4-Cylinder Supra vs 4-Cylinder Camaro 1LE: By the Numbers

"way2blu does a rev update" (way2blu) 02/13/2020 at 19:38 • Filed to: 2021 Toyota Supra, 2020 Supra, Supra, Camaro, Camaro 1LE

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All photos credit: me, unless stated otherwise. Above is the 2019 Camaro 2.0T 1LE, specifically the one I daily drive.

Today, Toyota announced the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , for the 2021 model year. Comparing the I4-powered Supra to its closest domestic rival, the Chevrolet Camaro 2.0T 1LE, some interesting conclusions can be drawn.

Full disclosure: I daily drive & autocross a 2019 Camaro 2.0T 1LE and find the 4-Cylinder Supra to be a fascinating idea. I used to drive a 1991 Toyota MR2 as well. My qualifications as a Chevy/Toyota pundit don’t go much further than that.

But wait? Why compare an import to a so-called muscle car? The Camaro and Supra are statistically the closest competitors. Both are coupes in the low 3100-3300 pound weight range, and have 2.0-liter turbocharged RWD powertrains.

Seeing as the 2021 Toyota Supra has yet to be driven by the press, this comparison is solely based on existing statistics provided by Toyota and Chevrolet. On paper, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! appears to be a worthy challenge:

Toyota Supra 2.o / Camaro 2.0T 1LE (best stats in bold )

Horsepower: 255 / 275

Torque: 295 / 295

Curb Weight: 3,181 lbs / 3,354 lbs

Weight Distribution: 50-50 / 50-50

Price: TBD / $31k

Seats: 2 / 4

Roof: Double-bubble / Double-bubble

Transmission: ZF 8-Speed Automatic / 6-Speed Manual

With similar-enough curb weights, advantage Supra, and identical peak torque outputs, straight-line acceleration will be close. Toyota’s claimed 5.0-second 0-60 time beats the Camaro’s time of 5.4 seconds, likely helped by the ZF 8-Speed automatic transmission.

Both of these sportscars offer only one transmission choice. The Camaro is manual-only, and the Supra is, sadly, automatic-only. Both of these, being enthusiast cars, would likely sell better if multiple transmission options were offered on each. “I want a track Camaro that I can drive comfortably in stop & go commuting ” and “I want a stick-shift Supra” are currently unavailable.

The Camaro’s back seats are, legally, seats. Seatbelts are present, as well as side-curtain airbags. They are not, however, ethically, seats. This is a car that seats 4 adults, with great difficulty and for a very short time. It’s truly a 2+2 rather than a grand-tourer, so I’m inclined to consider the seating count a tie between the Camaro and the Supra.

Aside from the pedal count, where the Camaro’s 3rd pedal for clutch actuation gives it extra enthusiast cred, both cars are similar enough to compete mostly on subjective preference.

One factor in the Chevy’s favor is its track warranty, which covers racetrack & autocross use !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! on stock 1LE-package Camaros.

Image via Toyota. The 4-Cylinder Supra 2.0 looks exactly like the 6-Cylinder Supra 3.0, which surely won’t confuse anyone.

Which of these is the better choice? In my opinion, it’s great that both exist. If you’re looking for a sporty car that can daily-drive but also dominate on a track, the 4-cylinder Camaro and Supra are both great choices. I can’t wait to see how the Supra drives.

Which would you choose? Or what other cars do you feel compete in this segment?

CB > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 19:44

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“(best stats in bold )  

Transmission: ZF 8-Speed Automatic / 6-Speed Manual”

way2blu does a rev update > CB 02/13/2020 at 19:52

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Khalbali > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 20:21

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https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a21050781/2018-kia-stinger-20t-rwd-test-review/

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 20:21

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Is the Camaro really Manual-Only in that trim?  I had no idea.  I’m thinking they’d sell better with the transmission 95% of America seems to prefer, but WTF do I know?

way2blu does a rev update > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 02/13/2020 at 20:24

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The only track-warranty Camaro with an available automatic is the ZL1 1LE. An automatic on the lesser engines should be an obvious option, but I guess GM can’t see it because of the blind spots.

