Ok Oppo, let's talk politics but with a SWERVE!

"fhrblig" (fhrblig) 02/22/2018 at 21:22 • Filed to: None

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Cutest safety image ever!

Don’t worry, I’m not dredging up a specific topic or trying to polarize anyone. Rather, I want to ask you a question. Is there a political topic where you once held a strong, line-in-the-sand position on but later did a complete 180 on?

For me it was same-sex marriage. That might seem weird since I’m a gay man, but it was more of a “I don’t need the government’s permission” thing than anything else. Truth is, I never ever once believed I’d see gay marriage be an actual thing. I was in high school in Colorado when Amendment 2 passed. I remember having leaflets left on my car by Colorado for Family Values that had the most disgusting dehumanizing things in them about us, especially about what we would do to children. I knew exactly what everyone thought of me as a person when it passed. So it’s really easy to be all “I don’t even care, whatevs” if you know there’s no chance you’ll ever be allowed to participate.

Fast forward to 2008. I met my partner, and we moved in together. For the first time in my life I had someone who I really loved and wanted to spend my life with. I’d had flings, but never anything serious because why pursue a relationship when you’d never be allowed to be married? Well, I got a huge wake-up call when he had to go to the emergency room. I had no idea what was wrong with him, but I was panicking. What if they won’t let me go back there with him? They were entirely within their rights to deny me any access to see him or prevent me from acting on his behalf because we had no relationship under the law. I want to give huge thanks to the Medical Center of Aurora, because everyone there has always treated me like I was his spouse. I was allowed to be with him the whole time. It turned out to be a kidney stone. Since then he’s had to go back a couple times for the same thing and each time they treated us just like everyone else, but every time I still worried that someone would prevent me from being there. And they absolutely could have.

Some time after that, President Obama publicly stated that he was in favor of gay marriage. I remember the day, because I had been pressed into service as a delivery driver and was listening to the radio when it happened. At first I thought no big deal, he should have come out for it sooner, etc. But then about 10 minutes later, right as I pulled up to a stop, I broke down crying. This was the first time a sitting President ever said that I deserved equal treatment. Sure, Ford came out in favor of it later in his life, but this was the first sitting President to do so. I know lots of people don’t like him, but I will always be grateful for that. Then the Colorado law banning same-sex marriage got overturned. I knew that the Supreme Court would be reviewing the case in June. I kind of rushed my partner into going to the clerk to get a marriage license, and surprised the hell out of my mother and my mother-in-law in the process. We’ve never had a wedding, and that kind of sucks... but I wanted to make sure we had protection under the law, hoping that even if the Supreme Court overruled Obergefell that our license would remain intact. It ended up that they ruled in favor of same-sex marriage, so our license is good no matter what. And now, more people support same-sex marriage than in any other time.

At times I still have trouble believing it ever happened. The sudden shift toward acceptance was completely stunning.

I know, it’s a very self-serving issue to have a change of heart on, but I really did believe it wasn’t important at one time in my life.

So, come and tell us all why you changed your mind on whatever subject you changed your mind on. And to all...keep an open mind, even if someone shifted to a position to something you disagree with.

jkm7680 > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:29

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The main thing I’ve changed my position on over the years is gay marriage and gay rights. I just decided that if it doesn’t concern me, why do I care? Just let them be happy doing what they want to do. It’s not my business if a dude wants to marry another dude.

For Sweden > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:29

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Some time after that, President Obama publicly stated that he was in favor of gay marriage.

Took him long enough.

fhrblig > For Sweden 02/22/2018 at 21:31

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Agreed. There are lots of Democrats that I believe were in favor of same-sex marriage all along but were cowards and allowed themselves to be intimidated.

CB > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:31

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I used to be certain, but now I’m not so sure.

For me, I’ve gone from “I’m always going to vote for X party!” to “let’s see who has the best track record, whose values are close to my own”. And the death penalty. I went from “it’s permissible in some cases” to “never”. So no complete flips.

Also, are you ever going to have a wedding or renewal of vows and do a big ceremony?

For Sweden > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:33

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“Should we put a gender requirement on state licenses?”

