Here’s Why Dodge Is The Brand For Everyday Enthusiasts

"Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru" (matt-powershiftmedia) 09/07/2019 at 15:51 • Filed to: Dodge, Hellcat, Challenger, Viper ACR, Hemi, Drag Racing

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Something my fellow automotive friends and I always find ourselves talking about is the debate of modern enthusiast oriented cars. Sure, double clutch transmissions and modern electronics have undoubtedly made cars faster, less harsh, and easier to drive for the mass market; but they’ve also caused some side effects for enthusiasts. While a good DCT like a Porsche PDK is unrivaled by a three pedal car in terms of shift speed, it’s just not quite as fun. The same can be said for so many modern innovations.

It seems the masses decided that lap times and technical babble became more important than driver engagement, after all it is easier to brag about statistics than it is to discuss the perception of steering feel and such. It’s hardly my opinion, just look at the modern offerings from the major manufacturers. Ferrari doesn’t offer a single three pedal option, the newest BMW M5 only comes with an automatic (a car originally only offered as a manual) and I can’t think of a single Lamborghini that offers it either. It seems that truly driver focused cars are gone, and Ring times are what really matters.

Who would really buy a one sided car that just focused on getting back to driving? Big V8s and sticks are dead. Or are they?

Enter Dodge

I know what you’re already thinking, and hear me out on this. Yes they’re not exactly the full on “driver’s” car because they all weigh roughly as much as Peterbilt 379. The Challenger and Charger aren’t exactly handling focused cars. They don’t lay down scorching lap times either, and therefore they just can’t be any good.

That’s exactly why they are good. Dodge hasn’t focused on making a suspension to be track tuned; instead they made the suspension soft so the cars hook while drag racing. In lieu of this, they also offer a luxury type of ride experience. In this article I’m going to refer mostly to the Challenger (they’re quite similar to the Charger so there isn’t a reason to delve into both) and explain what I’m on about.

One of the things I have to quote from the legendary Jeremy Clarkson is simple, yet true. “If a car is built for the Nurburgring it won’t be any good in the real world” and he’s absolutely right. Instead, Dodge went right back to their roots. America is obsessed with horsepower and drag racing; so why not build cars that do that really well? So they did. Let’s start.

Challenger Scat Pack

If you’ve been reading my words for a while, you’ll know that my friend of almost 20 years and I do some YouTube stuff together and I do some freelance writing. One of the cars I’ve written about a few times was his 2016 Challenger Scat Pack. I’ve driven a few of these myself and even have an article about it here on Oppo. His particular car was optioned the way an enthusiast should; cloth seats, no sunroof, manual transmission, and not much else. That helped save some weight and kept the focus on what mattered – speed.

His Scat Pack was a gorgeous B5 blue, and going fast wasn’t the only thing this car was good at. It was gorgeous, it sounded brutal and it would eat miles with four adults that were “mostly” comfortable. We actually took this same car to the 2017 DSM Shootout, and with four adults in the car. Nathan owned the Challenger for a few years before moving on for business reasons, but the car never gave him a single issue. I want to highlight why this car was special, and what made it a truly great enthusiast car.

Let’s start with the basics; the car was powered by a 392 cubic inch pushrod V8 that made 485 horsepower. That lovely Hemi was mated to a Tremec TR6060 transmission, the same one used in many of the best cars like the Viper. That 6 speed, that engine, and the limited slip differential made for a truly amazing package. From a roll (after about 10 miles per hour) we were able to defeat cars that shouldn’t have been beatable. Yes these cars are heavy, but you don’t really feel it when accelerating. Additionally there’s four pot Brembos with big slotted rotors on all four corners, so you don’t really when it when stopping either.

Handling wasn’t terrible by any means, but this car has a soft suspension and a high weight. It’s not a Cayman S and Dodge doesn’t pretend that it is. It would however destroy a Cayman in a stoplight race, and that’s exactly how Dodge DOES market this car. Considering the awesome ride quality, overall interior quality, reliability and feel, this car punches well above the price in which it sits. These can be had new for just above $40,000 and I would absolutely recommend one of these.

