Do you even lift bro? A trackday rant.

"WRXforScience" (WRXforScience) 12/16/2019 at 12:05 • Filed to: Track Day, track day bro

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Hi there, you look a little lost.

I go to the track pretty often (30 trackdays in 2019 and 22 in 2018), and I’ve worked my way to being an instructor with every group I run with (that’s the only way I could afford to do as many events as I have). As an instructor, I get a used to a level of awareness and courteousness that is frustratingly rare at most trackdays.

At most events, passing is only allowed in straightaways after a point-by. This is a very safe way to run events and helps avoid contact; however, this system requires the participants to work together to e nsure that passing happens efficiently and safely. The problem comes when you have faster drivers in slower cars. I’ve put in a ton of seat time and effort into getting faster, and I’m at a point where I can put down some pretty respectable laps in my 178whp BRZ (I run Hankook RS4's which are 200tw summer performance street tires) .

I’m fast in the corners and can usually out brake nearly every other car on track, but in the straights I’m among the slower cars. The problem is that passing only happens in the straights. Now, the proper passing protocol is for the lead car to lift off the throttle when they give their point-by; however, many drivers don’t realize how much slower I am than they are on the straights (they assume that all cars that are faster than they are faster everywhere and don’t appreciate how a car can out brake and corner them enough to completely erase their horsepower advantage).

I’ve had a few fellow instructors who didn’t lift for point-bys (instructors should know better, failure to give good passes is unacceptable for instructors), but the issue is most apparent in lower run groups.

This past Saturday , I was running the classroom portion of a trackday and due to scheduling I was only able to drive during the intermediate group (I made sure to bring up passing rules in class and even warned the students that I’d be out there and which car to watch for). Unfortunately, there isn’t any accountability for not attending the class portion of the instruction and some of the students and solo-intermediate must not have attended because I had problems with multiple Corvettes and other high horsepower cars.

So, next time you’re at the track, please remember to lift.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:07

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Ugh. I did a track night in america a few years ago where some dick wagon showed up late, missed the meetings, and trailered in a track-prepped lotus elise for a track day meant for street cars only. Th at was bad enough, but he was so desperate to get some track time, they let him run loose in the beginner run group. So we’re out there, trying to learn the lines in subcompacts and miatas while this dick wagon comes roaring up on everyone’s bumpers, shaking his fists and getting mad at everyone.

I wish more tracks were actually strict on people needing to attend the meeting and being in the correct run group.

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:14

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I had no idea an ND could walk away from a FRS/BRZ/86 like that. I figured they ’d be pretty evenly matched.

WRXforScience > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 12/16/2019 at 13:23

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That ND is supercharged, its got 50% more power than a stock ND. A stock ND and my BRZ are very even on acceleration (they have a very slight advantage until about 55mph then I have a noticeable advantage up to triple digits).

Jesus Arias > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:23

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Damn your driving is hella good. But back on topic those higher horsepower car owners are dicks for not letting you through. They were no doubt able to clearly see a bright red car riding their bumpers on corners.

WRXforScience > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 12/16/2019 at 13:25

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The lower run groups are tough since the drivers and not the cars determine pace. It doesn’t help that the track in the videos just reopened and has a new layout that everyone is still learning. 

Decay buys too many beaters > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:28

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Not only a lift, but “all the way off the damn throttle please ”. Some of these big v8s are making as much power part throttle as I am wide open.

-former FRS driver, current Miata driver.

WRXforScience > Jesus Arias 12/16/2019 at 13:35

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Thanks! A couple of them even had instructors who should have seen me and told them to give the point-by.

One issue I’ll have is that I close on the lead cars very quickly and in areas that they are busy ham fist ed ly trying to navigate. It’s easy to look in your mirrors in the straights and see a big V8 car barreling down on you, it’s harder to see a lightweight car wait an extra 200ft to hit the brakes and clear a corner with an extra 10mph.

Normally, I’d go find the driver and have let them know (in a helpful and friendly manner the first time and a more animated way if it happens again) that I had issues with them; however, this past weekend I spent all my time between session instructing the Novice and Intermediate students in the classroom and the people who needed the class the most (the guys who held me up) didn’t bother to attend the class (maybe why they’re so slow).

Since this track just reopened, at their trackdays they combine the solo approved intermediate drivers with the instructed intermediate drivers, which was the run group I had to drive with. So only about half the cars had instructors and the solo approved drivers were e ncouraged but not required to attend the classes. Corvette drivers tend to have egos, and most are going to have issues admitting that an 86 is faster than they are (especially since mine is pretty close to stock and I run street tires, it’s my daily driver).

WRXforScience > Decay buys too many beaters 12/16/2019 at 13:39

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The “lift” is supposed to mean all the way off the throttle. I even told the students in class that if they saw me they should get all the way off the throttle and even consider a quick brush brake to let my by more quickly so they could tuck in and try to learn the line by following through a corner or two.

