PolitiOppo (politics)

"boredalways" (boredalway666) 07/11/2018 at 10:46 • Filed to: Trigger warning, Politics, PolitiOppo

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I would normally post this in the Cigar Lounge but this is making my blood boil because I don’t want to see harm come to anyone’s child.

Also, I want to acknowledge from the get go that I continue to work hard at not offending anyone with opposing views so I want to be clear from the start that ONE’S POLITICAL VIEWS AND AN ELECTED OFFICIAL THAT IS SUPPOSED TO REPRESENT THOSE VIEWS ARE NOT MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE.

No arguing allowed folks. I don’t want to dismiss comments because you are offending each other and the mods should not have to step in.

So yes, thanks to the 43% of eligible voters that didn’t bother to vote, I’m talking about the president that we earned and deserve.

No, I’m inferring that conservatives are bad or are bad people (obviously, they are not, and I’m actually close friends with several conservatives — I hang out with them almost every weekend). And even though I don’t like our fractured Congress, I accept them because they are elected officials that WE THE PEOPLE need to force them to work together on nonpartisan solutions like they used to do on a more regular basis like they did 1-2 decades ago.

So what I am saying is that the elected individual and his administration are a bunch of bigoted imbeciles that need to go and go NOW.

Having said that, let’s play a game where we pretend that our only option to replace the current administration is with another conservative until the next presidential election.

For me, I would be comfortable with the natural order of succession. So House Speaker Paul Ryan would be president and Senate Pro Tempore Orrin Hatch would be vice president. Both would bring stability and end the [public] bigoted (and sometimes racist) divisiveness that is a plague on our country currently. I also believe both would calm down our differences with our allies as well by returning to political norms.

Officials admit they may have separated family – who might be US citizens – for up to a year

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If Kinja’d see comments

boredalways > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 10:46

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Officials admit they may have separated family – who might be US citizens – for up to a year

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jul/11/us-immigration-family-separations-doj-us-citizens?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 10:52

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“Both would bring stability and end the bigoted (and sometimes racist) divisiveness that is a plague on our country currently.”

I would love to believe that would happen, but I don’t think it has any chance for at least a generation. 

fintail > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 10:53

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But whatabout something, pizdets!

On one hand, I am not fond of Randian dbag Ryan, on the other hand, he’s less embarrassing than 45, his devilspawn, and second in command Sith, so I am OK with this, so long as the entire regime is gutted - no more Miller, SHS, Javanka, Ghouliani, Bolton, etc.

farscythe - makin da cawfee! > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:00

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do i still get to vote for giant meteor?

im liking giant meteor more every passing day

(also... i know i can expect a giant tax bill in a couple months time as i fucked up some paperwork... sooo before then would be grand)

Spanfeller is a twat > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:03

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That’s very sad, and speaks of the racially motivated focus of the agencies.

I find, more often than not, that world populists tend to want to mix race, ethnicity, or even socioeconomic standing into national identity. Excluding some groups makes people feel more special for some wretched reason. This is, by the way, not an issue of Republicans. I mean, look at any Bernie interview, he tends to talk about the “white” middle class and up until recently bunched up every other group into “others” this was until he was called out. 

Tekamul > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:04

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I mean, has Pence actually done ANYTHING, good or bad yet?

I don’t think he can reasonably be cast aside yet. Let him take office, push to repeal the 19th amendment, THEN yank his ass.

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail 07/11/2018 at 11:07

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The silent majority should put an end to minority rule; but that’s only gonna happen if the majority feels an urge to fucking vote once in a while.

Something that was made extremely clear to me listening to NPR is that parties struggle to bring out voters.

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 11:23

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There’s more to it than that - gerrymandering and electoral college issues hurt too. Remember who lost the popular vote. It now needs to be strategic as well as raw numbers.

The silent majority brings up thoughts of the “silent generation” - the ones before the boomers who are often not the most progressive, but still hold a lot of electoral and financial power.

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail 07/11/2018 at 11:29

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Out of every questionable thing Nixon did, using the “S ilent Majority” chant was genius; it called upon a general discomfort with the state of affairs in the country but not uncomfortable enough to ask for change . It’s supposed to be a Republican thing, but I think it has cross party appeal.

Even with all of the problems, if more people went out to vote, good things would happen. How else did reps win majority in state assemblies and governorships? Voters need to stop being so special and actually go out to vote and choose from two bad people rather than suffering from who they suppose is worse for four years.

Future next gen S2000 owner > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:29

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Can I nominate me? Let’s just do that. S2000s for everyone. Seriously, I’m pretty sure I could do a better job at not pissing off the rest of the world and attempting to make the US better off.

