Hot take: Crossovers should take over sedans

Kinja'd!!! "HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/12/2019 at 14:06 • Filed to: None

Kinja'd!!!4 Kinja'd!!! 100
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!!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! on Jalopnik got me thinking, that its fine that crossovers are killing the sedan.

They are getting to the point where they are so close that its really just a matter of wagon versus sedan, and given the fact that we almost all agree that the wagon is the superior sedan and that most crossovers are just a slightly taller wagon....

I mean the weight difference between the 6 and the CX-5 AWD is less than 100 lbs. They drive very similarly and the CX-5 is only moderately more expensive (factoring out AWD) with only moderately worse economy.

The CX-5 is also bigger inside, more versatile , easier to get in and out of,   easier to drive and park in crowded areas owing to its decreased length and are slightly cheaper to insure than sedans of equivalent price*

*based on the little research i’ve done on it.

It’s less that sedans are inferior and more than crossovers are crossing over more and more towards wagons with each generation and the gaps in performance and cost are shrinking substantially.

It’s not that I don’t appreciate the performance benefits of the sedan either, but you have to admit that even those lines are getting blurry.

Embrace the new sedan. Love the new sedan.


DISCUSSION (100)


Kinja'd!!! For Sweden > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:09

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Make Crossovers Wagons Again


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > For Sweden
04/12/2019 at 14:10

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Already happening.  


Kinja'd!!! vondon302 > For Sweden
04/12/2019 at 14:11

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Id buy that on a t shirt.


Kinja'd!!! functionoverfashion > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:12

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Speaking of “the new sedan”

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Kinja'd!!! RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:13

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Alternate take - need more crossovers with bustleback trunks. I.e. “sedans”, as they once were .

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Because a more dedicated and long trunk space remains a good idea, and if we’re going back to the 30s/40s heights and proportions...


Kinja'd!!! For Sweden > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:14

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These WINO s (Wagons In Name Only) are still too tall with too high a ride height!


Kinja'd!!! HondoyotaE38: A Japanese and German Collab...wait a minute > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:15

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Someone take away his mod permissions and give them to Monkee for this

Although I do appreciate that you used a CR-V in the lede pic


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:15

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WRONG

“crossover” is just a shit marketing term used to describe SUVs so people don’t feel as bad. They are too big and too useless. WOW your 1 child and 1 mother that are in that thing 99% of the time don’t need it. Get a wagon or a sedan and use more of your vehicle. 99.9% of these people will use the “lifestyle” part of these cars that marketers sell. The only time you need anything bigger is because some reason you though the world needed you to have 5 kids and at that point just get a minivan . You still have zero use for a full size Suburban. And I don’t care if you want to sit higher up. You have zero need for that want and it does not help safety. If safety was a concern then these people would all buy Subaru Outbacks becasue my god that thing is a cocoon of airbags and crash protection. Not to mention rollover is highly decreased by  not being a lifted top heavy piece of trash SUV


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > For Sweden
04/12/2019 at 14:16

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pffft, a macan is shorter than taurus


Kinja'd!!! Chariotoflove > functionoverfashion
04/12/2019 at 14:16

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I have long said this is the Texas version of the family sedan. That’s how most people use them, and what they buy them for.


Kinja'd!!! Party-vi > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:17

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“The CX-5 is also bigger inside”

In that there’s more storage space, but I had a CX-5 while my 6 was at the dealer and the rear rear room is way better in my 6 than the CX-5.


Kinja'd!!! 412GTI > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:17

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I tend to agree. At the end of the day they’re just appliances to 95% of the people. If they prefer to be seated higher and like to hatch type practicality, so be it. Like you said, you can’t argue that they are inefficient & such any more.

I don’t like the false sense of security everyone with AWD thinks they’re getting, but most people will figure that out along the way.

I think crossovers are good for older people. My parents have a sedan and a crossover and having a little more ground clearance isn’t a bad think. The Accord is scr apped up, while the Cherokee isn’t.


Kinja'd!!! Chariotoflove > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht
04/12/2019 at 14:17

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Also, Make America Whitewalls Again.


