Do you want to overpay for an E90 M3 with a major red flag?

"E90M3" (e90m3) 01/14/2020 at 09:30 • Filed to: unnecessary car shopping with E90M3

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If you do, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

WBSPM9C5XBE698680

At first, this E90 M3 is a very appealing car: late build E90 M3 with the ZCP (competition package) and a proper manual. Once you start to look past those, something is awry. First, lets look at the mirrors; those are not M3 mirrors.

These are what E9X M3 mirrors should look like:

As you can also see from my very own 2011 M3:

Moving on to the interior, it appears that the steering wheel has been swapped as well.

That can be forgiven !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

What cannot be forgiven is the seats.

This is what the seats are supposed to look like:

In fact this E90 M3 has the regular sport seats out of an E90. It’s not limited to the seats either, looks like someone swapped the whole interior including door cards.

Here’s what the door cards should look like:

For more comparisons, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

Currently, with 6 days left, the bid is $1 short of $26k.

So if anyone wants to ignore all the red flags and bid on this one, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! :

Update:

According to !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , the DMF is BS: 

functionoverfashion > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:36

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VIN says it’s an M3... so why would someone do all that? 

E90M3 > functionoverfashion 01/14/2020 at 09:38

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I was wondering the same things, it just doesn’t make any sense and the seller seems to be lacking a good explanation .

jimz > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:38

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I owned my Ranger for 2-3 years before I realized the skull caps on the left and right mirrors were different.  The left is the gloss black “premium” part, the right side is the unpainted base assembly. 

Arrivederci > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:44

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Too many other good ones out there to overpay for this one.

E90M3 > Arrivederci 01/14/2020 at 09:45

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Yeah and it looks like the seller bought it to flip it. 

MonkeePuzzle > functionoverfashion 01/14/2020 at 09:45

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flood damage?

or maybe they had someone offer them big cash to swap their inteiror, they didnt care and it felt like easy money?

DasWauto > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:46

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I don’t know if it was an option on the e90 M3 but on the e36 M3 one could opt for a comfort interior, which featured normal 3 series seats and wood trim instead of the ‘vader’ seats you could only get in an M3. Maybe something similar is going on here (though the mirror are a strange omission). 

Arrivederci > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:47

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Yep - you can tell he lacks a little awareness about the car from his comments and has started getting a little testy with the informed responses and theories from the commentariot.

I’d be happy to sell a car on BaT, but I’d make damn well sure I knew everything about it prior to auction.

E90M3 > DasWauto 01/14/2020 at 09:48

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In all my searching I’ve never seen one like this and I don’t believe that was an option. It could be an individual option, but that would be indicated on the build sheet, which it isn’t. 

functionoverfashion > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:49

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Yeah. Interior could be innocent (someone really like the other seats / didn’t like the M3 seats) but... then why the mirrors? Again, could be one got broken and they didn’t want to pay for the M3-specific mirrors...? It’s a gamble without more info.

On the other hand, there’s a 540i / 6-speed on there that looks very nice. I’d have that one for sure. 

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:53

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Grand total of one bid. LOL

Tripper > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 09:55

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Totally agree with you here, but the fenders... is it/was it actually an M3 or are you thinking it was a flood car or something with a swapped interior?

E90M3 > Arrivederci 01/14/2020 at 09:58

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I think if I was to sell my M3, it’d be on BAT, but I’d have everything sorted first and be able to answer any questions.

E90M3 > Tripper 01/14/2020 at 10:00

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I’m thinking this is an actual M3 with some dubious history. The weirdest thing about it is the fact they swapped the trim over from the M3 door. The VIN stamping and full M3 suspension would be too much work if it was a simple clone .

E90M3 > functionoverfashion 01/14/2020 at 10:01

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The seller seems to be a flipper, so he probably has no clue and seems to be getting testy; as someone else pointed out. 

Tripper > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:01

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I had to ask, haha. We’ll see what he says.

