"ttyymmnn" (ttyymmnn)
08/28/2018 at 15:42 • Filed to: Planelopnik
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"ttyymmnn" (ttyymmnn)
08/28/2018 at 15:42 • Filed to: Planelopnik | 4
| 33 |
Back in 2014, the A-10 was very much on the chopping block. That’s SecDef Deborah James trying to tell McCain that a B-1 will perform CAS, and the senator was having none of that nonsense.
Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 15:52 |
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Rekt
For Sweden
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 15:54 |
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Navy having to save the Air Force from itself. Again.
NKato
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 15:58 |
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B1....cas. what the fuck is this bitch on?
Brian McKay
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:05 |
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She was U.S. Secretary of Defense?!
I never heard of her.
haveacarortwoorthree2
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:08 |
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I’m not a military expert or strategist and there have been upgrades to the B-1 made over the last four years, but ...
That said, the A-10 is bad ass .
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ttyymmnn
> NKato
08/28/2018 at 16:10 |
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I think she is talking about JDAMs. They’re accurate, but not danger-close accurate.
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ttyymmnn
> Brian McKay
08/28/2018 at 16:12 |
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Me niether. I had to look her up .
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ttyymmnn
> haveacarortwoorthree2
08/28/2018 at 16:16 |
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“If I’m talking to a guy on the ground and I have my sensor on him ... we can drop weapons seven miles away, or we can drop lower, drop them closer.”
Seven miles doesn’t seem very close. Unless he means that he is seven miles from the target, which is entirely possible.
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NKato
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:18 |
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That’s the thing. B1 Lancer is a supersonic bomber that’s falling apart; it’s costing the Air Force more money to maintain than the A10s.
Plus, bombs are bad for danger close support.
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haveacarortwoorthree2
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:25 |
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Like I said, IDK. He also said “ we are going to do shows of force where we’re 500 feet overtop of their head,” whatever that means as well . My only point is posting it was that the B-1 now seems to have a lot more to do with CAS than what a lot of people thought just a few years ago.
facw
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:28 |
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I assume they mean they can hit a target from 7 miles out.
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facw
> haveacarortwoorthree2
08/28/2018 at 16:36 |
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I think probably just doing a flyover with a B-1 in a war zone would be a pretty scary thing without a shot fired:
Really drives home the difference in power.
And yeah, just because the A-10 excels at CAS with close in strafing runs and low level bomb and missile attacks doesn’t mean that is the only way to do CAS. As long as the aircraft can hit the target where and when the ground forces need it, it doesn’t matter what speed and altitude it strikes from. The B-1 seems to be making it work, and it’s quite possible the F-35 will as well, though I stick with my opinion that it is silly to talk about retiring the A-10 until the F-35 shows that it can indeed take up the slack (and even then, the A-10 is cheap enough to fly it might make sense to keep it around regardless).
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ttyymmnn
> facw
08/28/2018 at 16:36 |
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Which means they cannot see what they are hitting or confirm a target.
Ash78, voting early and often
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:39 |
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Yeah, and the A380 isn’t selling great, so let’s start using them as regional jets!
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facw
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 16:39 |
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You speak as though they need to be looking out a window to do those things. They have sensor pods and can get targeting info and other data uplinks from the ground right? Maybe they’ve been hushed up, but I haven’t heard anything about horrible friendly fire mishaps in Syria or Afghanistan.
unclevanos (Ovaltine Jenkins)
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 17:04 |
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A-10C has a TGP sensor pod for targeting and setting up Sensor Point of Interest (SPI). The mavericks can do the same but once they’re all fired, you lose the ability to use their own targeting camera. TGP can be used for a good distance away while mavericks have a limited range in the viewing camera.
Spanfeller is a twat
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 17:07 |
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DoD has budget cuts?
The hell?
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ttyymmnn
> facw
08/28/2018 at 17:24 |
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No, but CAS generally means close enough to see what you are shooting at. I certainly understand GPS, laser guidance, etc., all of which can be done from a distance or even BVR.
