What should I know about the BRZ?

"Jayhawk Jake" (jayhawkjake) 01/26/2019 at 18:33 • Filed to: None

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Alright oppo, tell me all the good and bad about the BRZ.

As I’ve mentioned a few times, I’ve given some thought lately to swapping out my Mustang for something with cheaper running costs. I’d like to do more track days this year, and as I’m staring down another $1200 tire purchase I’m keeping alternate options open. Tires for a BRZ would be about half that for a full set, giving me more for the money. And that doesn’t even begin to cover brake pads, gas, and insurance costs all which would be quite a bit less expensive.

Today I test drove a ‘15 FRS. I came away pleasantly surprised. It’s a nice car, the power isn’t as bad as I expected. It has a decent punch and feels responsive. No, it isn’t fast, but it’s not obscenely slow on surface streets. The small stature and lightness on its feet definitely helps make up for it. It’s just a different experience to the Mustang: it revs out more and can wring it’s neck without speeding, whereas staying in it to redline in the Mustang puts you in ticket territory.

I was also pleasantly surprised at the ride. On some less than stellar roads it felt about the same as the Mustang, and 75 on the highway at 3100 rpm or so isn’t terrible.

The cabin was also surprisingly roomy, at least driving alone. Better visibility than the Mustang for sure, and I actually fit in the heavily bolstered seats which has been an issue in other cars in the past (lookin at you ST/RS Recaros).

About the only downside was the sound and power. Which I knew. But it’s not like the Mustang sounded amazing with a restrictive stock exhaust either. Would an exhaust make it at least interesting? Idk.

Power, damn it why do these not have more?! Seriously, 250/250 is all it would take IMO, it could be the best car. I did get the tail a little loose at one point so the skinny little tires help make up for it but damn. I’m not suggesting it needs to be some 400hp monster, but it deserves more.

So what does oppo think? Will it be reliable and take a beating at autox and on track? Has anyone gone from a V8 pony to a BRZ here? Did it leave you with regrets, or did you put the noise behind you?

I think I would be sure to get a BRZ, with push button start, heated seats,  and automatic climate control. Maintain some luxuries. 

Maxima Speed > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 19:12

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All questions I need answered as well because I want one too. Either that or a Mazda 3 with the skyactiv X

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 19:20

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My dad has owned BRZs since spring of 2014. He started with a 2013 base model and has since traded up to a 2017 Series.Yellow. He put almost 30k miles on the 13 with zero issues outside routine oil changes. I never got to drive the 13 but I fell in love with the 17 when I drove it and autocrossed it. The 2017 facelift is a decent upgrade over the pre facelift cars with the 17 getting a tighter chassis (which can be futher excentuated with the addition of the performance package), different gear ratios, and a slightly stronger engine. In general the BRZs have been very reliable though a baffled oil pan is recommended to prevent oil starvation issues with heavy track work.

Under_Score > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 19:24

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The BRZ uses Premium gas, which will probably cost more in the long run. A lot of the other performance-oriented little cars do, too, but it’s something to keep in mind compared to the Mustang. Otherwise, a loaded one sounds like a good choice.

Honeybunchesofgoats > Under_Score 01/26/2019 at 19:28

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Mustangs use regular?

glemon > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 20:21

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I test drove one when they first came out, nice enough, if I we're going to have it for my daily driver a hatch would be nice.

Under_Score > Honeybunchesofgoats 01/26/2019 at 20:42

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I could’ve sworn they did, but it looks like not. Because the 5.0 isn’t a turbo or anything fancy, I just assumed it used Regular. Thank you for making me clarify.

That’s the side of luxury and performance  cars that gets you! Paying 30+ cents more per gallon at the pump. It adds up.

Josh - the lost soldier > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 20:58

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The first performance mod should be a new header. That and a tune will eliminate the torque dip in the middle of the power and and liven up the midrange.

For sound, a good catback would be the easiest fix . Personally, I’ve got my ears on a Perrin 4" catback, but everyone’s tastes differ.

The Primacy tires are a good bit of fun in the dry, but a little sketchy in the wet. When it gets slippery (especially when combined with the cold) the back end can step out without warning. All stock and in the dry, the tires don’t have a whole lot of outright grip but break away progressively. If you find yourself sliding, it’ll probably be at less than 40 mph and easily catchable due to the balanced chassis and responsive steering.

