Close Call With Toby This Weekend

"i86hotdogs" (i86hotdogs) 04/29/2019 at 12:45 • Filed to: None

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Dude still sleeps 20 hrs a day

So our back yard is 90% fenced. There’s a 5-10 foot opening on each side of the house. For the last month, Toby is very good at doing his business in the back without trying to creep up front. We even have a runner going across the yard so he can enjoy the huge yard, but he just won’t do his business when attached to the runner. So we’ll walk with him through the yard and he just follows along.

Friday was different. He did his usual business, and instead of walking back to the door with me, he darts straight for the front yard. I have to guess he saw a squirrel or bird. Well, he wouldn’t answer to me calling him, and runs directly into the street. If the Dodge Journey did not brake as well as he did, things would have been a lot worse, and this post would be a lot darker.

Two lessons were learned here: He’s not responding well to the training we’re giving him; and we need to close up this fence. We signed him up for a 6 week class at the local pet store, and went to the local hardware store for some supplies. Since we’re renting this house, we decided to go with a quick and cheap option compared to digging deep and pouring concrete. I cut and treated a handful of 2x4's, and stapled some chicken wire. The posts are a little less than 1.5 feet deep, which should be enough to hold for at least a year or so, but did not require digging deep or pouring concrete.

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Total cost was $55, which is a small price to pay for Toby’s safety. Landlord is all good with the work, as long as we’re not tearing apart the house. We did the DNA test so find out what breeds he is. I am excited to find out what he really is. Shelter said Labrador for sure, but his face looks like either a Dane or a little bit of Chow Chow. He does have black cow spots on his tongue, and Chow Chow are notorious for having that trait pretty exclusively.

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Snuze: Needs another Swede > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 12:53

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What a handsome boy! I could see a dane/lab mix, and it’s possible there’s some other stuff mixed in.

Ozzy did the PetSmart 6 week training and we’re going to take him back for 6 more weeks of intermediate training . It’s actually kind of fun and a good excuse to get my wife out of the house on a week night. Their training was good, but there’s still a lot of onus on the owner to train the pet. Come is one of those things we’re still working on. We learned this weekend that Leave It still needs work since he found some sort of bone (chicken or something) . At least he didn’t try to swallow it, instead he just stood there and then looked kind of sad when we took it from him.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 12:54

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We’ve got a 7 year old German Shepard/Chow mix that is a master escape artist. She scales fences, takes herself for a walk, then shows back up at the front door waiting to be let back in. I share the anxiety you expressed.

Chariotoflove > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 13:00

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My first dog, Jackie, had a thing for chasing cars on the local road. I couldn’t train her out of it using the methods I was taught, because she wouldn’t do it when on a leash or even when she knew I was watching. Fortunately her pursuits were done at a healthy distance, mostly barking from the shoulder.

Glad your Toby is alright.  He looks like a good boi.

i86hotdogs > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/29/2019 at 13:00

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Our neighbors don’t have dogs, so this training is the most social interaction he gets. Petco even does free puppy play time sessions every weekend. He is usually good with coming to us when called; but when he’s focused on something, there’s no breaking his concentration. 

Deltyn drives a meh car > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 13:00

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I have these same problems with my female blue heeler. We live on the corner of a residential street and a fairly busy road and it’s very scary to think what would happen if she ever got out of the back yard during an unsupervised potty break or just wanting to lay in the sun. I walk her at a levee close to my house, and her recall is very unpredictable. I don’t need her right next to me, but would like her to have a smaller radius and be more reliable at coming when called. Glad things weren't  as bad as they could have been for toby. That would have been horrible.

PartyPooper2012 > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 13:01

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This weekend was a shit show for having dogs apparently. We are still recovering but never mind that.

We have two dogs. One we knew can take on 12 foot fences from a stand still. Our plan of action is to fatten her up enough that she just can’t do that anymore.

The other dog isn’t much of a jumper. Last couple of years we planted some veggies in back yard. She loved rustling through thick vegetation. I had built a fence around it to keep veggie eaters out. Seemed to have worked too until I noticed the plastic mesh I attached to aluminum posts was ripped. Was my wife drunk? Was there a strong wind? No. The second dog decided to ever so gracefully jump over the fence and go through tomatoes and beans.