“yes”

“Should we make it harder for people to start two-parent nuclear families just because they aren’t straight?”

“yes”

fhrblig > CB 02/22/2018 at 21:33

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I don’t know if I can ever resolve my feelings about the death penalty. I swing wildly back and forth on it.

JeepJeremy > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:36

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I was raised in a very conservative home. But my parents ALWAYS told my sister and I that we needed to make our own way in this world and find our own path. My sister and I graduated from Ohio State and she and I are SUPER liberal. I’ve done a 180 on a lot of issues. Mainly it’s been over how an issue was presented to you while you’re young and ignorant and then after age and wisdom and experience kick in and it’s like WOAH I’ve been WAY off base on that issue my whole life.

djmt1 > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:39

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Social housing in London. Being a working class lad, I was all for free homes for the poor in the most expensive city in the world. Now I’m lower middle class, I loathe the idea that being shit at school gets you a free home. School reunion was equally enlightening as depressing.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:43

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For me, it was probably same sex marriage as well, but for different reasons. I grew up in a conservative Christian household and was taught that homosexuality was a sin. I was the stereotypical Christian that looked on in quiet judgement, but now that I’ve matured, making my own thoughts, and am moved out, I’ve completely changed my mind. I think same-sex marriage is a great thing, especially since this country is based on the freedom to choose.

*note, I’m not trying to make this a religious discussion but I found it to be relevant background*

Scary__goongala! > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:44

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Exactly what jkm said below.

CB > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:44

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Totally understandable. It’s a difficult issue to reconcile.

CB > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:44

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Totally understandable. It’s a difficult issue to reconcile.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:45

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Many things in the recent years, for example: gun rights. I used to be a gun nut, and I still am a gun owner, but I believe our gun laws are far to lax. I don’t think an outright ban is the right thing to do, because historically in America banning things made the black market stronger, but no one needs multiple 30 round clips. No one needs a gun right then, at that moment. No one needs an event(gun show) that makes it easy to buy a gun without a background check. No one should be able to sell a gun without proper credentials. No one needs to carry a gun without taking a training course(I have). No one needs to open carry(in fact I think it’s an absolutely stupid idea, as you are the first target in the event of a shooting). The Second Amendment is completely outdated, as our military has much more powerful weapons now, and we stand no chance against them(nor should we have ready access to surface-to-air missiles).

I used to be a fairly hateful, close-minded bigot. In fact, I wouldn’t have associated with you or people like you for being gay(thanks Alabama conservative upbringing), and for that, I sincerely apologize for being such a shitty person in the past.

So, basically, most of my political beliefs have taken a 180 degree turn in the past 5 years.

farscythe - makin da cawfee! > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:45

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i dont have strong feelings for most anything political (or most anything... prolly something wrong with me on that point)(wife n daughter excempted coz im very much a me n mine then ill worrie about anything else type)

cept guns.... if you dont need them you shouldnt be able to own them (and no you dont need a gun for home defense) if you hunt or live in area where wildlife will eat your baby fine own a gun... if you just shoot for funsies rent one at the club....

i dont foresee meself doing a 180 on that anytime soon tho..... thats why i try to stay out of gun control comments with americans.... all convinced someone will break into their home and murder them all if they dont have weapons (all safely stored of course coz fat load of good that will do ya in an emergency)

Svend > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:47

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I’ve always been for gay marriage, I mean, why should they be happy all their lives. Lol.

#JustKidding.

I don’t have very strong opinions except on paedophiles, gun laws and anti abortionists.

They are opinions that will never change.

AestheticsInMotion > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:56

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Drugs. Growing up with a lazy, unmotivated parent who smoked pot and cigarettes all day every day, another alcoholic parent that came into and out of my life at random times and was often jobless or homeless, and a brother who had a long and damaging relationship with heroine among other things... Made me hate anything drug-related with a passion. Seeing what it did to people, ruining lives, destroying ambition, dehumanizing and tearing a person apart physically and mentally... I stayed as far away from any of that as possible and had zero respect for addicts. I’d go so far as to call it a deep loathing. They had no will power, couldn’t control their urges and they would reap what they had sown. Just a shame that they hurt others in their downward spiral.

