Sports cars are likely dead

"El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First!" (lightningzone) 04/14/2020 at 12:50 • Filed to: None

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Just under 60.000 sports cars were sold last year in Europe.

For Sweden > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 12:55

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The 370Z is proof that sports cars can never die.

Textured Soy Protein > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 12:57

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Interesting the Z4 has sold that many copies. In the US, Toyota has sold more Supras than BMW has sold Z4s, but neither of them has moved anything close to 10k units.

interstate366, now In The Industry > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 12:58

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I’m honestly surprised the Mustang has sold that many over there. American expats/servicemembers maybe?

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:00

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Wait, so each of the big three muscle cars sell more than the Supra and Z4 in Europe? And holy crap that is a lot of Mustangs sold.

PowderHound > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:01

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The new  A110 sold 4,412? Am I reading this wrong? Because that seems incredible

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:01

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Audi sells that many TT’s? I would never had guessed.

It would be interesting to see the US numbers for the Rus tang, Cermero, and Challenged-er

facw > For Sweden 04/14/2020 at 13:03

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Well that’s the good news is that presumably companies can just keep making the same outdated sports cars until the tooling wears out or environmental/safety regulations make them untenable. With development and setup costs heavily amortized you’d expect they be able to turn a profit even with declining volume,

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > PowderHound 04/14/2020 at 13:05

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It’s an incredible car. Got to spin one around Barcelona last year. Got me a hard on.

jimz > For Sweden 04/14/2020 at 13:08

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so it’s a zombie?

For Sweden > jimz 04/14/2020 at 13:09

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370Zombie

PowderHound > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:09

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Lucky! I honestly thought it was a limited production run but super glad to see they are selling well. 

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > Textured Soy Protein 04/14/2020 at 13:10

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Z4 has a cult following in places like Germany, France, UK or the Netherlands. And there’s Eastern Europe too, where driving a German car is synonymous with making it in life. Of course, it helps that this new one is the best looking Z4, by far.

wafflesnfalafel > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:11

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interestingly strong numbers for the TT

My bird IS the word > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:16

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I didn't realize they sold challengers in Europe.

duurtlang > interstate366, now In The Industry 04/14/2020 at 13:19

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Nah. These are sold to people with European passports. The Mustang is a relative bargain, at least in countries with low emissions related taxes like Germany and the UK . Another u pside is that it’s not one of the generic German cars that are everywhere.

To put it in perspective: The M ustang sold 10k, the VW Golf 400-500k.

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > PowderHound 04/14/2020 at 13:20

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There are only two dealers in Spain, in Madrid and Barcelona, so you won’t see them as often as Clios, but there are cars to go around. The same can’t be said about the Alfa 4C. And that’s too bad. It’s a great car, but it’s a bit too flawed for mainstream, even sports car mainstream. They are white rhino rare. Hell, I’ve been to Rome for a week in February and I haven’t seen one.

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available 04/14/2020 at 13:23

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I’m blaming Richard Hammond! Of course, it helps that interiors and suspensions on today’s muscle cars are way way way better than those from the original muscle cars.

duurtlang > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:25

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Where is the BRZ/GT86 though? And the MX-5 (Miata) and MX-5 RF ? They are much more sports car than then FWD TT.

W hen you include the American trio of bargy coupes, why not include cars like the BMW 2-series and 4-series coupes? All these sold in quite significant numbers as well.

It seems a bit incomplete this way.

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > interstate366, now In The Industry 04/14/2020 at 13:28

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There are thousands of American military personnel in Germany, Poland or Romania so yeah. But not only that. Sales are driven by the EcoBoost engine and the fact that this is the first Mustang that's officially sold in Europe, by Ford. Before this, they were unofficially imported and bought by those who wanted a cheap V8, with a bad interior. 

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > My bird IS the word 04/14/2020 at 13:31

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They don't. Officially. But it's not illegal to import them and there are companies who do just that. Importing American cars.

duurtlang > My bird IS the word 04/14/2020 at 13:32

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Well, 631 cars in a market bigger than the American market is not that many.

