Bronco - but what does HHFP say about it?

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch) 07/14/2020 at 17:45 • Filed to: hammerhead says

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There is some kind of horse-based topless wundertruck that just came out and I’m here to have words about it.

Let’s get some things cleared up for my personal gratification. !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . Now that I have doffed my self feathered cap, we may continue.

Looks.

These two pictures sum it up for me. The 2 door looks like a toy that’s been squashed in photoshop and the flairs. Good lord the flairs.

Those are BY FAR the worst part of the design. They look SO bad its painful. Its not a narrow vehicle, and it doesn’t do the wrangler thing of coming to a point at the front. I just can’t get over how tacked on and cheap they look. Its what I see here when people get caught with too little flair to legally cover their tire and they have to throw something together to pass inspection.

The overall effect of both the 2 and 4 door is not my cup-o-tea. I don’t like em. I think it looks cartoony and overwrought. That being said I know a lot of people dig it. That’s cool too. Frankly, I think my 80 series is a bit of an ugly thing, but that’s neither here nor there.

Features.

Okay, Ford really REALLY deserves props for listening to outside help on this one. I know for a fact that Johnathan Ward had a hand in these and it shows.

Limb riser points, steep bumpers, integrated rated recovery points, and then the interior stuff.

YES! a track system integrated into the cowl?! granted I would have rather it been a cheese plate (a bunch of 1/4-20 threaded holes) than a rail where you have to buy from Ford now. I’m sure someone else will come up with something to take advantage of it. Still, very yes.

Yes to having power on the dash too. Helps avoid messes like this

Though, while 5v is nice, 12v would have been better. A 20 amp recessed Anderson connector up there with Ford accessories would have made adding radios and such easier.

This is a bag of “meh”. I understand the idea but its not great. Imagine having those clank around on a trail. Also, the “NO STEP” thing is dumb. 1. because this isn’t an airplane, it was never an airplane. 2. People aren’t going to care and step all over it anyway...have you met kids? Instead of an egg crate plate there they should have found some way to add panels. either screw them in, buttons, or something. The things people are hanging on the backs of seats are canvas panels with tools, first aid, maps, and cool overland patches that show others how overland you are. Speaking of which, this should come with badges, at least 3 pre-sewn into the roof panel.

Lots of yes going on here. 1. tailgates are cool. Yes to them. 2. Tie-downs are cool, I see 4 (could use 4 more inboard but whatever). 3. Freaking pneumatic struts that hold open deadly swing gates are cool. Hell no to the tiny interior space. A reminder that these are the same length and width as my 80 series, which has room for 7 people or LOTS of gear. Yes different times and so on. It’s also the same length and width as a 4runner which has room for 8 people or carry lots more gear. The Wrangler has the same problem and it comes down to those damned flairs. Just make the vehicle fit over the wheels!

What’s interesting is that this image reminds of the photoshop I did to square out the wrangler. hmm.

Capability?

Yes, it has it.

These numbers are good. I think their RTI scores are optimistic though.

For capability here is what we know.

Front axle is a DANA AdvanTek IFS axle, probably a 200 mm, the rear axle is a Dana AdvanTek M220, same as the Wrangler Rubi.

Front suspension is a PAAS type (Pointless Acronyms Are Stupid) with twin cast aluminum A-arms.

rear is a medium arm 5 link with an oddly placed panhard.

I feel like the samsquanch package has more !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! than it should with a bar angle like that. But maybe I’m wrong.

Clearance looks good and bless them for doing shock aft and wheel centric instead of in the middle of the axle and forward (Hi Colorado!)

Crawl ratios? I honestly don’t care. The 100:1 manual ratio will be great, as will the 70:1 auto. Feels like a wind-assisted pissing match to me. More slower is more better, but I honestly think I would have been happier with a numerically smaller axle ratio for better daily livability than having to deal a 10 tooth pinion on an 8.5 inch ring.

Payload is meh. 1170-1370 lbs

Towing is meh - 3500 lbs

mpg is going to be meh.

Let me be clear. Ford KILLED IT with the paper specs. They ticked all the right boxes and then a few more just for spite. Im sure this thing will be amazing off the road. It will certainly be a better desert runner.

And here is the rub. The world REALLY doesn’t need another pre-tuned ultra desert runner for people who don’t know the difference between a C-clip and a D-cup.

I mean, could part of that just be my old man yells at the clouds? yeah. But seriously, it’s getting pretty trashy out there with the quality of gear to quality of user ratio skewing badly. This doesn’t help that.