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ttyymmnn
> Spanfeller is a twat
08/28/2018 at 17:24 |
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Well, this was four years ago....
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Spanfeller is a twat
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 17:27 |
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Debt it seems, kills all.
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facw
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 17:33 |
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The close in CAS has to do with the proximity of the target to the friendly troops being supported. Traditionally this has meant that the CAS aircraft also had to be in close proximity in order to avoid accidentally hitting the friendlies, but it’s not clear (to me anyway) how much this is true anymore, and it certainly seems likely to grow less true as technology continues to advance.
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ttyymmnn
> facw
08/28/2018 at 17:42 |
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Yes.
BigBlock440
> facw
08/28/2018 at 19:44 |
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Some examples of what the B1 and F35 can’t do:
https://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/everything-went-wrong-on-the-a-10-warthog-s-first-missi-1795559531
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facw
> BigBlock440
08/28/2018 at 19:57 |
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True perhaps, but keep in mind there are missions the A-10 can’t do as well. Armored or not it is very vulnerable contested airspace, both to enemy aircraft, and to ground-based air defenses , which means it would not be valuable in a fight against a peer or near peer. It’s speed is also an issue (it’s no use in situations where it can’t get to the target quickly enough ), though this is offset by its loiter time (the B-1 can loiter for extended periods as well though).
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facw
> BigBlock440
08/28/2018 at 19:57 |
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True perhaps, but keep in mind there are missions the A-10 can’t do as well. Armored or not it is very vulnerable contested airspace, both to enemy aircraft, and to ground-based air defenses , which means it would not be valuable in a fight against a peer or near peer. It’s speed is also an issue (it’s no use in situations where it can’t get to the target quickly enough ), though this is offset by its loiter time (the B-1 can loiter for extended periods as well though).
wafflesnfalafel
> ttyymmnn
08/28/2018 at 20:27 |
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R ight with you on this - I’ve gotta think folks are getting “lobbied” against the A-10. It’s one of those “the cheapest solution is the best solution” situations so folks can’t make money off of it to the potential downfall of ground troops. McCain quickly recognized that and was able to put some weight behind it. And the rewing program isn’t even happening in AZ - McCain just tried to do the right thing regardless of the lobbying...
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BigBlock440
> facw
08/29/2018 at 00:01 |
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Yes, there are things it doesn’t do well at, but the things it does do well , no other aircraft slated for the CAS role can even attempt.
DipodomysDeserti
> wafflesnfalafel
08/29/2018 at 01:56 |
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Davis-Monthan AFB in Tucson has the largest contigent of A10s in the US and was passed over for the F35. There were fears the base would be closed if the A10 was retired. Davis-Monthan pumps about $1billion into Tucson’s economy every year.
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DipodomysDeserti
> ttyymmnn
08/29/2018 at 02:19 |
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A rabbi (and mohel) showed me this video today.
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ttyymmnn
> DipodomysDeserti
08/29/2018 at 08:24 |
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What might have been. McCain really wanted Lieberman as his running mate, but he went with that pinhead Palin instead. I wonder is that was McCain calculating and pandering to that side of his base, or if he was talked into it by his campaign. It’s obvious the two were good friends, and that pairing might have won.
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DipodomysDeserti
> ttyymmnn
08/29/2018 at 09:50 |
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Considering the state the economy was in after the Bush administration, I think the only way McCain would have won is if Clinton got the nomination.
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wafflesnfalafel
> DipodomysDeserti
08/29/2018 at 12:15 |
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interesting... yep, the 355th, you are right... I thought that was just the boneyard out there...
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DipodomysDeserti
> wafflesnfalafel
08/29/2018 at 13:01 |
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Yeah, the skies of Tucson are filled with A10s. There’s also a bunch of C-130 aircraft there as well . A buddy of mine was a linguist stationed at D-M and he flew around in a C-130 all day.