Kinja'd!!! PineappleMan > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:18

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no. crossover has worse performance in 0-60 terms AND mpg terms. They are also less comfortable and for what? ground clearance? or an “image” bleh. 


Kinja'd!!! SPAMBot - Horse Doctor > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:20

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I’ve never understood why people were freaking out about CUVs taking over the midsize sedan. It’s not like the Camry/6/fusion/whatever were sport sedans. You are trading one bland to drive vehicle for another. I don’t see makers of real sports sedans (BMW, for instance) getting rid of that category so we, as enthusiasts , should be fine.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 14:23

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what wagon? is there even a single wagon choice in the same price range as a cx5? vw spietwagon and...regal x?


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > 412GTI
04/12/2019 at 14:25

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we need to remember that the midsized sedan was the crossover of it's days for internet hate and blandness. crossovers are the right choice for the fat part of the curve


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > SPAMBot - Horse Doctor
04/12/2019 at 14:25

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dead right.


Kinja'd!!! For Sweden > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:25

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Not short enough!


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Party-vi
04/12/2019 at 14:26

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more leg room but lower seat height. same effective passenger space


Kinja'd!!! This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja: > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:26

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At what point does a crossover become a hatchback again?

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I don't even know what we're supposed to be crossing over to at this point.


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:26

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We would have more options here if people didn’t have the unreasonable want to sit higher for literally no good reason.


Kinja'd!!! Ash78, voting early and often > Party-vi
04/12/2019 at 14:28

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I wouldn’t even compare a CX-5 to a Mazda6, but the reality is that a lot of shoppers do just that. Personally, I see the CX-5 as just the crossover version of the Mazda3 (which is exactly what Mazda set out to do). A Mazda6 shopper would be more inclined toward the CX-9 in a perfect world.

That opens another can of worms in the Car vs Crossover debate about whether it’s better to have LONGER space vs TALLER space. I’m in the first camp, as a car guy.

But sedans suck, so between the two options I’m fine with crossovers.


Kinja'd!!! DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:29

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I just hope they start offering factory lowering kits, to make them true wagons.


Kinja'd!!! 412GTI > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:29

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Exactly. Can’t forget the Camry hate along with other sedans. Humans will bitch about anything, we’re all guilty of it. 


Kinja'd!!! Gerry197 > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:31

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People who are buying NEW are buying crossovers. When the top 3 selling crossovers are at or close to 30 mpg, fuel economy isn’t really worry even at high gas prices.

People who have the money to buy new tend to be older and want an appliance that’s easy to get into and out of.

We have a sedan and crossover, and I have to tell you, my 44 year old body didn’t appreciated having to get into and out of the sedan several times a day.

The crossover is so easy to use and I’m not worried about s crapping the front end, bottoming out on speed bumps or avoiding all the pot holes around town like I do with the sedan.

What do I lose for all this comfort, practicality and ease of use? Driving dynamics and some mpg? I can live with it since its pluses are much higher than its negatives during 90% of what I need. I have a motorcycle for weekend canyon runs.


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > SPAMBot - Horse Doctor
04/12/2019 at 14:32

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Because they are too big and 99% of people don’t need or use all that extra space so why get a bigger vehicle wasting fuel and space on the roads etc


Kinja'd!!! Ash78, voting early and often > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:32

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Obvious take: Sedans are inherently stupid.

Just imagine if the entire SUV and Crossover boom had occurred just like it did, but all the vehicles had the rear upper cargo area chopped off to make a trunk.

Now you can see sedans for the way the rest of the non-sedan world sees them.

Actually, that does almost describe things like the X6...which we all agree is silly.


Kinja'd!!! MUSASHI66 > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:32

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Complaints about t he death of the sedan and rise of the CUVs are pointless. It’s like complaining that French door fridges are more popular than the top freezer fridges. They are both appliances and 99.9% of the sedans  were never made for enthusiast.

Today, we have more affordable and accessible speed and horsepower than ever before.


Kinja'd!!! ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Chariotoflove
04/12/2019 at 14:34

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...sounds racist. 


Kinja'd!!! Party-vi > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:37

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ah I didn’t think of that. Felt like the CX-5 had flat floors which put my knees into my chest.