Great Jerb Ferd on making a better Horse face.

wpudvah: GTI, Super Beetle, now with more 80-Series > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 17:54

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you own an FJ80, therefore I trust your opinion!

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:02

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I bet someone makes more contoured flares you can paint or get bare. Oh I didn’t see that device mount thing before, I like that. 

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:04

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I have only been following this as George (of the Toaster Renegade) has been beside himself excited about the release. Unexpected, but interesting.

My takeaways:

I don’t like the tie downs on the hood. They look like JDM fender mirrors and functional or not I don’t understand the point of them. I people will probably mount light bars.?

At least one video we watched indicated the manual would only be available with the little engine. Now the “little” engine is fine, but fuck Ford for maintaining the “manual as a budget option” thing.

Everything else seems fine. They wanted to take on the Wrangler and I think they’ve succeeded admirably . They’re going to sell like hot cakes, especially when they announce the V8 for 2022.

Points George made that I like:

There is no reason to buy a Renegade anymore. With the possible exception of ground clearance every spec on the Sport is better than the Renegade. (I think the Sport looks a little pudgy but he likes it...)

Hopefully this will spur Jeep into making specifically the Renegade, but also the Compass and even Wrangler better vehicles. The Renegade could be much better , but it is apparent Jeep didn’t want to make them too good for fear of cutting into sales of the Wrangler. The Wrangler just isn’t a good car other than for offroading, and even then you have to DIY a lot of the capability. Like... how many people do you know that buy brand new Wranglers and immediately throw out half the car? It is a far from non-zero number.

Neither the Sport nor the proper Bronco tempt me or stir my loins. They’ll be... fine... and it will be nice to see something other than endless Wrangler Unlimiteds  on the trails, but overall... heh.

sony1492 > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:04

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The fender flares strike me as ford seeing that they are popular in the dude bro community and cutting out the middle- man, see also: Rims.

Wouldnt be surprised if the parts catalog had angry grilles and light bars in a few years

HammerheadFistpunch > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 07/14/2020 at 18:10

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Agree with these takes.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:10

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Thank you for that in depth breakdown.

The best way I think I can sum up my opinion is that it feels like Ford is trying too hard. I think they’ve also been teasing this for what feels like 2 decades now and I was over it 5 years ago. For me, this is too little, too late.

I’m just an observer so my opinion means jack , but I also feel like “overland ” is overdone. When my wife’s sweet cousin moved from NYC to Texas and bought a 4x4 and trailer, I knew it was over. 

Distraxi's idea of perfection is a Jagroen > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:13

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I looked at that rear 3/4 view and my ini tial reaction was “new Defender”. Which it actually doesn’t look a lot like, it’s butcher. But it looks a lot like a mashup of a new Defender and and old Defender (not a bad thing IMHO, the new Defender’s pitched too soft). Apart f ro m the wheelarches which are, as you say, silly. What’s wrong with havi ng a body that’s the same width as the wheels? Oh I kn ow, it’s so you can look to your aspirational neighbours like a serious mudrunner who ’s gone wild at the aftermarket shop, i.e someone with a lifestyle .

That is a nice set of toys though, both inside and underneath.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:16

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Not my kind of vehicle at all but I like how it looks

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:17

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Oh... missed one:

Show me a decent diesel with the manual and even I’d be eyeing one.

Gone > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:20

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Agree with a lot of this (especially the flares).

Couple things, the front diff is a M210. Which it better be as the M200 in the ZR2 still eats CVs (also tierods) with larger tires (33"+) and a lot less power (and gearing). The ZR2 also uses the M220 rear which seems fine.

Feel the same about the panhard.

Payload is crap, towing is same as the Rubi, so guess it works. People will overload them because the 2.7 has so much power. Those rear shocks are still low and those bolts that hang out of the mounts should have be done differently.

IFS sway bar disconnect is cool (dammit GM). Those knuckles look weak and there will be a giant aftermarket for them like the Raptor guys. The ZR2 knuckles and upper/lowers are beefy.

https://www.coloradofans.com/threads/zr2-vs-nonzr2-suspension.381689/

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:23

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Looks like a cartoon toy for dudebros to play macho man competitions with in the gym parking lot.

I ini tially thought it looked decent in base spec without being overly silly, but those high door sills and ridiculously bad cargo room are pretty horrible for someone who actually wants a competent vehicle without looking like a tool. Yes it has better tech than say something like a 4Runner, but it loses out on the bare basics like managing to get your shit in the damn thing.