It’s the amount of Camaros that surprised me the most. Ford and (to a lesser extent) FCA are strongly rooted in Europe. You can find a Ford or Fiat dealership in every town. GM however surrendered with its tail between its legs in 2017 or so, as they could not keep up. Currently GM only sell offers the Camaro, Corvette and maybe a Cadillac or two in Europe . At least on paper. I thought they sold those by the tens, but apparently they sold almost 2k units of the Camaro. For a company with no dealerships, this is quite remarkable.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:35

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Richard Hammond really did do a lot of free advertising. But also Ford specifically designed the current generation to be more appealing globally. For that matter I’m surprised FCA sold any Dodge Challengers. 

duurtlang > Textured Soy Protein 04/14/2020 at 13:39

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In Europe, Toyota is equated to octogenarians. Sensible cars that run forever and are incredibly boring to look at and drive. A brand for those that care about reliability, reliability and nothing else. The opposite of ‘fun’ I guess.

So on the one hand you have a conservatively but attractively styled car(with a removable roof!) from a fancy brand, on the other you have an odd looking car from a company with a bad reputation (from a sporty new car buyer perspective). And they are priced similarly. The result is that only the JDM fanboys buy the Supra, and every one else and their mom buy the Z4. JDM fanboys are rather rare in Europe.

Textured Soy Protein > duurtlang 04/14/2020 at 13:45

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Toyota has much the same reputation in the US, but also plenty of people who are enthusiastic about its performance cars. Plus the Tacoma & 4Runner.

Most of what I’ve heard/ seen about the Supra here is people complaining that instead of the bulletproof 2JZ in the MkIV , this one is full of crappy unreliable BMW mechanicals. But for those choosing between it and the Z4, coupes are much more popular than convertibles here. I believe at this point Mazda even sells more RF Miatas than soft tops.

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > duurtlang 04/14/2020 at 13:51

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I’m not sure anybody buys the 86 anymore. I haven’t seen one  around in Spain, Portugal or France in a couple of years. 

duurtlang > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 13:54

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Surely they sold more GT86/BRZ than the Lotus Evora, Alfa 4C or Chevy Camaro convertible. Yet those three are on the list.

RiceRocketeer Extraordinaire > For Sweden 04/14/2020 at 14:21

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don’t give them any more ideas for special editions

Sovande > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 14:28

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What were the numbers sold for prec eding years? How did you come to the conclusion that sports cars are dead based on sales figures for one year? How do they compare to other years? 

Gerry197 > interstate366, now In The Industry 04/14/2020 at 14:49

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The current Mustang has been the best selling “sports car” in it’s class for a few years in Europe. Surprising I know. They were serious enough to make a right hand drive for the UK market as well.

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/feu/en/news/2019/04/17/mustang-claims-title-of-best-selling-sports-coupe-in-the-world-f.html

Gerry197 > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 14:50

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At least in the UK, the V8 Mustang makes up 75% of it’s sales.  Majority of European Mustang sales are to Europeans, not Expats or military. 

El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! > Sovande 04/14/2020 at 14:53

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60.000 is way too little in a 15.5 million market. Sports cars had almost 10% of the market 10 or 15 years ago. Now? Not even 5%. 

SpeedSix > duurtlang 04/14/2020 at 14:54

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Here’s the webpage that links to the infographics on Twitter. Every sports car is there, I think.

ranwhenparked > facw 04/14/2020 at 15:22

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SAIC begs to differ.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 15:29

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You shut your damn mouth!

[weeps]

Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle > El Relámpago(LZone) - Humanity First! 04/14/2020 at 15:38

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The A110 must be good based on those numbers(not percentage but 4,412 cars is quite a few for such a unique car) . Seems like the perfect car between an Alfa 4C and a Cayman(4c size, close to cayman livability) . I want to drive one so bad.

Ash78, voting early and often > interstate366, now In The Industry 04/14/2020 at 15:42

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The Mustang has been one of the best-selling sports cars in Europe for a couple years now. The current generation is a great combo of size and handling to work pretty much anywhere in the world.