Anyone have solar panels or a windmill at their place?

"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
06/03/2020 at 11:50 • Filed to: None

We have a decent amount of both (more wind than hot sun), but aren’t in peak areas, and our home is all-electric, and I’ve been wondering how much sense it makes to invest in one of these, and what the payoff period is like. Solar seems to make less sense in our area (long-term payoff to investment), but the downsides of a windmill (noise) seem like they may be greater.

We’re in the “medium-orange” zone (eastern OK):

The government offers homeowners significant incentives for installing solar panels as an alternate energy source. For example, a residential federal tax credit allows taxpayers to claim 26% of installation costs for systems placed in service by Dec. 31, 2020. The credit dwindles to 22% in 2021 and expires Dec. 31, 2021.

Very few people have solar in our area:

Based !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! U.S. households use, it would take about 20 years to defray the upfront cost of a typical $21,000 residential solar system in Kentucky. In Massachusetts, however, the system would recoup its cost after just a decade. (based in the difference in electricity costs)

We’re also in the orange zone on the this map:

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

We may not have enough of either for it really to make sense, especially considering how relatively cheap our electric cost per unit is.

DISCUSSION (39)

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:00

Here, there’s no reliable wind, but sometimes extremely high gusts... and it’s soggy and overcast so much of the time in the cove that a solar panel proper would be as likely as not to mildew. Negatory, is what I’m saying.

Poor_Sh > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:13

I have wind panels and solar mills

PatBateman > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:13

Nope. I live in an area that gets a good amount of rain, wind, and hurricanes. While we do have some pretty good sun that solar panels could take advantage of, we also have some pretty good wind that could send said panels flying.

Textured Soy Protein > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:14

I rent my house so no but several neighbors in my neighborhood of townhouses have solar panels. Instead I connected my electric bill from PEPCO with a community solar project through Arcadia Power . Arcadia has solar farms and earns credits through pumping electricity into the grid. Instead of billing me directly, PEPCO bills Arcadia, Arcadia pays PEPCO with solar credits, and I pay Arcadia a reduced bill based on the solar credits.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:17

1/3 of OKs power is already wind. On top of UV exposure, you also have how your roof is shaped and total area.

It worked out great for m y older sister as they had big sloped south facing roof, in an area with high electricity costs . My aunt and uncle out theirs on a seperate stand away from the house. Their choice was less saving money and more as a backup due to frequent powerloss issues.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:20

I would say you should consider doing solar in tandem with redoing your roof shingles when the time comes that they need to be replaced. Because then you could just install solar shingles (like what Tesla sells) and nail two things at once.... and it won’t look like shit like the traditional “install ugly panels on top of a regular roof” that is usually done. Have a look here to see what I’m talking about:

https://www.tesla.com/en_CA/solarroof

And wind turbines do make noise. I would only install them in a place that is already noisy... like if you live next to a busy highway

3point8isgreat > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:20

Are the wind turbines sized for a house that loud? Last I knew power generation and sound levels were directly correlated. Such that an actual method for reducing noise to meet regulations is pitching the blades for less power. This also would mean a small one for a house won’t have the noise issues of a utility grade one. But maybe I’m missing something.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:21

At this point I still see solar as a luxury item unless there is some really good incentives or low interest loans available . If I could afford solar with a battery back-up I would do it. Even where I live in NW Montana solar would probably result in a $0 electric bill but would take 10-15 years to equate to our current power bill. I think we save more electricity by burning wood for heat and using low wattage appliances.

BigBlock440 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:36

I’ve been attempting to, got the system partially designed and ready to purchase some components. It’s a terrible payback, but I’m doing it for backup power mostly, so when the power goes out I don’t have to worry about my refrigerated /frozen food spoiling. It won’t be grid-tied though, and it won’t cover the full house due to it being all electric. Essentially a battery bank charged by solar/wind, with a backup battery charger for when they’re not producing enough to keep the batteries charged. I can heat with a wood stove, and deal with a cold shower, but I don’t want my 1/2 cow to spoil. I may or may not expand it later. The wind turbine you’d need to power a house would be rather large, and they don’t make much power below 15mph wind which further lengthens the payback period.

Svend > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 12:37

We’ve got solar panels on our roof here in the U.K. The government contributed to it’s installation and cost. Even when it’s not all that sunny it generates quite a bit of power. Whatever power we don’t use from them is sold to the National Grid and we get paid for.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > BigBlock440
06/03/2020 at 12:54

Ah, good point on the backup functionality. Why did you chose this over a generator?

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
06/03/2020 at 12:56

I live in a place that’s incredibly quiet, so that probably rules out wind.

Our house is north-facing, so the aes thetics of panels on our roof really isn’t a concern.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Textured Soy Protein
06/03/2020 at 12:57

Very interesting...

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
06/03/2020 at 12:59

Yeah, it’s amazing how much of the state’s power generation already comes from wind!

Thankfully we don’t deal with regular power outages, but a backup would be nice.

fintail > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:00

I love how my area is almost white on that irradiance chart.

If I had a detached house, I think I’d put up some kind of windmill just to piss off the Karens around me.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > 3point8isgreat
06/03/2020 at 13:02

Yeah, the small ones still make some noise, and probably get noisier over time.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Svend
06/03/2020 at 13:02

Nice!