The little boy in me gets excited thinking it is cool, but then the grown up in me takes hold and reminds me that there is no conceivable reason I would buy this over something else. But i guess plenty of folks will buy this mainly for the looks and the cool factor among a certain population, and that’s OK.

Future next gen S2000 owner > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:24

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D-Cups are good. DD-Cups are twice as good. C-Clips are not as fun as either. Pretty sure that’s the difference.

HammerheadFistpunch > Gone 07/14/2020 at 18:28

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Good beta.  I guessed on the front diff, but its nice to know is the larger 210.

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:34

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Thoughts from someone who is not an off-roader.

I don’t know why but I like the flares. They look a lot better than the actual tacked on fender flares I see on every bro truck around here.

I don’t know what I was expecting but 3500 lbs towing ain’t it, chie f. 5000 would’ve been a good number to shoot for. I’m sure there are reasons why it’s so low,   but a Subaru Outback can technically tow as much as the B ronco. The Jeep Cherokee out-tows it. I know it’s not a hauling vehicle but having the capability would be useful.

Either way I hope these sell well, I think F ord made a really good product here.

HammerheadFistpunch > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 07/14/2020 at 18:35

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payload, cooling, suspension geometry.  Towing and long travel wheelin don’t go hand in hand.

For Sweden > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:43

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Gone > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:48

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Should clarify the M210 only comes with the front locker (Sasquatch) . No front locker and it  gets the M190, same as the Ranger.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 07/14/2020 at 18:55

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Don’t know what the Ford Parts Bin looks like there, but I guess they don’t have anything like GM’s Baby D-Max or the FCA light duty diesel.

Funny that most of my zeal is around the “platform” but I’m not sold on the drivetrain.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 18:58

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Any guess as to material for that “rail system”?  

I like the concept... but all I see when I look at your pic is Mrs. SBA’s Love Affair with the cheap-ass “rail system” in the back of her MINI... that stuff was all busted to kraap after 20K miles.  If they took the trouble to include it, I hope it’s aircraft-grade aluminum and solid connectors.

HammerheadFistpunch > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 07/14/2020 at 18:59

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Looks like aluminum.  

SilentButNotReallyDeadly...killed by G/O Media > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 07/14/2020 at 19:05

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Australia says hi! The current twin turbo TDi & 10 speed auto combination under the high spec Ranger and Everest variants are quite good apparently .

As the new forthcoming Ranger platform is now shared with Volkswagen it is engineered for V6 TDi engines and the local press have already identified two Ford options capable of in excess 600 nM. They have also pointed out that, with numbers like that and the likely hybrid options, the V8 petrol engines no longer make sense to engineer for. Plus all the automatic vehicle safety options that are now virtually mandatory down here also kill the manual gearbox because the two are not engineered to play together...

nermal > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 19:06

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I’m surprised that they’ve taken the F150 approach of offering what seems like a bazillion different options configurations. More than likely dealers will order loaded up versions to start, with lower trim levels becoming more commonplace later in the cycle.

It’s wider than a comparable Jeep with the good and bad that comes with that. On road performance should be much better than the Jeep due to IFS. Looking at the manuel gear ratios, they appear to be better spaced than the JL / JT ones, so should drive better in that regard as well .

Real world fuel mileage will most likely be much worse than EPA numbers depending on trim level , much like it is with Jeeps. Ford is gonna pull a switcheroo with the EPA by certifying the base model with little tires to get their MPG rating. In reality moving from 30s to 35s is gonna have a significant impact on final results .

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 19:10

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1. Should have the 5.0 as an option with the manual or auto.

2. The Bronco Sport (as in, “hey there, Sport” patronizing) has Mole straps on the seat backs, where as the Bronco (MAN MAN MAN MAN MAN) gets shit plastic grating? Da fuq Ford?

3. Base model seems to be the way to go, looks wise.

4. Why can’t they offer a 4x4 with LSD’s instead of open or lockers?

5. I don’t see the cloth top available yet, which there absolutely must offer to really stick it to the Jeep people.

6. Did I mention the lack of V8? The 5.0 would be yes please, but the 7.3? That would be absolute filth and I needs it straight in my vains.

7. How long before people are putting in fake Raptor grills in their Broncos with Angry Eyes? /vomits at the thought

8. Suspension seats should be an option.

9. People are going to manage to spend $80k out the door after dealer add on accessories, and that’s just silly.

10. I like how they bragged about their Baja racer in the announcement commercial. The Baja racer that broke and lost to the Baja Boot!

