Fog of war

"Just Jeepin'" (macintux) 10/05/2020 at 13:50 • Filed to: Planelopnik, #shiplopnik

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Interesting video, along with  an article with context. I have to think military R&D would be a fascinating if morally challenging job.

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user314 > Just Jeepin' 10/05/2020 at 13:59

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Which works right up until you develop radar, and is basically useless until you develop Minovksy Particles .

ttyymmnn > Just Jeepin' 10/05/2020 at 14:00

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Now THAT is a chemtrail.

And in twenty years, the battleship would become largely irrelevant, supplanted by the carrier.

MrDakka > Just Jeepin' 10/05/2020 at 14:05

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It was a fun and interesting j ob for me . Got to work on truly groundbreaking stuff. Pay isn’t the greatest , but benefits are pretty good.

Best days are Thursdays (on the week of Friday being off, thanks to 9-80 ) when the base commander emails everyone to take a half day if working on nothing urgent and the following Monday is a federal holiday.

WRXforScience > user314 10/05/2020 at 14:06

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With radar, you just use chaff (basically aluminum foil) and you get an impenetrable radar wall. It won’t stop energy swords or flying robots though.

facw > ttyymmnn 10/05/2020 at 14:15

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I’m still unconvinced that that battleship was ever really relevant except for shore bombardment . Even before the advent of aircraft carriers, put that money into torpedo boats (and their submarine cousins) and you’d crush battleships easily.

ttyymmnn > facw 10/05/2020 at 14:18

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I’m certainly not a naval historian, but it would seem that the era of the battleship ended in 1916 after the Battle of Jutland. 

user314 > WRXforScience 10/05/2020 at 14:22

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True, though chaff (developed during WW2 and called ‘WINDOW’ by the British and Düppelby the Luftwaffe) is of limited usability by itself in modern warfare. Current radar sets can measure the Doppler shift of the target to squelch false targets from chaff since it quickly looses momentum after being ejected. Nowadays you have to pump a false Doppler signal into it ( a technique known as JAFF (jammer plus chaff)
  or CHILL (chaff-illuminated) ) to fool the radar.

facw > ttyymmnn 10/05/2020 at 14:23

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I’m not a naval historian either, but even before then, it’s not clear that they were at all optimal. 

and 100 more > user314 10/05/2020 at 14:47

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I love how in 08th they combat the scattered Minov sky particles by using an umbilical to each MS, AND A HUMAN RADAR!

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Just Jeepin' 10/05/2020 at 16:14

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Wouldn’t this also make the enemy invisible to you? 

Just Jeepin' > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 10/05/2020 at 16:17

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Sure, but the plane moves faster than a ship, so the tracking problem is harder for the ship.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > facw 10/05/2020 at 18:03

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The problem is the differences in range. before ww1 battleships were in the 20k yard point, while torpedos 4- to maybe 8k yards. An issue with torpedoes is the slow speed you could be shooting something at 30 knots at something capable of 20-25, so if they see you, you just have to turn around. Though effective range of the guns were less, you would still be within range of the guns. Your torpedo boats would also have to contend with a screen of torpedo boat destoryers that the opposite fleet would have.

facw > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas 10/05/2020 at 18:14

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You’d certainly lose a bunch of torpedo boats, but it seems very likely you’d still sacrifice much less than the cost of a battleship.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > facw 10/05/2020 at 18:28

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But again you would have your own fleet of destroyers and TB mixing it up, before they could close the range, to engage the BBs. Meanwhile the BBs would have the range to engage the enemy bbs.