviews (3 1/2 stars!). Within 10 minutes, one of the sales guys there got back to me with an email that said the following:
Hi Lawrence,
We do not have pricing information on these cars yet. November/December we should have a better idea. We should have one to drive in December as well. I can let you know when that time comes if you want. Otherwise we have a Korean model on display in our showroom.
So they dont have pricing on the car, even though pricing was made public about a week or 2 ago now, and the one they do have, the one LISTED FOR SALE, isnt for sale, but a display model. Then he says its a “Korean display model”. Stop the bullshit and just say the one you saw isn’t for sale its a display model. I highly doubt Kia sent them a Korean market Stinger. (I could be wrong though since they seem to be one of 3 dealers I have seen that have one. But still)Why list it then if its for display?
Do you guys think Kia dealers are going to treat this car the way FCA dealers did with Hellcats? Having display cars that you have to go through hell to actually try and get a look at only to be told that the car isnt for sale? Then it pops up later in the year for sale?
Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:42 |
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For some reason I read that as “A Kia dealer has a stale mimosa for sale”
citizennick
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:44 |
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oh wow, it comes in a color other than red?
random001
> Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer
10/02/2017 at 12:45 |
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I, for one, would like to know what a stale mimosa is like.
Arrivederci
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:46 |
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That actually doesn’t look like a USDM model. Korea drives on the right side of the road like us, so the steering wheel isn’t the tell, it’s the front markers. USDM Stingers have the ugly amber front indicators in the headlight cluster. The one you pictured doesn’t. Not a USDM car, by my eye :).
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LJ909
> Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer
10/02/2017 at 12:49 |
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Someone hasnt had their coffee yet.
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LJ909
> random001
10/02/2017 at 12:50 |
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I would assume like a flat soda.
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LJ909
> citizennick
10/02/2017 at 12:50 |
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I actually dont really like this color.
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Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer
> random001
10/02/2017 at 12:52 |
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I would like to know how a mimosa could become stale.
OPPOsaurus WRX
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:53 |
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I’m with Arrivederci. If you look at the Speedo, it shows some wierd method of measuring speed. WTF is a KM/H.
also it looks to have clear corner lights, which is shown on the Kia site but with foreign plates
awmaster10
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:55 |
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Oh my god its glorious in that color. GIVE ME.
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Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:57 |
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Someone has a throbbing sinus infection toothache going on.
Concentration=nope
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random001
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 12:57 |
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Good point.
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random001
> Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer
10/02/2017 at 12:57 |
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For Science!
DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:01 |
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I’m not sure if I understand the Stinger anymore. It seems to be priced into 3 series/A4/C Class territory, but with none of the “prestige” . What about this is gonna pull a BMW buyer into a KIA showroom?
Don’t get me wrong, I very much like the car. But even if I was shopping in this price range I feel like it would be a hard sell. I’m trying to figure out what the WOW factor with this car is.
Chariotoflove
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:02 |
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Sales guy is probably just telling you what he was told. The display and the listing on Cargurus is just more marketing to get people salivating. Although, I think car sites should confirm that the cars they are given to list are actually for sale. Makes them look bad if they’re not.
MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:11 |
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Actually Kia sent a pile of display cars that are Korean-spec or pre-production-spec to dealers around the country. Like 200 or so.
None of them are for sale. You can go look at them, some dealers are letting you sit in them but I hear they aren’t supposed to.
I’m not a member, but these guys over on the Stinger Forum are keeping a running list of where they are and if you can get in or not:
https://stingerforum.org/threads/stinger-spotted-the-official-list.694/
And Jalopnik leaked (then confirmed with a Kia employee) the pricing last week if you want to know what they run:
https://jalopnik.com/the-hatch-excellent-2018-kia-stinger-will-start-at-32-1818811469
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LJ909
> Arrivederci
10/02/2017 at 13:16 |
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You could be right. Thats why I made the point about this dealer being one of a literal handful with a Stinger. It begs the question still though of why even list it?
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Arrivederci
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:17 |
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Kia really hasn’t ever had a car that elicits any sort of excitement - they probably want people to come into the showroom and look at it and then leave in an Optima or maybe make a deposit/order a Stinger.
gettingoldercarguy
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:19 |
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Gauging markup are they?
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MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
> DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
10/02/2017 at 13:23 |
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It’s a hard sell with the pricing for sure. The point is that you get S5 performance for A5 pricing, actually you can get the V6TT GT model for LESS than the starting price of the A5 Sportback. Mercedes C300 is a joke in comparison performance wise. The Stinger GT even beats the BMW 440i Gran Coupe to 60 mph. It matches better with the BMW 430/40 GC than the 3 series and the 4 series has a starting price up over 48k.