A good street/light track/autocross tire upgrade on the stock wheels would be the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S. They’re less playful than the Primacy, but give you much needed grip when you need to set clean laps.

I’d hold off on forced induction for the first year of ownership. The driving experience of the Toyobaru is similar in ways to an S2000 or an RX-8, though Ti doesn’t quite rev as high.

If you’re looking for amenities, both Toyobaru variants are pretty sparse and the interior isn’t as well-appointed as a newer Mustang or Camaro, all in the name of driver focus. The BRZ Premium and the FR-S basically have the same kit, though the fake carbon fiber trim in the later FR-S models looks chintzy and I’m not a fan of the cloth texture in the BRZ Premium. If you want the cool toggle switches for the climate control, you’ll be looking at either the BRZ Limited or a special edition FR-S. The speakers are a bit weak on these cars, but the BRZ head unit, mediocre though it may be, is better than the FR-S’.

So far, reliability hasn’t been an issue for me (2013 FR-S with January 2013 build date) and maintenance has been fairly cheap at my local Toyota dealer. I haven’t had any mechanical issues with the car over ~60k miles and almost six years with the car. I’ve had some minor things happen (window switches freezing in 20 degree weather, passenger door lock freezing in 20 degree weather, etc.) but nothing that required an unexpected dealer visit. Just note that Subaru paint sucks and scratches easily.

With the Primacy tires installed, I could get about 30-32 MPG on my mostly-highway work commute using cruise control. City mileage is around 26 MPG, +/- 2 MPG. With the Pilot Sport 4S, mileage has dropped but not massively.

Honeybunchesofgoats > Under_Score 01/26/2019 at 21:15

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Tell me about it. Between my Jag and my Miata, I haven’t had a car that uses regular since my old Town Car. 

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 21:17

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The clutch feel was the absolute worst thing i have ever driven. Was like a video game. No feel.

Jayhawk Jake > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time 01/26/2019 at 21:25

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In the BRZ? I thought it was decent. Of course I’m coming from arguably the worst clutch of all time. 

Jayhawk Jake > Under_Score 01/26/2019 at 21:26

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The 5.0 CAN use regular, but I can’t imagine anyone does. Premium is recommended, and I use it.

The avg mpg on the FRS I drove showed 27.7. Which is about 10.7 more than I get in the Mustang 

Jayhawk Jake > glemon 01/26/2019 at 21:28

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I haven’t found the trunk on the Mustang restrictive, except when I try to carry 4 of its wheels. The FRS/BRZ is supposed to be capable of carrying its own wheels and they’re quite a bit lighter than the Mustang’s so I imagine it will do fine. 

Jayhawk Jake > Josh - the lost soldier 01/26/2019 at 21:30

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Thanks for the feedback. If I get one power mods may be a challenge depending how I intend to use it with autocross.

I actually found the speakers decent in the stock FRS, unless it had been upgraded cleanly. Is it true that the headunit is just a double din? Do you know if it’s reasonably simple to replace? If it’s underwhelming I’d likely just swap it out for something with Carplay

Jayhawk Jake > Josh - the lost soldier 01/26/2019 at 21:30

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Thanks for the feedback. If I get one power mods may be a challenge depending how I intend to use it with autocross.

I actually found the speakers decent in the stock FRS, unless it had been upgraded cleanly. Is it true that the headunit is just a double din? Do you know if it’s reasonably simple to replace? If it’s underwhelming I’d likely just swap it out for something with Carplay

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 21:35

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Yea this was a first year car so maybe they changed it up since then.

I loved the clutch in a 2013 5.0 I drove.

But ive also owned a DSM with a Stage 3 ACT and my LS RX7 has a Monster clutch rated for 600+ WHP so im a little biased with what I like

WRXforScience > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 21:41

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I did 22 trackdays and 20 autox events in my 2014 BRZ last year (I’ve already done 2 trackdays this year and am going back for my 3rd tomorrow). This is a great track car. I came from a tuned WRX (306 hp and 356 torque at the wheels) and I very rarely miss the power.

Tires cost half as much as a Mustang, I run with the Mustang GT’s on the track (I have to work hard, but out of the 4 at the track today, only one was faster than me).

The 86 is a momentum car, it’s not gutless but there isn’t much in the power department. Get a header and tune to get rid of the torque dip and have nice linear ‘power’. 200hp used to be a reasonable amount.

