I've got $5,000 to buy a project car.

"jkm7680" (jkm7680)
07/20/2014 at 10:48 • Filed to: hopefully its not a shitbucket even though in the darkest corner of my mind it's going to be one.

Something unique, and different is what I'm looking for. It must be running and driving, No convertibles, Nothing before 1960 and after 1985. Transmission doesn't matter, as long as there is one.

Any suggestions on what to look for? I've got a list down already, but I'd like to hear what everybody else thinks.

Ninja Edit: This money is coming from my motorcycle budget. Sadly.

DISCUSSION (79)

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:49

Can we see list?

gawdzillla > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:51

240z

trmoore09 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:51

Fox body 5.0?

daender > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:52

Vintage Hondas or Toyotas, Civics, CRX, Celicas, and maybe a Corona.

Kinja'd!!!

This sold for 3.8k$ at Barrett Jackson.

jkm7680 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
07/20/2014 at 10:53

P1800ES

Mg B GT

1st Gen Mustang

240z

Dodge Dart (Swinger hopefully)

oldirtybootz > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:53

I've been looking at GM cars with the Quad 4 all night, so I'm not in the right state if mind to give car buying advice.

Kinja'd!!!

Vicente Esteve > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:53

Easy, VW Corrado

jkm7680 > daender
07/20/2014 at 10:54

Probably not a Civic or CRX. I'll look into the others a bit.

jkm7680 > Vicente Esteve
07/20/2014 at 10:56

If I can even find one :P

It's probably a bit newer that I'd like also, the 70's were my main target.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 10:58

1st gen MR2? If not, then I'd say old Rabbit.

4age20vsilvertop > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:03

Dacia Sandero

Gimmi-Sagan-Om-Draken > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:10

Kinja'd!!!

We got our clean 240z for 5k, he wanted 6k. We rebuilt everything but now is the time to get a 70' or 71' before they go up. We adjusted a few things yesterday and she is really humming now, much smoother with the carbs but still punchy. Oh but I love an MGBGT Sebring clone with an aluminum rover V8....

DirtyBird > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:17

this! http://allentown.craigslist.org/cto/4543809094… because race car

Kinja'd!!!

Nibby > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:18

Project Benz. Do it.

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:19

I know a guy who is selling a restored MGB GT.

Kanaric > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:19

AW11 MR2 was made in 1985. Get that. Excellent project car.

Gimmi-Sagan-Om-Draken > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:20

Kinja'd!!!

This would probably cost more in the end, than an 240z, the Z has a bit more room in the back for luggage or a dog but I really like these.

Captain_Spadaro > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:21

Fiero?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:21

I say 1st gen Stang or 240z

jkm7680 > Captain_Spadaro
07/20/2014 at 11:23

I don't really like the Fiero at all.

But thanks for the suggestion!

jkm7680 > Gimmi-Sagan-Om-Draken
07/20/2014 at 11:23

And I've got a medium sized dog, that's why shooting brakes would be the ideal style for me.

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:26

I Think it is in your price range.

No Prius Needed > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:26

This is a nice 240z for $5800, doesn't look like there is much rust. http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/cto/457109…

jkm7680 > Vince-The Roadside Mechanic
07/20/2014 at 11:27

I was thinking more along the lines of a full-out project though, but thanks for the offer!

jkm7680 > No Prius Needed
07/20/2014 at 11:28

It's nice, but I'm not very wealthy and just shipping alone would probably finish it off. Plus there isn't that much work to be done by the looks of it.

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:28

Then I would go with the Swinger. Because I love them.

jkm7680 > Vince-The Roadside Mechanic
07/20/2014 at 11:30

Yup, this is the one that I'm looking into.

http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/457209…

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:34

OK, the swingers were equipped with a 340 if I am right. also try to get a 72 or earlier with the hood scoops. I don't think that there was a 6 cylinder swinger. I could be wrong.

No Prius Needed > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:37

But Wangan Midnight.

jkm7680 > Vince-The Roadside Mechanic
07/20/2014 at 11:40

There apparently was a Slant 6 Swinger from what I've heard. The 340s are a bit too much money.

JR1 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:42

3800 for this Galaxie looks like a sweet deal:

http://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/4577483409…

liquid_popcorn > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
07/20/2014 at 11:45

I have a Rabbit with a 2.0ABA swap, ACH 5sp, some other goodies. Picked it up for 3k.

