Carnage

"Pickup_man" (zekeh) 07/23/2020 at 15:30 • Filed to: None

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A while back I bought a Ford 300 with some unknown history. The guy was upfront and honest that he knew very little about the engine, he bought the truck to part it out, said the engine smoked, but he drove it home and it drove fairly well. I took the gamble on it based the the indestructible reputation of the 300 six, and well.....

I lost that bet. Before I even got into the bowels of the engine, the exhaust manifold was cracked clean in half, and the intake had a busted off mounting ear, so both were shot. Inside though is where the real fun began. Top rings for cylinders 1,2, and 4 are shattered as you can clearly see. The top ring for cylinder 5 is just plain gone, nowhere to be found, except for the little pieces left embedded in the piston. That discoloration you see on piston 3 is a crack that runs clean through the skirt. In addition the bearing on #2 had a decent score in it as well. Shockingly the cylinder bores and the crank look to be in good shape, a quick hone and the block should be usable, but I’m at a crossroads debating whether or not to rebuild, or junk it and look at other options.

I’m only $200 into the engine and trans currently but if I decide to commit to building it I’m looking at roughly $700 to have a run ready, drop in ready drivetrain , assuming no machine work and no other major problems . I can find running trucks for that price or less, but there’s no guarantee as to what you’re getting there either. The third option, which I’ve been debating lately, is abandoning the entire project, selling off the project truck and parts truck, and using the money, plus some extra, to buy a fun vehicle that already runs and drives. It’s been a dream of mine for a long time to build this truck, but the idea of a ready to use truck is certainly appealing.

What would you do Oppo? Is it worth rebuilding? Do I take another gamble? Or do I scrap the whole idea and buy something different?

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 15:39

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You know you have a good block and crank. How is the cylinder head? (Is it a flat head? I don’t know anything about the Ford 300).

I think you should just rebuild this one , you already took the gamble and got a good block and crank. Don’t gamble again, it could turn out okay but it could turn out to be another money pit and then you’re going to wish you’d spent the money fixing this one instead of buying another engine/truck.

just-a-scratch > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 15:40

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IMHO If  you want a project to work on, you got it. If you want a vehicle that runs, cut your losses on this.

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 15:41

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You can buy a lot of 350s (hell, even a 4.6) for $700..........

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 15:42

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In what condition is the project truck? Does it just need mechanical stuff or is it rough everywhere?

Project vehicles are not a rational decision so go with your heart. Just tell your heart to keep it under budget. It depends on whether you are out to learn new skills, wile away some time in the garage, wile away some time on the road, or any combination of them. You are the only one who can tell when a project is going to cost more than it gives back in the joy department. 

Discerning > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 15:53

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I thought the 300 was cheap and plentiful. If so, I'd sooner cut my losses and get a better example that isn’t half dead.

Pickup_man > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available 07/23/2020 at 15:58

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The t ruck needs everything really, it’s reasonable solid body wise but will need brakes, interior, glass etc. I’m not trying to rationalize the truck aspect of the project, because those numbers are never going to work out in my favor. I’m really just debating whether or not it’s worth rebuilding the engine. I’m at the point where I’m not really out anything if I go a different direction, but if I commit, I commit. 

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 16:00

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I’d shop for a used engine. I bet they’re not difficult to find. Buy it, drive it around a bit, and decide what to do next.

Pickup_man > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI 07/23/2020 at 16:03

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Not putting a 350 in a Ford, just not gonna do it.

Also, 5.4 or nothing . Problem with the 5.4 or the 4.6 is finding a manual trans, by the time you get both it really adds up. I’ve already got a transmission that fits the 300 so I want to stick to that route if possible. I could also go 302 or 351, but my heart’s kinda set on the 300. 

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 16:03

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I don't think it is really worth it to rebuilt this one. It's pretty far gone but that block might help you cut your losses.

Pickup_man > Discerning 07/23/2020 at 16:12

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They’re h arder to find than I thought, but that’s kind of where I was leaning as well, buy a good donor truck, harvest everything I need and junk the rest. 

Kiltedpadre > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 16:24

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Does the head look usable? If you’re looking at needing a new head your probably better off getting a different engine cost wise. If you’re really confident that the block and head are good I’d stick with what you have.