E90M3 > Tripper 01/14/2020 at 10:03

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Please let me know what he says. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:06

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Seller is getting roasted, rightfully so. This is either a theft recovery, repo, or flood damaged car. 

CalzoneGolem > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:06

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So ... it’s like a sleeper?

E90M3 > CalzoneGolem 01/14/2020 at 10:07

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Nah, seller doesn’t know what he has. This is why it’s on BAT and not CL. 

E90M3 > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 01/14/2020 at 10:08

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That would be my guess. I could see a swapped interior for a few reasons, mainly if it had come with the base seats, but the mirrors are what really throw me off. 

functionoverfashion > Tripper 01/14/2020 at 10:08

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realoem.com says it’s an M3 at least

jimz > jimz 01/14/2020 at 10:10

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I should note that I don’t think it was built that way; it had a “minor” collision sometime before I bought it and I think the right mirror assembly was replaced.

functionoverfashion > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:12

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I owned my blue E46 wagon for 5 years and I considered selling it on BaT because manual wagon but I decided I couldn’t handle the scrutiny. The car wasn’t perfect, but it was well sorted and well maintained, if not starting to show a couple signs of rust . But the thought of trying to get hundreds of pictures of every detail and then answer inane questions about its service history was daunting.

E90M3 > functionoverfashion 01/14/2020 at 10:13

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It’d be a headache for sure, but I think it can be the best way to get top dollar for enthusiast cars. 

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:19

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I’m amazed the seller didn’t just trade it in at a dealer or get a carmax buyout if they were done with it. Even if they sell it on BaT, wouldn’t the sale be null and void if they prove the car was misrepresented. Seems like a big headache for all involved to do it this way.

E90M3 > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/14/2020 at 10:22

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Looks like the seller bought it to flip it. It was for sale at a Honda dealer in November for 31k.

offroaddreams > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:24

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how did this get allowed on BaT? I thought they only allow quality listings that get heavy vetting or has that changed?

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:26

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I don’t even pretend to know much about the M3, but that’s just weird. Doing some sleuthing, I found the carfax on a dealer website. Car has already had three owners.

https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistory/p/Report.cfx?vin=WBSPM9C5XBE698680&partner=VAS_0

Now, that being said, the oyster is the non-M3 interior?  I think I like it better.  

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:26

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Chariotoflove > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:28

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$26k seems like a lot for someone to have bid with all the people that are apparently skewering it. 

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:35

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I have a new theory - this car was never stolen or flooded. It was vandalized. Vindictive spouse or friend or someone got into the car and thrashed the interior. Not wanting the car to lose value, the owner repairs it for cheap out of pocket and ditches the car to a dealer before the hearings. Gets a nice Honda or something so it looks more reasonable than a BMW when it comes to dividing the estate.

Current owner is the sap who got left holding the bag when the dealer sold it without knowing any better.

E90M3 > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/14/2020 at 10:37

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I was kind of wondering if that’s what had happened. I would think you’re probably right, since nothing was reported. I guess that would also explain why the paint was thinner than expected. 

Arrivederci > Chariotoflove 01/14/2020 at 10:38

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That bid was submitted before everyone started vetting it.

E90M3 > Chariotoflove 01/14/2020 at 10:38

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If the seller knew all the reasons, I could understand. They are way too many unanswered red flags here. 

E90M3 > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 01/14/2020 at 10:39

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The carfax provided with the auction shows the same thing.

That’s not oyster, it’s a but that wasn’t an M color. That’s the standard beige color. My dad’s 135is has oyster and it is quite nice. 

E90M3 > offroaddreams 01/14/2020 at 10:40

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It seems their quality  control isn’t what it used to be. There have been other questionable listings. 

Chariotoflove > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:41

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I went and read through the comments with my coffee. I think your theory that he just didn’t know what he had is likely. 

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 10:43

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I didn’t even realize the BAT auction had a C arfax. Duh.