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 11:34

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He riled up a base, in a classier way than the current leadership.  Funny thing, relative to modern dogma, Nixon would be a fairly centrist D.

Definitely, if more voted, things might change.  I’ve always seen it as being about the lesser evil, and have always said if you don’t vote, you don’t have a right to complain. 

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail 07/11/2018 at 11:36

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I mean, Nixon was pretty overtly racist... not sure he’s on the Dems side yet. I could see Reagan as a South Eastern Democrat tho.

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/11/2018 at 11:39

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It now needs to be strategic as well as r aw numbers.

It always  needed to be strategic, and election coverage for at least the past two decades have made that pretty clear, as does a middle school civics class.

fintail > BigBlock440 07/11/2018 at 11:41

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Was I replying to you? Thanks for the arrogant reply, I am sure you have the knowledge and credentials to give a fine lecture on the topic.

Sam > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:42

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Paul Ryan would not be able to handle being president. He just does what he is told, and I'm honestly not sure he has any beliefs of his own at this point.

BigBlock440 > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 11:42

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When their message is “vote for me because I’m not the other guy”, it’s not too difficult to see why people don’t want to waste their time. People would rather vote for  something, but if you aren’t offering anything, why should they bother?

Spanfeller is a twat > BigBlock440 07/11/2018 at 11:45

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Because it’s your responsibility to vote. If more people cared about the political affairs of the country, the politicians would become more representative.

You can only have a banker-supported democrat when few democrats read past the headlines, you can only have an evangelical supported-Trump when they never read past the headlines.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:46

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I’m afraid we’ll end up with some kind of civil war if Trump is removed from office (regardless of how legitimate the many and varied reasons are)...

nermal > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 11:54

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There has to be more to the story.

A US citizen crossing the border with his toddler doesn’t just disappear off the grid without the child, never to be seen again .

BigBlock440 > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 12:09

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So, which “not the other guy” is it my responsibility to vote for? Oh well, I guess I’ll just flip a coin.

No, people who are not informed should not vote, it only dilutes the vote of the people who are, and makes the person with the best sound bites or the flashiest/most ads the winner, instead of the person who would bring the best policy and carry out their duties correctly.  If neither candidate can make a compelling argument, why exactly should more people vote for one of them?

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/11/2018 at 12:10

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Did you post on a public forum?  Have this conversation over email or private message if you don’t want others replying to you.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 12:12

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In my view, at least half of the self-proclaimed ‘conservatives’ are not actually conservative. At least not fiscally.

A true conservative would not be in favour of a tax cut when there is a budgetary deficit.

In my observation, self-proclaimed ‘conservatives’ these days are just bigger bullshitters on average.

You voted Republican but “he’s not your president”?

Yeah fuck off with that bullshit.

You want things to get better but aren’t willing to switch your vote away from the Republicans?

Fuck off with that bullshit.

“So what I am saying is that the elected individual and his administration are a bunch of bigoted imbeciles that need to go and go NOW.”

I completely agree... and preferably Crooked Trump leaves office in handcuffs.

And for those who say Pence would be worse... I disagree. I have recently stopped believing that Pence would be worse. Oh he wouldn’t be a huge improvement. And at worst, I think there would be no difference.

I’m hoping that the families that got separated will eventually band together and make one giant terrifying (to Crooked Trump and his gang) class action lawsuit against the US government and personally against administration members who instituted the policy.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Future next gen S2000 owner 07/11/2018 at 12:14

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Nah... someone else needs to nominate you.

I’ll nominate you!

boredalways > Tekamul 07/11/2018 at 12:15

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Nah, let’s leave the amendments alone. The only real problem with them is all manmade: misinformation, fear mongering, ignorance, and a lack of critical thinking.

I wouldn’t mind, however, a legal tax of no more than 1% of an individual’s federal gross annual income if an eligible citizen doesn’t vote.

Because I'm a asshole.

boredalways > Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap 07/11/2018 at 12:16

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I guess I should have been a little more specific and inserted 'public'

boredalways > farscythe - makin da cawfee! 07/11/2018 at 12:18

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Only if giant meteor is a conservative

boredalways > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/11/2018 at 12:26

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That may happen, but I believe a properly run republic would squash that immediately. Even if it requires Martial Law.

...or Martian Law

My bird IS the word > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/11/2018 at 12:40

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Eww, don’t even suggest a civil war. I wouldn’t go to bat for him and I voted for him. Hell, I still would have voted for him.

Spanfeller is a twat > BigBlock440 07/11/2018 at 12:49

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The real dilution of the vote comes from the people that don’t vote. By not voting they give more power to the more fanatical, extremist people that show up every election .

