GLADIATOR! But what does HHFP have to say about it?

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch) 04/01/2019 at 16:25 • Filed to: hammerhead says, What does hhfp say, Jeep, Galdiator

4

41

So its here is it? A Jeep Wrangler truck. So what does this guy that writes words on a clackity keyboard onto the internets have to say about that?

Not much really. Its a Jeep and its a Truck so it does things those thing do.

1. Be a Jeep

This includes the following:

Be hot as in the marketplace as the fire of a thousand suns

Be able to easily double its price in the online configuratator machine.

Be able to double THAT price in the aftermarket.

Hold its value stupid well in spite of it still being made by the same people that make the Journey.

Be appealing to people who want to be outdoorsy and adventurous, as well as people who just play that person on tv instagram.

2. Be a truck

Examples include:

Be a useful daily driver for a small family

Be “best in class*” in as many niche categories as you can think up.

Have an extremely high profit margin

Have ardent haters based solely along brand lines.

Always have something in tow headed to a muddy jobsite (according to the internet)

Probably have a bed or something.

Does the Gladiator be a Jeep and be a Truck? It do.

Let me get this out of the way: Its what people want and it will sell and that’s okay with me.

It will also be exactly what people who want a wrangler truck will get, be it a fashion statement or a blank canvas.

What isn’t it? All that great at being a Wrangler out of the factory.

The base and overland models are good trucks, but their basic design limits make them poor off roaders.

Low frames, CRAZY long wheel base = tricky trucks to wheel.

Quick comparison time:

Overland trim 4x4 breakover angle 18.4 degrees

Sprinter 4x4 long wheel base 17

Tacoma 4x2 quad cab 6 foot bed 20

F150 supercrew 4x4 6.5 foot bed 19.7

Subaru outback 20

Colorado 4 door 4x2 6 foot bed 18.6

Have I made it clear yet what 18.4 degrees of breakover angle is yet? Hint: not enough for a Wrangler.

I know I harp on that a little but let’s be honest, it’s a big deal on a big truck meant for off roading and yes the Rubicon on its 33 inch tires is better...but its still only 20.3, or basically a subaru outback. ON 33's!

Can this be solved with the inevitable 2 inch lift and 37 inch tires? Yes, but now you’ve just made a big truck huge.

I don’t want to sound like I hate it, I think it’s rad they brought it out and made it a real truck. I’m a little sad inside that it’s only going to crowd up the backcountry a little more.

On the other side of the asterix there are some important qualifications.

Yes, it has best in class* towing and payload of 7,650 and 1600 lbs respectively, but if you look at the chart, most configurations are WAY off those numbers to the point of them almost being statistical outliers in the data. The mean payload is 1245, which is much closers to what most people will actually get and over 60% of the configurations are 1200 lbs payload or lower.

For towing it’s a little better with the mean max towing with the max trailer package (the only way to be fair) being around 6600 lbs.

Some numbers to consider: The sport truck without the max trailer package has the second WORST in class payload. (Worst is the Frontier PRO 4X auto at 1020). Also the Rubicon isn’t much of a heavy lifter at 1160 - 1200 lbs but a big improvement over its 4 door suv sibling at a laughable 892 lbs. (but hey, you can remove the doors to get a few pounds back, right?)

How does that compare with the competition? (mean numbers across all 4x4 4 door trim levels)

Gladiator 4 door 4x4

Payload 1245

Towing 6600

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Tacoma 4 door 4x4 configurations

Payload 1160

Towing 6400

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Frontier 4 door 4x4

Payload 1203

Towing 6330

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Ranger 4 door 4x4

Payload 1560

Towing 7500

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Chevy 4 door 4x4

Payload 1407

Towing 6970

As you can see, it’s certainly in the hunt, but hardly the standout. The Colorado/Canyon and the Ranger being your goto’s for both payload and towing for most if not all but a single model trims.

So what do I really think about them?

“Boy that detachable bluetooth speaker sure is neat, what was it you were playing around 1230 a.m. around your campfire? it sounded like Taylor Swift but I can’t say for certain. Oh and sorry I woke you at 6 AM this morning, I always try and get off a few practice rounds in the early dawn light, the extra loud noises of .357 mag bullets against cans fulls of rocks really help me focus for the day. Alright, enjoy your morning!”

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:31

2

I’ve always been team small car. CX3, Fiesta, Forte, Micra...the list goes on.

Then I got a puppy and irrationally want a huge road-monster.