My quick hot take – definitely buy one. If you’re an avid drag racer I’d recommend opting for the lovely 8 speed auto as they handle wheel hop better when the car is on drag radials. If you’re a racer that’ll only run a few times a year, get the manual for the engagement. Nathan loved this car very much and he’s undoubtedly one of us. This car gets a resounding stamp of approval. The Scat Pack is available in both Charger and Challenger models.

Challenger 1320

So, what exactly is a 1320 edition Challenger? Essentially this is a SCAT that is far more focused on drag racing. These cars are only available with the 8 speed automatic transmission and are only Challengers, sorry Charger fans.

Let’s talk about what Dodge has done to establish this as a true muscle car. First, the 1320 comes from the factory with a transmission brake. This allows the car to be launched without having a foot on the throttle and brake. Think of it like dumping a clutch, except less harsh. Second, dodge upgraded to 41 spline halfshafts (like the Demon) to reliably take the abuse. Third, they elected to use the new SRT adaptive suspension. The focus here is to allow the car to use the weight to its’ own advantage. Take a look at the picture above. This car (and all pictures of the 1320) belong to Nathan’s dad, and this car is very competitive and raced on a regular basis. Just look at that squat.

The 1320 has more than just a trick suspension and beefy driveline though; there’s a cool down feature that allows hot lapping to occur without the worry of overheating. Also assisting with the heat is the really awesome hood borrowed from the Hellcat, and it’s known as the “Air Grabber” hood. It’s aluminum, the vents are indeed functional, and you can quickly tell that this car is built around function rather than excessive form. Like the Hellcat and SCAT, the 1320 also has the dummy side lights by the actual functional headlights and these are removable to let even more air in.

The 1320 shares much of the tech and hardware from the Demon to allow consistent and fast drag passes. These cars drive very nicely and they ride like a true luxury car. That adaptive suspension is very neat and offers some of the best weight transfer I’ve seen in an OEM suspension The brakes are shared with the normal SCAT and that’s a good thing because this allows smaller wheels to be fitted for taller tires. Speaking of tires the OEM tires for the 1320 are drag radials. There’s really nothing that needs to be said about this, you know why you’re shopping this model. Technically this car is less driver focused than the manual transmission SCAT, but it is a drag focused car and that automatically evens it right back out. This is a car built for enthusiasts and nobody else really.

Nathan’s dad has been drag racing since before I was alive, and he’s owned some of the coolest Dodge products you can think of. He had very little to think about when he pulled the trigger on his 2019

1320 and he has already basically worn down the stock tires. Dodge rates this car at a mid 11.7 quarter mile pass, but he recently cracked off an 11.69 pass in a bone stock car. This was a full weight pass, and that’s just insane when you really consider that the 1320 package starts $3995 over a base SCAT Pack car. This car is in the same league as the Carrera GT in terms of quarter mile acceleration.

My quick hot take – if you’re a truly avid drag racing enthusiast, spend the extra and get this over a SCAT Pack. Nathan’s dad consistently wins money with the 1320 in bracket classes and he could also wax about ¾ of the mid 2000s best supercars in a stoplight race. That tells the story, I don’t need to say much else. Also, the name of the color on the 1320 in these pictures is indigo. It’s gorgeous!

Hellcat

So you really do need more power over the SCAT, and you can’t have enough? Let’s up the ante and talk about the Hellcat; 707 horsepower from a very supercharged 6.2 liter Hemi engine should do the trick. Here’s the funny part though; Dodge rates this car at a 11.4 quarter mile time stock. As you just learned, the 1320 will almost do the same. This is where traction is your friend. The Hellcat makes an earth shattering amount of power, and in order to fully harness the potential of this car, you’re going to need drag radials.

Perhaps drag racing isn’t really the biggest thing for you, you just want to drive a fast car. I’ve got good news for you – you can get this car with the lovely Tremec 6 speed as well. Imagine for a moment that you’re rowing your own gears as you mash the throttle and allow that 707 horsepower to take you away. I’ve done it, and it’s wonderful. This car is a sweetheart of a machine and it’s also one of the most fun things you’ll ever do. With that being said…

I’m a drag racing enthusiast and I’d get the automatic if I absolutely knew I was going to be racing a ton. If I’m honest though I’d personally have the 1320. If I wanted a car to cruise and enjoy eating miles and spirited blasts in, I’d get the 6 speed Hellcat.