Chariotoflove > Arrivederci 01/14/2020 at 10:44

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There were a couple of comments about it before the bid but yes, most of it came afterward now that I read through. I bet the bidder also didn’t know what they had.

FWIW, the discussion all seems to be civil and adult despite the serious questions. 

E90M3 > functionoverfashion 01/14/2020 at 10:49

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It’s an M3, I don’t think that’s being debated, more of how this M3 got to its current state. 

The Ghost of Oppo > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 11:00

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This just has to be s omeone got a salvaged regular 3 series cheap , swapped the interiors, sold off the M3 interior for profit, and sold the M3 to an unsuspecting dealer.  

E90M3 > The Ghost of Oppo 01/14/2020 at 11:06

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That’s possible. Someone suggested vandalism; regardless, something is up. 

Tripper > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 11:09

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Nothing yet...

E90M3 > Tripper 01/14/2020 at 11:13

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Saw that, I was the one who liked it. 

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 11:25

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My money is on it being vandalized as well but maybe the dealer got tricked into thinking it was NP!!! because it was an M, but unlikely.

Someone’s nepotism bit them in the ass because their relation shouldn’t be vetting trade ins?

Is there even the slightest chance one of the owners just liked that interior better? I’m no BMW nerd so idk if that interior installed presently is universally considered worse than the M interior. I would think so because of value alone but again I’m no expert.

E90M3 > MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) 01/14/2020 at 11:29

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Seems like the seller bought it to flip it. In that case, I don’t feel bad for him at all.

There is a slight chance, but it doesn’t seem very likely. I could see it if just the front seats were swapped, but it doesn’t make sense to do the entire interior like that. 

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 11:36

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I meant the 1st owner may have swapped the interior out of preference, that’s the ONLY way that would make sense (except it seems to not). Still convinced it was vandalism but maybe the initial owner got it in their head to make it a sleeper and swap all the cosmetic M parts off?

Hypothetically th at could even be a cool idea imo assuming you didn’t care about resale or it was already devalued  (salvage). Find some 18 year old to swap all the parts with. I’m sure that idea fizzles out when you realize the cosmetic parts are (I assume) functional too

It does seem to be very close to the M colour interior too unless I’m wrong? The mirrors don’t make sense either, unless they malfunctioned and non-M replacements are much cheaper?

Tripper > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 11:38

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I’m in a mood, I’ll keep going.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 11:59

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welp, there’s your answer

Tripper > Tripper 01/14/2020 at 12:10

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and I poke poke poke the bear! shitty dealer

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker 01/14/2020 at 12:11

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Reads like one giant run-on sentence fueled by frustration and 3 cups of coffee

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 12:20

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Super surprised BaT hasn’t ended this yet. The seller is getting a bit short (which is understandable) and the angry masses are moving in. I don’t think the seller has any answers but the way he is presenting himself/ this car isn’t helping...

E90M3 > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 01/14/2020 at 12:23

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I’m kind of surprised as well. There’s not one right way to approach this, but the seller certainly isn’t approaching it correctly. This is probably going to go cheap as a result, but then it’d take quite a lot to make it correct. 

SoCalM2 > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 12:26

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We’ve seen this before on forum postings, especially in the BMW world. My thoughts are that someone did an interior swap plus cash with a 328/335 then sold the car to the dealership. Remind me a few months back when there was another posting on a M4, but it had regular 4 series seats. It can’t be optioned from the factory like that, so it was traced back to a post where the previous owner did an interior swap plus cash.

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 12:29

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And then will always have the stain of this BaT listing.  I think without knowing what happened this listing will always follow this car (unless BaT deletes it and even then I’m sure the forums are lighting up).

E90M3 > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 01/14/2020 at 12:31

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I mean this post is already at 1600 views, so I’m sure this car is going to have a black mark unless some one buys it, rectifies it, and then documents it.