What could you get for the project truck as is, and how much are you looking at for the type of fun vehicle you’d be interested in?

Michael > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 16:31

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Psssh most of those pistons are still there

My bird IS the word > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 16:40

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Depends. I find myself in a similar situation. Follow your gut. It may be the "wrong" decision, but it will be the easiest to live with.

Pickup_man > Kiltedpadre 07/23/2020 at 16:41

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Head looks ok from what I can tell, and I’m mostly assuming the block and crank are good, they appear fine visually, but I haven’t put a mic or any real measuring tools on them.

Both trucks as they sit could probably bring 2k, add to that some cash I have from selling a few other things and I’d be looking for something right around the $6,000 mark. That amount will buy what I consider a pretty nice vintage truck, but I feel like if I’m buying something I should get something I can haul my kid around in on occasion. There aren’t any cars I’m interested in, which leads me to Broncos/Blazers, but $6,000 doesn’t get you very far in that market either. 

John Norris (AngryDrifter) > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 16:50

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The cost shouldn’t drive the decision. Not at that level of cost anyway. Go get the drivetrain you want that will be reliable and what you won’t regret. You are going to expend much more equivalent  cost in your labor. So go get what you want and enjoy the result.

Future next gen S2000 owner > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 17:24

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Coyote swap!

MM54 > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 17:38

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I’d get another cheap 300 and take the good bits of both. By the time you buy an intake and exhaust manifold (let alone a set of pistons) you could have another engine.

Pickup_man > John Norris (AngryDrifter) 07/23/2020 at 17:50

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Cost absolutely drives the decision. What I want is a flathead V8, I happen to have one , but rebuilding it is going to cost far more than I can afford. The 300 is my second choice, just not sure if it was worth rebuilding this particular one, or taking the chance on a different engine. I consider my labor free, I do this in my free time and it’s an activity I enjoy. 

Pickup_man > MM54 07/23/2020 at 17:55

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Used manifolds are $16 at the local pick and pull, they’ve got two out there currently. Granted, they’re still single barrel carb and stock exhaust manifolds, I’d prefer to have a 4BBL and headers, but they’re cheap enough to get it running until I can upgrade. Full piston/rings/bearing kits are only $180.

My full $700 estimate includes a lot of parts, clutch, alternator, water pump, distributor, used manifolds, gasket kit, pistons, rings, bearings. Feels much more reasonable when I consider the whole list. 

Pickup_man > Future next gen S2000 owner 07/23/2020 at 17:56

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Too much $$$$$$. I kinda want to keep this truck a bit old school as well. The 300 isn’t period correct for a ‘50, but it feels more true to the truck than a Coyote does, although it would be really fun. 

MM54 > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 18:03

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Damn, that’s a cheap rebuild. Now I understand why you might not want another core haha. How are the rods?

RacinBob > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 18:18

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What you really need is a 300 that has been in a crash and is not usable because a motor mount is broken off. Use the pistons, head, exhaust and intake and you are probably fine. But it is probably easier to buy a salvage yard motor that appears maintained, plug it in and take your chances.

It looks like the engine ran way lean probably because of the busted intake. The resulting preignition wrecked the pistons and rings. I had a lean condition bust some pistons on our pinto 2.3 engine that looked to be similar . damage.

RacinBob > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 18:22

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Heck, the best strategy might be buy the cheapest 300 you can find with all the parts and move them over. 

John Norris (AngryDrifter) > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 18:55

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Okay, yes I agree. If you are going to go a bit exotic, period correct, and rare you do need to mind your dollars.

I’ll still say go for what you want. Projects sometimes go through rough stages.  If the end game isn't the first choice it makes it harder to carry through.  

Of  course it’s very easy for me to spend your money to make you happy.  Just my 2 cents.  

RacinBob > Pickup_man 07/23/2020 at 22:02

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Thinking of your comments, the only answer is buy a ring set, a bunch of RTV and put it back together! don’t install top rings in the ones that are busted above and see how it runs. It ain’t a race car. I bet it will!

pip bip - choose Corrour > Pickup_man 07/24/2020 at 05:54

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Barra swap

Pickup_man > MM54 07/24/2020 at 08:57

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Rods look good, cam also looks pretty good, although I wouldn’t mind a better one.