I’m usually one of the lower powered cars on the track, I’ve got straight line speed over NA’s, NB’s, and NC’s but that’s about it (pretty even with the ND’s). And even the Miatas are tough for me to get all the way past in the shorter straights if they don’t lift.

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:41

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wow okay that makes a lot of sense, I was really trying to figure out how that was possible.

WRXforScience > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 12/16/2019 at 13:48

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I had the same reaction the first time I met the guy/car. I was expecting to keep up coming out of a corner (we were on the same line and my entry/exit speeds were as fast or faster than his) when he just pulled away. I went over after the session to check out the car to find out it had a supercharger and a few other goodies. 

Decay buys too many beaters > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:51

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Yeah, it’s supposed to mean all the way off , but I usually find myself needing to track down a few people after a session to kindly remind them earlier on in the day.

On the NDs, assume you’re talking about the ND1s? They were pretty even with my FR-S in the straights, but the ND2s would leave me for dead just about everywhere (about the same power with 500lbs less weight)

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 13:57

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Snark incoming: Maybe he should’ve spent more time learning to drive his vehicle on a track before he dropped a few thousand in parts.

WRXforScience > Decay buys too many beaters 12/16/2019 at 13:58

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Most of my experience is with ND1's, whenever there’s an ND2 it’s usually in a lower run group and the driver is less skilled so whatever difference in power to weight there might be isn’t nearly as big as with the Corvettes, Porsches, and Mustangs I also have to deal with.

The better drivers usually don’t upgrade as often and stick to known platforms. The ND is still not as common at the track as the other Miatas and I couldn’t tell the difference between and ND1 and ND2 just by looking. I usually only find out if I talk to the driver or if there is a driver list/results posting.

WRXforScience > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 12/16/2019 at 14:03

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That’s true of about 7 0% of the track drivers, it’s easier to buy parts than to develop skills. The Miata belongs to one of the owners of a Miata parts vendor, they develop and sell performance parts for Miatas so it’d be weird if he drove a stock car.

Really, I don’t care how fast/slow someone is as long as they are safe and give good point-bys. I have some friends who are much slower than they should be but they have a great time at the track and do a very good job of giving passes so no one cares that they are slow.

Jesus Arias > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 15:35

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Well for near stock with street tires it looks like it handles amazingly. Also why would they bother to go to the track and not the class if they don’t know how to properly drive fast? Does it really boost their ego that much to hold up faster drivers?

WRXforScience > Jesus Arias 12/16/2019 at 15:56

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The classroom instruction is full of great information and is worth it for anyone who wants to get faster (sometimes drivers from higher run groups sit in for pointers or tips). The only reason anyone would skip it is if they think it is beneath them. I’m more than happy to tailor the classes to whatever the people need help with, from racing lines to smooth inputs to advanced driving techniques like trail braking or heel-toe shifting.

I’ve got a set of Ohlins coilovers, sway bars front and rear, and upgraded wheels and tires. The BRZ handles about as well as any car. I’ve had the opportunity to drive some impressive handling vehicles (every Porsche except a Carrera GT or 918 Spyder, all the Miatas, and a few S2000's) and the BRZ can compete with all of them. The handling and braking is among the very best out of any car at any price.

Some of the Corvette drivers have just enough experience to think they’re starting to get fast. They can keep in front of just about all the cars in their run group and don’t realize just how much they have left to learn (basically they suffer from the Dunning-Krueger Effect ). The Corvettes were doing 20+ mph more at the end of the long straights than I was , so they have a hard time understanding that they are 4-10s a lap slower than I was.

It doesn’t help that the 86 has an unwarranted reputation as being slow. Sure it’ll lose just about any drag race you enter it in, but the track has more than just straightaways.

Jesus Arias > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 16:01

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Well their loss for not taking the class. It should be fairy apparent as to why they keep getting slower laps and they should focus on cornering because although a higher horsepower figure may look impressive  on paper, there are more factors than just numbers when it comes to going to the track . Also you have driven Porsches? Damn nice I was considering a 986 Boxster for my next car but German cars are expensive to maintain so I plan on just importing a Suzuki Cappuccino.

nermal > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 16:15

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This is a major reason why I prefer trackdays on bikes to cars. Every org that I’ve ridden with does a similar set of passing rules, straights for beginner group, straights & outside of turns for intermediate, and anywhere for advanced. As long as the org is good about placing people in the right groups, it works well. No passing rules in club racing other than don’t intentionally wreck somebody else.

For cars, I’d be more inclined to skip the trackday ranks and go straight to racing as soon as practical. It just doesn’t sound fun to constantly be checking your mirrors to point people to pass. 