The 2015+ are the ones you want (2013 had some issues and 2014 still had the coilpack problem). They run great at the track, I had a wheel bearing go and a clutch issue (I pushed the pedal in to change gears and it stayed on the floor) but other than that the car has been solid (4 hard years of track, autox, and daily duty).

You’ll need an oil cooler and if you’re going to do more than 5-6 trackdays a year I’d recommend getting the AP Racing Sprint Kit brakes (pads are cheaper and you can run a thicker pad, kit costs $2100 new and $1600-$1800 used). The SSC SCCA spec class(limited to 2013-2016 since 2017 got the extra 5hp) is a great fit for the car and makes a capable dual autox and track setup that’s pretty cheap and does everything except the headers and a tune to get rid of the torque dip (which is only an issue if you drive an 86 with headers and a tune, if you don’t you can live with the dip). You’ll need some negative camber in the front, stock with camber bolts you are only going to get -1 to -1.5 degrees and for track and autox you want -3 or more up front (rears are fine especially if you lower the car you’ll end up with plenty without adding anything else).

If you don’t like the idea of SSC, an STX build is what I run and it also makes a decent TT5 track build. STX is at least $2k more than SSC (which is a TT6 build I believe ) but you can get rid of the torque dip and end up with a faster car (1s per mile at the track, and 2s at autox). STX is more customizable but you’ll pay for the flexibility.

Josh - the lost soldier > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 21:55

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The head unit is indeed a standard double-DIN unit. It’s fairly simple to upgrade, though I think some dash panels have to be removed. On the performance parts front, focus on torque first, then power. Having a more usable midband of torque is better than 500 HP at 8000 RPM.

Under_Score > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 22:35

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Premium or not, the Toyobaru’s are definitely gonna get better mileage than a V8 Mustang, contributing to cheaper running costs. I’m on board with the BRZ plan. “EKLIPSE”? A plate that says “FRS” on a BRZ? “P0RSH”?

Under_Score > Honeybunchesofgoats 01/26/2019 at 22:38

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And I’m out here thinking “I’m glad I don’t pay for my own gas”, as I get below EPA (I get around 19-20 on average  and EPA is 22 city) with Regular gas. Many regular cars get better mileage now, but sheesh, I’d have to hop in a hybrid boat. The Miata using Premium doesn’t seem to make sense.

Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 23:05

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I’ve had mine for 2 months, with the heated seats and climate control stuff :) [2018 Sport-tech RS]. I can’t talk much about reliability, but I haven’t had to take it back to the dealer for the first 5000km! I’m very happy with it so far, and it isn’t whining too much about the cold weather. 

I had a big unexpected expense with this car when I went to get winter tires. Steel rims do not fit over Brembos, so I was into rims/tires about $600 over budget. In fact, a lot of rims don’t fit the Brembos. Even f actory only has about 5 mm of clearance. I don’t think the 2015s were offered bigger brakes, so that may be a non-issue.

It feels significantly faster than my old NB, but I can’t compare it to a V8. I don’t drive a lot of powerful cars.

I’m putting about 35 litres of fuel for every 400ish kms, which is roughly 27mpg. Always 91 octane - not every place has 93/94 here.

Autocross/track days will probably wait until the warranty is up, unfortunately .

The only complaint I have is that it isn’t an ND Club, because NDs are very expensive where I live, and I don’t think they’d hold up well in daily winter driving with no garage.

John > Jayhawk Jake 01/26/2019 at 23:22

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Funny you tested a ‘15 FR-S...since that’s exactly what I bought (profile pic) nearly a month and a half ago. It’s my first daily driver that has a manual (my first manual is a garage kept 2000 Z3 that I’m the 2nd owner of). I haven’t and don’t plan on doing any mods anytime soon since I’m mechanically lacking.

Positives: Driving the car is FUN 100% of the time, it’s quick but not fast, has a super easy clutch...so much so that spending upto an hour in stop/go traffic (my commute is hell) has turned into something I enjoy, it’s fun to rev, handles extremely well and eats corners for lunch with non-stock tires. Fuel efficiency is solid, I average around 30mpg including my stop/go commute. The seats are fairly comfortable as well. Also, I seem to be ignored by cops around here (who are easily bored since it’s so safe) even when pushing it...which is perfect. :)

Cons: Driving at night with truck/suv lights blinding my retinas is a challenge. Speaking of trucks...they will run you over if they’re not paying attention since the car is so small and mine is the asphalt color so I tend to blend in when it’s dark. Power on the top-end is lacking as everyone knows. I instinctively try not to get into a pissing contest on the interstate or piss anybody off...because I can’t outrun them and I can easily be crushed.