Also: MK1 GTI, Scirocco 16v, or a MK1 Caddy because they're cool as hell.

liquid_popcorn > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:46

I suggested some VWs (no bias here! haha), but from your list I'd go with the 240Z.

P1800ES is cool as hell, but the other cars are more fun to drive in my opinion.

Also everyone in northern VA has a project Mustang it seems.

TheVancen- In Pursuit of a Greater Payday and Car Parts > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:47

How about the '70 Ranchero for sale here in Kingston? It's only a 302 automatic, but all of the mechanical work is done. It just needs a bit of rust repair.

therevengeofthesaab (really likes pre-2005 hondas right now) > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:47

MK1 GTi

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 11:48

2 years ago the swinger 340's were $4000.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > liquid_popcorn
07/20/2014 at 11:57

I think you responded to the wrong guy. I've been in your Rabbit haha

GhostZ > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 12:08

For car shows, resale value, and casual driving:

Kinja'd!!!

1977 280Z

What's that you say? NOT A 240Z? Here's why:

1. 240z used prices, in good condition, are generally out of your budget right now. 280Z prices, however, are significantly lower. For the same quality of car, a 280Z is generally half the price of an equivalent 240z.

2. Since it's a project car, it's not going to be original or numbers-matching already, so through any hope of 'collectible' resale value out the window.

3. The frame, chassis, and interior between the 240Z and 280Z are almost identical . I don't mean they are similar, they are almost (and in some cases are) part-swappable.

4. The 280Z made about 7% more power. It was also fuel injected. Good fuel injection. It's an extremely simple and reliable mechanical system (not vacuum like porsche's of the era!) that's easier to tune and deal with than carbs. Most 240Z modifications start with a 280Z block anyway, and it's generally superior in every way to the 240Z engine, except for the lower redline.

5. The 280Z had a larger R200 differential, which could handle more power and solved some early 240Z differential wear and tear problems.

6. The 280Z ALSO had a rear sway bar, the 240z did not.

7. The 280Z weighed about 300lbs more than the 240z: 150lbs was easily in the bumpers alone. the larger differential, 5-speed transmission, sway bar, and beefed up suspension weighed another 100lbs, the larger engine, radiator, added sound deadening and AC weighed another 50lbs. So if you remove the bumpers and replace them with smaller chrome ones, the rest of it is weight you WANT to keep.

8. The 280Z from 1977 on, had an optional 5-speed. This greatly improved acceleration and fuel economy. With overdrive, you can easily get 30mpg. It is also the same BW T-5 used behind many american V8s, so swapping the engine in a 5-speed car is a lot easier and doesn't require a new transmission, just a simple adaptor plate (that usually can be taken off of the engine doner car). Likewise, if you have an engine and a transmission already, another T-5 can bolt right in.

9. Those lengthwise vents on the hood? Those actually provided a much better airflow and cooling than the 240z's vents, helping further improve the engine reliability.

10. Speaking of reliability, the lower compression ratio in the L28 vs the L24 meant less gains (the L28 was still more powerful though, by about 10 HP) but drastically lengthened the life of the engine and head/gaskets. A better-designed head also helps.

The only trade-off you make for going with a 280Z over a 240Z is peak RPM and collector's value, along with slightly harder to find a good condition car.

Next, if you're going for real world drivability and performance:

Kinja'd!!!

1979-1980 280ZX 5 Speed

The 280ZX has as many advantages over the 280Z. It has all of the previously mentioned, plus more details:

1. Just as before, the 280ZX is about half the price of a 240z for the same condition, however, there are fewer of them on the road in good condition because of lower sales numbers. They may not have as good resale value however.

2. Unlike the 280Z, the 280ZX does not share any parts with the earlier models. This could be a disadvantage, but usually the cheap cost and performance benefits outweight it.

3. The Fuel injection got even better, and the engine is the most powerful naturally aspirated L engine Nissan made. HOWEVER, there is a turbo model that came with an automatic-only option, that is even more powerful. For a project car, it's better to turbocharge the stock engine (which already has a silly low compression ratio anyway) using high quality modern parts, than to go with a 30 year old non-intercooled turbo system. The 5-speed N/A is best then.

4. The 240Z and 280Z were plagued with aerodynamic issues over 80mph, and at triple digit speeds could be downright dangerous. The 280Z? No problem. Not only does it have a significantly lower drag coefficient, but it's also way more stable at speed. Throw on some headlight covers (which look badass, BTW) and it's one of the slipperiest sports cars of its time.