The demonic Hellcat offers big 6 piston Brembos, 2 piece rotors, and tons of options for your own personal tastes. When I think of an enthusiast focused car, the Hellcat just always comes to mind. Dodge truly identified an audience that so many manufactures didn’t think existed; the sales prove we are here and we want these.

My quick hot take – These are available in Charger and Challenger models, simply identify what you want the car to do. Driver and not so much drag racer, I’d opt for the three pedal car. These cars drive very well, and the black key allows around 500 horsepower to tame it down for the wife or whoever else. These are cars that can and should be driven daily.

Redeye

So, you’re just never happy are you? The Hellcat is just too slow and you don’t know what else to do with your life. That or you’re incredibly suicidal and you want to go your own way.

Meet the Redeye; this is the most insanely ridiculously powerful car I’ve ever driven in my life. 797 horsepower is now extracted from the same 6.2 liter Hemi

The Redeye gets a ton from the insane Demon including the 2.7 liter blower chucking out 14.5 pounds of boost, twin fuel pumps and the awesome “Power Chiller” that uses the air conditioner to cool the intake temps down. These cars come in the wide body and narrow body trim, and the wide offers a set of 305 tires that I didn’t get to experience. Instead…

Time to delve into the experience I had. I spent several days with a wide body Redeye that was on drag radials. Even then, if the tires were cold this car was beyond dangerous. Mash the throttle and unleash that blower and gasoline is simply converted into tire smoke and fear. I’d checked the pressure in the radials of the car I was given and lowered them down to about 20 psi for the rears. This totally changed things for the better.

Now once the tires had heat (and the quarters are covered in rubber) you can use launch control and literally lift the front tires. I’ve had a hard time finding a set in stone metric for what this car is supposed to be rated for, but it appears a 3.4 0-60 and 10.8 quarter mile blast is reliable. I was able to get a 3.1 0-60 and a 10.4 second quarter mile out of it on a very unprepared backroad. This car is fast. Very fast.

Here’s the thing about it though; it’s also very luxurious too. The ride was very soft and compliant. The interior noise was shockingly on par with some of the best I’ve tested. The materials inside were fantastic, everything just seemed well put together. Yes these do only come with the beefed up 8 speed automatic, but it’s well suited to the car. I’m going to be honest, a manual in this car would be terrifying.

I say that because a car this powerful can and will wag its’ tail when the accelerator is pressed, therefore having two hands on the wheel is a really good plan if you enjoy living and breathing. Once heat is in the tires the Redeye will launch so hard and straight that you truly feel like your internal organs are pulverized into a fine powder.

Yes I’m a hypocrite because I started this article talking about manual transmissions and such. But it isn’t just about that; it’s about building cars that are focused while being civilized. It’s about not following a cookie cutter flow chart for building a high performance car ( more on this later) and it’s about listening to what the people want.

The Redeye is so good that I don’t care that is lacks three pedals. I covered around 800 miles in one, through rain and shine, and through different types of roads. There was never a point in time that I wasn’t smiling like an idiot. Doctors should be writing prescriptions for a Redeye for depression patients, I’m serious about this. I’ve driven a lot of amazing cars this year, and by far and away this is the one I’d have. It’s comfortable, ridiculously fast, and it makes the best noises ever.

Muscle cars never made any sense to me, I prefer Mitsubishi powered tin cans and European cars; but it all started to make sense the first time I drove this Redeye. It changed my entire perception on everything I’d thought I’d known about myself. This is a car that quite literally redefined who I am as an enthusiast. If you haven’t done triple digit pulls in one of these, you owe it to yourself to do it. That car, that noise, and that feeling will never die in my mind and heart. It’s that good.

Before you get out your pitchforks and say that I’m a Dodge fan boy, understand that Nathan and I used to get into near physical altercations over this. He’s a Dodge guy and I’m anything but that. In the age of electronic this, turbocharged small displacement that, let us embrace what Dodge is doing. They’re offering manual transmission vehicles, they’re offering large pushrod V8 powered cars with blowers on them, they’re offering us what our fathers (or maybe you) grew up living with.