11. Can we get back to a 2-Door Bronco with the 7.3 and a manual?

CRider > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 07/14/2020 at 19:10

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The hood latches are supposed to be for mounting kayaks, I think? 

Derpwagon > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 19:13

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I think in a couple years I’ll be looking at a 4 door Bandlands trim with the Samsquanch package.

CRider > nermal 07/14/2020 at 19:20

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They probably build it like the F-150 because F-150s are all Ford knows how to build. 

atfsgeoff > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 19:29

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And here is the rub. The world REALLY doesn’t need another pre-tuned ultra desert runner for people who don’t know the difference between a C-clip and a D-cup.

In this world, demand beats need every time. And judging by the Wrangler’s continued success, this style of utility vehicle is in high demand.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 19:52

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I have to read this later, but I’m skeptical about ecopoof engines out in the middle of the desert somewhere going poof .

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 07/14/2020 at 20:03

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The Bronco isn’t based on the current ranger

HammerheadFistpunch > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/14/2020 at 20:04

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Eh, they'll be solid for the first owners, 200k miles? Not likely. But to 90k, yeah

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/14/2020 at 20:45

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On the other hand, Ford has been doing the truck ecoboost engines for 10 years now. There’s a whole lot of them out there now with a lot of miles on them. They seem to be pretty solid for at least the 150kish life of the turbos.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 07/14/2020 at 20:56

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I don’t think I said it was, did I?

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 07/14/2020 at 21:00

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Maybe you did, maybe you didn’t, I don’t know, I’ve been drinking

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 07/14/2020 at 21:04

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Heh. If you’re gonna post, you gotta share with the whole class.

I used the word “platform” but I meant the approach/ departure angles, axles and diffs, interior goodies, hard points, tow points, design.  I’d like the rolling chassis, but could care less about EcoBoast...  I’d LS swap it and make it into a real truck.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 07/14/2020 at 21:17

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Meijer has 30's of PBR for $ 19, so I couldn’t pass that up

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 21:21

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In no particular order:

1. I’d argue the flares are probably so the aftermarket can easily outfit larger ones for the bro truck mall crawlers that are inevitably coming .

2. It’s very deliberately styled to be cartoon-y, we’ll see how that ages, I don’t have super high hopes.

3. I’m sure they did extensive testing, but something just sits wrong with me about crawling at low speeds with a gasoline turbo engine. I’m sure it has the powaa, but cooling gives me pause.

4. In typical Oppo/Jalop fashion, these will be great to pick up once they have 100,000 miles on them assuming a. they’re not beat to shit, and b. they prove reliable.

5. The aftermarket is going to have a field day with these.

5a . Who will be the first person for front solid axle swap it?

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 07/14/2020 at 21:22

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Hell, a G olf can tow almost as much......

adamftw > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 22:13

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Front axle is m170 w the 4 banger and the 210 w the V6.

There is nothing about this I don’t like, except that I won’t be given one for free. 

adamftw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/14/2020 at 22:14

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These motors are pretty solid. Easy 150-200k, just like literally every other car sold today. Follow the recommended maintenance schedule.  

adamftw > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 22:15

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They’ll be just fine. Follow the maintenance schedule.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > adamftw 07/14/2020 at 22:19

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I’m skeptical. So much complexity and in my experience, complexity lends fragility. But you’d know better than I, because I do not know.

HammerheadFistpunch > adamftw 07/14/2020 at 22:23

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M170? That's tiny. I heard m190

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com 07/14/2020 at 22:25

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I bet diligent oil service is key there. Turbo lubrification, oil-actuated variable valve timing...

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > adamftw 07/14/2020 at 22:29

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I bet diligent oil service is key there. Turbo lubrification, oil-actuated variable valve timing...

Thanks for the opine. I’ll enjoy renting one someday and trying it out.

Never been a Ford man. I’m driving a ‘97 GMC Safari 4.3L with 240-ish k miles. I’ve rebuilt pretty much everything over the past six years or so, all proactively. Next up is the rear spring mounts and then upgrade the rear drums to disc. I’ve driven from the Pacific to the Atlantic and back three times in that van with my family on board. Last Summer I rented a GMC Colorado — or whatever it was — and has the current V6 high-feature VVT offering and 8-speed trans and was powerful and sophisticated and drove like an absolute champ. And I shuddered to think of the expenses of worn timing chains or some other high-fallutin’ gastafenator pump or whatever.