5. Four wheel disc brakes. The earlier Z cars had rear drums, which is a huge performance issue for project cars that want to go racing, as you have to do all sorts of stuff to fit modern discbrakes in them. The 280ZX however, is a simple rotor and caliper swap.

6. Better rust resistance. Not by much, but the 280ZX tends to rust less than the 280Z and 240Z for some reason.

7. 5-lug wheels. The 280ZX had 5-lug wheels, which are much more common today, and can accept a much wider range of wheel types. The 240Z and 280Z are both 4-lug.

8. T-tops were available in 1980. C'mon. You know you want them.

9. The engine is generally the most desired of all the L engines (that isn't a turbo).

10. Interior space. There is a LOT more room in the 280ZX. The 2+2 (4 seater versions) had even more.

All of the advantages that the 280ZX has over the 280Z come at a weight and resale value cost, however. While it's a better base platform to make a modified car out of, you'll likely to get less of your money back and you will always have to deal with heavier weight. it matters more if you're sinking $20,000+ into it, rather than $5000 of course.

daender > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 12:20

Kinja'd!!!

I was thinking early-70s Civic only, it would be a rocket-ship with a newer engine. Same with Celicas, the first-gens look amazing if you remove the rubber baby bumpers.

Avoid British stuff since those are cash-blackholes.

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 12:50

I have several hours to kill if you're willing to give me your approximate location I will troll through craigslist ebay etc in your area. I personally recommend the p1800s because I think they're gorgeous and rather unique and the 1st gen mustang because it's also gorgeous not as much of a money pit as the others with a higher demand for them original or modified and because it's an American V8

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 13:02

Thanks!

Craigslist Dc/Eastern Shore is where I've been looking, but only if you have time to that would be great :)

jkm7680 > GhostZ
07/20/2014 at 13:02

Haha, Good sales pitch. It's on the short list for sure.

bhardoin > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:09

I think it probably depends on how much money you want to dump into it long term than the initial purchase price. You could pick up any number of awesome shells for 4-5k, but if you just want something that's gonna be a steady trickle of small upgrades you'll need a totally different project.

Are you looking to do something like, engine swapped and the whole shebang, or just get a running project?

BJohnson11 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:14

What is the goal of the project? To have something to work on or to have something to drive? I'd suggest (based off of your name picture thing) a VW Type 3 wagon. Theres a bitchin one in my neighborhood thats slightly lowered, has a surfboard and a vintage cooler on the roof rack and a swamp cooler AC unit hanging out the window.

I always say the best bang for your buck project vehicles though are old trucks. F100s and C10s can be had in good, solid running condition for cheap! And they have infinite potential and can be turned into whatever you want.

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:19

I'm about to go on my 6th 6 hour roadtrip in the past three days I have time. Also what's your opinion on old Mercedes'a found one for 700 that looks to be in fairly nice shape but has engine issues, timing chain jumped. http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/453968…

bhardoin > GhostZ
07/20/2014 at 13:24

A) I fully agree that either of these are awesome projects
B) a couple quibles: the T-5 trans (I think?) came in 1983 with the turbo ZX. The 280zs had 5 speeds that basically had the same gear ratios as the four speeds, and then an extra 5th gear. 79-82 had the FS5W71, and that stuck around on the 83- nonturbo ZXs.
Also, if I remember right, the ZX has different suspension that is less ideal for a performance oriented build. Won't matter much if its just to drive around mostly stock, but I think its tougher to get proper roll-camber and toe stuff.

TillTheWheelsFallOff: Brocoma > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:29

Whatever you may get, I hope you keep the shitbucket tag for your updates.

jkm7680 > TillTheWheelsFallOff: Brocoma
07/20/2014 at 13:32

Don't worry, Haha. I will most certainly do that.

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 13:34

Thanks! When I'm in Spain I've got a blue 190E which I use. No window handle cranks or anything, If all goes well I might be able to loosen it from my family and bring it over.

jkm7680 > BJohnson11
07/20/2014 at 13:34

The goal of the project is go get something that's DDable, and something that people won't really recognize as easily. (Not the Mustang as much)

Thanks for the suggestion about the VW, those things are pretty rare!

jkm7680 > bhardoin
07/20/2014 at 13:35

My idea was to get a running project, and then fix everything else up around it. Something that I can drive, and slowly fix all that needs to be fixed was the original idea that I had.

BJohnson11 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:39

Dont know where you're located, but this one looks like a great deal.

