Datsun 2000 vs Triumph Spitfire 1500

"mikecyc72usa" (mikecyc72usa) 07/31/2015 at 21:06 • Filed to: Datsun 2000, Triumph Spitfire 1500, Harris Hill Road, Good Carma Automotive, SPL Parts, track test, vintage, track session, comparison terst, driving impressions

7

14

It was a classic setup: two friends have cars from roughly the same era. Both are formerly dormant and abandoned, now rescued. Rob Curtis of Good Carma Automotive ( !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ) and I, Mike Jankowski of SPL Parts ( !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ) have been friends for years. A few years ago I helped Rob get his SU carbs working, and his Datsun 2000 hasn’t looked back since. Even then we thought it’d be interesting to do a comparison. Two seater convertibles. Two crazy, rabid owners. A comparison test, but where?

Harris Hill Road, ( !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ) just south of Austin was the chosen site. Of course, it wasn’t as simple as that. We had agreed on a date. Then Rob’s car had tie rod end issues. My car had differential woes. We pushed it back. A few times. However, one fine Sunday morning in early July we met at Harris Hill. This wasn’t a race, it was truly a comparison. We’d do laps together, swap cars, and do more laps, then discuss impressions, then do more laps. Simple. Life is never simple. After a quick inspection of each car we headed inside.

After signing the requisite waivers and paying fees, Rob and I headed out on course. First impressions from me: “My front suspension springs are tired. I have little grip on 175/70r13 radials. My carb needles are great for road trips halfway across the country, but not for track work. That Datsun seems to be staying behind me - oh, never mind, there he goes. Jeez does that thing sound good. Talk about torque. Seems to hook up and take a set in the corners. He’s pulling away...” Well, until he pulled off into the pits. I followed suit.

The Datsun’s water temp was creeping up, and you can notice the evidence of it. But after a little bleeding all was well, and I was thinking “Japanese reliability, my ass.” After some discussions of the car characteristics, we agreed to swap cars. I got into the Datsun, Rob got into the Spitfire, and after some belt and seat adjustments and some tips to each other, we were off. So far my car was doing ok, running well, and I was excited to drive the Datsun for the first time.

Are either of these cars stock? Hardly. But the mods are pretty equal. Rob has Miata seats in his, mine are stock, I have uprated ignition, carbs, bushings, shocks, the list goes on. Neither of these charges are concours quality cosmetically, either. Yet both are solid, well maintained and well used on a regular basis. The first difference I noticed was pedal placement. The Dastun brake and accelerator are on the same plane for great downshifting. The clutch is light but a bit vague. The brakes are there, but have a totally different feel, and require a bit of faith at first.

Once out on the track, Rob took off in my car and was really throwing it around. I was getting used to the Datsun’s brakes, steering, and handling. It was great. Cornered well, power hook up was beautiful, and the steering was different, but direct. The brakes took getting used to, but bit well. It was at this point I saw my car slowing, then slowly rolling onto the grass at the top of the hill. I pulled off beside him and we tried to restart my car. Fuel starvation while cornering? Nope. Bad coil? We weren’t getting spark, so we got a tow back to the clubhouse.

Turns out it was a wire that came off in my ignition module. While diagnosing, then laughing at it being that simple, we talked about the differences now that we had seat time in both. Truth be told, other than some ergonomic issues with the Datsun, it was damn near perfect. Main gauges more in your sightline for one. Brake and gas pedals not on planes that require you to lift your foot 3-4 inches to go from gas to brake. I prefer the Triumph steering wheel position, though.

Rob commented how much he liked the shifter position in the Spitfire. “You don’t have to reach way down over there for it, just drop your hand off the wheel and it’s there.” Though the long throw compared to the Datsun is a negative in my opinion. Mechanically both cars are similar in concept, but much different in execution. The Datsun is a 2 liter engine with a 5 speed gearbox. The Triumph is a 1.5 liter with a 4 speed, though a marginally lighter car.

Rob’s biggest complaint of my car was “It needs stiffer front springs and LOTS more tire.” I agree totally. Where the Datsun would set up, grip and be steady over the bumps and dips of Harris Hill, my car wasn’t quite as composed. It was more a religious experience in that you had to have faith it was going to settle down. Eventually. The front was kind of shall we say, jello-y? Hit a bump, suspension compressed, then rebounded, then kind of compressed again, throwing weight bias off and loading and unloading the front wheels erratically. (New front springs have been fitted, and the handling is much better. Though stiffer may be needed yet.)