But that Safari: 23 years and a quarter-million miles. Hard for me to imagine anything in the past five or ten years returning a service life like that.

HammerheadFistpunch > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 07/14/2020 at 22:31

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I couldn't even imagine this with the 7.3. if guess they would never get it to meet regs in it's tighter epa category

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/14/2020 at 22:54

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Yes.  Modern oil is pretty darn good at its intended applications these days.  Also lots of turbo motors now spec’d for synthetics and semi-synthetics.

Ford has also gone to great lengths to dummy down the turbo ownership experience. On my former 2017 F-150, the 2.7 ecoboost engine was designed such that all the oil from the heads and valley slowly trickled down through the turbos on shutdown to prevent the carbon cooking of oil sitting in improperly cooled down turbos, and there was a secondary electric water pump that circulated coolant through the turbos after shutdown. You’ll find similar measures on most any new car today.

Hot take:

I think it can be easy to overlook that the average engine in modern car is, and has been for 5-10 years, turbocharged. That is to say it is the default at this point on modern cars. Modern twin-scroll designs have largely all but eliminated turbo lag and the classic peakiness once associated with turbo motors, and modern engine management and engineering has come so far to make turbo motors into appliances. If modern turbo motors were to temperamental beasts turbo motors once were, we’d know it by now.

Put another way, the diesel world has been turbocharging the bejesus out of motors large and small for 40 years, and doing so with superior reliability and longevity. There, it is a baseline assumption that the owner will have to drop a few grand to replace a turbo or two over the life of an engine. Compared to things like periodic timing belt services of decades, I look at the modern car assumption of replacing a turbo at 100-150k (and maybe a set of headgaskets to go with de-carboning the intake valves of direct injection) as a pretty reasonable major service at around the halfway point of the engine’s life.

sn4cktimes > HammerheadFistpunch 07/14/2020 at 22:57

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I wonder if the towing capacity is so low due to lack of transmission cooler... haven’t heard if they have one. Even my AMC Eagle has one

nermal > CRider 07/15/2020 at 00:13

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They can build Escapes and Explorers too. 

nerd_racing > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 07/15/2020 at 07:46

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Ever since we knew this was ranger based, we knew the V8 was never an option.  I’m assuming they will add more space on the next design cycle when it bloats up... 

nerd_racing > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 07/15/2020 at 07:53

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So... Exactly like a Wrangler?  I imagine the high door sills have to do with crash ratings with the doors off.  

i86hotdogs > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 07/15/2020 at 08:10

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As a Renegade fan/former owner, I thought the BS would compete more directly with the Cherokee? I haven’t seen dimensions for the BS yet, but the Renegade seems a lot smaller. Strictly comparing engine options and price range, I perceived the Cherokee to be more similar than the Renegade as a competitor. Otherwise, the Renegade’s low starting price is a huge advantage over this (under $20k). (The manual option was another advantage, but that was dropped a few years ago BOOOOOOOOOOOOO)

I do agree, though, that the success of the BS should kick Jeep in the rear about making those smaller vehicles a little more refined. It seems that they are only making them for the lessees who just want to own a Jeep but have the comfort and ride of a car. A refined Renegade/Compass/Cherokee with some better off road chops would catalyze a compact off roading boom that I am all about. Rugged vehicles that start in t he mid $20k range.

i86hotdogs > sn4cktimes 07/15/2020 at 08:12

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I read the BS will get a trans cooler on the Badlands trim. I would hope a cooler would be part of at east the Sasquatch package

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > nerd_racing 07/15/2020 at 08:20

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The V8's would fit no problem in the Bronco, Ford  just doesn’t want to go through emissions testing with V8's when they can cheat the system like everyone else thanks to turbocharging.

adamftw > HammerheadFistpunch 07/15/2020 at 08:22

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Phone typo. you are correct-o.

adamftw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/15/2020 at 08:24

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Yup. Better oil, at shorter intervals than what the factory recommends. The internet is full of oil analysis and what works better for this motor shit, so find the one for the motor you have, and change it often. Personally, I think 7500 miles should be the absolute max on a DI turbo motor. Clean burning regular ole EFI jazz I’d feel comfortable pushing to 10k in easy environments .

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > adamftw 07/15/2020 at 08:29

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I always go at 5,000-mile intervals because it’s easy to follow on the odometer. I always buy Mobil 1 synthetic oil at Walmart, where a 5-quart jug costs around $24. Only one of my vehicles has VVT and requires 0W 20 oil. And I always rotate the tires, which gives me a chance to inspect the brakes on a regular basis and look for things that might be falling off the car, or fluid leaks. People just drive cars until something breaks...