camarov6rs > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 20:29

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I’d bet the camaro will end up cheaper even with the 1LE package.

way2blu does a rev update > Khalbali 02/13/2020 at 20:30

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Honestly, I forgot the Stinger existed.  90% of the performance with 2x the practicality and a similar price. Good call. 

way2blu does a rev update > camarov6rs 02/13/2020 at 20:36

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Mine sat on the lot for 2 months before I got it for $5k off MSRP. Meanwhile at Toyota: “ We don’t allow test-drives of Supras unless you fill out this finance application”

Chevy’s dealers are desperate to cut deals, while Toyota’s want to squeeze the customer for every cent. Supra vs Camaro could be a $10k difference, easily.

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 21:05

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Camaro, and it’s not even close for a multitude of reasons.

Price/Performance

Rel iability/parts availability

Practicality-this sounds silly but the camar o actually has a relatively  usable cargo area vs the travel size luggage compartment on the Supra. It’s honestly laughable.

Choice of manual.

And arguably I think it looks better.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 21:05

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!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Heh. They have a few of those...

DipodomysDeserti > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 21:19

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The four banger Supra makes 255 hp, weighs about 3200 lbs and comes with the ZF8. Sounds like my wife’s eight year-old X1.

AestheticsInMotion > camarov6rs 02/13/2020 at 21:51

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Probably by a considerable amount

thatsmr > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 22:15

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Preface: While I think a Toyota would have an overall better build quality and longevity of things like window motors, hood releases, trunk releases, door handles, anything interior....the robustness of GM powertrains in the last 20+ yeats is notable, and they would be my choice of “domestics” if had to be made.

That said, I found it interesting that I sold a used RC-F to an engineer recently who was uncomfortable with BMW sourcing of Supras, and concerned with !lack of experience of Toyota techs to service or repair a Supra

ItalianJobR53 - now with added 'MERICA and unreliability > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 22:33

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I’ll just drop this here:

If you are fine with not having rear seats (but a big boot connected to the cabin), C5Z is kinda unbeatable at this price point. Drop another 15 grand on top of the buying price at a race shop and you’ll have a rocket ship (if you want)

coqui70 > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 23:07

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Does the Mustang Ecoboost offer a track package and manual? If so then maybe another option.

BadMotorScooter > way2blu does a rev update 02/13/2020 at 23:42

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Well, I had a MkIV Supra TT back in the day. After many many enthusiast cars since then, I have a LT1 Camaro and a 911T as fun cars. I have little interest in an auto BMYota Supra. If they offered a manual then maybe, but still Camaro 1LE FTW. 

way2blu does a rev update > coqui70 02/13/2020 at 23:47

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The Mustang Ecoboost High Performance Package is the track-y Ecoboost, but weighs ~3650 pounds. Optioned with the HPP and Handling Package, it’s running $36k+.

That said, if the 2.0L Supra costs that much, I’d take the Mustang at that price point,  no questions asked.

way2blu does a rev update > BadMotorScooter 02/13/2020 at 23:51

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They don’t sell the Supra in dark green yet either. I think the Camaro 1LE is more like the old Supra than the new Supra is.

How’s your LT1 drive compared to the MKIV you had? That’d be an interesting comparison for sure.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 00:38

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It makes me sad that I’d choose the Camaro over the Supra being a Japanese car fanboi for so long, it I can’t in conscience choose and automatic sports car over an manual one. It just ain’t right.

That said.

Ecoboost Mustang over either one.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > coqui70 02/14/2020 at 00:40

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Yes and you can get a Performance Pack drop too Ecoboost for less than 40k. 

wafflesnfalafel > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 01:27

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I wish the Camaro was about 125 lbs lighter, or the Supra had a different nose and roof line.  

