I need help picking a DD

"Stugots" (stugots50) 09/19/2020 at 20:46 • Filed to: None

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With Vroom and Carvana offering crazy $$, I ended up selling my truck I bought new in June for $7.5K over what I paid. The truck will be on a flatbed next week and I’m left driving my girlfriend’s Rav4. Since WFH, I don’t really need anything immediately. Here’s my short list of wants but most aren’t deal breakers:

-<$60k OTD

-AWD / 4wd (upper midwest)

-Adaptive Cruise

-Non-Truck

-New or ultra low mileage / CPO

-Comfortable

I test drove a new 2020 S4 this week and really liked it. I talked the dealer down to $54.5K on a $63K sticker. Cons: I don’t like the massive depreciation and it doesn’t look all the different from a base A4. S5 Sportback’s are rare and likely won’t be discounted 13%.

Next I looked at a used X3 M (dealer loaner with 3k miles ). This is about $10K more. It was fast, but I just didn’t like it all that much. Was not a comfortable DD. And it looks like it was driven hard.. I received a quote on a new 2020 X3 M out of state for the same price. I tried talking down a bit on the used one, but no budge.

Should I jump on the S4 or just hold out?

Nibby > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:33

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bubble taurus and give me $55,000

Stugots > Nibby 09/19/2020 at 21:35

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They have to all be rotted out by now.

DarkCreamyBeer > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:36

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I drive a B9 S5 coupe which I absolutely love. I had a B8.5 A4 before that.

If you can get a new S4, presumably a Premier if it has adaptive cruise, for $54.5k , I’d absolutely jump at that deal. I hope it has the sport diff, which I consider definitely worth the money. Also stealthier looks can be good too, and trust me other Audi fans will know it's an S4 ;-)

Nibby > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:37

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okay then give me $60,000

dogisbadob > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:37

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TourX

Textured Soy Protein > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:39

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Singer GT2 AWD. Has *all* the options, solid to drive, doesn’t break and depreciate like the euro brands, big discounts on new ones. The surround view camera was added to the GT2 trim for 2019, the 18 has a regular backup camera.

onlytwowheels > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:40

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Stugots > DarkCreamyBeer 09/19/2020 at 21:41

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Nice!  This is a premium sport, but has the driver assist and sport package (no steering though). Only bad thing is the summer tires, but I’ve lived with two sets of wheels before.

UserNotFound > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:41

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I’ll only charge you $25,000 if you get a bubble Taurus and only give Nibby $10 ,000. There, you’ve saved $2 0,000.

PyroHoltz f@h Oppo 261120 > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:42

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e450 wagon 362 hp turbo 6.

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:43

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So my issue with the X3M is that, at the end of the day, you’ve just got a X3 that goes unusably fast. You still have to live with the X3 interior all day.

S4 is sorta the same thing, though Audi tends to be nicer inside. Interiors are more important to me than the go fast parts.

So: 540i X-drive would be about your budget. GS/LS would be worth a shot, too. If you’re wanting something SUV like, you might be able to find a CPO Macan or F-Type that would fit the bill. 

Stugots > Textured Soy Protein 09/19/2020 at 21:45

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I’ve been meaning to drive one, only thing that concerns me is the interior and overall quality. It’s on my list though. 

Jayvincent > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:46

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Acura TLX ($33 k+) or RLX ($54k+)

word of caution - don’t accidentally make eye contact with the nsx because then you won’t want the other two and it costs 3x your budget

Or if you miss the big vehic le feel, try the RDX/MDX options with turbos, suprisingly fast for small suvs

full disclosure - I own a 2011 RDX, but I haven’ t driven the latest TLX/RLXs and I’ m too lazy to see if they have adaptive cruze, but they hold their value well and are much lower maintenance costs than your BMWs and Mercedes

Tripper > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:48

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How bout the rs3? That 5 cyl is all that.

Stugots > PyroHoltz f@h Oppo 261120 09/19/2020 at 21:48

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Only downside is there are 0 near me. And the closest ones are a bit out of price range. 

dogisbadob > onlytwowheels 09/19/2020 at 21:50

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DarkCreamyBeer > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:52

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I don’t have the winter tire problem since I’m in Georgia. My car has the 20" wheels, which is the one thing I'd change. They handle great but ride a little rough and at $1300/set. They look great though, so...