I certainly wasn’t a goody two shoes, it’s just that my particular vices were the gym and women. And food. There were some serious eating issues that stayed hidden only because of constant working out, be it weights, running, swimming, whatever. After highschool I finally lightened up a bit and had my first drink. It was a bit of “a moment”. Friends had tried to get me to drink for five years and had all but given up and then out of nowhere I decided to take a shot at a Halloween party. From then to now I drink occasionally, a cider here and there and a few cocktails with a date. Maybe once a month I’ll go out drinking. Despite an addictive personality and alcoholism in the family it was pretty clear from the start that I wouldn’t have any issues with alcohol. Buying alcohol on the other hand... I always get shit from friends because I have hundreds of bottles in a well stocked bar but rarely drink. I just like being prepared if anyone else wants a drink.

Anyways... I kinda lost the thread. What I’m trying to say is that I loosened up quite a bit, and am now a “to each their own” person. You want to do drugs, go for it. Washington makes pot legal? Eh. Doesn’t really effect me. Just... Be responsible. Know yourself, know your mental health and make good choices. I still firmly believe that smoking cigarettes is one of the worst things you can do to the people around you though. That will likely never change.

Spanfeller is a twat > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 21:59

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An issue I was againts and changed?

Probably affirmative action...

but it was my first big political take... most issue to me now are based on my exploration of affirmative action. It was the first issue I had to think about seriously before I spouted bullshit about. It was the first issue I was corrected about, the first debate topic I conceded about, and the first topic that made me challenge my privilege, the privilege of others, and how my privilege might blindfold me to certain realities.

As some say here Me puse en los zapatos del otro .

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:02

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I mostly hold more nuanced political views instead of my childhood “blanket statement” tendencies. Pretty typical growing-up process.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 02/22/2018 at 22:03

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ALSO: inb4 it’s not a clip it’s a magazine. Whatever.

fhrblig > CB 02/22/2018 at 22:05

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As far as a ceremony, I’m torn. I kinda want one, but I know we can’t afford one anytime soon. And my husband seems indifferent to it. So...maybe?

victor > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:17

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Growing up in a conservative Christian home in California , I have come around on same sex marriage, affirmative action, illegal immigration, taxes, health insurance policy, and pretty much everything else.

Mind you, I still go to church; but I think my view of what Jesus was espousing does not line up with a conservative perspective the more and more I read the Bible.

Kiltedpadre > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:20

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I can’t think of any specific issues where I’ve made a full 180, but there are certainly many issues that in the past I didn’t really have specific opinions on purely because they didn’t effect me that I have strong opinions on now. As I’ve matured I’ve come to realize that whether I’m personally effected by an issue doesn’t mean I shouldn’t advocate for or against something.

Feeling something is wrong, but not trying to do anything about it because it “wasn’t my battle” was something I realized was a mistake once I matured to the point of better being able to view the outside world with empathy. What good are opinions and values if you don’t try to do something about something that violates them?

fhrblig > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 02/22/2018 at 22:25

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Much of my family hunts, so I support gun rights somewhat. But we’ve reached a point where the arguments against gun control are becoming untenable, I think.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:28

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“I took money from the NRA, why would I give up my summer home for a few kids lives?”

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:29

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Where is the assistant branch manager?

Bman76 (hates WS6 hoods, is on his phone and has 4 burners now) > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:30

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For me it’s basically a copy of what Jordan said. I grew up around guns and I’m a gun owner myself, but I’ve become completely disillusioned by what the hobby and gun ownership has become. I enjoy hunting and trap shooting, but I just can’t understand why anyone needs more than 5 rounds in a magazine. I can’t understand the resistance to waiting periods or in depth background checks.

Growing up in a conservative household in the midwest meant that I was a pretty homophobic jerk throughout high school and more than a little xenophobic as well. Luckily the first semester of Architecture school cured me of both of those traits real quick, and in general made me a much happier/better person.

fhrblig > Kiltedpadre 02/22/2018 at 22:33

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I struggle with that. Speaking up is hard for me, but I try to force myself to stand up for what I believe in now.