SAVAGE SS 1LE > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 02:55

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i am a proud owner of a 2018 Camaro ss 1LE which at one point in my life i was full blown JDM supporter and owner but in these 2 comparison’s i think the supra is a better choice being its a more compact smaller sports car and i think it’ll hold a higher value longer then the camaro but the v8 on the other hand is a monster my ss is one bad machine i lightly modified my ss and it’s fast im pushing in the 500 hp range to the wheels the only problem that i have with it is the length and width feels like driving a bat mobile lol as a matter of fact ford and dodge is just as bad thats what sets the supra aside from American muscle cars the supra is like driving a sportbike with 4 wheels even though its not fast like a bike its compact and i also think its easier to control. i had a 350z before its about the size as a supra and i had alot of fun with my z especially when i modified it all in all i love all cars im not bias.

Jeff > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 06:56

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More like 20 k 1le sticker from 30 to 34  can be bought 3k to 5k less . On a good day you could buy 2 1le's for the price you would pay for a supra

BadMotorScooter > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 08:43

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I had the MkIV Supra back in the 90s so hard to do a modern comparison. Mine was a 93 turbo, red with black interior. I can say that the Supra TT had its flaws though. My car was stock, unmodified, and it had serious turbo lag from the sequential turbos. There was a very noticeable transition to the big turbo that you had to be aware of because that’s when the power hit. It was heavy, had numb steering, and it was very non-rigid compared to today’s cars. It would shake like a wet dog over railroad tracks or bumpy roads (it was a targa top, I hear the very rare fixed solid roof cars don’t have this issue). Overall, the Camaro is an order of magnitude better in almost every area, except visibility and utility from the large Supra hatch. Also, a stock MkIV TT had 320HP, and was heavy, so not that fast out of the box. A 1LE Camaro would beat it in almost every measurable way.

The Supra did have an aura of coolness, almost exotic-car like, that was impressive. Even before the FnF scene, that car would draw a crowd and have people gawk and stare like no Camaro ever has.

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 09:34

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why not also compare the ecoboost mustang? 3500 lb with 310 horsepower and 350 ft/lb torque .seems about the same

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 09:39

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Both are coupes in the low 3100-3300 pound weight range

Holy crap, I didn’t realize these were so heavy

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 09:44

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It may weigh the most, but it also has more horsepower and torque than both the Camaro and the Supra, 330hp, and 350lb-ft with a wider torque curve than the standard EcoBoost engine, as it uses a Focus RS-derived engine with a different turbo and cylinder head.

Part of that handling package is Magneride, as well.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 09:51

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Which would I choose?

The Porsche, plus either classic Supra after that.

way2blu does a rev update > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 02/14/2020 at 10:11

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I’ll write more about this in another post, but I ended up going with the Camaro because it was the best “90s JDM” vibe of any entry level car on sale today.

What brings you to the Mustang? Better horsepower or better visibility? Or something else?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 12:21

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It flabbergasts me to think that a four-banger can boast 275 hp and 295 torques. The V8 in my crappy 2010  Vic is rated less than that.

way2blu does a rev update > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/14/2020 at 12:57

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The crazy part is that the Camaro’s LTG motor has plenty of room for tuning too. The one that won SCCA CAM-C last year was up to ~375 hp & 400 torque.

Also, just look at how small the LTG is in the engine bay:

Tons of room for upgrades & cooling.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 13:13

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Will it go 200k miles without major maintenance like timing chains and turbochargers and other espen$ive stuff?

way2blu does a rev update > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/14/2020 at 13:28

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Hard to say. The 2.0T looks more DIY-friendly with all the space, but I have a hunch your V8 probably requires less maintenance. 

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 14:03

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I wanna drive one of those. I’d also like to drive a base-model Kia Stinger, which comes with a four-banger rated at 205 or 210 HP.

feather-throttle-not-hair > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 15:26

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Possible third option : BMW 230i

Same engine as the Supra, same 3-box shape as the Camaro. It weighs the same more or less as the Camaro, but it is smaller on the outside, while having a much more usable back seat. Unlike the Supra, it comes with a stick.

It costs more than either car, with a base price of 35,300 and is likely a tiny bit slower (I think most tests are in the high 5 second 0-60 range) but i’d still consider that the same ballpark. Also, bonus points for being able to see out of it.

Textured Soy Protein > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/14/2020 at 15:45

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The 4-cylinder Stinger has 255 hp.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Textured Soy Protein 02/14/2020 at 15:50

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Have you had a chance to drive one yet? There aren’t any Stingers on Turo...