Kinja'd!!! SPAMBot - Horse Doctor > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 14:38

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If everyone bought what they needed, we’d all be driving around in an i-MiEV or something similar. 99% of us need a V8, 4x4, etc., but we like features that bring us comfort, convenience, or fun. And CUV’s get very similar mileage than the hatchbacks they are based on.


Kinja'd!!! benn454 > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:39

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The Taurus is also the size of a tugboat. 


Kinja'd!!! fintail > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:40

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Sadly, I think the blandboxes have also helped push out wagons, as the drones will see a CUV as rugged and adventurous, while a wagon is a Brady Bunch throwback (I recently picked up a wagon myself, and it got some snark from my co-workers).


Kinja'd!!! ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:40

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Agreed on your take that crossovers are better than sedans on the spectrum of bland automobiles.

I’ll raise the stakes her a little bit that I might get flamed for – what the hell is up with coupe versions of regular sedans (for the most part)?

I know people find an aesthetic appeal in them, but I don’t. I’m saying this as the former owner of a BMW E30 coupe and current owner of an E46 coupe – for both I’d much rather have had the sedan version (but was just a matter of right car, specs, condition for the price). These coupes are sedans made less practical.


Kinja'd!!! ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Ash78, voting early and often
04/12/2019 at 14:41

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Which I think is the OP’s take – sedans are stupid and wagons are the best. Crossovers are closer to being a wagon than a sedan is, and for most use cases is equally proficient as a sedan, if not more - so by definition crossover is the superior choice.


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > SPAMBot - Horse Doctor
04/12/2019 at 14:53

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That is a fair point but when it is an appliance for these people then I don’t care what they want. They should buy what they need. 


Kinja'd!!! Ash78, voting early and often > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
04/12/2019 at 14:54

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Sure, absolutely. It’s a bit of Preaching to the Choir on Oppo, so I was just adding a mental image that (if I had Mad Photochop Skillz) I like to imagine every time I see an SUV.

If sedans hadn’t already been the tradition, we’d never invent them from scratch.


Kinja'd!!! Milky > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:57

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Except they are always going to be less efficient and have worse driving dynamics simply because they are jacked up wagons. Plus they always cost more.

If you're an old and/or have a bum hip its okay though.  


Kinja'd!!! Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 14:58

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“They drive very similarly”

I would not agree based on my experience . 


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > functionoverfashion
04/12/2019 at 14:59

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its going to be christmas for people who actually want a truck when gas goes back up. So many used trucks for cheap.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Party-vi
04/12/2019 at 15:00

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I always prefered tall over more legroom, makes it feel more comfortable.  I mean, its the reason people bitch about the tacoma.  It has enough legroom but its not tall legroom.


Kinja'd!!! SPAMBot - Horse Doctor > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:00

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Most people think they need it for the once a year they go camping, or have 5 people in the car.

Funny story that happened yesterday. I had lunch with a girl I used to work with yesterday (at the place with the cold brew flight). She bought a Q5 because she wanted room for the car seat but the rear facing doesn’t actually fit behind the driver or passenger seat. So if she has another one, she needs a Q7.

The car seat fit fine in her accord hybrid. lmao


Kinja'd!!! Svend > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:00

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I think of all the body styles, the saloon is the least practical, followed by the coupe and the cabriolet. Hatchbacks and estates are by far the most practical.

A crossover is just a lifted estate car on the way to an SUV. 


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > benn454
04/12/2019 at 15:00

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yes, but its still true.  Crossovers are getting shorter all the time.


Kinja'd!!! Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:01

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Pretty sure the Taurus is based on the Explorer, about as bloated as they come.

A lower, lighter version of the Macan would be better in every way .


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:01

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yeah well we don’t and its because crossovers offer all the benefits of wagons to most people and many more as well.


Kinja'd!!! MrSnrub > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:01

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Crossovers make more sense for most people. Especially in the CR-V/RAV4/CX-5 class, when comparing to a similarly priced (i.e. midsize) sedan, they have similar interior space in a smaller footprint, a more usable cargo area, easier ingress/egress, and (I don’t think this is mentioned enough) just enough extra ground clearance to ease the stress of driving on our increasingly awful roads.