I always remember my dad talking about the muscle car era, and what it was like. It never really resonated with me, DSMs are my muscle cars. It all truly clicked between driving different SCAT pack cars and that week with the Redeye. There’s a sensational feeling that comes with instantaneous torque and 6.2 liter cold starts. I’ve never wanted one of these cars in my life. That changed about a month and a half ago.

My quick hot take – What can I even say, I feel deep in love with the Redeye. Yes I’d suggest one of these with a contingency; don’t buy this if you’re a novice driver. Be very aware that this car can and will kill you if you don’t respect it. Be real with yourself about your driving abilities and if you even slightly doubt it, buy something else or take some driving classes. If you’re up to the test definitely go drive one and you’ll want to own it. I truly do think this is the daily drivable car we all want that puts up hyper car numbers.

Conclusions

I love Dodge now – yes I do. I never did before, but I can say I truly appreciate what they are doing. They offer something for us all. Fast SUV? The Durango SRT was incredible when I drove it. I’d love one for a daily. Need to haul the family but you don’t want an SUV and you need a manual? Grab a SCAT or a Hellcat.

It’s bittersweet but we need to all be face to face with ourselves and admit that these types of cars aren’t forever. I mentioned the “cookie cutter” approach earlier and here’s what I meant. BMW, Audi and Mercedes all must have had a hand shake meeting and agreed to just build engines and that exactly displace .5 liters per cylinder and make all V engines a hot V. All the V8 Euros displace 4 liters, the 6 cylinder cars displace 3 and so on. The V8s are all twin turbo with the turbochargers situated in the V of the engine. It’s boring and it’s beyond predictable. What those cars offer in performance, they lack in soul. None of them offer a manual transmission and they all essentially feel the same.

That doesn’t sit well with me. I want my V8 to be big and rumble. I want my V8 to make me  feel like they used to make my dad feel. The F10 M5 never did that for me; I found that car to be fast but boring. I’ve never turned in a mile in any modern SRT Dodge and found myself bored. It just doesn’t happen for me. These are cars aimed at the true enthusiast, not the mass market individuals that can throw ink on paper and satisfy the people at board meetings.

Dodge really is kind of the last stand against those types of ideals. Someone like Audi would never offer anything as ridiculous as the Demon, and BMW hasn’t ever given us a true halo car. Unfortunately the Viper isn’t with us anymore, but let’s not forget that the ACR went around the world and dominated at tracks everywhere. A manual transmission, naturally aspirated engined, and American built car took on the best the world had to offer. It set records and made a statement. That’s why Dodge is killing it, and that’s why they’re currently my favorite brand.

Thank you for taking time to read my rant, and I’d encourage you to go drive any car in this article and give me some feedback. I am in no way affiliated with Dodge, just want to throw that out there.

Just Jeepin' > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 16:07

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Since I’ve never really been a car enthusiast, and only recently became a Jeep enthusiast (and caring about lap times/0-60 speeds/etc is definitely not part of that “job” description)...

How did drag racing become so popular? Serious question.

What little car enthusiasm I had as a younger adult revolved around a convertible on a twisty mountain road, and now I appreciate that as well as driving a Jeep slowly on a rugged mountain road.

I’m glad Dodge and Jeep are keeping the stick shift alive, and I suppose if someone gave me a Dodge muscle car I’d take it, but I’ve never been smitten with drag racing. I went to the NHRA Nationals in high school to sell ice cream as a fundraiser, and I don’t think I spent more than a minute or two watching any racing.

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > Just Jeepin' 09/07/2019 at 16:13

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Hard to answer the popularity, its just been around since forever :)

WilliamsSW > Just Jeepin' 09/07/2019 at 16:26

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For exactly the same reasons circle track and road course racing became popular. People love speed and they love competition. Those 3 things are just 3 very different ways to go fast.

Drag racing may seem “simple” but it’s not — serious racers spend a lot of time tuning engines and on chassis engineering just like the others do.