Where are you located?

nerd_racing > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 07/15/2020 at 08:32

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how is it cheating the system?  Turbos do scrub emissions more, due to recirculating the exhaust through the turbine.  

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > nerd_racing 07/15/2020 at 08:44

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You tune your small displacement engine so that when the emissions and fuel economy testing is underway, the turbo isn’t fully spoo l ed. E verything looks perfectly kosher to the EPA and you get a nice large fat MPG number and the OEM gets to publish high power figures. It’s a win/ win.

Except for the end user. 

adamftw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/15/2020 at 08:53

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I’m on Long Island in NY...

I’ve been going by the meter on my truck since I’ve had it the past couple years and it usually rings about ~6,500-7000 miles. Tires get rotated every other. Last two changes I used the walmart synthetic 5w30 and I’ve consumed almost no oil, whereas I’m usually 3/4 a quart low when I get close to needing a change.

Pickup_man > HammerheadFistpunch 07/15/2020 at 09:59

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The flares are a bit wonky for sure, but not enough to stop me from wanting one. I’m %100 on board with the rest of it with two exceptions. First, the look with the doors off looks like you just took the doors off any ol’ truck, the Wrangler looks intentional and better. Two, the tow rating is too low. My personal use case for this would be daily driving, grid roads and some windy mountain roads occasionally, I’d be willing to give up a little capability for say 5,000 lbs towing capacity. I wouldn’t be surprised if they offer a max tow package at some point that does exactly this. Ideally it would be available with both engines/trans, but knowing Ford it’ll be the 2.7/auto only.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > adamftw 07/15/2020 at 10:34

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I’m in the San Francisco Bay Area. And I need to change the oil in my Mazda 3... My 5,000-mile interval passed 500 miles ago...

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > i86hotdogs 07/15/2020 at 10:35

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Second hand I think George was saying the Sport is only about 2 inches longer than the Renegade. Most of the videos do seem to be comparing the Sport to the Compass, but the styling is clearly more targeted at the Renegade and the Renegade has better offroad chops than the Compass.

i86hotdogs > Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo 07/15/2020 at 11:21

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Definitely. I’m not sure why they make the Compass still. Focus on the Renny for a small CUV, and freshen up the Cherokee. If the BS is in the same segment as the Renny, the BS blows it out of the water. Only advantage like mentioned ear lier is the sub $20k base price.

adamftw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/15/2020 at 11:54

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I haven’t been driving much during the pandemic thing, I’m still waiting for my interval to come up.

sn4cktimes > i86hotdogs 07/15/2020 at 12:46

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I always find tow weights to be suspect anyways. We pull a teardrop with our Juke. It’s not even rated for towing in North America. And it does fine. Even with a CVT transmission. I’m sure the ladder framed 200hp SUV can pull more than that. They likely just didn’t want to test it for more. Hell, look at the “caravans” that passenger cars with sub 100hp power trains towed in the 50’s-70’s.

Good to know that some packages are going to have a trans cooler though. Makes a big difference in wear and tear and prevents the degradation of the fluid. We change the Jukes CVT  fluid at twice the recommended interval. It doesn’t have fittings to install an aftermarket cooler. I’ve debated buying another housing and drilling and tapping it myself but given the cars age it’s not worth it.

i86hotdogs > sn4cktimes 07/15/2020 at 13:22

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I agree, unless it’s a full ton truck, tow ratings are usually set for “safe” towing. I mounted a hitch on my manual Renegade when I had it. Manufacturer did not recommend towing with it, but I hauled a steel basket with a scooter on the back with no issue.

CRider > nermal 07/15/2020 at 15:34

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Well they’ve had a pretty hard time building the new Explorer so I don’t think they have that one quite down yet.

https://jalopnik.com/the-launch-of-the-new-ford-explorer-has-been-a-mess-1839224574

sn4cktimes > i86hotdogs 07/15/2020 at 16:02

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Exactly . We also had our trailer built with electric brakes just to be on the safer side. B ut honestly, I’ve tried some braking runs with the controller disabled with a full tank of water in the trailer and felt no differences in weight shift or control including on gravel grade slopes, going both up and down. I think it’s more important to have proper tongue weight, load balance, and have a realistic driving style than rely solely on a rating. I’ve seen a lot of trucks and trailers in the ditch that were 100% within their rating and obviously did something wrong. Some of those with a standard hitch and some with a 5th wheel coupling.