Tripper > Tripper 01/14/2020 at 12:59

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Hahaha got em! And an “ explanation”.

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 13:10

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Wasn’t the re an issue with the Late M3 of that generation where BMW literally ran out of M3 Parts? I think I recall a Jalopnik article about it.

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 13:11

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That’d help for sure, but I’d always want to know why it was like that in the first place. I’d even go so far as to say I like the interior as is, much less flashy, but you’d want to know for sure why  it was changed.

E90M3 > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 01/14/2020 at 13:16

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They were still making the E9X M3 into 2013, so I don’t think this would be affected, but I could be wrong. 

Azrek > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 13:22

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That would make sense to me. Everytime I take my car in now they have it for 8 days or so to get parts. Either my dealership is fucking worthless (which I believe) or there is a supply issue. 

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 01/14/2020 at 13:24

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There was a guy who bought an E9X M3 with a custom paint color but the paint took so long to approve it was one of the last made. Only problem was, they painted it the wrong color. By the time he took delivery and they realized the mistake, they had already shut down the line for retooling and had shipped excess parts off as spares or something. So his options were to have the car be repainted and everything (but the car’s paperwork would always show it was supposed to be a different color) or drive the car as-is and pay a massive premium for a color he didn’t like.

He got reamed for having a first world problem, but honestly I’d be pretty pissed too if I paid a couple grand for something and they just.....didn’t do it. 

Tripper > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 01/14/2020 at 13:27

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lol the guy came at my NECK! Provoked a little ;)

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 13:29

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My Memory is probably wrong, I mean it is a Chrysler move more than a BMW move.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 01/14/2020 at 13:47

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wait, how many cups of coffee is “normal”?

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 13:49

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buy this: https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1971-datsun-240z-121/

E90M3 > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 01/14/2020 at 13:56

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I’m good. 

bob and john > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 15:03

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the more I read into it, the more I think its been vandalized, sold off by PO for that, and the flipper bought it and just got the cheapest E90 3 series parts tot throw at it. 

id3550 > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 01/14/2020 at 15:34

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If you look up the vin on  vinwiki is comes back as a legit ‘ 11 ZCP with correct interior and wing mirrors. Not sure why the current owner would have gone through the hassle for a far less premium and heavier interior though.

Saracen > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 16:50

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You should be glad they took those awful things out! Heck, in the final year of Ev o X production, Mitsu did the work for you...they pulled all the Recaros out of the Evo and charged you for it!

BLCKSTRM > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 18:09

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Sedans ended in 2011 though, didn’t they? It was coupes that ended in 2013.

So that makes sense for the interior. Are sedan mirrors different than coupe? If so t hat would be an easy explanation.

BLCKSTRM > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 18:12

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Great comment :

E90M3 > BLCKSTRM 01/14/2020 at 18:20

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Saw that, pretty great. 

E90M3 > BLCKSTRM 01/14/2020 at 18:22

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Mirrors are the same across all E9X M3s and I don’t believe they were changed in an LCI. As far as the seats go, the E90 and E92/3 seats are different, but I’ve neither heard of them running out of E90 M3 seats nor have I seen any other like this. 

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 18:31

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LOL that’s a pretty entertaining thread. AND I learnt a new word out of it -

persnickety- placing too much emphasis on trivial or minor details; fussy.  

And reading the comment thread, I’m learning that it likely came from one of our very own Oppo members on here ;)

Danny Korecki > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 18:36

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How is this still up? (the listing not this post)

Doesn’t BaT have specific rules about a car being misrepresented? 

E90M3 > Danny Korecki 01/14/2020 at 18:51

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No idea, might be because the seller wasn’t trying to be deceitful; obviously giving him the benefit of the doubt.

I’m more surprised it wasn’t picked up in the PPI, then again, they might have just been looking at mechanicals.   

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/14/2020 at 22:02

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Wasn’t that a Jalopnik article a few years back? It was suppose to be some kinda frosty white or blue.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 22:38

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Are the bumper gaps that bad on the front?

