What are the unique challenges that an automaker faces?

"Spanfeller is a twat" (theaspiringengineer) 06/16/2018 at 13:20 • Filed to: None

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I like Kia and Genesis for the same reason that Mr. Regular liked the Stinger: it seems like they are underdogs in a world of German Shepherds, and because these brands are in a sense contributing to creating a more competitive landscape in their respective markets.

Or they would if Hyundai was able to market the Stinger and the Genesis brand in the United States. In my honest opinion they’ve had issues because of two things: Perception, and dealer inertia.

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Kia is an established brand in the US, but it’s known mostly for cars like the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! or the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . Therefore trying to loose their image as economic shitbox is very hard in a market where the average car on the road is 11.5 years old and the average consumer is getting older and older (some rant about millenials). This is no better for Hyundai in general who also had issues breaking that very same stereotype. In fact, their range topping cars in 2017, the K900 and the Equus, both appear on Jalopnik’s “worst selling cars of 2017” !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

So they sort of gave up I suppose... which is where Genesis steps in. Once a sub-brand that sold mid level coupes, Hyundai thought they had enough brand recognition to make it a, uhh, Brand? But their introduction of the Genesis brand has been less than stellar, as they fail to release the cars and also a weird situation with !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! which is not good as far as selling luxury cars goes when you have no history of selling luxury cars. Which comes up nicely to why Hyundai wanted to give separate dealers for their very expensive cars:

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According to The Internet, Kia dealers in the US are really bad, and you just can’t mix a car that is compared to a Panamera in Kia’s own website with dealers like !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! So there’s no wonder that Hyundai wants to keep their fancy Genesis cars far away from their typical dealers, yet it has proven harder than usual to achieve that.

You see, I was surprised to read Kia dealers in the US were !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , because I had a genuinely nice experience with them, they showed me their import logs so that we could chose any car, let us test a car, the service department isn’t a hole in a wall that is overcrowded, and their assessors are truthful. But this seems to be only true of !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! where Kia and Hyundai have dumped a genuinely ridiculous amount of money to try and put themselves in the same level as VW; a classless brand that is attractive across a wide spectrum of buyers. This could also be because of PROFECO; the very aggressive consumer protection agency that closely monitors how dickish dealers are.

So the Stinger initially sold very little, attaining 1,500 dollar discounts on the very first ones to arrive here. But now they’re doing fine. Kia never had the judgmental attitude in Mexico, it has always been Hyundai here. It might’ve also helped that the range topping model here in Mexico is almost !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , this because Hyundai wanted to use “emotional marketing” to attract buyers in the US.

I think these challenges are unique to Kia, Hyundai, and Genesis, who have struggled to go into higher regard in the US market despite other Asian brands like Toyota, Honda, and Nissan being able to have better ratings. That while also having relative success with their upmarket counterparts Lexus, Acura, and Infiniti.

E90M3 > Spanfeller is a twat 06/16/2018 at 13:30

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I think it has two problems. First is the badge. No one really wants to roll around in a Hyundai. Every time I see a nicer one, I still think oh you bought a fancy Hyundai. It’s going to take a lot of years to remove that image. A Genesis might be better in every category than an S-Class, until someone asks you what you drive.

Not all dealers are the same, but as a general rule, the regular car dealers suck. I’ve been to a lot of dealers, and hands down, the worst is Ford. They’re terrible. I wouldn’t buy a Ford because of that. On the other hand, Porsche has consistently the best experiences I’ve had. I was at Mercedes and at least 4 people asked me if I needed assistance today.

Spanfeller is a twat > E90M3 06/16/2018 at 13:31

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Porsche dealers are very nice... I went to one just to snoop around and they let me, some 20 year old, sit in a 200,000 Panamera without questions.

That without mentioning that my cousin in Monterrey spends his time going to BMW, Audi, and such dealers testing out their cars. But go to a lower end dealer and bah, they trust you a lot less.

E90M3 > Spanfeller is a twat 06/16/2018 at 13:34

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The Mercedes dealer in Hilton Head let me take out a C-Class without the salesman, after I pulled up in a rental Corolla.

Even when I pull up in the M3, lower dealers still don’t trust me.

Spanfeller is a twat > E90M3 06/16/2018 at 13:36

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Yeah, but Kia isn’t a lower end dealer here. I could say that about Hyundai.