Textured Soy Protein > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:52

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The interior might not be up to euro material quality , but it’s fine enough for me. It’s much nicer if you can track one down with red upholstery instead of all black. That interior only comes with the more boring colors like white, black, gunmetal, and what Kia calls ceramic silver but is more of a flat gray pearl. That’s the only slightly interesting color option with the red interior imho.

The G70 has a bit of a step up in material quality but you give up the bigass hatch and I hate the front end styling. The upcoming refreshed one  looks pretty decent but I can’t stand the current version.

PyroHoltz f@h Oppo 261120 > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:53

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Yeah , I’m having the same problem. I know they’re rare and it doesn’t help that I’m in an unusually small market for CA.

onlytwowheels > dogisbadob 09/19/2020 at 21:55

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Good choice. Oddly, the long roof has a lower msrp than the sedan. 

Textured Soy Protein > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:58

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An d speaking as a 2-time former BMW owner , the euro brands aren’t quality. They build stuff that looks and feels nice with big performance and many (optional) features but they don’t build shit to last anymore. They're all about making a good initial impression and providing a hopefully not-too-troubling experience to the first “owner” who is most likely a lessee. Then the shit inevitably breaks, the parts are expensive, and the cars aren’t designed or assembled with ease of repair in mind so you pay out the ass for labor or curse doing it yourself.

CompactLuxuryFan > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 21:58

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I’d say you’re on the right track with the S4. Just make sure you check out and drive the M340i and C43 AMG as well. If the C-class got the new interior in the US, then all three should be pretty equal and it comes down to taste.

I’m guessing you don’t wanna go electric? A Model 3 may depreciate less than those in the short term at least.

If size is no object then you might be able to get a 540i xDrive in your price range but I think it’d be tough. Since you’re open to used maybe see how much Panamera $ 60k gets you?

Stugots > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind 09/19/2020 at 22:00

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Agree on the X3 M.   S4 is way more livable from a DD perspective.

Those are good ideas. I never thought about Lexus. 

Stugots > Tripper 09/19/2020 at 22:00

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I really want to like it but it seems too small for me . Maybe I need to see one in person or drive one.

stuckMTB > Nibby 09/19/2020 at 22:07

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I’ll wager you can get a bubble taurus for a helluvalot less than 5g’s

Stugots > CompactLuxuryFan 09/19/2020 at 22:08

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I can’t find a C43 close to me or else I would’ve drove one by now . The only m340is near me are new 2021 stock so pushing up on the budget a little. I keep telling myself it’s probably not worth $10k more than an S4 - maybe I’m scared I’ll like it more.

Stugots > CompactLuxuryFan 09/19/2020 at 22:11

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Also, I do like the Model 3, but it’s tough in a downtown apartment right now. I would have to pay to install a charger. 

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > Nibby 09/19/2020 at 22:11

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Have some class, man. At least recommend the Sable.

Stugots > Textured Soy Protein 09/19/2020 at 22:13

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Wow n ever gave the g70 a thought - I don’t think I’ve ever seen one actually..

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:15

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Used A7? They depreciate like rocks and are pretty sweet.

Tripper > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:20

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Oh yea I mean it’s small haha just really fun. I had a regular S3 for a few years which I liked a lot but went back to a 3 peddler 

Textured Soy Protein > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:26

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The G70 is a tad sportier to drive than the Stinger. Same basic car but the G70 has a shorter wheelbase and loses a couple hundred lbs. But the front end, to me, looks atrocious. It’s like a bad Alfa Romeo Giulia knockoff that someone tried to graft a mutated Bentley grille onto. Yuck.

I especially wouldn’t buy one right now when it’s going to be refreshed for 2022 to look actually pretty decent.

CB > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:26

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What does a used GS-F go for these days?

SmugAardvark > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:40

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How about a Jaguar XF Sportbrake ? Dealers are offering huge discounts on them, and I think they look gorgeous (although I am admittedly biased).

It should be stated that the ad lists this particular one as new when it clearly isn’t. But you still get the idea.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:43

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Jag XF Sport wagon?

My dealer has one they would let go for a steal. 