I tied a rope from post to post over the fence trying to make it seem higher so she doesn’ t jump... Little jerk jumped through about 6 inch gap between rope and fence.... Landed on her tail, twirled a baton and whatever else miss congeniality talent show had.

Point of the story is that the fence might be short if your pup sees another furry tailed rat. 

i86hotdogs > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 04/29/2019 at 13:02

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If Toby  is part Dane, he’s going to be HUGE. So this 4 foot fence won’t do much against him when he grows up.

i86hotdogs > PartyPooper2012 04/29/2019 at 13:08

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For now, Toby’s  legs are still young and weak. He was very skinny when we picked him up. He still struggles to get up on the couch. I’ll hope that the training and the temp fencing will be enough to teach him to stay back there. 

i86hotdogs > Deltyn drives a meh car 04/29/2019 at 13:09

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I’ve never owned a pet more than a fish before Toby, and this was the first time I ever felt that near miss heart dropping moment. Not a fan-would not recommend.  

i86hotdogs > Chariotoflove 04/29/2019 at 13:10

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He is, I was worried and mad for all of 90 seconds. Before I knew it, he was curled up on my lap like nothing happened.

Svend > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 13:40

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Glad he’s okay, and your okay too after that sudden burst of adrenaline.

Our Maremma, Caesar managed to often escape our six foot wall. A giant ruddy Pyrennian jumping six feet. But he’d be round at the castle near by with all the tourists.

They do scary things and then look at us like, ‘what, I’m a dog, you know that! ’.

Fuckkinja > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 13:41

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We use Pet Safe  wireless fence. It is portable also. We live on a rural State road with no incidents or physical fencing. It’s kind of pricey but no worries about losing a dog. 

Future Heap Owner > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 13:55

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I know exactly what you’re talking about. It’s terrifying. I’m glad Toby is OK.

Future Heap Owner > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/29/2019 at 13:58

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Training classes are really for the owners to learn how to train their dogs, not for the dogs. Training is a very long-term process, especially when it comes to maintaining attention on you in the face of distractions. You just have to keep on working on it as much as possible, in as many different places and situations as you can.

Future Heap Owner > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 14:11

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Dogs are terrible at generalizing things they learn. It helps a lot to spend at least 15 minutes every day (preferable in two or three sessions throughout the day) reinforcing everything they’ve learned, with as much variety in places and situations as is feasible.

Another good technique is to train them to pay attention to you. The most basic form of this are attention games where you show them that you have treats, but they won’t get them until they establish eye contact with you. You can take two treats, show them to him, put one in each hand and hold your hands straight out (so your body makes a T shape). When he looks at you and not one of your hands, he gets praise and one of the treats. Rinse, repeat. Eventually you can start to increase the amount of time he needs to hold eye contact for, and phase out the hands (remove treats from the hands, then stop holding hands out). You don’t want to train a command for this; it should be default behavior. Another form is to “drop” a treat or some food on the floor, cover it up with your foot, and praise & reward when he looks at you and not your foot. I do this a lot with Ravna while I’m making lunch and dinner.

To help make this a default behavior, make eye contact a prerequisite for the parts of the daily routine he most looks forward to, like meals and going on walks. You want to reinforce in him the idea that all good things in life come through you, and he needs to check in with you to get them. Whenever he spontaneously   makes eye contact with you in a distraction-heavy environment, like outside, be sure to praise & reward heavily.

Even with all this, it’ll probably be months to years before you can get his attention whenever you want, no matter what. With my last dog that I had with my ex for two years, I was able to get to the point of getting her attention even when she was in the middle of playing with another dog, but  when she saw a squirrel all bets were still off.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Future Heap Owner 04/29/2019 at 14:11

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You said it much better than I did. But yes, this.

I’m not going to lie, I’m an idiot about this stuff, so I went into it with some expectation that after 6 weeks my dog could, you know, do stuff. And he kind of can... the stuff we’ve spent a ton of time working with him on! Like sit. And down. That’s about it for his list of commands. But we’re going to keep working with him and taking more classes.