All-in-all: It’s the most fun car I’ve ever owned. Full insurance coverage is ~$800/year, it was priced well (‘15 FR-S/51k mi/3rd owner/no mods or wrecks - $14k), has been an excellent way to teach myself how to drive a stick in all kinds of weather (ice/rain here so far and some sun) with an featherweight clutch. You really can’t go wrong...unless your main goals are to burn the tires off and go fast in a straight line. But, since it seems as if that’s what you’re moving on from...I believe this car will be just what you’re looking for.

Bonus: Upgrades down the road to make it your own.

Good luck! :)

AddictedToM3s - Drives a GC > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 00:44

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I had one for 2 years. Road trips will wear down your ears. Gearing is BAD for traffic if you commute in traffic. My commute was about 12-15mph the whole way so I was always between second and third. Rain also sounds like hail due to the lack of sound deadening material. Keep that in mind if you commute in the rain.

As someone else said, the clutch is meh. It has barely any feel and it abruptly catches so it requires a lot of effort to get off from a stop light smoothly. Also if you’re planning on taking it on an expressway then people will ride your ass all the way up to the speed limit from a stop.

It was a fun car though. The trick to getting smoother shifts is to take your time. That said, the transmission hates the cold and it’ll refuse to go into first from a stop and also it’ll hate going into second until it’s warmed up slightly.

Overall, I do slightly miss it. So I’d say you’ll like it if you’re looking for engaging. Just remember that if it’s your only car the backseats will be useless and that’s what pissed me off the most. I couldn’t drive anyone around and it sucked.

glemon > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 02:19

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I had a couple little hatchback 2 seaters as daily drivers a long time ago.  Like a lot of features, if you haven't had it you probably don't miss it.  But without rear doors or a back seat it is a great place to be able to load up groceries, beer, dogs, drunk freinds, etc.

DoomsdayMelody > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 02:19

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If I may play devils advocate, I’d suggest you take a look at a Fiesta ST. Yes, the interior is garbage. Not necessarily poor construction, just lots of hard plastics. Speakers are great provided you aren’t an audiophile, and you don’t HAVE to have the recaros in the fiesta since the only real option you’d be foregoing are the butt warmers aside from the seats themselves. Fuel economy will be in the high 30’s with cruise control set at 70mph. I see 25 mpg in my city cycle commute... 24 mpg if I run e20/e30. Oh, right why mention e20? Because on the stock fuel map you’ll be putting down 230+ ft/lbs of torque with no other mods just by putting about 2.5 gallons of e85 in the tank. The little 1.6 is a torquey son of a gun and also makes around 200 hp. Granted, it’s 100% midrange and the power tapers off if you run it all the way to red line, but it’s a lot of torque in a car that weighs as much as your proposed toyubaru. You will not want for power, and while the engine won’t beg you to pull to redline every time you dip into it, the chassis is constantly reminding you that it isn’t even trying. You can take that corner faster. Off camber? Doesn’t matter. Lift the throttle through the corner and feel the car rotate. Yes, it’s front wheel drive, but it’s a damn good chassis with a brilliantly tuned suspension. You can get into a brand new one for about 19k plus tax, title, and license.

Just food for thought.

And since we’ve mentioned tires, 4 good  summer tires will set you back $400 on tire rack. You can find all seasons for similar prices.

lamawithonel > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 02:40

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T here’ s a delay valve in the slave cylinder that makes engagement non-linear if you release too fast. T he pedal travel is a little excessive, too, for a sports car. It’s maybe not so bad coming from muscle cars . Y ou can swap out the slave cylinder if you really hate it.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77390

lamawithonel > Josh - the lost soldier 01/27/2019 at 02:48

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One small panel that pops off. Replacement is about as straight forward as it gets these days, except the built-in microphone. But if all you’re after is Car Play or Android Auto, those features are available on the ‘18+ BRZ .

Sinanigans > John 01/27/2019 at 08:36

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You sir, get it! I’ve has my brz since March of ‘ 13 and I still live driving it. It makes everyday driving an experience. 

Tekamul > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 09:25

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Just to confirm, yes a set of wheels and tires fit in the back with the seats down.  I’ve done it a couple times, no real hassle.

mazeroni > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 09:55

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I have a 2013 FRS Series 10. Bought it in 2015 with 26K miles.