Discerning > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 16:30

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“It would however destroy a Cayman in a stoplight race”

Not a new Cayman S, it wouldn’t. Not from a dig or a roll.

Cyman S is with PDK is capable of a high 11 at about 117 mph. Scat pack is a mid 12 second car at about 114. The drag pack makes it a little quicker at a track where it can possibly deadhook. But at a stoplight? Not a chance.

Even a base cayman with pdk would probably tie it from a stop but lose from a roll.

The scat pack isn’t slow but it isn’t that quick by modern standards compared to the other pony cars.

“The materials inside were fantastic, everything just seemed well put together”

I’ve spent some time in a few challengers and chargers and my opinion of the interior is very different from yours. Cheap plastics, plasticky smell, hard materials, cheap leather, dim and cheap displays, etc. In fact, the interior was the biggest let down of both cars for me. Everything else was fine, but the interior was depressing.

Just Jeepin' > WilliamsSW 09/07/2019 at 16:33

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Oh, sure, I would never say that drag racing was simple. My question was not intended to be a subtle way of saying  “man you guys suck that’s so boring”.

I never found racing of any kind to be all that compelling, but drag racing just seems particularly uninteresting to me. The line that caught my eye...

America is obsessed with horsepower and drag racing

Seemed worth exploring. When did America become obsessed with drag racing?

AestheticsInMotion > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 16:38

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Good article. I’d never heard of the 1320 package.

As far as enthusiast-aimed cars, I agree that Dodge sits at the top. Who else offers a package for literally everyone, oodles of engine choices, tons of great colors, etc.

T he ND Miata is also up there, albeit in a very different way. Just like the D odge, no one is building anything that’s similar to the Miata.

Jewish Stig > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 16:43

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A smart person once told me,

An enthusiast’s car is about “weeee” factor, whether it’s in a straight line, or in a drift, or both at the same time.

If the car makes you scream “weeee”, you are doing it right

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > Discerning 09/07/2019 at 16:44

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Indeed the scat does a mid 12 stock. A lot of that is traction. We destroyed a good friend of ours’s RB 240 that had a big turbo. We also walked several high 11 second cars from a roll. I’d put my money on a well driven scat from a roll vs a cayman all day.

Yeah I didn’t get that impression on my end. I found the interior to surpass the price of the vehicle, but that’s all personal likes and such. Love the feedback, I appreciate it :) 

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > Jewish Stig 09/07/2019 at 16:44

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Nailed it

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > AestheticsInMotion 09/07/2019 at 16:45

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Check out the 1320 it’s a nifty niche car :) glad to introduce you!

Couldn’t agree more. I love the Dodge colors very much, and I absolutely adore the new ND. That’s a valid point right there. The Miata is one of those final frontier types of cars as well. 

Discerning > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 16:47

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Ehh... they seem to trap about 114. Usually 112 to 115. I don’t see that taking down from a roll a car that traps 120. Cayman local to me trapped 121 on a cold night - bone stock. Haven’t ever seen a stock 6.4 car go over 116.

Even the car that car and driver had trapped 120 and there isn't anything about the dodge that would result in a better top end. Cayman is more aerodynamic, traps higher, and has lightning quick shifts and a flat powerband.

I had some fun with a few of the 6.4 cars when I had my C5Z and it wasn’t really close. Even my poor-mans-redsport with a tune was quicker.

DipodomysDeserti > Just Jeepin' 09/07/2019 at 16:58

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Tucson, Arizona has a street named Speedway Boulevard. It was re named that in 1904 because people would drag race their horse and buggies down it, reaching speeds of over 20mph.

I think drag racing is popular because going fast is fun, and drag racing is the easiest way to go fast.

gettingoldercarguy > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 17:07

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Great work.  Fun to read!

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > gettingoldercarguy 09/07/2019 at 17:10

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Thank you :)

WilliamsSW > Just Jeepin' 09/07/2019 at 18:34

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It really took off after WWII, for a few reasons. First, a lot of guys came home with real mechanical skills. Plus, that’s where we got high octane gas. They a lso had   money to put into hot rodding their cars. Then came the OHV V8, and the horsepower competition ( And drag competition) between the big 3 later in the 1950s- early 60s.

