The Clock is Ticking

"hillrat" (hillrat) 03/25/2020 at 08:45 • Filed to: None

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I have one year to buy and sort out a car for my oldest child. I had originally thought that this would be a years long thing that we would do together as father and daughter, but alas my daughter is not into it....at all.

Despite her mother and I’s best efforts, we have raised a super prissy girl that doesn’t like sports or getting dirty or building shit. Actually that’s not 100% correct, she does like to do crafty things, paint, sew, and knit/crochet a little bit. I have no gifts or training ( or ever had the opportunity to explore) in those areas so I guess we’re a pretty complimentary pair in that respect. She’s also a super talented singer and, with no lessons or formal training outside of what she’s received over the last school year, a pretty decent by ear piano player.

I don’t know about y’all, but when I started driving in the 80's cars were still slightly terrifying. I drove a ‘72 Chevy Impala that weighed about 14,000 lbs and had drum brakes, when you were driving in the rain you were CAREFUL.

My first thought is that I want her to be driving something just this side of Fury Road to start. I always wanted a Mustang and I was thinking that might a good first car. Buy a cheap 90's Mustang with one of those dog shit V6 engines and a 5 speed so that she actually has to learn how to drive . It would still have an airbag and possibly ABS but no traction control and would be RWD. Is this a stupid idea?

DutchieDC2R > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:08

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I’d probably go with something else. Something that isnt rwd, actually has the nanny’s you mentioned and maybe a bit newer.

I understand where youre coming from with the 'so that she can actually learn to drive' comment, however, I dont think a rwd Mustang without traction control would be the best choice for a first car. 

pip bip - choose Corrour > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:11

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Toyota Corolla

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:13

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You mean something like this? https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/ctd/d/laurel-very-nice-2002-ford-mustang-rare/7096862064.html

I think it’s a good idea - I like the idea of teaching new drivers manual right from the get go, and I don’t think that’s too much car to get in trouble in. My first “real car” (after learning in my parents GMC S-15 ) was a 98 Pontiac Grand Prix GT which is very comparable in terms of size/weight/power. The only difference is it was FWD and auto. But it was probably the right car for me to start on.

Just Jeepin' > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:14

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If she’s not interested, you can’t make her be. Buy her a used,  modern appliance (Fit, Soul, etc) and call it a day.

hillrat > DutchieDC2R 03/25/2020 at 09:16

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I’ll take this under advisement, thanks for weighing in.

punkgoose17 > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:17

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Old Camry? 

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:21

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Get her something relatively nimble, but easy to drive. Later model civic coupe, golf hatchback, or perhaps a kia forte koup are all good handling cars that can be driven like appliances. If she develops a love for cars, then these cars will help her see how much fun it can be to drive. But if she doesn’t, then you haven’t foisted upon her something she hates.

Good on you for wanting to give your daughter something nice, but keep in mind that if you give her the mustang and she dislikes it, it’ll be a sticking point between you two. She’ll probably feel resentment since you saddled her with *your* desires, not thinking about what she might want or like. And if you get her the “regular” car and she dislikes it? Then that’s sorely on her, since you did right by getting something nice that she might actually appreciate .

TRivet > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:21

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I understand EXACTLY where you are coming from. My oldest, a daughter that is in MANY ways similar to yours - having ZERO interest in cars and mechanical applications (sigh) but so intelligent and talented in more “fine arts” stuff....so, I understand.

We ended up with a FWD Saturn Vue. As my wife drove a Pontiac Torrent, it was very similar mechanically, so I was already familiar with it (many parts are interchangeable , and the Torrent was relatively easy to work on).

We both liked the cargo capacity, it was not too big, and the plastic body panels are very forgiving (no door dents or dings :) and it’s bright red, which she liked, and makes it easy to see. 5 years later she is still driving it, still working well with mini ma l maintenance .

RWD would not be an option for a year-round car for my daughter in Michigan due to the snow.  I love the idea of a stick, as I believe you truly learn how to drive a vehicle. 

E90M3 > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:23

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I had a 1997 Explorer as my first car that I got at 16 ; I’m 30 now for reference . I would get her something in the same vein as that. Just something simple and reliable with modern safety features. 

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:24

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What’s your budget?

My first and best recommendation to folks is a Toyota Corolla from about 2005. Affordable, dependable and they drive well.