The only price you have to pay for this is slightly worse fuel economy than a similarly-priced sedan (but similar fuel economy to a sedan from 5-10 years ago) and theoretically lower handling limits.

Also, if the new Escape is any indication, crossovers are starting to ditch the SUV pretense and embrace being slightly taller wagons anyway. I’ve always been a small hatchback person, but I wouldn’t mind something with a little more space that doesn’t scrape on driveways and crash over potholes. I just want some sporty variants with extra power please

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Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Ash78, voting early and often
04/12/2019 at 15:02

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Totally agree, s edans are dumb. 


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
04/12/2019 at 15:02

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ayup.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
04/12/2019 at 15:04

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They are the automotive equivalent of a nose job.  Good for you, you’ve made enough money to be able to correct some minor flaw.  only we all still remember what you used to look like and will never forget it.  Also, how’s your sense of smell?


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > MUSASHI66
04/12/2019 at 15:04

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damn straight.


Kinja'd!!! benn454 > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:04

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Perhaps, but pointing out that one of the smallest crossovers is smaller than one of the biggest sedans is a little disingenuous. 


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > fintail
04/12/2019 at 15:05

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I think that mentality is starting to circle back and the “boring” crossover is starting to be seen as “moms car” and people are starting to demand different more car like shapes.  hence the full circle that will bring us back to mostly wagons.


Kinja'd!!! Jordan > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:06

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No. Crossovers are the only category of cars which is entirely irrelevant. They are worse than a wagon in literally every way.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Milky
04/12/2019 at 15:06

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not by enough to offset their benefits of being more versatile  and comfortable.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast
04/12/2019 at 15:06

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depends on the vehicle, but i don’t think the 6 and cx-5 are all that different.  You feel the wheelbase difference and you notice the cg difference but its not night and day.


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > SPAMBot - Horse Doctor
04/12/2019 at 15:07

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That is literally the dumbest thing I have ever read. You know what can do everything that q5 can do and fit a car seat? My A6 Avant


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Gerry197
04/12/2019 at 15:07

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bingo.  small trade-offs for real world benefits.  


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:07

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I don’t know. My A6 Avant would argue with you that it can do as much as any SUV


Kinja'd!!! duurtlang > Chariotoflove
04/12/2019 at 15:07

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Should the Mexicans pay for your whitewalls?


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja:
04/12/2019 at 15:07

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This is the point.  Like I was saying, the crossover is the wagon, the wagon is the crossover...time is a flat circle. 


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Jordan
04/12/2019 at 15:08

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They are the least relevant? They are the MOST relevant. they aren’t a fad, people want them and there are reasons they do and it’ s not so they can live out some SUV fantasy from the 90's.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > benn454
04/12/2019 at 15:10

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does this help?

https://oppositelock.kinja.com/porsche-golfwagon-1831112196


Kinja'd!!! This is what we'll show whenever you publish anything on Kinja: > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:11

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And somehow on a long enough timeline, they’re all coupes.

When it comes to cars, words don't mean what we've all previously agreed that they mean anymore. Just dazzle 'em with bullshit and write it up, that's the game of the day.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:11

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I love wagons, I want wagons...my point is that crossovers are more wagon than sedan...and thats good since we aren’t getting more wagons.


Kinja'd!!! Milky > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:14

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“more ... comfortable” d ef has a big ol asterisks next to it and more  versatile is super useful when 80% of the time there is only 1 person in it.  


Kinja'd!!! duurtlang > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:14

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I would argue the crossover is the hatchback, the hatchback is the crossover. Wagons tend to have a lot more horizontal space and rear overhang than a crossover in the same class. Just compare that Kuga/Escape above with the hatch and wagon versions of the new gen Focus.


Kinja'd!!! BigBlock440 > For Sweden
04/12/2019 at 15:14

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But they’re not wagons in name...


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > benn454
04/12/2019 at 15:14

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here is an even more poignant example

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one of these is a coupe and the other is a crossover.  


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:15

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But it isn’t good because they are too big. Even the CR-V is massive compared to my wagon. I would much prefer a sedan to a SUV if all I needed was an appliance. If these people asked for a nice cheap wagon then we would get them here. And then we would also get the fun ones.