BigBlock440 > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 13:00

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That doesn’t matter, it will be harder for the “fanatical, extremest people” to get their candidate the votes of the more informed populace that of the uninformed that are just going to be flipping a quarter. Is there a chance that in some local election that happens? Yes, but it’s local, and if they’re truly that bad, they will be dealt with quickly enough. Will it happen nationally ? Not unless there are a lot of “I’m only here because it’s my responsibility to pick one of these people that I don’t know anything about for a position I don’t know anything about” types.

“I like your shirt, ok I’ll vote for you”.

Future next gen S2000 owner > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 07/11/2018 at 13:07

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Seconded ! Motion carries!

Spanfeller is a twat > BigBlock440 07/11/2018 at 13:09

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What is your argument? Because I think you’re arguing for the sake of arguing. I’m saying more people should care about politics and go out to vote because they need to care about the country’s affairs. Voting for someone you don’t like because they’re the lesser of two evils doesn’t mean you should vote straight party (My argument is quite frankly, the contrary ). What I’m trying to say is that people need to have the spine to go vote for the least worst option and in a way that will be effective, that takes research and making compromises! If people want to have their “moral” candidate get to a national stage they need to care about them from the beginning, vote in the primaries, and try to spread the word.

BigBlock440 > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 13:25

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My argument is that people shouldn’t vote for the sake of voting. All the “go out and vote”, “it’s your civic duty to vote” shit just means a bunch of people who have no idea who is even running are voting because they’ve been shamed into it. You’d get the same results using a group of chimpanzees to select who wins. We’d be better off if they just stayed home. It also closes the door to better qualified, lesser known candidates from a different party, since now you’ve got a ton more people voting for the party they’ve always voted for or heard about rather than knowing which candidate they’re voting for, putting the lesser qualified candidate in office instead. It’s not the people’s voice when the people don’t even know what they’re saying.

Should anyone who wants to vote have the ability to do so? Yes.

Should they be forced or shamed into voting, regardless of their knowledge on the position and the candidates? Absolutely not.

If politicians want more votes, they should convince more people to vote for them for a good reason.  “I’m not the other guy, and it’s your civic duty to vote” isn’t a good reason and won’t bring anybody to the polls for you.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > My bird IS the word 07/11/2018 at 13:27

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You wouldn’t, but I’m afraid there are many that are blindly rabid in their support that would... And he’s shown that he’s not above riling them up.

My bird IS the word > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/11/2018 at 13:32

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That wouldn’t be a civil war. I t would be more like the rodney king riots. They try to ban guns I could see it, but that’s about all.

Spanfeller is a twat > BigBlock440 07/11/2018 at 13:36

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The other argument is that if you’re going to be forced to vote (like in Brazil) why not try to educate yourself about it?

I don’t think people should necessarily be legally forced to vote, but I think there should be a cultural shift towards more people voting and voting in a more informed manner.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > My bird IS the word 07/11/2018 at 13:36

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You’re right - it would just be localized riots. I wrote “some kind of” thinking that would lessen what I was saying, but it’s still wrong. There might be individuals and groups that would like to start a civil war if he was impeached and removed , but it wouldn’t go anywhere.

My bird IS the word > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/11/2018 at 13:38

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It’s easy to overblow these things, it’s all the media is pushing because they want it to happen. People are both dumber and lazier than most give credit for.

BigBlock440 > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 13:51

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The other argument is that if you’re going to be forced to vote (like in Brazil) why not try to educate yourself about it? 

Because it takes effort, and humans are lazy creatures. It could also lead to a rash of voting in your best interest, not necessarily the country’s with a candidate that promises everything, no matter how unrealistic. “eh, he’s promising me things, I’ll pull his number instead of this other guy that didn’t run as many ads”.

I don’t agree that everybody should be voting, or should even care about voting. If they’re content to let other’s handle the politics while they go about their life, they should be free to do so. If at any point they decide to stop being content, they should also be free to participate, but until that point, any vote they make will be uninformed and may or may not be for the better candidate . I don’t agree there needs to be a cultural shift, society is built on segmented responsibilities, and life can change dramatically year to year. If someone doesn’t have the time to properly research a candidate, or have the knowledge of what they’re actually voting on, I’d argue it’s more their responsibility to refrain from voting.  Some people don’t have a lot of free time for that stuff, and would rather take care of their function in society.

