I'm beginning to get pissed off.

"19JRC99" (19jrc99)
05/15/2020 at 16:13 • Filed to: None

Went to start it a couple weeks ago. Wouldn’t fire. Replaced the coil. Didn’t work.

Plugs were super fouled. Replaced ‘em.

Didn’t work. It has fuel, it has spark.

What. The. Hell?

Pap’s theory is it’s so flooded from all the pedal pumping it can’t fire. I hope he’s right. Gonna let it sit a couple days with the throttle jammed open to suck in air and try it again.

I’m starting to become absolutely convinced the car has an actual mind, and it hates me. We even tried “hot wiring” it. Still didn’t fire.

But you know what? I’ll fight this fucker til every single thing has been replaced on it if I have to. NOTHING is going to keep me from driving it.

DISCUSSION (39)

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:25

Did you add stabilizer Before sitting all winter? Battery fully charged?

19JRC99 > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
05/15/2020 at 16:26

No stabilizer, battery fully charged. If it were just gas, it would at least *try* to start on starting fluid, but it doesn’t. It just cranks endlessly.

My bird IS the word > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:27

If theres gas in the cylinders, you should be able to tell by pulling the spark plugs.

Go through and check the electical system piece by piece. You can test if you are getting spark by removing a plug and grounding it out as well.

RallyWrench > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:30

Flooding is possible, gotta wait to evaporate the fuel in the intake and combustion chambers. Might help to take the plugs out instead of opening the throttle, avoid working the accelerator pump. Does the oil smell like fuel?

lone_liberal > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:30

That sucks. I hope it’s as simple as being horribly flooded. I guess it could be timing or something in the carb causing it to dump too much gas in it (stuck float?) but the flooding seems more reasonable.

The Snowman > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:30

Id still spray some starting fluid to test...

19JRC99 > My bird IS the word
05/15/2020 at 16:31

Yeah, we’ve checked spark. We know it’s getting it. We just did the plugs today (by the way, doing plugs on a big block in a first gen Camaro sucks, especially with power brakes and power steering).

The old ones were extremely fouled, but they weren’t wet.

19JRC99 > RallyWrench
05/15/2020 at 16:32

A little, but not too bad. We held the throttle in position with a screw driver to keep it in place for a couple of days. I’m not taking the plugs back out- it was a total PITA (headers on a big block in an early Camaro with PB/PS... ugh).

19JRC99 > lone_liberal
05/15/2020 at 16:33

We tried turning the distributor. I can’t see it being a stuck float- the carb’s new. Well, maybe it could be, I don’t know.

19JRC99 > The Snowman
05/15/2020 at 16:33

That’s what I mean. We did. It didn’t even try to fire.

lone_liberal > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:35

Yeah, if the carb is new it’s really unlikely to be a stuck float since that’s usually from sitting but i t would give you an excuse to bang it with a hammer!

The Snowman > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:38

Lol I can’t read today at least it’s Friday

How did you test for spark?

19JRC99 > lone_liberal
05/15/2020 at 16:38

Well- new-ish. It’s about 3 years old and has MAYBE 30 miles on it at most.

Tareim - V8 powered > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:44

I know the feeling, been through similar with my TR7 when it was on carbs when it didn’t want to fire up, feels great once it’s resolved so good luck with that

lone_liberal > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:44

Well, if it keeps fouling plugs and flooding I guess you could try giving the float bowls a couple of whacks. It’s easy and won’t hurt anything.

This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja: > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:55

Try any ether/starting spray?

Checked for spark?

MoCamino > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 16:57

If they were fouled, but not wet, you might have to prime the fuel line. Due to some repairs I had been doing, my ‘79 Elco with a 305 sat for several months. It would crank, it was getting spark, and it would fire if I poured fuel in the carb. But I could not get gas to flow from the pump, even after cranking long enough to weaken the battery.

I charged the battery back up, dropped the fuel intake line on the fuel pump into a gas can below the car, and ran some fuel back down the fuel line from the carb to the pump by hand until I heard it flowing into the gas can. (This was no big deal, as I had the line loose anyway replacing the filter on the Quadrajunk.) I splashed some fuel in the carb to make sure it would start. It fired up, ran a little rough just because it had been a while, but smoothed out and ran fine.

I shut it down, then reconnected the pump inlet to the line from the tank and fired it up. It ran fine at that point, maybe stuttered once briefly. For a while I thought I had a bad pump, but I think it had just sat unused for so long the fuel in the line evaporated/ran back to the tank and the 40 year old pump couldn’t draw enough suction to pull fuel the 15 feet from the tank up the empty line. I imagine I need to replace the pump, but as long as I drive it at least once a month, I haven’t had any trouble since.

Edit: I missed the part where it won’t even sputter on starting fluid. That is weird.

jimz > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 17:02

if it flooded real badly, the gas may have washed down the oil film in the cylinders. years ago I had a guy limp an old LTD into the shop; it sounded like it was running on 2 cylinders and spewing smoke everywhere. turned out something in the carb fucked up and was dumping gas into the intake which washed down the cylinders and dropped compression to nothing. if it still doesn’t fire tomorrow check the oil for signs of gas dilution, squirt a bit of oil into each cylinder through the spark plug hole, and see if it’ll fire up.