You know, 50lb dog max, need 10,000lb towing capacity and more c argo space than my living room

Future next gen S2000 owner > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:31

7

I want to take the doors off, put the windshield down, and tow the boat to the lake. But I won’t because I’m like everyone else on the internet.

Honeybunchesofgoats > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:35

2

Honestly, if I needed a pick up, and money meant nothing, I’d get this, just because it looks cool

But, like everyone who will buy this, I don’t really need to tow or haul anything. Unlike everyone who will buy this, I’m not interested in financing it for 96 months.

That said, I hope they sell millions of these, because I’d like to pick one up in about a decade to have as a winter beater car. 

Nothing > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:36

0

Its overall length puts in in line with the DCLB Tacoma (or other similar long bed mid sizers) but without the extra foot of bed. I guess that at least translates to more rear seat legroom than its competitors.

benjrblant > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 04/01/2019 at 16:36

6

Are you a closet American?

HammerheadFistpunch > Future next gen S2000 owner 04/01/2019 at 16:37

2

hey, taking the doors off would help the payload numbers, so there’s that.  hopefully with all of them off on the sport model you could take the boat AND the people at the same time.

HammerheadFistpunch > Honeybunchesofgoats 04/01/2019 at 16:38

3

This is the market for the Gladiator summed up neatly. 

HammerheadFistpunch > Nothing 04/01/2019 at 16:38

0

oh it’ s going to be MILES more roomy in the back compared to the tacoma or pretty much anything else. So that’s nice.

Discerning > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:38

1

Hey, my F150 has a better break over angle and toes significantly more (10k). Neat.

But I only have a rear locker with hill descent and whatnot :(

Woe is me. Lol

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > benjrblant 04/01/2019 at 16:38

1

The car market isn’t much different between us. We get the occasional wagon/hatch you don’t because ???

and 100 more > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:41

1

How long?

How long until someone makes a dual ie version?

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > benjrblant 04/01/2019 at 16:41

7

Also, yes 100%. Do I ride around in an older pickup listening to banjo music despite living on the west coast of Canada?

Yep.

HammerheadFistpunch > and 100 more 04/01/2019 at 16:43

4

The real question is - which will come first?

6.4 hemi swap

6x6 conversion

long wagon conversion

dually.  

and 100 more > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:47

2

My money is on Hemi swap, if I’m being realistic. But I’m sure a dually isn’t far behind.

Also...

I’m waiting to see who comes out with a camper shell first.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:47

1

I had a suburban with running boards, it had a terrible break over angle, but as long as the terrain didn’t present break over angle challenges it was nearly unstoppable . Locker on the rear, lots of mass, and good tires. That being said Jeeps image implies that the wrangler (Rubicon ) and it’s iterations is supposed to be able to tackle the Rubicon trail in stock form.

vicali > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:48

3

I can already imagine the parking lot at the salon/tan studio /tattoo shop..

Needs more Gecko Pearl and Xtreme Purple Pearl I think ..

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:51

0

6.7 Cummins swap

wafflesnfalafel > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:53

1

you just need to install the optional, retractable,  3rd middle axle - voila, problem solved

TheBloody, Oppositelock lives on in our shitposts. > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:53

4

Question, are Ed Hardy tribal tattoos s till a thing and when I buy a Gladiator Rubicon will I get one complementary?

benjrblant > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 04/01/2019 at 16:53

1

becuase of smaller potential market which means this makes no sense, so f- it why not

Pickup_man > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:55

2

Reading a lot of comments and reviews on this I come away with the impression that there’s generally one of two things that people wanted this to be, when in fact it’s only one. There’s the Jeep f irst, t ruck second crowd, and the truck first Jeep second crowd, when in fact this is both Jeep and truck at the same time. That comes with compromises. Is the breakover angle great? No, but making it any better is going to take away from it’s truck- ness. Is the towing capability great? Also no (but really not that bad), but making it a more capable truck is going to take away from it’s Jeep-ness. You can only have so much of both.

Personally I like it just the way it is, a capable, immensely fun, and customizable truck that will be a great swiss army knife of trucks, ok at a lot of things, not great at any of them.

In the next couple of years I’ll be in the market for a new rig , something that can tow a small camper/boat/pair of atvs/motorcycles, be big enough for 3 (possibly 4) people, and be enjoyable and fun. Right now it’s a tough debate between this, the new Bronco (assuming it’s what I assume it is), or just another used 1/2 tonner. 