Captain of the Enterprise > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:25

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I see where you’re coming from but I’d go safer than rwd and that old. I’d probably go with a C orolla or Camry personally.

RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:25

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Not so sure I’d go with RWD...might be a bit hairy. If you want basic where a person has to actually DRIVE a car, you could get a Hyundai Accent (yeah, I know, I know) like mine (or the equivalent Kia Rio as they are the same car underneath)?

I have an ‘09 Accent hatchback base trim ...5-speed, no ABS, no hill start assist for the manual (handbrake starts on hills ftw!), no Cruise, open diff, no traction control, no Bluetooth or touchscreens or any of that crap. It does have airbags (here in Canada we only ever got front airbags, but I think you got side airbags too in the US) and could be had with A/C though, so not completely devoid of safety and luxury. Mine’s been dead reliable and parts are easily available and it’s cheap to repair. Not a large amount of power to accidentally get herself in trouble (110hp but peppier than you think), but a basic-enough car that she would actually have to learn to drive it properly.

DipodomysDeserti > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:34

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My wife drove a manual Mustang in high school with the dogshit V6. That’s what we both learned to drive a manual on. We both also learned to drive using pickups, so the rwd and no tc wasn’t an issue. The Mustang was much more stable in the rain.

hillrat > TRivet 03/25/2020 at 09:37

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Are we the same person? We used to have a Torrent until it was stolen.

3point8isgreat > DutchieDC2R 03/25/2020 at 09:39

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I’ve had my slowstang since high school and I have to say I’m not sure traction control would do much.  Having almost no power at all makes it quite difficult to break traction unless you’ve got crap tires in wet or snow.  ... Granted this only ever resulted in me trying even harder to get it to break traction.  

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:39

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Yeah, this just sounds like a job for a Corolla. Prius maybe.

hillrat > Snuze: Needs another Swede 03/25/2020 at 09:40

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Yeah, that exactly what I was thinking of.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 09:51

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That should have airbags, ABS, TC, etc. All the basic safety stuff. And I think the early V6s were about 150 HP, the later ones were 200 HP.  Not earth shattering by any means. With it being RWD the one thing to stress is decent tires, especially for bad weather. 

TRivet > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 10:05

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Wow - someone stole a Torrent? Easier than selling it I suppose......

Kidding of course. What happened? Di d you get it back?

DutchieDC2R > 3point8isgreat 03/25/2020 at 10:06

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I have a feeling that the chance of s omething going wrong (during rain or snow) with a rwd car is higher than fwd/awd. Im not saying TC is an all out savior or anything, but for a first car, I'd absolutely look at something with a bit more tech to 'help' during such conditions. Add to that that the safety tech in an older mustang isnt all that great, yeah, something newer for sure. Thats just IMHO btw.

OmerCarrothers333 > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 10:16

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When my wife’s new Kia is paid off our kids will be driving, I figure a hybrid is a good first car. Although it has the same horsepower as the 78 Camaro I had, it's a much safer car.

WildlyMild > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 10:24

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Prius. Cheap and very few repairs. Also, it may make her want to care about what she drives

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 10:45

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“Oldest” Keep in mind,  what you get one child will be the benchmark for the others and may be a sticking point for years to come. Not that I have any resentment

boredalways > hillrat 03/25/2020 at 11:10

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You're welcome

hillrat > TRivet 03/25/2020 at 15:11

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Dude, that car getting stolen was one of the best things that ever happened to me!  

Wife was on her way to Hawaii when she parked it at the Metro here in DC and decided to leave the keys in the glove compartment but didn’t lock the car. Now I don’t know if you live in a big city, but here in DC people just try car doors all the time because many people (including yours truly) leave their doors unlocked after their window got smashed for 4 CDs and $1.47 in change. So someone tried our door, found the keys while rifling through the car, and it was Merry Christmas to them.

So I came home from work to find my car stolen and my wife was in Hawaii. That all sucked, but that car had lived a hard life here in DC and had just short of 100k brutal miles plus all the milk spilled , fruit left to rot , etc. that my children and wife had subjected it to. It needed the head gasket done and had 4 mismatch tires on it, I was looking at $2500 in repairs on a ten year old car that sometimes smelled bad when the Sun baked out a long forgotten smell. Then it got stolen and a car that I *might* have gotten $2-3k if I sold it myself (less on a trade-in) suddenly turned into 3 weeks in a rental car and $8k. Pretty good deal for me.