Back then, a 21 year old guy could actually afford a fast car - new - on  regular wages.

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 18:39

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Good take! I quite enjoyed the 5.7L Challenger that I rented for an autocross. It was the perfect car for driving around Dallas as well as the longish drive to the autox. So different than my Miata as well as my STi. The noise was definitely my favorite part but I thought it looked cool and turned wayyyy better than I expected. It wasn’t actually fast on course but I had a ton of fun powering out of turns. I learned that I really need a powerful, loud v8 as a comfy highway cruiser at some point in my life. I’d probably rather have something like an e39 m5 or even a c5 Corvette but compared to new? And for how cheap relatively these dodges are? I completely agree with you on the value perspective. 

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) 09/07/2019 at 19:22

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Well said. The 5.7 cars are definitely fun, I’d had a Durango RT for about a week (article is on here) and it was a fun vehicle. They really aren’t producing anything bad anymore lol. 

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/07/2019 at 20:58

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I also got one of those when I rented a “minivan or similar” from SFO. I was doing a drive from there to LA so it was much better than the Dodge journey and Nissan quest alternatives. I was transporting like 7 boxes since I was moving and it fit me and everything nicely while not being boring on the long slog down the 5. I was sad to not be driving home in the Saabaru I intended to buy during that trip but I guess I’m happier with the problem free STi in the long run! Not that that part of the story is at all related lol.

Urambo Tauro > Just Jeepin' 09/07/2019 at 22:14

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I’ve never been a big fan of drag racing, but I do still see it as one of the purest forms of racing. It’s not so much about who’s the faster driver, as it is about who has the quicker car. Yes, there is some skill involved regarding reaction time and such, but the main focus is really on the car itself.

I imagine that it all started even before “horseless carriages” even became a thing. No doubt people with fast horses wanted to see whose horse was faster. But a horse can have an “off” day, as can riders, and a rider might always wonder if he could have pushed the horse to go faster. Automobiles offer more consistent results. Sure, some variables remain, especially regarding the driver’s reaction times and such, but they’re kept to a minimum and it’s easier to discover which car is quicker in a head-to-head competition. And there is a constant influx of new machines to test against each other, keeping the sport alive .

Just Jeepin' > Urambo Tauro 09/07/2019 at 22:19

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I would have guessed, not knowing anything about it, it was less about reaction time and more about knowing the traction you have (or don’t) so you don’t waste energy .

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/08/2019 at 00:07

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I’ve been looking at these recently and they really are a fantastic deal for the performance.    They definitely made my list for my next car    

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s 09/08/2019 at 08:39

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That makes two of us. That Redeye ruined me!

StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/08/2019 at 10:05

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Thank you!  They really are great cars to knock off the miles, plenty of power and a nice ride.  Hellcats are fun Red Eyes are ridiculous fun.  A little something for everyone.

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 09/08/2019 at 11:51

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Fully agree with this. The supercharged SRT models are just amazing. I really want to whip around a trackhawk whenever I can find access to one.

That Redeye though. I truly can’t stop thinking about it. 

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > Discerning 09/09/2019 at 07:42

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Cheap plastics, plasticky smell, hard materials, cheap leather, dim and cheap displays, etc. In fact, the interior was the biggest let down of both cars for me. Everything else was fine, but the interior was depressing.

You just described every modern car on sale today.

Dodge gets hated on all the time for their interiors and quite frankly, it’s a load of shit. The Challenger Scat Pack costs almost $30k less than a Cayman S, yet looking at the interiors side by side, the Challenger looks like a better place to spend time and offers almost identical straight line performance.

I look at the Porsche and see a sea of black plastic, even plastic door panels, a cheap console covering, and seats that look like something from the 80s :

Then I get into the Challenger. I’m greeted by leather trimmed door panels, a nice leather wrapped wheel, suede leather seats, leather wrapped armrest, all with nice stitching, a well integrated ergonomic dash layout, etc   :

IMO the Porsche looks far cheaper inside and it costs far more money.

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/09/2019 at 07:46

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I’ve been saying this for a long time. Nice write up.

You know even on the weight argument, the Camaro/Mustang are only a little lighter than the Challenger and neither offer anywhere near the same level of comfort.