If you are legitimately  off roading or needing to tow heavy objects then fine get a truck/suv otherwise NO


Kinja'd!!! BigBlock440 > Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast
04/12/2019 at 15:16

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Pretty sure the Taurus is based on the Explorer, about as bloated as they come. 

You’ve got it backwards, the Explorer is based off the Tau rus.  If the Taurus would have been based off the Explorer, we’d have a BOF, RWD full size with an optional V8.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Milky
04/12/2019 at 15:17

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versatile =/= utilization. Versatile means that it can do more things when the need arises . just because its mostly 1 person doesn’t mean there aren’t legit uses cases where a hatch body is way more useful than a sedan body. Hatches are big in Europe for a reason.


Kinja'd!!! BigBlock440 > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:18

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“crossover” is just a shit marketing term used to describe SUVs so people don’t feel as bad. 

Wat?  They’re not SUV’s.  It’s a marketing term used to describe hatchbacks so people will actually buy them.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > duurtlang
04/12/2019 at 15:18

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most crossovers are hatches this is true, but thats only because we’re used to seeing the most popular ones, the midsizers like the rav4/CX-5.  Big bois are wagons through and through.  I mean, the suburban is called the wagon body.


Kinja'd!!! BigBlock440 > duurtlang
04/12/2019 at 15:20

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Mostly, though there are CUVs like the Durango, Explorer, Pathfinder, etc. that are wagons.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:22

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This is a very old fashioned way to view the crossover. It’ s not about towing or work anymore, it’ s about usable space. A q5 has more seats up space than an A4 all-road and nearly as much seats down space and its shorter.


Kinja'd!!! SPAMBot - Horse Doctor > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:24

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I’m not saying you are wrong, and I obviously am on team wagon, but most people want the higher load height so they do not have to bend over while extending to strap a screaming/pooping/squirming sack of flour into a car seat. Now that many of my friends have kids, I can see why they all got crossovers lol


Kinja'd!!! BigBlock440 > DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever
04/12/2019 at 15:24

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Kinja'd!!!


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > SPAMBot - Horse Doctor
04/12/2019 at 15:31

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Kids literally ruin everything. They should all get wagons


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > BigBlock440
04/12/2019 at 15:31

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But they aren’t hatchback. Not anymore. They are just small SUVs


Kinja'd!!! CaptDale - is secretly British > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:32

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I have never ever seen anyone with enough stuff packed in their Q5 driving on the freeway by themselves to necessitate  that vehicle.


Kinja'd!!! Jordan > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:33

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Definitely least relevant, definitely a fad. Raised suspensions and black plastic cladding is to the 2010's what fins and chrome were to the 1950's. Anything a crossover can do a wagon can do better. And for less money. And given that most people don’t need a vast amount of space, a sedan would meet their needs even better.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:34

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as I said in another comment: Versatility =/= utilization.

It doesn’t really matter if you’ve never seen it for the advantages of this body style to in fact be a benefit to people.  The tree still makes a sound even if you’re not around to hear it.

I’ve never seen a loaded a6 avant on the freeway either. Therefor wagons are useless buy a 2 door?


Kinja'd!!! Milky > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:35

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By all means I get hatches. But you don’ t need to lie to me and say a jacked up one is just as efficient as a lower one.

But regardless of us not agreeing, since most people dont care, I’m ready for the EV autono mous   box overlords. We can drive our m iatas/land cruisers until they take them from us and the people that want an appliance can have just that.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Jordan
04/12/2019 at 15:35

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I want you to look at the actual numbers for the last 2 decades and tell me its a fad.  the rav4 is the new camry.  Deal with it.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > Milky
04/12/2019 at 15:36

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Im not saying just as efficient. Im saying the penalties are small and the upsides are big.


Kinja'd!!! CobraJoe > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:39

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I have only one real complaint about modern crossovers:

They’re unnecessarily tall and soft.

Get rid of that extra “tough 4x4 look” and they’d be just fine .


Kinja'd!!! punkgoose17 > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:39

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Also the next Escape is just a Focus hatchback, apparently.

Crossovers are fine appliances.

