Why ... ?

"Darkbrador" (darkbrador) 10/08/2020 at 14:53 • Filed to: None

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Amazon revealed their new electric delivery truck, developped in collaboration with Rivian. Electric is perfect for that sort of application, it looks cool and smiley and all, but ... but ... but ... why is this truck floor as high as a regular gasoline/diesel truck ?!?

On a regular ICE truck, the floor is fairly high as it sits above the frame, which itself sits above the suspension and clears enough space for the transmission and rear differential.

I don’t know how this thing is built, but e lectric vehicles don’t need a front engine with a transmission going all down the truck and no differential.

The delivery drivers spend their entire day going in and out, up and down the truck. One would think a dedicated vehicle would take that into account and take advantage of the flexibility in de si gn of the electrical powerplant to keep both the driver and the cargo close(r) to ground level. But that’s not the case :

Why ?

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:18

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Batteries take up a lot of vertical space even when they are stressed members.

Darkbrador > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available 10/08/2020 at 15:21

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somewhat of a false equivalency, but a Tesla floor is not 3 feet of the ground ... 

ibRAD > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:22

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Perhaps for ground clearance? I imagine it would be pretty easy to high center a 53' trailer if it got too low.

Darkbrador > ibRAD 10/08/2020 at 15:23

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Maybe. But I doubt we’ll see many Amazon delivery trucks on the Rubicon trail ... 

Sovande > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:24

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They still need to operate out of and into  traditional facilities that have loading docks. Loading docks are a specific height.

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:26

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Loading docs are a standard height .  Big trucks are kind of put together like Lego, from a lot of standardized off the shelf parts.  Making all your own stuff from scratch is going to cost crap tons more, for not a lot of benefit.

Darkbrador > Sovande 10/08/2020 at 15:27

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That’s a good point.

Cost is an issue, but here again for a dedicated vehicle, a variable height suspension would really make the drivers life better. But why would Am azon care about their employees/contractors ?

Darkbrador > shop-teacher 10/08/2020 at 15:31

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While in college, I worked as a truck driver, delivering to restaurants. At the end of one long day, I slipped on the steps of the truck, fell down and broke my ankle.

It all depends what kind of benefit we’re talking about. Safety, health and well being of the employees is some overrated socialist  bullshit, or something.

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:31

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As others have mentioned, standard loading dock compatibility and breakover angle need to be accounted for. The frame members also need to be strong enough to carry the rated weight which means the frame members must be a certain size . P lus the load floor needs to clear the rear tires.

InFierority Complex > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:32

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What would be the advantage of a lower floor? More capacity?  It doesn’t really make it easier on the operator if they are bending over more. Just seems like an increased chance for someone to throw their back out.

Michael > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:35

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a 53' trailer can high center over a railroad crossing

Michael > Michael 10/08/2020 at 15:36

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Hold mah... nevermind

WilliamsSW > shop-teacher 10/08/2020 at 15:37

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Bingo! 

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:37

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Standardization .

WilliamsSW > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:45

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Or perhaps lower the cab, and/or incorporate steps to make entry and exit easier?

Amoore100 > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 15:52

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flatty

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > ibRAD 10/08/2020 at 16:10

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I saw that happen to a car hauler when I worked at a dealership. He went into the gravel back lot to turn around and got stuck on a uneven part of the lot. The trailer had maybe 8” of clearance even unloaded. 

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 16:12

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Load hight. Others mentioned the loading dock problem but also unloading  things from waist hight than it would be if everything was 12” off the ground.

BigBlock440 > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 16:15

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And neither is a regular RWD sedan...

Nauraushaun > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 16:34

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Is it perhaps because of batteries in the floor?

Future next gen S2000 owner > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 16:43

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Besides what shop-teacher said, the suspension has to have room to travel. Straight frames are easiers than bent ones. Probably cheaper to make as well.

Pickup_man > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 16:50

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I’m curious if they’re building the vans on the same skateboard platform as the trucks and SUVs.

It would make sense since they’re still small potatoes in the auto manufacturing world, designing and manufacturing a bespoke chassis for these vans would be very expensive. Obviously though that frame isn’t ideal for the lowest and flattest floor possible due to the rise above the rear axle area. However, if the floor was built flush to the top of the frame I can see it being roughly the same height as the current competition (21"-29"), which checks out with what I can see from your video, and if it’s good enough for Ford/Ram/Mercedes, it’ll be good enough for Rivian.

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/08/2020 at 19:20

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If your ankle was more patriotic, it wouldn’t have broken! ;)

There’s definitely some logic to your logic, but given how many kajillion trucks and loading docs all share the same common height, it ain't gonna happen.

oldmxer > Darkbrador 10/09/2020 at 01:50

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overall length concerns

Darkbrador > shop-teacher 10/09/2020 at 09:26

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I agree if we talk about truck whose main purpose is to load/unload at dock height ... (even though one could argue that the docks height is dictated by the trucks dimensions , kinda chicken & the egg).

But here, even if it’s loaded at a “fulfillment center”, we have a truck designed to deliver packages to residential locations. Houses, condos, townhomes, you name it, in the city or the burbs or the country. You, me, them. Not industrial or commercial buildings, not docks. It ought to be designed accordingly.

Let’s move on. You still have not bought my Vespa, by the way ...

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/09/2020 at 11:52

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I told you, my offers are very refusable :)

Darkbrador > shop-teacher 10/09/2020 at 12:02

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I can’t refuse if there is no offer. 

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/09/2020 at 12:19

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OK, I’ll trade you for a ‘99 F-150 extended cab long bed.  2wd, about 200k miles, lots of rust ... but it does at least have the 5.4.  I can drive the truck there, and ride the Vespa back to Chicago :)

Darkbrador > shop-teacher 10/09/2020 at 13:23

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See ? Now I can refuse the offer.

I already have an old truck (‘01 Sierra 2WD ext cab long bed with 300,000 miles ), not full of rust. Try again ...

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/09/2020 at 13:47

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I told you it was refusable!

Any interest in a modern scooter? I’m thinking of letting go of my ‘09 Zuma 125.

Darkbrador > shop-teacher 10/09/2020 at 14:02

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How about a ‘09 YZ 125 instead ? 

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/09/2020 at 15:07

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I don’t have one of those, but I have sent the Zuma into some placed that the YZ would have been the correct tool for :)

Darkbrador > shop-teacher 10/09/2020 at 15:24

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Well, that’s the thing, I’m moving out of the city into a more country-ish area, an alternative option to selling the Vespa is to turn it into something like this below, with a side car for the dog ...

shop-teacher > Darkbrador 10/09/2020 at 16:16

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That would be pretty epic.

The F-150 is definitely going to get sold, and soon . The Zuma 125 is PROBABLY going to get sold. While I have other cash, until I sell those I wouldn’t be able to part with enough to buy your Vespa.