Future Heap Owner > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/29/2019 at 14:15

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That’s good! Six weeks to get consistent with a few commands is totally normal. Keep at it! You may also want to check out my reply to i86hotdogs in this thread about training attention.

I had a similar level of cluelessness going into my first dog. I saw people out and about with their well-trained dogs, and I figured it can’t be that  hard. But I had no idea how much work their owners had put in to make the dogs so well-behaved.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Future Heap Owner 04/29/2019 at 14:20

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I saw that reply above, thats great advice and I will definitely incorporate it into our training.

One thing that I’ve also found, and we’ve only had Ozzy 2 months, is that just spending time with him is really great. Just playing with him and giving him rubs and scratches is a great way to bond, especially when he seeks it out . It’s time consuming but i t seems to make the rest of the training easier.

Cash Rewards > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 14:21

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Not to discourage training, because i t never hurts, but I’m of the opinion that when it comes to things that can kill a dog it’s your responsibility, not his. So good job on the fence. Even if it’s shorter than he can jump, the training should handle the rest. But that’s why I can’t stand dogs off leash on sidewalks of roads. I don’t care how trained it is, it shouldn’t be the dogs responsibility to understand how cars work. (End rant).

Glad the pups ok!

Future Heap Owner > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/29/2019 at 14:25

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Awww, yeah, you’re gonna do great. Playing like that, apart from strengthening your bond, also helps tire him out a bit, which makes everything (including training) easier. The best time to train them is after they’ve been exercised, but before a meal, so they’re even more food-motivated than normal. An d  as they say, “a tired dog is a good dog” . I do most of my new-trick training with Ravna after her evening walk and before her evening meal.

i86hotdogs > Cash Rewards 04/29/2019 at 14:28

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I absolutely take responsibility for this incident. We talked of putting up a fence ever since we adopted him last month, but was put on the back burner. It wasn’t so much the issue of running into the street, it was the fact that he won’t come to my call if he sees something that really excites him. That’s w hat the training is for. Hes still a baby at 5 months old.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Future Heap Owner 04/29/2019 at 14:29

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Hmm, I’ll give that a try.

Ozzy is so hard to tire out. I recently got a pedometer app on my phone because I wanted to get an idea of how much we’re walking him. We’re averaging over 3 miles a day over about 5 walks, and he still has energy . But Saturday I took him to Cars n Coffee, and a few longer than normal walks, we ended up going over 8 miles that day. He was one pooped puppy that night .

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 14:41

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A slightly less cheap option that’s worked great for me is attaching that invisible fence wire *to* the fence, therefore you don’t have to bury it. It gives the dog both a visual and then auditory stop point; so much so that my older dog knows how close to the fence he can get before it’s gonna beep so he stays clear. Pet safe is the brand i use; t he transmitter and collar are about $200 in a kit and then wire is about $20 for 500 feet, though any 20ga wire will work. 

i86hotdogs > Future Heap Owner 04/29/2019 at 14:51

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I’m learning that as I sit in these classes. It’s more teaching us to train our dog vs. them training our dog with us there. I’ve never owned as much as a fish before Toby, so I’m soaking every detail I can.

i86hotdogs > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind 04/29/2019 at 14:52

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We might switch to invisible fencing when he gets bigger. All depends on how long we plan on living at this house (renting).

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > i86hotdogs 04/29/2019 at 15:29

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The benefit to putting it on an existing fence vs actually in the ground is that it’s super easy to do (staples) and super easy to remove. Just gotta have a bit of cover to keep the transmitter box relatively dry.

Edit: for your chain fence, you could probably use zip ties and weave it, making it even easier. 

Future Heap Owner > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/29/2019 at 17:47

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How old is Ozzy? Puppies & juveniles can have crazy amounts of energy. Walks are not enough.

If you can give them 20-30 minutes of hard exercise, that helps a lot. Romping at the dog park, playing tug, and running with them are all good ways to do that (though be sure to get a harness if you start running him).

Mental stimulation helps too. The most interesting part of walking, for the dog, is sniffing; I try to let Ravna sniff as much as she wants on walks , unless I can see that she’s trying some food (or cat poo). But since I can’t give her hard exercise yet (illness), I’m come to rely very heavily on wearing her out mentally, using these products/activities :

* Kongs! Kongs are the greatest. Indestructible rubber toys with a hollow center. I fill them up with peanut butter or wet food with some kibble sprinkled in, then freeze them . Getting through all the frozen food is a good puzzle. I’d recommend getting at least two so you can have one ready to go whenever.