The Series 10 has keyless and push to start, HIDs, and the LED accents in the lights; but it lacks the leather and heated seats of the BRZ Limited. The FRS Monogram is a BRZ Limited, but very rare.

AutoX: I originally bought the car with the intent to do autoX, but my priorities shifted. Tires are obviously a must, but if you’re looking for grip you’ll need to go up to 235 width tires minimum. If you want to continue to slide, consider swapping to the Pilot Super Sports, as someone else mentioned. They don’t really get you much more grip, but they are softer and feel better at the limit. Then of course pads and fluids.

Reliability: My car is now at 65K and I’ve only had to do tires and oil. You’ll see the same if you visit the ft86club forums. There are people with 140K miles without major issues, except the typical water pump replacement or new spark plugs. But don’t let anyone tell you the spark plugs must be changed at 60k; it won’t need it for a long time.

Performance: I’m fine with the performance. I do wish for more torque, but you are right about going full throttle being safe. Also, around onramps, blasting by people in their crossovers at double the speed without the car being near  the limit is funny.

Sound: You need a resonated catback at the least. The longer you own the car, the more you’ll come to hate the sound of the stock motor and exhaust. A UEL header will get you the boxer rumble and more torque.

I don’t recommend going too loud, however. There are lots of 18~20 year olds getting into used models and they are turning them into a crap shoot of cheap aftermarket mods and overly loud bumblebee exhausts. It’s a bad look for all of us; if you do mods, please by tasteful!

MPG: Depending on your daily drive, you can get 25 to 30 mpg on average. If you baby it, you’ll be shocked how good your mileage will be. But bombing around at high RPMs doesn’t destroy your gas tank.

Ride: The 2015 FRS switched to the BRZ suspension tuning, so your ride is probably going to be better than my car. Right now, in the cold, the car is borderline unlivable. In the summer if gets a little better. On the highway during long trips, the car tracks straight and doesn’t tramline or anything like that.

Quality: It’s reliable for sure. But the build quality and materials are bad. Everything squeaks and rattles. You’ll hear all sorts of horrible bangs going over bumps or hitting potholes. There are weird plastic humming sounds. Going over light debris on the road will make you cringe. When it rains, the car gets very loud because there is no sound deadening for the roof. The aftermarket exhaust helps.

Summary: I would recommend the car to anyone that wants to have fun in the corners and loves revving a motor out. Yes, its power is only adequate once you go down 2-3 gears, and you will get walked by an F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost, but you will catch up on the onramp and you’ll be smiling again.

Jayhawk Jake > glemon 01/27/2019 at 10:22

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I’ve owned a hatchback. It was useful, but it just isn’t necessary for me. I’ve had a Mustang as my only car for 3 years now and have never found a situation that I just couldn’t handle. Yes, I’ve borrowed a truck a handful of times but IMO those 3-4 instances in 3 years (including borrowing a truck to move) don’t make it worth seeking a hatch.

Jayhawk Jake > Tekamul 01/27/2019 at 10:24

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Does it leave much space for other stuff? It was kinda hard to tell without actually putting wheels in. Like I would ultimately need to carry a jack and some tools too, and ideally a small-medium plastic tub without taking up the passenger seat.

I’ve managed to fit a disturbing amount of stuff in the back of my Mustang so I’m willing to bet the twins would carry plenty 

McFuu > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time 01/27/2019 at 10:28

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This is pretty much the worst part of the car, the clutch is a bit dull, but it's thankfully consistent and after a few days with the car you get used to it and it's catching point in different weather. There is a mod to install a hydraulic clutch, vs the old school fork that the car has. 

Jayhawk Jake > WRXforScience 01/27/2019 at 10:28

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I suspect I’d likely target an SSC build eventually, but I’m still not sure I’m a good enough driver to truly pursue anything outside of street class in the near term. I’m planning to do less autox this year in favor of more track, because I’ve frankly hit a wall with autox where the only way I’m going to get better is to travel more and I genuinely don’t want to. I’m one of the fastest street class drivers in my region, which is fun but I know I'm not really being pushed to get better ATM. Maybe having a slower car in a slower class will help though because I'll have to work harder. 