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > PatBateman
06/03/2020 at 13:03

Good point!

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Poor_Sh
06/03/2020 at 13:04

Impressive.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > fintail
06/03/2020 at 13:05

Not sure how you figure that return on investment...

functionoverfashion > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:05

We’re strongly considering putting a ground-mount setup on our land, there’s so much damn sun over there. The only thing is, the tree cut is mostly east-west, so even though it’s a 2+ acre clearing, we might still cut a couple more of the tallest trees on the south tree line. Then, we need to dig a 300' long trench to our house for the wires. We’ll see if this makes our budget this year or not. The tax incentives are good though, and our local electric company has rebates too - cash rebates, not credits.

One strike against it is that they don’t to 1-to-1 net metering anymore. You used to get 1kw credit for 1kw produced, whether you used it right then or not. My parents got in with this system, and they produce more than they use; their electric bill is now the minimum service charge, something like $30, for the foreseeable future.

Ours would be about like this:

Kinja'd!!!

fintail > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:07

The LOLs would have some value. It’d also keep those pesky government 5G surveillance drones at bay.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > functionoverfashion
06/03/2020 at 13:12

their electric bill is now the minimum service charge, something like $30, for the foreseeable future

WOW!

BigBlock440 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:23

I have a generator too, but right now my house is only wired for it to run my kitchen and well pump. I decided on solar/wind mostly because of laziness. I don’t want to have to run a generator and worry about keeping it fueled up if the power’s out a week, but I have the option to do so if I need water or to charge the batteries back up. I also wanted to get some of the savings from solar/wind and make it basically a dual function system, using the solar/wind when available, running off of the battery when not, and having a battery charger on a transfer switch to charge the batteries if there’s not enough solar/wind to keep them charged. May not be the most efficient, and i t may end up not working out like I plan, but we’ll see. I’m starting small because I’m building it myself, but figured I’d learn something doing it and have it sized to the absolute necessities to start with. Over the past few months of designing it, I changed the scope from free energy to backup power mostly because I’m starting small and adding on, and the refrigerator and freezer are the most consistent (and necessary) loads. I figured it’d be a relative small cash outlay, get me a backup power source, and I’d find out firsthand how much power wind and solar actually makes at my house to give me an idea if it’s worth taking further.

functionoverfashion > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:28

The only catch is, they can’t use the solar directly. So if the power goes out (grid), they still have no power, ironically, even if it’s full sun.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > BigBlock440
06/03/2020 at 13:30

Nice! We will require regular OPPO updates along the way.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > functionoverfashion
06/03/2020 at 13:31

Huh, that’s a bummer.

functionoverfashion > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:37

I think it *could* be done, but you’d need a way to regulate the power in and out because unlike a generator, the amount of power coming in from the solar array could vary widely. I am sure it could be done but the way to do it is probably a battery setup, from which the house would then draw power, more or less like a generator in terms of how it would be wired into the main house panel.

functionoverfashion > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:38

You know, also, the clearing on our new land gets a lot of pretty steady breeze. It’s amazing how consistently there is wind over there even when it feels variable just 300' away, because we have *some* tree screen to our west.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 13:44

Well regardless of that, even if you’re installing uglier-looking panels, install it after the roof has been redone if it hasn’t been redone recently.

You don’t want to have to uninstall the panels to redo the roof if you can avoid it.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
06/03/2020 at 13:51

It’s probably not going to happen anyway. Not enough strong sun and electricity too cheap for it to make sense.

Tekamul > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 14:00

I’m in VT and have had panels for about 2 1/2 years.

The total cost was ~$ 23k minus a 30% tax credit. The math for estimating when they pay off is tough to calculate, because it’s highly dependent on rate increases. My rates increase 3-6% a year. If it’s 3%, it will be 10 years to payoff, if it’s 6% it’s more like 7 years.

The panel warranty is 25 years, so I feel like it will be worth it in the long run. It’s a 21 panel system, with a 6kW inverter. I average 8mWh a year, which, after adding a PHEV, is almost exactly my usage.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Tekamul
06/03/2020 at 14:02

Very nice! Sounds like a no-brainer in your situation.

Vlachen > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 14:42

I’ve been considering a solar addition to my roof. I’ve got a fair amount of roof real estate and I’m in the same irradiance zone as you (NW AR. ) Probably a no go on a small wind turbine though. My house is on the side of a valley and tends to be pretty sheltered from the wind.

Dusty Ventures > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/03/2020 at 20:18

I saw a vertical axis wind turbine on a pier in Portland, ME that was quiet even when standing at the base and, according to signage, is able to start generating at lower wind speeds than a standard turbine. It may have a lower top speed as well. A quick googling says it’s made by Windspire.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Dusty Ventures
06/03/2020 at 22:39

Cool - thanks!

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > Dusty Ventures
06/03/2020 at 23:42

Those look awesome. I’m going to have to look into those. We get shockingly windy days here in central Ohio.

Dusty Ventures > Carbon Fiber Sasquatch
06/04/2020 at 07:14

Yeah, they seem pretty cool. And their ability to work in “dirty” or more turbulent air and require less area for blade clearance is great as well

CaptDale - is secretly British > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
06/06/2020 at 13:25

Been on my mother about installing solar panels on the house. We could use them and our roof faces the right direction for them.