The delicious cherry on the cake was that less than a week a fter I had sent the keys and title to the insurance company, they found my car up in Baltimore. Cops asked if I wanted to come pick it up, but as I explained to them, “That car belongs to the insurance company now, I don’t have a title to establish ownership or even a set of keys.”

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 03/26/2020 at 13:53

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The name didn’t click but I saw your post below that you’re in the DC area. I’m i n VA around the Sterling/Great Falls border. Did you ever go to Katie’s Cars n Coffee (back before the apocalypse)?

It sounds like you’re not in a huge rush (1 year) for a car, so if you have any interest I’m looking to potentially sell both my cars this year. I’ve got a 1996 Volvo 850 GLT (non-turbo, automatic) that’ s basically a backup car at this point . It’s   definitely going as I’d like to get a 240 wagon project car instead. The more iffy one is my 2012 Cruze LT daily driver. It’s got the 1.4 turbo and a 6 speed manual. I am thinking I’d like a new daily driver and with things going the way they are, it’s going to be a buyers market so it may be a good time to get into something a bit newer and nicer. But I kind of want to see where the market goes and such before I dive in and get a new car. 

hillrat > Snuze: Needs another Swede 03/27/2020 at 07:12

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No, I’ve never been to a cars & coffee any where, ever unfortunately.

Ohh, both of those cars sound intri guing. If you’re going to put a 16 year old that doesn’t really care about cars into something why not a super safe Volvo that will take the beating DC puts on a car? The Cruze is also a viable option; new-ish with modern nannies, but has a stick to keep the kid’s attention a little more focused.

You are 100% correct that new cars are going to be CHEAP in about 6 months and I’ve been rubbing my hands together in anticipation. I wasn’t able to take advantage of the “everything is discounted if you have money and/or good credit” nature of recessions in 2008, but I will this time.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 03/27/2020 at 14:29

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When things get going again you have to come to Katie’s. Its every Saturday 6 to 9 AM in Great Falls, VA. Its awesome because it draws such a range - you might have a Ferrari F12 sitting next to a 63 Corvette split window, sitting next to a Citroen 2CV.

The Volvo is a typical Swedish tank. I bought it last year from a girl at work. Body is clean and mostly straight, the interior was shot, and it needed some maintenance, but its mostly sorted at this point. The Cruze is also due for some work that I’m planning to accomplish in the next few weeks. 

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 04/15/2020 at 15:39

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Hey, since you seemed at least semi-interested, I'm going to be putting the Volvo up for sale in the next few days. Let me know if you're interested. 

hillrat > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/17/2020 at 18:20

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Thanks for the heads up. What are you asking for it?

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 04/17/2020 at 21:06

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Well, to answer your question I’d like to get what I have tied up in it, which is $1500. I bought the car for $400 because it was clean and straight, just way down on maintenance. I’ve done a timing belt and water pump, shocks & struts, motor mounts, and fixed the ratty interior. It still needs a little work and I know originally you sounded like you were interested in something to do a little wrenching on.  If you think you might still be interested shoot me an e-mail at mark . gates @ gmail and I will give you more of a rundown about the car and what I have done and what it needs.  

hillrat > Snuze: Needs another Swede 05/02/2020 at 09:37

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Sorry it took me so long to reply. My youngest has hi-jacked my laptop and I don’t Oppo on my phone or work computer.

The wife has declared a “no speculative car buying until we know what the fuck is going to happen” fatwa. Which is really quite reasonable when you think about it. What we have agreed on is taking the plunge and buying a cheap welding setup to fuck around with after watching this video:

https://jalopnik.com/how-to-get-started-welding-for-dirt-cheap-1843130301

Snuze: Needs another Swede > hillrat 05/02/2020 at 11:42

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No worries, and I understand completely. Ive been trying to sell the car through other channels and no bites so far (though I did price it a bit high, maybe too high). But I think a lot of people are holding off on these kinds of things, especially the target market for this car, which would be a first car for a teen. Well they have nowhere to go, no driving to do, so it makes sense not to buy yet.

Good luck with the welding, though. I bought a cheap MIG box and taught myself. Im not great but I can do what I need. And its a valuable skill to have.