Kiltedpadre > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:41

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I became ordained as a minister online so I could officiate a wedding for a gay couple I worked with. After telling my 90yo homophobic grandmother why I did it the rest became much easier.

There are still times that speaking out on issues can be hard, but that’s because I’m a very shy and quite person in general. I am much better now at speaking my convictions than I used to be though.

HammerheadFistpunch > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:44

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I used to believe people would generally act in their own best interests, then I started seeing more and more crossover coupes

fhrblig > HammerheadFistpunch 02/22/2018 at 22:48

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I genuinely LOL’ed.

Also, crossover coupes are exactly the kind of thing my partner is into, so does that mean you’d be against gay marriage now?

HammerheadFistpunch > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 22:50

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well I’m certainly thinking out loud about his tastes in vehicles.

CTSenVy > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 23:01

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State ran Healthcare. Was completely against it but now think it has to eventually happen just to keep the economy working. I’ve seen way too many people be wiped out financially due to med bills even with insurance.

Shoop > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 23:01

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Lel, Ive mostly moved right on things, but ive learned not to talk about them on the internet.

fhrblig > AestheticsInMotion 02/22/2018 at 23:02

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I never did try cigarettes. My mom and stepdad smoked, and then my stepdad died of lung cancer in ‘97. My mom hasn’t smoked since he was diagnosed.

I have smoked cigars since after I graduated high school. Not sure what drew me to them. My mom says my dad smoked them, but I don’t remember ever seeing him do it.

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > fhrblig 02/22/2018 at 23:39

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I’ve always been sort of a leftie but with some different economic views. I had a lot of protectionist ideas because I grew up in a town that was devastated by the fact that it was wholly dependent on a single industry.

I thought that NAFTA was a major ball-drop for the left in the early 90s because it was a Reagan economic policy. Now I understand that the global economic environment is much more nuanced than that and trade agreements are often set up to be mutually beneficial.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 02/22/2018 at 23:44

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No one needs to open carry(in fact I think it’s an absolutely stupid idea, as you are the first target in the event of a shooting).

in my area people started putting stickers on their cars, and I always think

A) you’re not going to intimidate me, I’m still going to honk and

B) you dumb MF, you just announced you have a gun, if it doesn’t act as a deterrent you just gave them an incentive to act.

scoob > fhrblig 02/23/2018 at 00:32

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Born and raised and still reside in leftist liberal elite city, so I’ve always disliked guns. But I once watched a vlog from a YouTuber about his trip to a gun range, and it finally hit me.

There are good gun owners out there, and there are terrible ones. Just like there are good car owners, and terrible ones as well. We just always hear about the bad ones: the ones who street race, spin out at Cars and Coffee, and so on. People against cars whine about pollution and bad drivers, but us enthusiasts still love cars. We want to take them to the track and enjoy them. Same goes for the good gun owners out there. They want to go to target practice and see how sharp they are.

Banning guns outright would almost be like if cars were banned, in that us enthusiasts would be completely screwed. Well not me, since I don’t have a car, but still.

Either way, I still don’t give a crap about guns, but I guess I understand now?

Alfalfa > fhrblig 02/23/2018 at 00:44

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Abortion. Theologically, my opinion remains the same, that it should only be done in dire circumstances such as when the mother’s life is at risk or rape victims for starters. But I’ve realized that the State is definitely not the body to make that decision. It’s a deeply personal decision no matter how or why it’s made, and should stay that way.

It often confuses the hell out of people when I say I’m theologically pro-life, but politically pro-choice.

bhtooefr > fhrblig 02/23/2018 at 02:24

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I used to be full-on libertarian, until I realized three things:

The tragedy of the commons is a whole thing that exists.

The “rational actors” that the libertarian system needs to work... not enough of those exist. Information asymmetry is a real thing (especially with poor education systems, which libertarian systems encourage), as is exploiting people’s emotions.

The core tenet of “your right to swing your fist ends at my face” is a great one, but... what is your fist? What is my face?

Since then, I’ve ended up moving very, very far left.

duurtlang > Alfalfa 02/23/2018 at 05:00

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It often confuses the hell out of people when I say I’m theologically pro-life, but politically pro-choice.