I mean, it’ll cook an A7 and a base Panamera to 60.
For less than 40 grand.
It’s still a performance bargain....just maybe not as cheap as we may have wanted.
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citizennick
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:27 |
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Same, some colors should have stayed back in 1997.
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LJ909
> DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
10/02/2017 at 13:30 |
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They are pushing the performance for the money I think before anything. I like what they are doing, but I just honestly dont think the people they want to notice, will notice.
Wobbles the Mind
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:31 |
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The pricing was not finalized for US models, those reports were more an official “price area” to see response and give people a better idea of what to expect. All of the cars arriving in dealerships are, in fact, Korean-spec display only cars. US-spec cars (the ones you can sell and drive) wont be arriving until late this month. All of the Korean-spec cars also have the Stinger “E” badges on the steering wheels and “Stinger” written across the center of the hatch alongside the clear front markers.
If you don’t list them on car sales sites then no one will know you have a Stinger at your dealership that people can look at. Dealers for any car will list display models without a price online that way people know that they can contact that dealership. This is the same thing Kia did for the Niro and we have all seen how successful that launch method has been.
All this also helps them gauge reactions to badging/branding and pricing while having people talk about the cars on their Instagrams and Facebooks. That’s how you get the existence of the car out to the 95% of the population that doesn’t even know that a car exists until they see it on the road.
On a side note, if Kia does go through with the exact same pricing as was given earlier for the US then you can expect an available 10% off MSRP incentive to accompany the cars. There are a lot of very clever and effective sales tactics being utilized with this car.
Textured Soy Protein
> Arrivederci
10/02/2017 at 13:35 |
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Also the front license plate mount is rather wider than US plates.
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LJ909
> Chariotoflove
10/02/2017 at 13:40 |
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Yea its pretty annoying that they are using the car as a marketing ploy and its not actually for sale.
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LJ909
> MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
10/02/2017 at 13:48 |
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Thanks for that list. 3 of them are near me so Im going to have to check them out. I hadnt realized that Kia sent out 200 showroom specials though. Thats a good and bad thing.
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LJ909
> Arrivederci
10/02/2017 at 13:50 |
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True. Its a huge gamble though price range wise though. Especially with them not moving really any K900's.
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DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
> MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
10/02/2017 at 13:50 |
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So they’re going after the niche of buyers who care more about performance specs than branding then?
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LJ909
> gettingoldercarguy
10/02/2017 at 13:51 |
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I wouldnt doubt it.
FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com
> DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
10/02/2017 at 13:56 |
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There is some overlap in pricing if you look at the whole ranges, but if you compare trims with similar output, the Kia is way cheaper. The hints are that the Stinger GT with the 365 hp V6 tops out at $48k. That competes with the 440i GC starting at $49k and the S5 Sportback starting at $54k. I agree that there is still an element of “well a 3-series starts at $33k and this starts at $33k so I’ll take the known quantity” and that will hurt sales. But for those that do take the time to compare a base Stinger which is relatively well equipped to a base 320i that is down 70 hp and doesn’t even have power seats, the value proposition for the Stinger does exist.
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DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 13:58 |
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Yeah if they’re going after the luxury car buyer segment then they’re gonna have a bad time. A 340i is a easier sell than a KIA. I guess they’re going after the value performance crowd.
My issue is that that segment is so crowded. Performance enthusiasts in that price range are looking at STis, Focus RSs, Civic Type-Rs, Golf Rs, S3s. It seems aimed at the very narrow section of buyers who want a nice car like a 3 series, but want something a bit faster? I don’t know man, I’m sure they did their research, but what is so good about the Stinger GT that should make me want to buy it over a Golf R?
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DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
> FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com
10/02/2017 at 14:02 |
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Yeah I see that, but a BMW buyer is gonna buy a BMW, right? I mean thats why the CLA sells so well. Not very good value, but its a Mercedes. My point is that I the market for the Stinger and Stinger GT must be very small.
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Arrivederci
> Textured Soy Protein
10/02/2017 at 14:06 |
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Good eye! Didn’t even catch that.
NojustNo
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 14:08 |
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Hopefully these won’t be like a lot of manual cars:
1 - Dealers don’t stock them because there isn’t much demand.
2- Because of #1, buyers that want them can’t get them and just buy autos.
3 - Dealers use lack of sales from #2 to justify #1.
4- Repeat.
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MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 14:33 |
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I agree that it’s good and bad. It’s good you can go look at it (possibly climb in) but tragic that a salesman will probably try and push some other Kia that Stinger buyers probably have no interest in at all on them. It also sucks if someone wants a car RIGHT NOW they aren’t going to wait a few more months for real ones.