ShrimpHappens, née WJalopy > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 16:57

0

1. With a tow rating of 2700lbs, the Subaru Outback shouldn’t be in this conversation at all. But as an owner of a 2018 Outback I maintain that if you don’t need to tow it’s the best vehicle on the planet.

2. I’d like to bring up  how pretty much every review mentions that its interior is the nicest of the bunch. I’m not sure what that’ll do in the real world, though, as everyone seems content to pay $40k+ for Tacomas and 4Runners with their lame interiors.

HammerheadFistpunch > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 04/01/2019 at 16:59

1

I have a guidebook that talks about a trail i did 2 years ago called lockhart basin and the picture they used in the book is a suburban hung up on the gatekeeping challenge. it always makes me think of breakover issues.

HammerheadFistpunch > Pickup_man 04/01/2019 at 17:00

0

I hear you but that breakover is laughable for any 4x4 truck, let alone anything with a rubicon name.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:01

1

I turned around on a forest service road one day due to break over issues. We were nearly to out destination so a 1/2 mile walk wasn’t a big deal. Better than getting hung up in the woods 20 miles from civilization.  Cars that made it without issue: Subaru Outback, F250 4x4, chevy blazer.

Future next gen S2000 owner > TheBloody, Oppositelock lives on in our shitposts. 04/01/2019 at 17:07

1

Yes but it won’t be a full wrap around.

Pickup_man > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:08

0

What is it about these then that makes them so low? As far as I can tell with my sub 30 seconds of research wheelbase is similar to most mid sizers, and tire size is roughly the same as well. Do the frames on these just hang that low? 

benjrblant > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:15

0

I think at the end of the day, for all the flaws we could nitpick over, it’s the only “mid-size” pickup with solid dana 44's, optional f+r e-lockers, and a convertible hard/soft top. i think it’s cool that we at least have this option in the market even if it’s not from a brand i care for.

hopefully it puts enough pressure on other players in the segment to give better or more offerings catered in this direction.

nermal > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:16

1

From a value perspective, a Ram 2500 with the gas V8 is still a better option across the board, from base to the Rubicon / Power Wagon trim .

Once you hit the $60k mark you’re in Raptor territory as well.

These will definitely sell. But just because people will buy them doesn’t mean that they are all that great. 

TheBloody, Oppositelock lives on in our shitposts. > Future next gen S2000 owner 04/01/2019 at 17:17

1

Well fuck I’m out then. I mean, what’s the point otherwise?

CobraJoe > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:19

0

Stop thinking “Jeep Pickup” and start thinking “The new half-ton”.

The Gladiator is really damn close to my ‘05 Titan crew cab in many stats. My max payload is 1100, towing is 9500, fuel economy is 13/17, curb weight is 5200, HP is 300, tires are 32in tall...

That Gladiator is a half ton in a slimmer body, and it’s true for most of the midsized trucks.  

HammerheadFistpunch > Pickup_man 04/01/2019 at 17:33

0

It’ s the wheelbase, which is actually 10 inches longer than a comparable Tacoma but only 6 inches longer overall.

HammerheadFistpunch > nermal 04/01/2019 at 17:34

1

if it were my money I would go tradesman with power wagon package all day

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:38

2

Sounds more like Gladiator Overhang!

p.s. also given how easy it is to swap out so many of the body panels, we need harlequin wranglers! It would add some nice humor to the overly bro-ed out demographic.

SilentButNotReallyDeadly...killed by G/O Media > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:43

1

In this respect, it’s only competition is the SsangYong Musso...the only other dual cab that was designed off a true 2 row vehicle rather than a single cab ute.

Unless you ignore the VW Transporter and the Ford Transit dual cabs...

SilentButNotReallyDeadly...killed by G/O Media > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:44

1

Excellent summary, Mr Fistp unch.

Pickup_man > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:48

1

Yep, that would do it. 

Chuckles > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 17:53

1

I'm not really the in the target demographic for this vehicle (people willing to spend money), but I would have enjoyed seeing a 2 door version along with the 4 door offering.

BigBlock440 > Pickup_man 04/01/2019 at 18:24

1

The breakover was sacrificed for the approach and departure, like the Wrangler, but making it a truck meant it had to be longer.

shop-teacher > HammerheadFistpunch 04/01/2019 at 19:29

0

I concur with your assessment.

Just Jeepin' > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/04/2019 at 12:49

0

I once saw online a shop in the L.A. area that would paint Wranglers like a Harlequin. Haven’t been able to find it again, but I’d be sorely tempted.