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:42

Alright I'll keep looking.

jkm7680 > BJohnson11
07/20/2014 at 13:45

That thing looks pretty damn great!

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 13:45

I appreciate it!

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 13:49

http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/455518… interesting buy at the least leaving you a fair amount for restoration plus it's a 60s car which holds it's value fairly well

http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/456494… another interesting buy

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 13:53

The E12 is awesome! I'm definitely going to look into those a bit more . Plus it appears to come with two sets of wheels, which is great.

Thanks for finding these!

Spaceball-Two > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 14:03

Why no convertible?

jkm7680 > Spaceball-Two
07/20/2014 at 14:05

I'd love a Triumph Tr6, except more space would probably be better for me. Plus leaky, Haha. The MGB GT is one of the most serious cars I've looked into though.

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 14:06

Thanks I can't for the life of me find a first gen mustang near you that's not a total rust bucket or way out of your price range.

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 14:08

I really do appreciate the help searching, the Mustangs near me all do seem to be complete rust buckets though, Haha.

bhardoin > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 14:10

Well, I'd cast another vote for a Z-car of some kind. I love my 240, I went with an early car so I don't have to deal with CA emissions law in the future. But a 280 would do fine too. 260zs are kinda frowned upon because they came with trickier carbs, more emissions gear, and less power from factory, but the chassis between the 1971-1978 are almost identical. ZXs are sweet too, and cheaper, but I never felt like they had the same flare that the early ones did.

These things are super easy to work on, and really run to drive. Added bonus: there are lots and lots of drivetrain parts available because of how many people swap in V8s (which is another fun project route...). So Motors, transmissions, carbs, stuff like that are all relatively cheap considering the obscurity of these cars.

liquid_popcorn > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
07/20/2014 at 14:37

You watch yourself, civic si driver.

Kanaric > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
07/20/2014 at 14:41

I really do think with $5k AW11 MR2 would be the prime choice. So much you can do with $5000 on that car. Especially since you can get things like turbo manifolds now from people like matrix garage. 4AGTE MR2..... yes.....

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 14:45

I noticed that... it's a shame when people abandon and mistreat nice cars. Closest thing I've been able to find is this https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/cto/452950… np for sure and it'd make a decent running project. I also found a nice spider but figured that that would quickly run itself out of your price range.

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 15:01

https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/cto/457552… not an MGB but a midget

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 15:17

this might be my favorite yet https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/cto/456655… best body I've seen so far decent paint

Carlos wishes he has a manual > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 15:19

http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/cto/4563008038…

definitely a project but it would look great if you can finish it!

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > liquid_popcorn
07/20/2014 at 15:20

You Rabbit needs more VTAC bro.

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 15:22

That's a good one! The body seems to be pretty damn straight, and all of the bodywork is done. That will definitely go on the list! Thanks!

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 15:34

Here's an interesting one, couple of small issues to work out before it'll get up and go but definitely interesting https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/457326…

jkm7680 > catkam623 misses his 944
07/20/2014 at 15:52

Pretty nice! Thanks!

catkam623 misses his 944 > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 15:56

one more an American 911 rear engined nice interior straight body just a little rust but not major and pretty cheap https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/cto/454814…

Gimmi-Sagan-Om-Draken > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 17:06

I have a bulldog, he likes the Z, he turns around and looks out the back haha. Its not my car but we went out on the coast with it and My dog Renault.

Stef Schrader > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 22:04

Lovin' the P1800ES and the 240Z.

Could probably also pick up a 944/924 or a 914 in that price range, too. Or if you dig slower, odder cars, the VW Type 3 or Type 4.

jkm7680 > Stef Schrader
07/20/2014 at 22:07

Yeah, I've been looking into the Squareback a bit. Too bad they are so rare. The 944 for sure is on the list.

Stef Schrader > jkm7680
07/20/2014 at 22:24

Oh, man. Tell me about it. I want another LeMons fasty so bad.

AKJonny > jkm7680
07/22/2014 at 06:52

It's not a project, but the nicest Scirocco I've seen in a long time(show quality) as been for sale for the same amount that you're looking to buy. It's located in the NYC area, so look around there on Craigslist. Last I looked was about a month or so ago, & it was still listed.

SaigaShooter - He's got an Impreza > jkm7680
08/08/2014 at 15:57

Kinja'd!!!

International Harvester Scout 80

Inline 4, 3 speed manual, not a chance on the highway.