Kia does this though, they did with the Niro as well when it was launching.
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LJ909
> Wobbles the Mind
10/02/2017 at 14:34 |
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Well the pricing that was released to Jalopnik a week or so ago came officially from Kia and it was a break down so I would say the pricing is pretty much official.
I get your point though. But at the same time its misleading to list something for sale that isnt or at least make it seem that way. Cadillac ran into that problem with people wanting the Elmiraj. Leave it up to marketing to get people into the dealerships, either at corporate or at the dealership level.
I think they would be foolish not to discount this car. I dont see it happening right off the bat though. And with how Kia dealers are you’re going to go through hell to get a test drive. I see discounts coming only after they realize them treating it more special than it really is is causing inventory to sit for 100+ days.
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LJ909
> DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back
10/02/2017 at 14:39 |
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The problem with the segment, at least what Ive seen is that people shopping for those types of cars dont really shop around. They are already pretty much set in what they want. If they do consider something else or are a previous owner buying a new gen or coming to a new brand, you have to really come to the table with something special to win them over. The Stinger is special in that its unexpected being a Kia. Other than that though when you look at the performance and pricing better can be had elsewhere. And whether or not some people want to keep bringing it up, the badge and brand perception is going to be a major problem in getting buyers into this thing.
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LJ909
> NojustNo
10/02/2017 at 14:42 |
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Sadly I see this happening. The take rate for the manual will have it being an uphill battle to even find one on a lot. I honestly dont think the people that Kia wants to buy these, enthusiasts, will be the ones buying these which will lead to the majority of them being autos Buyers of this are going to be people that came in on a upper trim Optima, but think a Cadenza is a old mans car and cant really afford or dont want the equally old man K900 and they get into a Stinger. Ive noticed a snobbery with some Optima buyers so this could win them over.
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LJ909
> MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
10/02/2017 at 14:44 |
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Thats what I see happening. Even when the car is released, sales people will push you on to something else because they either prejudge (a person coming in to look at this will get sized up and try and be pushed on a Forte or some other entry car) or they are going to treat it with an imaginary velvet rope.
KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 15:28 |
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I think the dealers are going to have a bigger issue, which is getting people who can afford that type of money for a car into a Kia dealer.
There’s a ton of cars out there for $39-50K for a V6 Stinger. I suspect that people will be more willing to go to dealers that have better dealer experiences (i.e. Lexus) than Kia.
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LJ909
> KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs
10/02/2017 at 15:37 |
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Thats one of the things I keep saying. The shitty service is going to cost Kia sales and its why a lot of models have been killed off over the years.
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KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 15:53 |
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I mean, as someone getting a car squarely in the range of the Kia Stinger GT, I should be their target market.
Even the Chevy dealers have been annoying...I expected a bit more from them since they also sell Corvettes.
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MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 16:18 |
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I get the feeling you’re right and it’ll probably be a combo of the two. Like, sorry we don’t think the Stinger is a “good fit” for you, check out this Optima.
I hope they do well with it. I feel like they’re really trying.
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LJ909
> MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
10/02/2017 at 16:32 |
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Yea Im rooting for them because they are actually trying. In a world where automakers are focusing on soul sucking things like autonomy, EV’s and crossovers, Hyundai/Kia is actually doing performance and its great. Its just the realities of everything are against them.
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MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 16:38 |
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Fill this out and they’ll send you Stinger updates:
https://www.kia.com/us/en/forms/updatesrequest/stinger/2018
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LJ909
> MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
10/02/2017 at 16:39 |
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Oh yea Ive been on their list for months now. Its just the emails Ive gotten about it is info Ive already known.
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NojustNo
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 21:00 |
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Yah I hope the stinger is a success. I really like its style and handling. I’d be interested but really don’t want a large new car payment. Maybe I can sneak one of those korean demos out the showroom :)
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LJ909
> NojustNo
10/02/2017 at 21:25 |
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I want it to do well too, but the realities of it so far dont look to be in its favor. I keep saying though, like an Equus or K900, its going to be a helluva good used buy.
JQJ213- Now With An Extra Cylinder!
> LJ909
10/02/2017 at 22:06 |
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Sorry if it was said already in here
I work for a Kia dealer and they got a Stinger demo in. Yes, it is a Korean demo. It’s covered in Korean stickers and warnings and the infotainment system isn’t even in full English. As far as I know they aren’t completely road legal in current form and really are just to look and get a little feel for them before they really launch. It sounds crazy but Kia really did send them out like that