Folding Machine

"Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo" (rustyvandura)
05/22/2020 at 08:24 • Filed to: None

My sense is this guy’s likely asking (way) too much for this box. But if I wanted to fold, and this box was maybe $100, couldn’t I install a 1060 or a GTX580 card and fold away? The only other use the machine would get would be listening to Spotify and browsing the Web.

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DISCUSSION (30)

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 08:38

Yeah, $ 260 is an absurd price for that system, no one should pay that. It’s staggeringly obsolete. I’ve sent machines around that level to electronics recycling. Hell, I could probably ship you something at cost, though the cost of packing and shipping to the other side of the country would almost certainly make it a bad deal for you.

But setting that aside, if you just wanted to have a system for folding, anything with a PCI-E x16 slot (pretty much everything made in the past 15 years) and a ~450W+ power supply (ideally you’d want to make sure it can provide an 8-pin PCI-E power cable as well, though there are adapters that could help you out there).

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 09:03

A chief concern is whether giant GPU card would fit. Assuming that this machine has an adequately spacious case and an adequate power supply, what would be a fair price for that box?

Verdog ~ manual Bro, Bro - HellHawk Equipped > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 09:35

$100. No HDDs, which means no OS. 13 year old machine... no more than $100

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 09:46

That case looks like it would have plenty of room. Possibly you’d have to remove the bracket over the card, but it doesn’t look like it’s doing much useful anyway.

I think even $100 for that system is steep. We’re talking about a ~13 year old machine with a 10 year old mid- range video card, no drives and no OS. Maybe it’s worth $50 for the power supply and case, but this is really quite ancient.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 09:49

Other than finding a price, I think the machine might otherwise be ideal for my purposes. I was told that the GTX580 will fold m ore efficiently and faster than the 1060. Any opinion on that?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Verdog ~ manual Bro, Bro - HellHawk Equipped
05/22/2020 at 09:50

I'll aim for $50. Longish drive to go pick it it, also. What's your opinion on 1060 versus GTX580 purely for folding?

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 10:01

GTX 580? No chance... It’s less than half as powerful as a 1060 and seems likely to draw more power than the 1060 as well. It is true that for double precision folding the 580 might be able to hang with the 1060, but I believe F@H is mostly using single precision. And even using double precision, the 1060 should be a lot less power hungry.

I had actually thought you were suggesting the Radeon RX 580, which is a direct competitor to the 1060 in general (I don’t know which GPUs F@H “likes”, though I’d guess it has at least a small preference for Nvidia). The RX 580 will be cheaper than a 1060, but I’d expect it to draw more power (the RX 5500 has around the same processor power as the RX 580, but is much less thirsty, but also considerably more expensive).

In any event, I think if you can find a deal on used 1060, that would be a good way to go. As far as power consumption goes, I wouldn’t consider anything older than the Geforce 10XX series or AMD’s RX 460+ series (though I think sticking with Nvidia would be the right call) . The reason is that graphics cards were stuck at the 28nm node forever before switching to 14/16 with the above (chipmakers couldn’t get their 20nm process to work well) . Power consumption generally decreases with process shrinks, so there was a huge gain in power efficiency when that happened. The GTX 580 is a 40nm process, so it’s even worse in that regard.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 10:24

I’m actually going to sell my old cpu and GPU from before the recent upgrade. Ryzen 7 1700 and a Sapphire Nitro + SE RX 590. Interested in either, or both? I'm sure an Oppo discount applies.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com
05/22/2020 at 10:37

No case nor power supply, right?

Jb boin > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 10:37

A Core2Quad generation computer at this price is just madness.

The chassis/PSU seems quite similar the the Dell Precision T3400 workstation that is for Core i7 first generation or Xeon 55xx/56xx which are miles better than a Core2Quad in term of performance and efficiency and uses DDR3 ECC (which is dirt cheap and faster than the DDR2 of the XPS), i bought one 2 years ago for less than 100€ including shipping with a 12 threads CPU.

You can find old dual CPU workstations for less than the price of the XPS that are equipped with 750+w PSUs and can be used with only one CPU and take plenty of RAM and have many PCIe slots ; for example a Dell Precision T 5400 or a HP Z600 for the oldest generations .

For example : A HP Z620 with a single Xeon 2670 v1 (Sandy bridge generation, similar to a Core i7 2600 but with twice the cores ), 24Gb of RAM, 5 PCIe slots and a 800W PSU would cost you Ł 260 including the 20% British VAT (that you might not pay if you buy as a company).

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 10:41

Maybe I had the letters wrong. I know it was 580...