I like cars that are enjoyable to drive, relatively low center of gravity, and relatively low weight. I will keep buying the other cars available, I can only afford used cars, maybe I will just keep buying older and older cars.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > CobraJoe
04/12/2019 at 15:42

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Thats certainly the way they’re heading.  I mean the new escape for example...cmon.


Kinja'd!!! punkgoose17 > MUSASHI66
04/12/2019 at 15:43

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Also, both are still available. Buy what you want.


Kinja'd!!! HammerheadFistpunch > punkgoose17
04/12/2019 at 15:43

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I hear you on the idea that there are certain cars that are hard to replace on the modern market but I can tell you my Forester XT 5 speed was in no way less enjoyable to drive than a similar wrx wagon.


Kinja'd!!! fintail > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:51

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We can hope.  It might take some time though, as there’s an entire generation of “active” mommys who want nothing more than something with ride height and (faux) butch looks.


Kinja'd!!! BigBlock440 > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:54

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But they are hatchbacks, they’ve never been further from SUVs than they are now.  Hell, some of them are even shorter in overall height than some sedans.


Kinja'd!!! duurtlang > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:55

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Fair enough. Living in Europe I never see those Mastodons, the biggest class of crossover that you see here is the class the X5 belongs to. Which is a fat hatch.


Kinja'd!!! mazda616 > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 15:57

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I like having the best of both worlds. My wife has a CX-5 and I have a 6. Excuse the CX-5s lack of cleanliness in the photo.

I can see your point, though. It’s easier to get large/bulky items into the hatch of the CX -5 than it is into the trunk of my 6. I really, really, really wish Mazda sold the 6 wagon here. I understand why they don’t, but that doesn’t make me want one any less.

Kinja'd!!!


Kinja'd!!! CobraJoe > CaptDale - is secretly British
04/12/2019 at 15:57

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WOW your 1 child and 1 mother that are in that thing 99% of the time don’t need it. Get a wagon or a sedan and use more of your vehicle. 99.9% of these people will use the “lifestyle” part of these cars that marketers sell.

Have you had a kid? Have you carried them in a modern clip in car seat? Have you tried to drop a kid in and buckle up a rear facing car seat in a modern sedan? Have you tried to put a large stroller in a modern midsized trunk?

Sedans just suck for kid use these days. The roof is too low to easily put a kid or car carrier in the back seat. T he “fastback style” rear glass reduces the rear door opening, making it even more difficult to buckle a rear facing child seat. And yes, large strollers are a luxury, but try getting one in the mail slot opening that a modern car calls a “trunk”.

Wagons fix 2/3 of those problems (unless the rear doors are shared with the sedan) , but roof height is still a big annoyance . Plus, the extra ride height and thicker sidewalls help out on the rough post-winter streets around here.

You still have zero use for a full size Suburban. And I don’t care if you want to sit higher up. You have zero need for that want and it does not help safety. If safety was a concern then these people would all buy Subaru Outbacks becasue my god that thing is a cocoon of airbags and crash protection.

2 notes here: 1. You don’t know how people use their Suburbans, maybe they do need the capability. 2. Outbacks are insanely popular right now, one of the most popular CUVs out there. (And yes, it is a crossover.)


Kinja'd!!! Eric @ opposite-lock.com > CobraJoe
04/12/2019 at 15:59

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Everyone really wants wagons, they just don’t know that they want wagons and they’re afraid of the idea of wagons, so they need them to be butch and lifted.

Then again, roads being what they are, I am contemplating a trophy truck as my next daily driver.  


Kinja'd!!! Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast > HammerheadFistpunch
04/12/2019 at 16:00

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Steering is more numb. Bigger stee ring wheel. Any non-forward visibility is worse. Seating position feels like you’ re on a stool with your back much more vertical . Insurance is higher (on the Mazdas I shopped specifically )  

Physical size is only part of the story. 


Kinja'd!!! ZHP Sparky, the 5th > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
04/12/2019 at 16:01

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p.s. special shout out to 2 Door GTI fanbois.

GTI is best! All in one super practical vehicle, everyone should drive one ! But I’ll only buy one if it’s made less practical by removing 2 of the doors in to the vehicle!