WRXforScience > Jesus Arias 12/16/2019 at 16:20

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I instruct with the local Porsche Club, so I get to drive Porsches pretty regularly. I spent a year and a half going around to all the clubs and becoming an instructor with everyone so that I could get as much track time as possible and so that I could learn from as many groups as feasible. I instruct for: the SCCA Time Trials, Porsche Club of America, BMW Car Club of America, APEX Academy, Park Place Experience, and Eagles Canyon Raceway regularly (I’ve instructed at a couple Edge Addicts events as well).

The Boxsters and Caymans are all great, they feel almost the same as my BRZ as far as handling and track behavior (except that even the base models have more power than my BRZ and they spin more easily thanks to the mid-engine layout ). I’ve always like the Cayman and from my experiences instructing with the Porsche Club, they aren’t as bad as I thought as far maintenance costs. The 996 and 997 911's also make good track cars.

You should make sure to check out the convertible rules for the track and clubs you want to race with. Some have extra safety requirements for convertibles and some (BMW Club for example) don’t allow convertibles without a full cage and driver restraints.

The Cappucc ino looks like a hoot, you’d probably get run over at the bigger tracks, but it would tear up tight, technical courses. I’d be worried about finding parts though, there’s nothing worse than worrying if a part will arrive in time to fix up your car before an upcoming track date.  

With unlimited funds I’d track a Porsche GT3 or GT4, if I had to replace my BRZ, I’d get another one. If I couldn’t have an 86, I’d get an S2000 or Cayman S (any generation, there isn’t a bad one really). Miatas are great at the track and super cheap to run, there are some great deals on NC’s since they are the black sheep of Miatas. All those cars are pretty reliable and whatever shortcomings they have at the track are well documented and relatively easy to address.

I really like having a car that I can drive without worrying about working on all the time or killing me on consumable costs. It’s also nice that my BRZ can fit a full set of tires and tools in the back with the seats folded down.

WRXforScience > nermal 12/16/2019 at 16:28

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In the higher run groups, people will grid based on speed and there isn’t too much passing anyway. I like how in my car if I screw up and spin out or go 2 wheels off track I just come into the hot pits for a quick once over then head back out, the guys on bikes aren’t usually as lucky if they push too hard or make a mistake.

More power to you bike guys, but I know I’d hurt myself if I tried trac king as much and as hard as I do on a bike.

Jesus Arias > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 17:49

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Yeah I am aware parts will difficult to find. But I plan to Turbo Hayabusa swap it so it will have some speed to hopeful keep up with some of the newer cars. But wow you are quite involved in racing huh? I want to be able to go to the track but my car (99 TransAm ) isn’t ready (old parts ) and there isnt   any nearby tracks.

nafsucof > WRXforScience 12/16/2019 at 22:15

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my club (cartct) typically says if someone won’t let you pass, pit in and then back out so your session isn’t ruined. we use the same passing rules someone always ignores it. i had a guy in a lotus elise close the door on me straight after straight when i clearly was pulling on him in corners but just barely  faster in the straight. he’d drag race me to the end of the straight as i was about to pass and then he’d slow me down in turn 1, 3, and so on.  we talked about it and at the end of the day he offered me a beer.  said he didn’t realize we weren’t racing?! i was like this is a lapping day not door to door racing...

WRXforScience > nafsucof 12/16/2019 at 22:58

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Pitting is always an option, but in my experience it only helps if you’ve caught a train, otherwise the time you take in the pits is about the same to get to the next couple of passing zones. Also, you aren’t guaranteed to get open track after you pit, you could just end up in another group of people and get stuck after you’ve wasted a couple of laps and minutes by going in and out of the pits.

nermal > WRXforScience 12/17/2019 at 11:50

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It’s odd how the differences between two and four wheel are wayyyy more than expected. It’s not unusual to have 50 or 60 bikes on a longer track at once. Plus, costs are so much lower, from track fees to buying bikes to maintenance and consumables .

There are many more injury-free crashes than you’d expect as well. That said, occasionally there are helicopter rides that nobody wants to see. Just like there are $100k+ cars eating Armco that nobody wants to see.

WRXforScience > nermal 12/17/2019 at 12:16

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My last set of track tires lasted 20 days and cost $600, I’d be surprised if bike tires cost less per day (breaks down to $30/day).

The bikes are fun to watch, I’ve run a number of events where one of the run groups was a motorcycle group.

I don’t have any desire to ride a motorcycle. I talked with the track manager at one of the tracks I frequent, he’s been in charge for the last 15 years and there have been no fatalities for cars; however, they average about 1 motorcycle fatality every other year. I only know one guy in a car who was injured in a crash (his brakes failed and he did a duke’s of hazard jump through a tire wall, he broke his nose and tail bone mostly due to his harness bar breaking ). I prefer the idea of having a crash structure to help absorb the crash energy.