Jayhawk Jake > Under_Score 01/27/2019 at 10:30

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I’ve been struggling to come up with a plate idea too. FRS on a BRZ is pretty good. “supra” would be a bit funny to me but it doesn’t quite hit the same note as “Camero"

Jayhawk Jake > Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] 01/27/2019 at 10:33

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The ND seems so much more constructive as a daily. I drove a soft top and RF a little while ago. It's a fantastic car, but the cabin is tiny with very little storage and the trunk is quite small as well. The FRS felt fairly spacious and simply having the back seat opens up more capability to toss stuff back there and not worry about it, rather than questioning whether or not I can carry a heavy coat in an ND

Tekamul > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 10:37

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Not really. The wheels go right to the back of the front seats. It would be whatever you’re fitting on top of the front pair.

Track trailers are pretty cheap and easy.

Stang70Fastback > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 10:38

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Check out my BRZ blog :)

www.seriesblueadventures.com

Dusty Ventures > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 12:02

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Most questions have already been answered, and done-so better than I could (haven’t tracked or modified mine yet), but figured I’d +1 the endorsements. You may have already figured this out in your research but if you want heated seats the only option is the BRZ in Limited trim or a post-Scion Toyota 86 (there may be a FRS special edition in there somewhere that got them as well, but outside of that it’s not an option on the Scion). I got a ‘16 BRZ Limited for that very reason, my ass needs the warmth here in the frozen north.

What I can tell you that I haven’t seen mentioned yet is that the average fuel economy readout lies. I rented a few on Turo before buying mine and they’ve all read about 2 mpg optimistic when compared to distance traveled/gallons used at the pump. That said I still averaged 32 mpg driving it 3,000 miles home from Texas (and not at all babying it on that drive), and now that I’m home I’m doing about 26 on the work commute.

As mentioned, the stock tires, while decent in the dry, break loose easily in the wet. And if there’s a dusting of snow... hang on to yer butts. I’m going to run them until they’re worn out, but definitely replacing them with something that gives more wet confidence once they’re done. Leaning toward the Pirelli UHP all seasons personally.

If you get a 16 you’ll get the backup camera, but you also get a trapezoidal shaped head unit, so when you want to replace it (and you will because it’s garbage) you’ll either have to create a custom surround or you’ll have weird gaps on each side. 17+ is better in pretty much every way (engine, gear ratios, suspension, head unit, etc), but those improvements also mean there’s about a $3,000 price gap over the 16. More if you want the performance pack with the better brakes and dampers. As someone else said, I wouldn’t go older than a 15, the first two model years had issues that weren’t worked out yet.

My biggest gripes, after the head unit (which is so so bad), are the lack of map lights (there’s just the center dome, or you can use the sun visor light), the limited cabin storage (just water bottle holders in the doors, very little space in the center console , and the owner’s manual takes up nearly the entire glove box), and the fact that at night the entire dash is red. All the buttons and switches are red. The digital displays are red numbers on a red background. The gauges are red needles over red numbers with red lines. Woe be upon you if you don’t know where redline is. Oh, I almost forgot, one more gripe, the only buttons that don’t light up at night are the ones to toggle odo/trip/ambient temp/fuel economy. Eventually you get used to where they are and it’s not a problem, but it was a pain the first few nights.

All in all only minor complaints, and certainly no regrets. I love this thing.

Poodles > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 14:52

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It’s kind of a double DIN.  Factory radio is wider than a normal double DIN, so there’s spacers that get installed to take up the gap.

Poodles > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time 01/27/2019 at 14:57

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Most Hondas are worse.  You get used to the feel pretty quick and it’s nice in traffic.  It appears they use the larger slave cylinder from their turbo cars (that have stiffer clutches) instead of the one from their NA cars.  It’s a simple swap to get more feel if you want.

Poodles > Under_Score 01/27/2019 at 14:59

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They can run E85 with just a tune, and around here E85 is as cheap or cheaper than regular.  Get a bit worse gas mileage on E85, but more power...

Poodles > Dusty Ventures 01/27/2019 at 15:05

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I’m crazy and prefer red or green dashes.  Just set the shift light if you can’t tell where the redline is.

Poodles > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 15:23

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OK, let’s get started. I owned a Series.Blue BRZ for 3 years. I now own a WRX

- Ride quality is great from 2015+ as that’s when the dampers were revalved. It actually handles a bit better as well and is less prone to bottoming out in the rear.

- Sound, block off the sound pipe because it just drones on the highway anyway and throw a header and tune on it. E85 tunes work great and even on 93 these engines will knock in hot summers. Don’t do like I did and get the catback first and it’s not going to give you any power, and when you add the catless header, it’s going to be VERY LOUD.