But given all your horror stories I’m not surprised Genesis wants nothing to do with their habitual dealers

E90M3 > Spanfeller is a twat 06/16/2018 at 13:39

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Does Kia sell cars like the Rio there?

I had a 2016 as a rental and it is the worst car I’ve ever driven.

Spanfeller is a twat > E90M3 06/16/2018 at 13:44

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I also had a good experience at Ford, they didn’t let me open a GT350 tho.

kia sells low value cars, but VW sells the Gol alongside the Touareg too and their dealers tend to be really nice... the only bad dealer experience I’ve had was in Tesla.

Maybe it has a little bit to do with how Mexicans usually buy cars, we tend to distrust credit a lot. Even if it’s being more widely accepted now, many people still pay cash for their cars here, so dealers that sell cars like the Rio or the Gol don’t find themselves beig ran by predatory lenders. Though the industry is growing and it’s very disturbing.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Spanfeller is a twat 06/16/2018 at 13:51

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Brand perception can be hard to overcome. Hyundai made their name by being the cheapest of the cheap. They sold in droves in the 80's by simply being that much more affordable than the competition. Corners have to be cut to make a car that cheap, and it led to a reputation of poor quality and cars that get taken off the roads much sooner than they should be. By the 90's the badge was seen as a mark of shame. You only bought a Hyundai because you couldn’t afford anything else.

They’ve been steadily fighting that perception since the turn of the century, first with some of the best warranties in the country and then with highly improved offerings like the 1999 XG350 and the 2006 Sonata. Their cars have been competetive in quality with the rest of the market for quite some time now, but it’s only in the last few years that the public has started seeing them as a respectable choice. It’s taken Hyundai 30 years to buck their poor initial impression among americans.

Meanwhile, Mercedes Benz was always seen as the last word in prestige and build quality after its introduction the U.S. market. Americans still see them as an aspirational marque, even though many of their offerings (anything below an E-Class) have been steadily declining in quality over the last twenty years. You can currently buy a Hyundai that is competitive with a Mercedes. Whether that says more about Hyundai or MB is up for you to decide.

Spanfeller is a twat > If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent 06/16/2018 at 13:56

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Kia’s warranty is amazing, but it’s almost as amazing that few people have to use it.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Spanfeller is a twat 06/16/2018 at 14:21

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There’s a couple of things here: brand image, and dealer network. The Korean’s position today isn’t that different than the position of the Japanese makers in the early 80's. Prior to the mid to late 80's Japanese cars were seen as the same inferior crap/couldn’t afford anything else buyer that the Korean makers are associated with today. The Japanese took 20-30 years in the US market to change that perception by the 80's, which is to say that it took a generation to change their brand perception in the US. The Koreans haven’t been building desirable cars for all that long.

I’d offer that the luxury brands helped complete the change in brand perception for the Japanese, but they went about it very differently than the Koreans are. From the consumer perspective, they were different brands. Your Acura didn’t say Honda on it anywhere the consumer usually saw or interacted with. They also had completely different dealer networks offering a different experience. Honda, Toyota and Nissan dealers in the US have never sold Acura, Lexus or Infinity cars.

We’ve bought cars from both Honda and Acura dealers. While we’ve never had a bad experience with a Honda dealer, we’ve also never had a great experience with one (even the day with showed up with two cars with the intention of trading in two cars and buying two cars at the same time, which we did). We’ve never had anything less than a great experience with an Acura dealer, and the difference starts as soon as walk on the lot. Nobody chases you down when you’re browsing the lot, you’re greeted by a nice person and offered a variety of drinks when you walk in the door, there is an effort to make you happy by making the process as quick and professional as possible and the starting point of negotiations was always in the ballpark. An Acura dealer seems to operate on the presumption that everyone who walks on the lot has the money to buy the car, and they treat folks accordingly.

Even the service experience was a bit different. There was no asking for a loaner car at the Acura dealer, it was a given they were going to give you one when you dropped of a car for service.

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat 06/16/2018 at 15:41

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As many are saying:

Dealers. Come to Murka, visit a Hyunkia dealer then a big 3 German dealer, report back.

Badge - most people like a pretty badge, and brand equity is worth a lot. I think Hyundai botched it with the Genesis plan, too. Many, myself included, thought it should have been a Genesis brand upon introduction in 2009, instead of Hyundai Genesis. Now it is Genesis, and people think “Hyundai” because of the prior association. D’oh.

Design and material quality - not always up to snuff, even if some mechanical bits are convincing.