Why isn't the CTS selling?

"mkbruin, Atlas VP" (mkbruin)
09/16/2015 at 10:29 • Filed to: None

The CTS is amazing; however, I rarely see them on the road. By volumes I see, its getting dwarfed by the ATS and the XTS.

Why is the CTS such a slow seller for being so brilliant?

DISCUSSION (32)

McMike > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:32

I think it’s because of the ATS.

Didn’t the ATS take it’s slot, allowing the CTS to grow into something people consider before they realize that with a few options that a BMW is the same price?

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:33

It’s definitely the ATS. My lust for an ATS-V greatly exceeds my lust for a CTS-V. The same goes for their non-V models.

spanfucker retire bitch > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:34

Of course the ATS is going to sell more. In the same way the 3-series sells more than the 5-series, or the C-Class sells more than the E-Class.

That issue it isn’t seling relative to the E-Class, 5-Series, or GS series. As to why? I couldn’t say beyond brand perception.

Party-vi > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:34

Because the last CTS was a 5-Series competitor with 3-Series pricing that made a lot of would-be buyers wary. “Why is this American 5-Series the price of a 3-Series? Is it bad?” is how luxury car buyers think, which explains why Hyundai and Kia aren’t exactly seeing Equus’ and K900s flying out of dealer lots.

The new CTS is gorgeous, and you can get over 400hp, which is more than the competitors offer unless you got with an AMG or M5. I don’t think the new CTS is getting the recognition it deserves.

marshknute > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:38

Because the interior isn’t up to par with the Germans/Lexus, and CUE is the most abysmal infotainment system ever put into a luxury car. Rumor has it Cadillac is already working on a clean-slate design for a replacement infotainment system.

jjhats > McMike
09/16/2015 at 10:41

ATS isn’t selling either

spanfucker retire bitch > marshknute
09/16/2015 at 10:43

It’s no rumor. Just look at the interior shots of the CT6.

Luke's Dad Sold His 2000TL To Get a Sienna > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:49

I’ve sat in one and the rear while it looks good that it slopes back, meant that there’s like no headroom in the back. I’m only 5’ 6 and my head was very close to the roof when I sat in the front seat. (Although that might only be from how the Car Show people set the seats.)

Part of me is glad that none are selling because the stock that’s left with the old badge is like New AND selling for $14,000 off.

Danger Ranger XLT > Party-vi
09/16/2015 at 10:50

I’m not sure about that.

The previous two generations of CTS were 5 series sized with a 3 series price. They sold loads of them, sometimes as many as 60,000/year. The new CTS is more expensive, a financial crisis or two has happened since the original’s introduction, and its previous pricing point replaced by ATS. Makes sense they’d sell fewer.

BMW and Mercedes sell cars with 400hp+ that aren’t AMG or M, BMW’s with 445, but they cost more than the CTS and Mercedes seems to have killed off the E550. Hyundai and Kia can’t sell luxury cars because Hyundai and Kia don’t sell luxury cars. Maybe 20 more years will change buyers’ minds. Maybe they’ll leave the US luxury market like VW.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 10:54

Because it sucks

Party-vi > Danger Ranger XLT
09/16/2015 at 10:56

Oh hell, I forgot about the 550i. Also, for all intents and purposes the Equus and K900 are luxury cars from a non-luxury marque. If people did not care about badge and brand recognition they’d spend less money to get the equivalent car, but if that happened then we wouldn’t have luxury brands to begin with.

nermal > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 11:00

It’s because despite the best efforts of everyone at Cadillac to change the brand perception, it’s still exactly the same. Old people buy the cars, and old people and wrappers buy the Escalade. Also, old people that can’t afford an Escalade buy whatever the rebadged Chevy crossover thing is.

Stop by your local dealer and you’ll see. You can get a brand new ATS for < $30k with low options and discounts. Despite that very reasonable entry into the brand for young people, the dealership will look like something that your grandfather would really enjoy.

In order to fix the brand, they need to rename everything to something starting with Q completely revamp the product, brand, and buying experience to something completely modern. The problem is that doing so risks completely alienating their core customer base, which is old people.

Thus, where they are currently.

Ash78, voting early and often > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 11:05

Anecdote or fact? I still see 50-100 CTS for every ATS.

But I could be wrong...it could be the “A3 effect” where the two look so similar from 100 yards away, I’m actually seeing the ATS everywhere. But I doubt it.

The demographics in my area shun the Mercedes CLA in favor of the C-Class, and this is the same basic analog.