- Power, as said a header helps immensely. I had a Gruppe-S Unequal Length but the best is the Ace headers but they’re crazy expensive. With a tune the Ace headers will put down 200 WHP on 91 and only climbs from there on 93 and E85. If you want more, there’s a wide selection of ways to boost the car, but most of the people racing that I’ve seen run supercharger setups to keep the throttle response.

-Racing/Tracking the car. I never did, but from what I’ve seen, outside the usual brakes/tires, you’re really going to want an oil cooler. Tires are still expensive, but being a far lighter car, they don’t wear as fast.

-BRZ vs FRS/86 I picked the BRZ for a number of reasons. Far better headlights (HIDs factory), heated seats, amazing seats (I miss the alcantara and wish the WRX had it), dual zone climate control (another thing I miss as the gf is always different than me), heated mirrors (this is a little thing that I will always have on a car from now on), plus the most important thing... WORLD RALLY BLUE!

Keep in mind the Series.Blue had the body kit, lighter wheels, and the JDM underpanels which definitely cut down on road noise.  Before you ask, yes the WRX is faster...but I still miss my BRZ.

Dusty Ventures > Poodles 01/27/2019 at 15:42

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I don’t care what the colors are, I just want there to be at least two of them. Red on white, red on green, blue on orange, hot pink on deep purple, whatever.

Milky > Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] 01/27/2019 at 16:28

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*looks out at ND club covered in snow and salt*

Its doing pretty damn great  so far.

Decay buys too many beaters > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time 01/27/2019 at 16:58

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Agree, removing a helper spring and swapping out the slave for one from a forrester xt was one of  the best $50 i spent on my 86

Decay buys too many beaters > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 17:01

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Funny, I’ve been thinking of going the other way. But I’ve got a M iata as well so it’s probably a matter of owning two cars that are too similar. 

Doc > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 18:09

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I went from an ‘04 Mach1 to an FR-S, not by choice, but I went. Something in my Mach’s electrical harness went out and since Ford no longer made that piece, it was leaving a junked harness from another Mach as the only option for replacement, and the insurance company wasn’t having it—they totaled my car out.

I went from close to 500hp with everything in my Mach to around 200hp in the FR-S. I got the car because I liked the small stature and like you, it is so much cheaper to buy parts than the Mach. I immediately changed out the exhaust and put cat-less LT headers on, a new OP, reasonated FP, and cat-back system. I also replaced the stock air box, stock springs, pulleys, brakes/rotors, and tuned it with an OFT. The tune and exhaust made a world of difference over stock, and gave it more punch off the line. The all new exhaust also helped the sound come in to a deeper sporty tone that sounds like a sports car should, not the deep rumble of a Mach by any means, but it sounds really good and I’ve gotten lots of compliments. The tune also takes care of the loud sound made on cold starts having something to do with the catalytic converter warming up??? I’m not sure on that and have only read about it in forums, but I digress.

The springs and wheel spacers were also a needed change, as it gave the FR-S a better stance, and took care of the unsightly wheel gap. All in all, I am happy with it when compared to my Mach1. It’s great on city streets and country road driving, and it does well on the open highway, too. Not the Mach by any means but it’s a good car to drive, when it’s been modded. The gas is a lot cheaper and so are parts—well, except for headlights, and they’re insanely expensive. Don’t be afraid to pick one up. They have their quirks like all cars but being able to mod just about anything leaves them as an open canvas, and makes them great for a DD.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > Jayhawk Jake 01/27/2019 at 18:12

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“NA WRX”

wafflesnfalafel > Jayhawk Jake 01/28/2019 at 00:46

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looked at them before I got a  wrx - I didn’t really fit that well... but otherwise it’s cool.  I like it a bit better than the 86 especially with those wheels.

Arrivederci > AddictedToM3s - Drives a GC 01/28/2019 at 08:45

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Lots of truth fact here. The roof was the tinniest thing ever - large raindrops literally sound like hail. A fucking acorn fell off a tree and left a tiny dent in my roof about a week after I got the car.

The clutch pedal is meh - you can do a free mod to remove the helper spring that returns a lot of the feel.

Spanfeller is a twat > Jayhawk Jake 01/28/2019 at 10:06

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You can always add a turbo kit.

Didn’t you have an ecoboost and swapped it for the V8? or was that another Opp o?