Discerning > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness 09/09/2019 at 08:01

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I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion. I e been in a lot of different cars in the last few years and I’d probably rank Dodge at the very bottom.

Ha ve you been in a new Cayman or 911? Because the look and feel of the Dodge versus the Porsche is very very noticeable in person.

I like the value that God offers but I also acknowledge that there interior isn’t as nice as the luxury offerings

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > Discerning 09/09/2019 at 08:08

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And how many of those cars offered the same performance level for the same price?

It’s easy to say a $100k car has a nicer interior than a $40k car, I would sure as hell hope so. When comparing them to actually comparable cars, say the Camaro/Mustang, the Challenger feels lightyears more luxurious. It may not be as “advanced”, but it is a far nicer place to spend time. Same goes for a lot of their other vehicles. The base/rental trims tend to be cheap feeling, sure, but once you get into a decent model, they’re usually very nice places to spend time.

Discerning > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness 09/09/2019 at 08:20

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I think there’s a disconnect here. I didn’t say they offer the same performance value. I’m saying that the interior is plasticky and disappointing.

But I can say the same thing about my F150 and the Z06 I had before that.

I supposed this should give this all context - I looked at the charger at the same time that I was looking at the Cayman and a used 911 and a C63. I ended up getting a truck and a camper and spending more than I would have on those, but those were my Benchmark when I was looking at fun cars. People kept saying that I should look at the Hellcat and so I did. The amount of power they were offering was exceptional but the chassis and especially the interior were very disappointing. I wasn’t necessarily surprised by either of those but it was my biggest takeaway from driving the car.

Vs GM and Ford products I would say that the Dodge isn’t much worse. I do believe that it isn’t quite as nice but the three of them are all pretty comprable.

I’m also not saying that having a plasticky interior is the worst thing in the world. I’ve owned almost exclusively cars with plastic interiors that emphasize performance over luxury. But that doesn’t change the fact that the Interiors are plasticky. It just provides an excuse because the price is going towards performance as opposed to luxury and quality

If you are looking for a comfortable ride in a reasonably spacious interior in hey performance missile, then the Challenger is definitely the better pet over the Mustang and Camaro. But if you aren’t considering any of the above and you want a mix of luxury and performance, then you are probably best off continuing to not consider any of them.

All of the above said, all of the project I’m looking at lately have considerably worse Interiors than the Dodge. I want something that is raw and light and emphasizes performance above everything else now that I am stuck commuting in a massive numb truck.

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness 09/09/2019 at 09:54

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This is exactly what we were discussing yesterday, well said!

Thank you for the kind words! Glad I’m not alone in my thoughts. 

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > Discerning 09/09/2019 at 10:18

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I looked at the charger at the same time that I was looking at the Cayman and a used 911 and a C63.

I guess I just can’t see why anyone would be cross-shopping those......But given you were, I can see why you have a disconnect on how they drive/feel. After driving a Cayman, I could see how the Challenger would feel disappointing. Go into it expecting Cayman level handling/feel, it will feel heavy/numb. Go into it expecting heavy muscle car, it feels extremely nimble/responsive, with tons of power to boot.

Discerning > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness 09/09/2019 at 12:04

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I’ve owned a Cobra and a Z06. I just wanted something that I would enjoy and hopefully hold onto.

I looked at the Cyman and 911 because I’ve always wanted a 911 and heard great things about the Cayman. The C63 came up because a coworker has ome and it sounds glorious and just seems overall fantastic. Also looked at an M3 and it was OK.

But I also looked at a C6 ZR1, C7 z06 and z51, dodge scat packs, demon, bullit mustang, gt350, and more.

I’ve lost count of everything I looked at.

I had settled on either a Cayman or a 997.2 C2S. But then at the same time my fiance wanted something new and we started talking about getting a camper and everything went in a very different direction from there.

Now we're looking at new houses, so who knows how long it will be now.

StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 > Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru 09/10/2019 at 19:54

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Trackhawks are stupid fun.  Thing torque steers, it’s wild.

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 09/10/2019 at 20:44

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That sounds like a great time!