I think even the base-model Stinger is pretty expensive, like north of $30k.

XT6Wagon > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/14/2020 at 16:32

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4.6l 2v loves boost. Sadly the engine is likely the only mechanical bit that will tolerate 750hp.

XT6Wagon > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 16:35

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It's an actual car. The back seats are useable by people with legs, and the trunk is borderline huge. Camaro has a mail slot above the tail lights to access the place some who hates his golf clubs might get a bag in. 

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > XT6Wagon 02/14/2020 at 16:35

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But 750 hp I do not need. Half that amount would be very stimulating.

Where’s a good place to look at doing that mod? Wouldn’t I fail a smog test if I added boost?

Textured Soy Protein > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/14/2020 at 16:54

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I’ve driven a V6 Stinger and Genesis G70, not the 4-cylinder of either. Both are nice comfy reasonably quick GT sedan with competent handling for a car of their size. I prefer the looks of the Stinger, the G70 interior is a bit nicer. The Stinger back seat is slightly larger and the trunk is way huger. 

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Textured Soy Protein 02/14/2020 at 17:20

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I have yet to see a Stinger in the wild.

way2blu does a rev update > XT6Wagon 02/14/2020 at 17:30

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^this, is why the Mustang outsells the Camaro 2 to 1. For actual “car” duties, it’s far more competent, weight penalty be damned.

xc90v8/I4 :( > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/14/2020 at 17:33

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A45 AMG...

AdverseMartyr > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 21:21

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I bet you could get the Camaro’s weight down even closer to the Supra’s if those (nearly) worthless rear seats were removed.

coqui70 > way2blu does a rev update 02/14/2020 at 22:44

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Weight can be removed ... luxury item delete, rear seat delete, cloth vs leather seats, half the sound insulation material, lightweight hood and trunk and you can probalbly shave 200-300 pounds.

Rocker > way2blu does a rev update 02/15/2020 at 05:08

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Why was,the Mustang 4 cylinder turbocharged included?  I meam let's get real here. 

pip bip - choose Corrour > way2blu does a rev update 02/15/2020 at 07:11

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2021 Supra 4cyl v Mustang eco boost?

Raaa > way2blu does a rev update 02/15/2020 at 07:37

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You kind of contradicted yourself when you put the manual trans in bold as the best stat but later said the supra got up to speed faster with its automatic trans.  Also you cant say the Camaro has 2 seats because I can put my kid in the back seat, I can't do that if there are no seats present.  Idk why I’m even reading this though because I wouldn’t buy either one.

Spanfeller is a twat > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/15/2020 at 08:19

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I saw many in California, how bizarre

PeteBrusch > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 02/15/2020 at 11:58

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Came here to say this!

way2blu does a rev update > Raaa 02/15/2020 at 12:09

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I guess I can clarify: I said best, not fastest. For an “enthusiast” car, especially an entry-level one, the 6-Speed manual wins out as “best” over the ZF8. It’s just more fun to drive. In a 4-cylinder version of a faster car (Supra or Camaro) it’s already not chasing the outright numbers, because faster versions exist. “Fun” should be the priority on the lighter, better-handling models like these. The ZF8 is definitely faster though.

I’m curious now, what would you buy? If there’s an alternative option that I missed, I’d love to hear more about it.  

way2blu does a rev update > pip bip - choose Corrour 02/15/2020 at 12:11

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I left the ‘Stang out because it weighs almost 300 lbs more than the Camaro and almost 500 lbs more than the Supra. I’m realizing these will probably be cross-shopped though, so I’ll try to do a piece in the future comparing all of them.

bob and john > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 02/15/2020 at 13:55

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turbos I think of them as wear items. now, are they VERY long term wear items, yes. But Id factor in turbos at 150K miles to keep it boosty and fresh

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > bob and john 02/15/2020 at 19:16

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I should think that oil changes would be extra critical with turbochargers.

ZHPowner > thatsmr 02/15/2020 at 19:30

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> overall better build quality and longevity of things like window motors

God, I sure hope they went to the Toyota parts bin for those. BMW regulators can almost be considered a wear item.