Michael > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 17:02

Manual or electric choke?

The Snowman > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 17:56

Its possible you have the timing so far out that it would not try to start.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 17:59

How’s the ground strap? Frayed or oxidized? Couple years ago was going nuts why I was having starting g problems only to see the strap from the transaxle bright green.

Gone > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 18:44

Not sure what carb is on it, but even if newer and it had ethanol fuel in the bowls it can ruin the floats as many are nitrophyl, not brass. Same with the rubber diaphragm ac cellerator pump, change to GLFT.

19JRC99 > lone_liberal
05/15/2020 at 19:41

True. Mostly they were fouled from being gapped wrong.

19JRC99 > The Snowman
05/15/2020 at 19:41

It ran last year, barely moved the distributor.

19JRC99 > The Snowman
05/15/2020 at 19:42

I can’t exactly explain it, it was a technique my grandfather knows. Basically putting an old spark plug in a wire, grounding it to the battery, and cranking. And it sparked.

19JRC99 > This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja:
05/15/2020 at 19:43

Yes and yes.

19JRC99 > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
05/15/2020 at 19:43

Ground strap is good.

19JRC99 > Michael
05/15/2020 at 19:43

Manual. It’s definitely not the choke- it started fine back in November 2018 when it was far colder than this.

The Snowman > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 20:51

My money is on timing/bad fuel. It was probably way out of time but running. Then you put bad fuel in turn the dizzy and it doesn’t want to run. I’d get a gas can and hose to run off fresh fuel and reset the timing. G uessing it’s a small block 327?

John Norris (AngryDrifter) > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 21:26

Big block 1968 Camaro. What a great car. Whatever you have to do to nurse it back to health is worth it. What a great, great car.

Bad gas maybe? Once it airs out I’d go with the starting fluid first if your gas is old. Perhaps once you got it flooded with old gas the ether wasn’t going to help.

This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja: > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 21:40

Have you tried swearing at it and threatening to crush it ? That’s what I’d usually do.

Jokes aside, h ope you can get it sorted. Pretty car. Maybe t ime for a tri-power upgrade.:)

Thisismydisplayname > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 22:14

In this case the miles don’t matter, it’s the time that fuel has been sitting in the bowls. Ethanol not good for long term health of a carb.

19JRC99 > The Snowman
05/15/2020 at 23:04

Nope. 454. It definitely isn’t bad fuel, since it wouldn’t even sputter on starting fluid. As for timing, it doesn’t have a tab or a mark on it so I’d have to find TDC to determine it.

19JRC99 > John Norris (AngryDrifter)
05/15/2020 at 23:05

I’m hoping it just needs to air out.

Thank you for the compliment. I adore it. It’s just a pain in the ass sometimes lol. Years of neglect will do that.

19JRC99 > This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja:
05/15/2020 at 23:06

Nah, one carb has been trouble enough!

I’ve tried swearing at it. Can’t even bring myself to threaten it with crushing it.

AdverseMartyr > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 23:22

Have you tapped on the carb with a hammer, and then slammed the dash three times with your fist after running widdershins around the car twice?

The Snowman > 19JRC99
05/15/2020 at 23:34

Also this is a good read, I have had brand new coils be garbage.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

The proper method to check for spark is with a spark tester. It resembles a spark plug but has a sunken center electrode that simulates a load on the coil.

Holding the plug wire and seeing if a spark jumps to ground is inconclusive. The spark is arcing in atmospheric pressure. This is substantially less pressure than the energy required to arc the plug electrode under load.

For an engine to start and run properly, the energy must arc the plug and keep that arc going until all of the combustible mixture is consumed. Anything less and the engine will be weak, run rough, stall, and misfire.

Weak ignition is often confused with a fuel problem since the two systems are codependent. Many times, especially with small engines, the carburetor and the fuel are unjustly demonized for a problem when the ignition system is the real culprit. Think spark first then fuel, not the other way around.

19JRC99 > AdverseMartyr
05/15/2020 at 23:50

I should try this. Must it be the dash? I did smack the roof and door panel once or twice.

AdverseMartyr > 19JRC99
05/16/2020 at 03:07

Nope, that’s the wrong order. And to do those actions you slam the hood down with confidence after tapping the carb.

smacking the roof is done in the case that it does not start after slamming the dash. (It looks to the car gods as if you have given up in frustration) , and then you re-enter the car, stick your arm out the window, tap the door panel 2-3 times while softly saying, “come on. baby.” (some people say that adding in “work for daddy” helps). The key should be turned on the 2nd & 3rd tap. (The working theory is that the car gods see your sincerity and desperation then act out of mercy.)

If it still doesn’t start, then you need to get a bag full of Jeep rust from David Tracy, and draw a circle around the car.