M.T. Blake > E90M3 01/14/2020 at 23:57

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Its probably a theft/crash car put back together with no record of either issue being documented. 

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2020 at 00:30

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Yeah, I think that’s the article he was referring to. He wanted it to be “Atlantis Blue” when it ended up being made “Atlantic Blue” but he had a custom interior color as well so his seats looked off.

Tripper > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 08:42

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Wooooooowzers almost up to 10k views. “I really hope the seats and mirrors don’t take away from the rest of the car.”

How about the CF wrapped dash pieces the door cards etc...

Hey guy, weird car is weird! You should have put this on your lot and sold it to the first guy with bad credit and 3 buttons on his shirt left undone. Instead you “presented” it to a bunch of unbelievably well educated car nerds...

E90M3 > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/15/2020 at 08:43

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I don’t know which gap you’re talking about. 

E90M3 > Tripper 01/15/2020 at 08:48

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The mirrors and swapped interior are absolute ly going to detract from the value. Especially because there is no good explanation .

Fun fact, if you google the VIN, WBSPM9C5XBE698680, and go to images, these pop up from this post: 

E90M3 > M.T. Blake 01/15/2020 at 08:48

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Seems like it’s something like that. 

Tripper > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 09:03

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Lol, dare you to thr ow that in the comments.

Also, yes not only does it detract from the value but I don’t want that thing period. Far too much weirdness to ignore.

E90M3 > Tripper 01/15/2020 at 09:06

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I might throw something in the comment. I have already put something in the comments. 

Tripper > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 09:07

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Aw man, now I gotta play the guessing game?

Tripper > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 09:15

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Also looks like its about $2500 to replace the mirrors BEFORE paint.

E90M3 > Tripper 01/15/2020 at 09:18

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Made a comment, and yeah they’re not cheap. I can’t imagine trying to replace that interior. 

Tripper > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 09:26

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Well said. They HAVE to pull this.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 09:51

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The gap between the bumper and fender looks big, even for my GM standards. 

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 10:16

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I was going to make this into its own post but I’m at work and need to get to it here soon. But you or someone else might want to comment about this. He claims the interior was swapped due to the Novillo leather containing Dimethyl Fumarate which gave the PO a skin allergy. Th is is documented with leather couches and seats in the past so that part checks out. But what is odd is that leather products containing DMF were outlawed for manufacture in the EU in 1998. It was illegal to export or import anything that contained DMF in 2009. When a product is shipped that contains DMF nowadays, it’s a big fucking deal.

So that explanation doesn’t add up. And I worked at a BMW leather supply plant. We didn’t use DMF as an antifungal agent. We used DuPont’s AMICAL line. No DMF at all. And that was for the SUVs being made in SC. I can’t imagine Germany would allow BMW to use DMF.

E90M3 > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/15/2020 at 10:21

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Yeah that seemed fishy, I’ll update this post with your info. 

E90M3 > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/15/2020 at 10:30

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Thanks for the info:

After a cursory google search I found and I posted this link, to an official EU site mentioning the ban.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 10:45

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Yeah. And by the time of the ban, DMF wasn’t in the dyes/coatings for leather. It was sold as a small pouch like silica gel and left on the underside of couches and seats. What would happen is someone would find it and assume it was silica and handle it/drop it and get a reaction that way.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > E90M3 01/15/2020 at 10:50

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Lol, I saw the responses. There’s a full blown defense on it now. But the damage is probably done. I don’t see that car selling at this point.

E90M3 > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/15/2020 at 10:52

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I figured my work there was done; I seriously doubt this car will sell now.

I bet this oppo article isn’t helping. I included  the VIN so there’s no way the car can escape its past now. 

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > Tripper 01/15/2020 at 10:57

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Read: I’m realizing I got screwed I really hope I get my money back by screwing someone else .

This guy is a typ ical dealer.