This is the one I was trying to compare to the 1060:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/114215236641?ViewItem=&item=114215236641

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 10:43

Yeah, that would make a lot more sense. My guess is that you’d pay less up front, but wouldn’t get quite as much performance folding (they’d be more similar for gaming), and would consume more power doing so.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Jb boin
05/22/2020 at 10:45

I’d be a buyer of that XPS at $40-50. I only want to browse the web and play Spotify on it and fold.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 10:46

So you’re sticking with the 1060 recommendation?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 10:47

Again, seriously: browse the web, listen to Spotify and maybe some elementary Photoshop hackery ahead of an Oppo post. This box would live in my garage and I’d only use it when I was out working on one of the cars.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 10:48

No case or power supply. I could also send you my old Dell Gaming X370 motherboard (free) with it, although it isn’t a great board and it might be temperamental to get working outside of an original Dell case with the specific fans and whatnot that it looks for on boot. If you wanted it I’d send it along with all the original fans and power switch type stuff that I’ve got left. It might work best as a test bench type setup mounted to a board, or something.

I’ve also got the OEM AMD wraith max CPU cooler that came with the 3900x. It would make a pretty mighty air cooler for that ryzen 1700.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com
05/22/2020 at 10:52

You know, actually building something sounds like more effort than I want to expend. That’s why the XPS appeals to me. Pop in the SSD I have, get Windows Something running, pop in the GPU, and off to the races. That’s my thinking, anyhow. I’ve built a bunch of computers over the years and I’m way over that now.

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 10:54

Yeah, I think so. Anandtech bench gives single precision folding scores of 74.5 for the RX 580 (they don’t identify if this is an 8GB or a 4GB), 76.1 for a 3GB 1060, and 80.6 for a 6GB 1060 (founder’s edition, which IIRC was clocked slightly higher). So they are all pretty close in there. But the Nvidia can do double precision as well (slowly), and as I say should be a bit more efficient power-wise. I’m sure there are folding hangouts where you can check people’s PPD on both cards.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 11:04

I get that. Just thought I'd put the offer out there.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 11:05

Thank you. I’ll go with 1060/6GB. Also, I emailed that guy and told him what I was doing and indicated that the computer might fetch $40 at the Thrift Store. We’ll see what he says. The idea is MINIMAL expense, pop in a used GPU, and begin folding. I have too many other projects around here to fuss around with building a PC.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com
05/22/2020 at 11:07

Mucho appreesh. I emailed the guy from Craigslist and told him what I was trying to do and told him I thought the box as it sat might fetch $40 at the Thrift Store, but that it also might be perfect for what I am trying to do. Bring home that old XPS box, install a SSD I have lying about, get Windows SOME VERSION running, pop in a used 1060/6GB and start folding. Then with two boxes, I might be able to flirt with a million points on some days.

Jb boin > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 11:17

You should really go for a first or second gen Core i* that are sensibly better in term of performance and power consumption than the old Core2* and are also dirt cheap.

And if you don’ t use an ad-blocker, you will need a powerful CPU to visit Oppo and Jalopnik !

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Jb boin
05/22/2020 at 11:24

Whatever I wind up with, it’s gotta be SIMPLE to deploy.

Verdog ~ manual Bro, Bro - HellHawk Equipped > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 11:28

You mean the RX580 AMD? They are neck and neck. I would go for the 1060 because I love nvidia.

Verdog ~ manual Bro, Bro - HellHawk Equipped > facw
05/22/2020 at 11:28

I took it as the RX580, which is neck and neck to the 1060,

Verdog ~ manual Bro, Bro - HellHawk Equipped > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 11:30

This sounds like a solid plan. $2XX is stupid money.

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 11:32

If you are just folding/browsing you can probably just install ubuntu, though for you image editing you might have to learn to use GIMP or something.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 11:47

Can I run Spotify under Ubuntu? I wouldn’t know where to begin installing Ubuntu or finding drivers or any of it. Sounds like fun though, but too low a priority to devote the time to the learning curve.

facw > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
05/22/2020 at 11:52

Yep. I don’t see why the web interface wouldn’t work, but there is an official Linux client as well: https://www.spotify.com/us/download/linux/

If you wanted to go the Ubuntu route, you’d just follow the instructions here: https://ubuntu.com/tutorials/tutorial-create-a-usb-stick-on-windows#1-overview

As for drivers, one reason to recommend Ubuntu over other flavors of Linux is that it should ask you during install if you want to install proprietary drivers and then do it automatically , instead of making you jump through hoops like some other distros. For most things it will load an open-source driver, but you will want the proprietary drivers for the graphics card for optimal performance.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > facw
05/22/2020 at 14:09

This is tempting, I confess...