* A feeder puzzle ball. It’s a plastic or rubber ball I fill up with kibble, and it has small holes in it so the kibble will fall out when she pushes it around. Half of her breakfast goes in the ball for her to spend half an hour getting out of the ball after the morning walk.

* Training sessions; I try to hit at least 15 minutes a day, usually in five minute chunks. Training is a good way to calm her down when she comes in jazzed from a walk, or gets jazzed playing tug.

* Easy nosework in the form of a little game I call “truffle pig:” I reserve 1/2 to 3/4 cup of her dinner kibble, and then throw them around the living room one piece at a time for her to sniff out. Hard mode is doing it at night with the lights off. This is an easy thing I can do while watching TV or reading, since I only have to listen for the sound of her biting into the last piece of kibble I threw.

* Playing tug. Early in the evening it’ll be full-on tug, but it’s often also the last thing she does at night, while I’m in bed or on the couch watching TV. Then it’s less tug and more “I’m gonna bite this toy dad’s waving around and then pull on it half-heartedly.”

* Rawhides (though I use a plant-based substitute called a No Hide, but it’s pretty much the same ) . Another reliable food-based activity that takes a good 20-60 minutes to get through (depending on size of the hide and chewing prowess),   unlike most of the consumables you can buy at the pet store. I limit this one to once every few days because it upsets her stomach a bit (and they ain’t cheap).

* For heavy chewers, elk antlers are a good toy. They can be a little pricey, but tend to hold most dogs’ interest and the whole antlers (as opposed to split) last a long time. I got one recently for Ravna but have not yet given it to her, but we had a whole one for my old dog that lasted a long time (a year if not more). Split ones are more enticing because it’s easier to get to the tasty part, but may not last too long for heavy chewers.

* Flavored tough plastic chews. Both my dogs haven’t cared for nylabones, but I got a fancier one for Ravna that has some real wood and maple flavor in it, and she loves it! It’s been her most consistent toy, and the non-consumable thing that most holds her attention. I can try to figure out the brand if you want.

The only other consumable thing from the pet store that I’d recommend are hooves. They only last a couple hours for heavy chewers, but they’re cheap as heck. I only don’t use them because I’m vegan, so I don’t like buying dead animal parts when I can help it.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Future Heap Owner 04/29/2019 at 20:46

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Ozzy is a rescue and so there’s a lot about him we don’t know, like his age, though the shelter and our vet guessed around 4.

I took this one just now as he’s watching me eat dinner and hoping I drop something.

Thank you for all the good advice on toys and activites. I just read your suggestions to my wife and she’s appreciative as well. We are definitely going to try some of those.

Future Heap Owner > Snuze: Needs another Swede 04/29/2019 at 22:02

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He is so cute! I like the subtle merle in his coat, his dichromat eyes, and his extremely boopable nose.

I hope the suggestions prove useful. A few of them came from this e-book I found a few weeks back on how to manage very energetic dogs, called “Give Your Dog a Brain.” I highly recommend it; it’s helped me a lot.

https://3lostdogs.com/give-your-dog-brain/

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Future Heap Owner 04/30/2019 at 07:59

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Thanks! He hates being booped (of course that doesn’t stop me) ... But what he LOVES is this video, which featuers comedic booping:

He normally doesn’t pay too much attention to music or the TV or anything like that, but if I play this video for him he gets super into it and his head is constantly tilting left then right, back and forth. It’s hilarious

About the eye thing, It’s hard to see in that picture, but his brown eye has a blue spot in the bottom of it and his blue eye has a brown spot at the top. We think he’s part Catahoula because of the eyes and the merle. But he’s short and like 40lbs, and long, and has big ears, so we’re thinking maybe either corgi or basset hound.

Thanks for the link to the e-book, I’ll give it a read and pass it on to my wife. She’s been reading “The Secret Lives of Dogs. ” I’ve read a bit from it already but I’m going to go through the whole thing when she’s done, but it seems really good so far.