Tom McParland > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 11:11

1. Prestige - must lux buyers want the badge

2. Resale value and lease prices - the Caddy can’t hold value like the Germans so it hard to compete with those heavy lease incentives from the Europeans. The only thing Caddy can do is throw tons of cash at the car to reduce the sale price and have lower lease payments. But that doesn’t help the lack of prestige.

TL:DR - Caddy doesn’t sell because of chicken and egg problem.

Danger Ranger XLT > Party-vi
09/16/2015 at 11:17

Unfortunately for the Equus and K900, they seem popular only among people who can’t afford them. Those who could, don’t, because value be damned (or something). For what its worth, I think these cars would be smart alternatives to more typical choices, including the Cadillacs that started this conversation.

HOWEVER. I’ve been seeing more Genesis sedans than I anticipated. $38,000 base is a lot for a Hyundai - perhaps perceptions are changing and people are recognizing Korean bargains when they see them in markets unconventional for Korean brands. $53,000 gets you a fully loaded 3.6AWD, which looks like a good deal from here (a base E350 4Matic starts at $56k...).

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman
09/16/2015 at 11:21

elaborate...?

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
09/16/2015 at 11:26

Nope. The sales numbers speak for themselves

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 11:31

After seeing one on the road, I’m glad I rarely do. That face is awful. No one looks at a methhead’s mugshot and says, “Hey, I think I want those teardrop tats on my car!”, and that is what the DRL’s look like. From the face back, it’s a great looking car, but that face...

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman
09/16/2015 at 11:38

Oh, ok any car that doesn’t have huge sales stats sucks then?

That’s pretty fucking stupid.

Battery Tender Unnecessary > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 11:43

It’s in a weird place, market-wise. At it’s price, you’re out of the section of car buying where people gravitate to the cheapest car that looks good and has the features they want. You’re getting into the tier where people instead say, “why don’t I just spend a few extra thousand and get the BMW, Mercedes, Audi, etc. ‘I deserve’.” They are still suffering the sins of their 70s-00s cars and brand image.

TylerJ > Danger Ranger XLT
09/16/2015 at 11:52

re: $38k Genesis sedan

On Autotrader, dealers are marking new GenSedans way down to near $30k levels.

JR1 > Tom McParland
09/16/2015 at 11:54

I wonder if the dealership network doesn’t have something to do with it? A Cadillac dealership should not have the service of a Chevy dealership and sometimes the two brands overlap.

JR1 > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 11:57

CUE for one. Dealership service for another. Brand perception. And have you noticed Cadillac is never the star car in movies? BMW, Audi, Mercedes. Cadillac needs to get into that market of being the official car of whatever movie is out.

Tom McParland > JR1
09/16/2015 at 12:11

Dealers are part of the problem too.

Danger Ranger XLT > TylerJ
09/16/2015 at 12:18

Wow, maybe that explains the ones I’ve seen! That’s like Sonata Hybrid MSRP money for a whole lot more car

TylerJ > Danger Ranger XLT
09/16/2015 at 12:22

Yeah I’m tempted to take a look at them, but I know if I did get one, I’d kick myself for not going for the 5.0 engine.

Tapas > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 12:37

Because no matter what people say, a car purchase is (at least in part) an emotional purchase.

People can’t always understand the rationale behind decisions other people make. Maybe the product doesn’t feel right? Or just because they don’t wanna get a Cadillac?

I don’t even know why people I’ve known my whole life do certain things.

Your boy, BJR > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman
09/16/2015 at 12:57

How?

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
09/16/2015 at 13:06

For a company (and more importantly investors), if it doesn’t sell at targets or better, it sucks. You failed at providing a competitive product. It’s that simple.

If you were a Cadillac planner and you had a product on hand that was losing you money, what would you see it as? A success? If the answer to that is yes, then you’d be a bad executive

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman
09/16/2015 at 13:09

Because they don’t move a lot of units doesn’t mean it’s a bad car.

It means it’s either priced wrong or people don’t KNOW it’s a good car.

There’s a lot of things that go into this, you can’t just dismiss the car because of sales figures.

If that’s your policy, I think you’re the one that would be a bad executive.

Give me reasons as to why the CTS is actually a bad car.

ranwhenparked > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 20:31

Couple of things. Cars in general are a tougher sell now because everybody wants crossovers, the Cadillac brand still doesn’t have the status of BMW/Mercedes/Audi, and the shift in price and positioning to make room for the ATS is confusing and alienating buyers.

Maybe if they had renamed the car when they shuffled it’s position, instead of waiting for the next generation to call it CTwhatever. The fact is that the current CTS is occupying a different niche than previous CTSs, but it’s being hamstrung by the former car.

Marcus > mkbruin, Atlas VP
09/16/2015 at 22:02

Advertising. They've made the nice car, now they need to let people know about it.