I think that’s a very mature point of view, really. You realize that your personal opinion shouldn’t impact the very important and difficult life choices of others you have no connection to. Even if they make a decision that you personally oppose, it is none of your business.
Sadly, many people never reach that level which I view as maturity.

duurtlang > fhrblig 02/23/2018 at 05:12

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No 180s here that I recall. I’ve become more nuanced though. More accepting of other opinions, as long as there is some rational thought behind that other opinion and a willingness to at least listen to other opinions.

I still hold that life is too short for owning a Toyota-like beigebox though.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas 02/23/2018 at 06:53

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In the event of a mass shooting, the shooter will seek out the person with a gun before they start popping off rounds.

diplodicus > AestheticsInMotion 02/23/2018 at 09:03

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I lived the reverse of that lol. Started smoking pot when I was 13 drinking shortly after that. Drank quite a lot in high school and excessively in college. I’d be hungover practically ever day, skip class so much that I failed out and when I did go to class I had multiple teachers ask me if I was even in the right place. Really shitty time in my life. Ended up quitting drinking shortly after turning 21. Experimented with pills, lsd, mushrooms too around the same time. A girl got my best friend addicted to heroin, I eventually got him to quit, and then she hung out with him when I was away at college and shot him up while he was drunk. He od’d, his roomates saved his life by getting him to the er. He ended up moving half way across the country to get away from it and then I just completely cut everyone I knew from that part of my life out of it. Now I don’t really have friends, it’s tough to make friends as an adult when you basically just used drugs to make friends your whole life. Exercise has basically become my addiction, along with my dog. Not drinking at all definitely makes it harder to meet women, and once they find out I never drink because I have a problem they usually lose interest. I get it though. Cigarettes I still struggle with, it’s been over a month since my last one but I still mentally crave them.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > AestheticsInMotion 02/23/2018 at 09:09

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Very sorry to hear you had such a rough childhood... very glad you didn’t let yourself become a victim to it.

punkgoose17 > fhrblig 02/23/2018 at 09:15

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I flipped on health care. I used to think health insurance should be privatized because the government is pretty bad at running things. Then I realized private health insurance is bad too because the insurance companies gouge the hospital prices and while the insurance company will agree to pay 80% of the asking price that makes the uninsured required to pay 100% of the asking price. Also you end up with different networks and difficulty finding the right doctor. With government health care it will still be junk, but at least everyone will be covered and it will be one system.

I used to believe in protectionist economic policies to keep jobs in the country, but now I prefer free trade and using tariffs to and embargoes against human rights violators.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > fhrblig 02/23/2018 at 21:48

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cutest cover image.

A saying that was said by someone smarter than me was “if you’re teh same at 30 as you were at 15 you didn’t grow up, you just got older” 

I grew up in a right leaning household, and was heavily influenced by my grandfather who was a republican fundraiser of the Rockefeller sort. This shaped a lage part of my early political thought process. Since then I;ve tacked to the left as I find the gop has lost their minds, first with the Iraq war, then christian right during Ws days, and the tea party was the final closing arguement.   

I think the biggest shift I would have to say would be on gun control. My grandfather being a hunter introduced me to guns at a young age. I had toys guns and played cowboys and indians or civil war, then couldn’t wait to get my first bb gun. then pellet gun, then paintball marker. I drank the nra coolaid after columbine of “from my cold dead hands”. I was always looking at it from the perspective of why are you going to take my hunting rifle.

It was a number of conversations with a family aquantence who was a cop that that really made me reevaluate how I stand. I think most gun owners are compeltly delusional when it comes to their assessment of their skills and ability. When the Virginia tech massacre happened it was just confirmation there are too many guns adn they’re too easy to get. The responses after Sandy Hook and now Florida I just find insane.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > AestheticsInMotion 02/23/2018 at 22:01

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I had a few people in my life with drinking problems. As a result I never drank till I was 21. It finally me accepting that “I am not that person”.

I came around to legalization of pot when in a liqour store before christmas. i was buying a crazy amount of booze for 4 parties and some for gifts. It was then I realized, I could drink myself to death 20+ times with the amount of booze I have and the only thing they’re going to ask me at the register is for an ID, and cash or credit.