CompactLuxuryFan > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:43

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You’re in a really similar boat to me a year ago except I had a hatch requirement so the sedans were out. I’m also in an apartment so no electric for me. I also didn’t want anything too big. Anyway, I ended up in an X3 M40i as the best all-arounder  vs the GLC 43 (which had a horrible outdated interior at the time), an S5 Sportback (also outdated infotainment and wasn’t as good to drive as the X3), and a Macan S (way way way higher priced). Based on what I’ve seen both the X3 and M340 can be negotiated down more readily than the others except maybe an SQ5. I feel like BMW dealers compete more against each other or something. The S4 seems like a great choice, but drive the M340 just in case!

CompactLuxuryFan > CB 09/19/2020 at 22:48

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Ooh that’d be a good one but a) I’m guessing very limited choices vs something like a new S4 and b) no AWD?

Beefchips > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:51

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I was about to suggest a polestar but sounds like that’s a no- go!

Stugots > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 09/19/2020 at 22:54

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There is a nice CPO 2019 A7 near me for the same price as a new S4. It is bigger and more stylish, but trading off the new interior and some performance.

avalonian > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 22:58

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Yea h, the Fpace would be a great option you can get a fully loaded one with everything for around 60 with negotiations . Or a used 2017 range rover sport, or perhaps even Velar !

Dark horse candidate alfa Romeo stelvio.

Stugots > CompactLuxuryFan 09/19/2020 at 23:04

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I wanted to look at the X3 M40i. Side note: I don’t have any experience with the German dealers, but it’s been weird. BMW wouldn’t show me the X3 M I wanted to look at (probably because it’s out on loan ) and told me it probably sold. In pricing discussions I brought up the quote I got on a new X3 M and the tone changed. They kept asking what dealer and laughed at where I thought the used X3 M should be at. I j ust wanted to get out of there.

Audi caved to my price after two days and told me someone is looking at it right now so I should put a deposit on it (yeah right).

avalonian > CompactLuxuryFan 09/19/2020 at 23:08

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Nope, no all wheel drive only rear. You could get a GS350 Fsport, with AWD. 

Stugots > SmugAardvark 09/19/2020 at 23:15

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I love them. Bit dated, and deprecation. I h ad a Lincoln LS at one point, first intro to Jag maintenance .    

SmugAardvark > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 23:22

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My current daily is a ‘17 XE R-sport, thus the bias. So far, no reliability issues. But of course, those won’t spring up until the day after the factory warranty expires.

You’re right though, depreciation has hit these hard and will continue to do so.

CompactLuxuryFan > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 23:34

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Well that just seems like typical dealer stuff. For some reason I feel like BMW didn’t make that many X3 M with or without the Competition package for the US so maybe they’re holding their value? The BMW forums are good for finding sales people that work with enthusiasts.

I followed the Tom McParland advice of only working with dealers/salespeople that were willing to do everything via email including finalized quotes including everything out the door. Definitely the way to go. Of course you have to know what you want already so you have to go test drive stuff independt of that first. 

Chariotoflove > Stugots 09/19/2020 at 23:37

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You are looking for new or almost new and toward the luxury end of things , but you seem to be worried about depreciation, as if you won’t plan on owning it for very long. That means you are looking for something that depreciated like a rock right out of the showroom and hot the bottom of its curve quickly. There aren’t too many choices that fit that bill. My Kia K900 is one, and a new model K900 might be in the same class. However, if you need sporty  performance in your luxury sedan, that won’t be your thing, nor will it be if badge is important to you.

Tapas > Stugots 09/20/2020 at 00:44

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Wh at do you think of the Volvo V60?

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > Stugots 09/20/2020 at 01:08

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AMG 43. Don't care which version. They're stupid reliable. Just stick to regular maintenance and you're good to go. Biggest downside is tires; OE ones wear out by 20k at most. I'd throw Conti DWS or Michelin AS3+ on it for upper midwest, those should last longer and fit your conditions much better than the original summer tires.

CB > CompactLuxuryFan 09/20/2020 at 03:25

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Not AWD.

How do those new AWD V Cadillacs look to you?

nermal > Stugots 09/20/2020 at 09:18

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Can you find an Alfa Quattrofuckmeaglioolio in your price range? If so get one of those.