Rob’s car has grunt, character, grip, and is a blast. My car has less grunt, less grip, lots more character in some areas, less in others, and is a blast as well. It’s easy to see how the Japanese started with the Datsun roadsters and kept refining the idea of sports cars through the decades. They took British ideas, revamped them, and even now are still sticking to those core ideas. Witness the latest MX-5.

There will be a follow up, as this was the first in several test and comparison sessions. Rob’s feedback was invaluable. It validated my assessment of my car, and mine his. Both of us had an absolute fantastic time, and we developed our next action plans for our cars. When it cools off later this year, the action will heat up again. Watch for that writeup.

I also want to thank the guys at Harris Hill Road, and the other members who showed up as the morning progressed and dealt with some very slow traffic (me, I barely got my car to 85 at most) in a gracious manner. Thank you!

RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars > mikecyc72usa 07/31/2015 at 21:15

2

Great article and an interesting and awesome comparison between two equally cool and fairly similar cars from two different methods of thought! :)

mikecyc72usa > RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars 07/31/2015 at 21:15

1

Thank you!

RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars > mikecyc72usa 07/31/2015 at 21:17

1

You’re welcome, looking forward to the next one!

Laird Andrew Neby Bradleigh > mikecyc72usa 07/31/2015 at 21:23

1

Two bloody awesome cars, and an awesome story :) More please.

mikecyc72usa > Laird Andrew Neby Bradleigh 07/31/2015 at 21:26

0

There will be. I’ll be catching up with my other adventures in the Spitfire soon.

Laird Andrew Neby Bradleigh > mikecyc72usa 07/31/2015 at 21:28

0

Sweet :)

someassemblyrequired > mikecyc72usa 08/01/2015 at 00:17

1

Spitfires are totally underrated - I wish my Dad’s Mk3 hadn’t violated his “three times at the side of the road” rule because it was a fun beast. Weber carb, electronic igntion, Ansa 4-tipped exhaust, full-syncro gearbox from a Mk4 and a Sherwood tape deck. 16 yr old me was in heaven, until it got traded in on a Taurus.

mikecyc72usa > someassemblyrequired 08/01/2015 at 11:30

1

True they are underrated. Even with my skinny tires and soft front springs I could hang with Spec Miatas in the turns, but exiting they would drive away like crazy. This is my 12th Spitfire, and 43rd Triumph. To have driven close to 80,000 miles in it since March 2010 hasn’t been a huge issue, except no AC here in Austin. It’s been basically as reliable as any modern car I’ve had.

someassemblyrequired > mikecyc72usa 08/02/2015 at 01:57

0

You have to remember the big leaf spring IRS out back, but they are fantastic handling little cars. Ha 43 Triumphs - as long as there were only a few TR7s you’ve had some fun.

The one we had ate clutches like crazy towards the end. In retrospect it was probably a bent flywheel or pressure plate issue. But before it ate 3 clutches within 3000 miles we’d think nothing of taking it a couple of hundred miles from home. Even with the clutch issues it was definitely much more reliable than the Taurus that replaced it.

mikecyc72usa > someassemblyrequired 08/02/2015 at 18:14

0

TR7 and TR8 are some of my favorite Triumphs. The early Spitfires were a bit tricky on the limit, but can be made to outhandle many newer cars. My current Spitfire has been one of the most reliable cars I’ve owned.

Jon Clark > mikecyc72usa 01/10/2016 at 17:53

0

Terrific article. I remember why those cars were new. And I love the patina on both of these cars. Don’t ever sell either of them. They should stay in the family.

mikecyc72usa > Jon Clark 01/10/2016 at 17:57

0

I doubt I’ll sell the Spitfire, and Rob will never sell the Datsun. I a going to repaint my Spitfire this year all one color and redo the interior. It needs to be done finally. Besides, I found an Austin Mini Cooper S I want to take in and finish...

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > mikecyc72usa 06/22/2016 at 02:34

0

No idea why I’m replying to something from 2015 but I was searching for something and this came up and I can’t believe I missed it!

How have you come sorting the suspension on your car?

From the description of what’s happening above, it seems like you need better controlled shocks rather than stiffer springs if the suspensions compressing, rebounding and then compressing again. Ideally, you’d want it to compress, then rebound and stay damn near where it’s rebounded to...

mikecyc72usa > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 06/22/2016 at 11:20

1

Stiffer shocks helped, the ones in it were stock grade. However, 330lb springs are still too soft by far, allowing front outside corner dive when cornering, and too much nose dive on hard braking. Better tires helped, but I’m likely going to install springs at least 100lb stiffer as the next step.