Tekamul > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 13:51

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I must be an asshole too, because I like that idea

Spanfeller is a twat > nermal 07/11/2018 at 14:12

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Feds are historically bad at accountability when it comes to who is a citizen of where

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/04/23/the-u-s-keeps-killing-americans-in-drone-strikes-mostly-by-accident/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.8a596326b395

boredalways > fintail 07/11/2018 at 15:00

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Bwahahahahaha, I finally looked up 'pi zdets'!

nermal > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 16:08

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What does Obama’s drones blowing up civilians (some of which were US citizens) in the Middle East have to with children of immigrants at the border being separated from their parents?

fintail > BigBlock440 07/11/2018 at 16:27

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Start your own forum if you want to make the rules.  

Until then, keep being an apologist and defender of the worst regime in modern American history, if not its entirety.  We expect nothing less.

Spanfeller is a twat > nermal 07/11/2018 at 16:38

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Someines they’re bad at accounting for what some agencies do to citizens 

fintail > boredalways 07/11/2018 at 16:39

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It sums up this new age in more than one way.

nermal > Spanfeller is a twat 07/11/2018 at 17:44

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I think the things that are done intentionally are much worse than the poor accounting practices.

Spanfeller is a twat > nermal 07/11/2018 at 19:11

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Not justifying either. I agree with you that this story must go deeper

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/12/2018 at 07:44

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I’m not making any rules...

fintail > BigBlock440 07/12/2018 at 09:45

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Pedantic view....

Have this conversation over email or private message if you don’t want others replying to you.

You want users to regulate their discussions in a certain manner.  I wasn’t butting in on you.   You came at me, bro.

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/12/2018 at 10:03

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What rules state that you can’t post a reply to someone if they don’t reply to you first? Please point me to this rule that I’m supposedly changing. I’m sorry you don’t know how the internet works.

You want users to regulate their discuss ions in a certain manner.

Is that not what saying “I wasn’t talking to you” is? You want users to regulate their discussions in a manner inconsistent with publicly accessible forums, including this one .  The OP wasn’t talking to you either when you typed up your comment.

fintail > BigBlock440 07/12/2018 at 10:10

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Who stated that was a rule? It’s bad form, but as a 45 supporter , bad form should have been expected. My mistake. 

Yes, I am sure you can lecture about “how the internet works” as much as you can lecture about the rudimentary elements of American elections.    Tons of cred, tons of knowledge, really, you’re bigly.

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/12/2018 at 10:23

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Who stated it was a rule? You did.

Start your own forum if you want to make th e rules.

fintail > BigBlock440 07/12/2018 at 10:26

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I stated you were trying to make rules. It’s not your place to do so.

So sure, yeah, if stating you are not in a position to make rules is a rule, then you are correct. Must be some more of those alternative facts you guys love so much.

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/12/2018 at 10:30

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Again, what rules am I trying to make?

fintail > BigBlock440 07/12/2018 at 10:37

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Do I have to type really slow ?

You blithered:

Have this conversation over email or private message if you don’t want others replying to you.

It’s not your role to make such demands. You don’t set those standards.   Your pedantic distracting arguments around it aren’t effective. Let it go man, y ou’re just getting deeper.

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/12/2018 at 10:52

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I’m not making demands, I’m making suggestions. If you don’t want someone to comment on your conversation, don’t post your conversation in public view. It’s how the internet works. That you seem to think you have some expectation of privacy on a publicly accessible forum is laughable. You don’t, and if it’s something you want to keep something private, keep it private, and you won’t run into issues with “undesirables” speaking to you.  It really is that simple.

fintail > BigBlock440 07/12/2018 at 11:09

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Ah, now just “suggestions”. I see. Again, you aren’t in a position to suggest anything. You came at me, and apart from not grasping context, you weren’t expected nor welcome. That you seem to think you have some kind of high ground, or even basic cred in this, is amusing. The cop outs never cease from the base. Simple is as simple do es.

BigBlock440 > fintail 07/12/2018 at 11:21

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It’s amazing how you still don’t grasp how the internet works, even after all these years.  Or apparently have reading comprehension.  See, I could start yelling STRAWMAN!, STRAWMAN!, because the only one even mentioning changing rules on here is you, but I don’t think you’d get that either.  If you want to be able to chose who is worthy to reply to your posts, start your own site, or join a closed forum, because you literally can’t do that here.  I don’t know how you still can’t grasp this basic concept, YOUR POSTS ARE NOT PRIVATE!

fintail > BigBlock440 07/12/2018 at 11:24

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The point seems to be beyond you, and any reasoning is like screaming at a brick wall. Strawman indeed, keep distracting. Maybe you are cranky and cluelessly boorish from constantly winning so much. Protip: don’t  lecture about what you don’t grasp.

Good day, good luck!