Jayhawk Jake > Dusty Ventures 01/28/2019 at 13:10

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Good take. Appreciate the insight. I’ve been trying to find one to rent but haven’t had much luck, very few cars here in general. I know at least one owner fairly well that I am considering asking to let me rent his car for a week...

Jayhawk Jake > Decay buys too many beaters 01/28/2019 at 13:12

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I had test driven one before I bought the first Mustang. What stood out to me this time was how little the lack of power bothered me. When I drove it the first time, that was a major issue.

A lot of it depends on what you’re looking for I think. At the time, I felt I was ‘ready’ for a more powerful car (I had a turbo Sonic). The FRS was not that car. Now that I’ve had power for a while, I don’t feel I need it as much, so the lack of power wasn’t a strong deterre nt.

Jayhawk Jake > Spanfeller is a twat 01/28/2019 at 13:12

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Yes, that was me. 

Spanfeller is a twat > Jayhawk Jake 01/28/2019 at 13:16

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Changing cars so often is always the biggest expense, the benefits in fuel economy, insurance and tires might not pan out in three or four years.

So, I don’t know how you’re looking at this finantially, But the depreciation on the Mustang, and the final depreciation on the BR-Z when you sell it might end up being more expensive for you than keeping the V8!

Specially considering a recent facelift and the new models might mean your V8 might've taken a big depreciation hit of late.

Decay buys too many beaters > Jayhawk Jake 01/28/2019 at 13:41

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I will echo what most on here say, a nice UEL header and a tune makes the car a lot more street-able . The precat just after the merge collector, and the transition point from direct injection only to blended port/direct injection, robs mid-range torque. I gained about 40ft-lbs at 3800rpm from stock, hugely improved driving experience.

I had it turbocharged for a while too, and while it was fun, It became pretty tiring to always be checking gauges and listening for weird noises. Kind of looking for similar on throttle lols, but with oem reliability. 

Jayhawk Jake > Spanfeller is a twat 01/28/2019 at 13:44

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Long term financial will probably be in favor of the mustang, but I have equity in it and an unsecured loan that I will just pay off over the next few years regardless. So sure, I’ll lose a little here or there, but what I save in motorsports running cost will make up for it.

I think you might be overlooking what I mean by running costs. Of course the daily costs of fuel, insurance, and normal tire wear will be much lower. But I eat a set of tires each year for autox as it is, and I’d like to do at least 2 or 3 trackdays this year. If it means 2 sets of tires, that’s $2400 of tire for the mustang. I could go through 4 sets of FR86Z tires for that. 

Spanfeller is a twat > Jayhawk Jake 01/28/2019 at 14:11

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As long as the numbers make sense to you, trade it...

Dusty Ventures > Jayhawk Jake 01/28/2019 at 14:48

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Maybe offer a trade for a few days?

If you find yourself in Portland (OR) there’s a yellow TRD edition FRS there on Turo. Owner’s a cool dude. I rented it when I was out doing Car Vs America with Raph and Mike, which was hilarious because for most of the weekend it ended up being the impromptu “star car,” which meant one of them riding in the back seat...

AddictedToM3s - Drives a GC > Arrivederci 01/28/2019 at 21:31

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That helper spring delete was a Yoga exercise for me since I (unwisely) chose to do it with the car parked next to my garage wall. It definitely did add back some feel though.

Another free/cheap mod was the sound tube plug in the passenger footwell.

Funny you mention the acorn. My roof had a similar dent from a pinecone. Did you trade it for an S3? I was also thinking about swapping to an S3 from the BRZ. I somehow ended up with my current car instead though. How do you like the S3?

Arrivederci > AddictedToM3s - Drives a GC 01/29/2019 at 08:30

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Yep - traded the BRZ on a S3 about two years ago. I love it and it has been a great car.  Very quick in a straight line, great all weather performance, understeers at the limit.  Numb compared to the BRZ, but most things will be, I suppose.  I bought it when looking for a Golf R and actually found the S3 less expensive on the preowned market.

AddictedToM3s - Drives a GC > Arrivederci 01/30/2019 at 01:18

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Strange how I also looked at the Golf R. I just couldn’t get behind spending that much on a Golf even though I know the money is spent on the drivetrain. True about a lot of cars being numbed compared to the BRZ. There are days where I miss the visceral rawness of it.

Looking back on it I should have bit the bullet and gotten what I really wanted. Oh well. Le sson learned.