Trying to understand pickups. Part 2

"Spanfeller is a twat" (theaspiringengineer)
06/09/2018 at 11:07 • Filed to: PULLING A WERTH

This morning I woke up to the Weekend Editor causing a flame war by saying pickup trucks are stupid.

A truck on Mexico City plates? what an oddity!

I thought she was right but then I posted !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! to oppo and I finally understood “it.”

It was explained quite well by RamblinRover:

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

It’s aspirational in a sense, and given what Americans consider is a good size caravan, it´s good that they have the equipment to haul their dreams.

While yes, a Transit Custom is both cheaper, and better in most measurable ways, in Europe and Mexico (supposedly) speed limits for people that are towing are lower. So the Transit would make sense in Mexico because we don’t drive doing 150km/h with a trailer many tons heavier than our vehicle behind us. It’s very much an American problem... which is why I did not understand “what if you need to tow a boat, in a canyon, with your family, with gear in the back, and also a dog doing 80mph in an uphill section.” but given how many times versions of that situation were commented I suspect it’s a real grievance among US motorists.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

But the best arguments for pickup trucks as dailys is that, “it” doesn’t matter. In the end what car purchase more expensive than a Camry is actually rational?

While trucks are a pain in the ass all around the world, in the wide and spacious domains of the United States of America why would it matter?

An average lane in Los Angeles is probably 1.5 times as wide as a Super Duty, and cars are being replaced by SUVs that have crash structures higher up so that they don’t become roadkill in an incident.

also trucks handle surprisingly well nowadays, I don’t want to admit it, but after seeing an escalade tearing up Muhuland drive, and driving a Suburban up the Sea to Sky in British Columbia, I cannot deny that dynamically those trucks are approaching tall car levels nowadays.Did I even mention that the fuel economy is not terrible?

In conclusion, I’ll never understand trucks unless I move to the United States or Canada. But in the meantime I guess I just don’t have the damming information to complain about them without being handed over 130+ responses saying “Who gives a shit, they fit here, I fit in them, and so does my shit”

So yeah...

DISCUSSION (100)

E90M3 > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 11:19

Kinja'd!!!

I don’t want a truck, but after having one as a work truck, I get it. You also can’t fly down an oilfield road at 70 MPH in a 1 series.

Spanfeller is a twat > E90M3
06/09/2018 at 11:23

I’ll double down and say it is exclusively an American problem.

But don’t worry, ya’ll seem to be infecting my fellow Mexicans in the north, so maybe I’ll get “it” one day.

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > E90M3
06/09/2018 at 11:28

Not with that attitude

Alfalfa > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 11:35

what if you need to tow a boat, in a canyon, with your family, with gear in the back, and also a dog doing 80mph in an uphill section.

I’m not sure why so many people have difficulty with this scenario. If you have a boat, you’re likely not going to want to go boating all by yourself. It’s often a social activity. Bodies of water that lend themselves to boating aren’t exactly 5 minutes out of town, so yeah, you’re gonna want some other gear. And in my state and surrounding Rockies states, the best boating spots are literally in the fucking mountains.

jimz > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 11:59

Body on frame, V8/RWD pickups are the big American cars we’ve long been used to.

and gas is too cheap for most people to care about their relative inefficiency.

Spanfeller is a twat > jimz
06/09/2018 at 12:04

I guess the Charger R/T is just too small nowadays

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:13

Oh those “editors” with no real world cred or knowledge. Best strategy is to not get involved.

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail
06/09/2018 at 12:15

I feel for her because she is a bit overworked and under supervised.

Shes like the black sheep of the Kinja family, even the new intern is getting more love

DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:21

I also found her complaints about tucks massively exaggerated. Living most of my life in Texas, I haven’t had parking spots ruined by trucks anymore than regular cars, and I don’t think parking spots are any bigger in Texas than any where else.

Plus even the efficiency is kind of exaggerated. I only got about 25mpg city in the Integra and the Volvo I have now, and I don’t drive crazy in town. A V6 truck can get pretty close to that. My first car was a V6 Ranger that got about 22 mpg city. Granted the Ranger is smaller than most trucks, but it also had the Vulcan motor which is an absolute turd for power and efficiency compared to modern V6 engines.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:38

Pickup trucks are stupid in the same way that sports cars are stupid. There is no practical reason to buy an F-150 when a Transit will carry just as much stuff and with better weather protection than any cover or camper top can provide. In fact, one could argue that since both an F-150 and a cargo Transit are equally excessive to the average private user, the real solution is actually the Transit Connect size class.

In the same way, no sports car can race on public roads for any practical purpose. They are both equally useless and we should all be driving Corolla hatchbacks.

The crappy lifted bro-dozer’s sports car equivalent is an 86 or Genesis Coupe slammed with 5 deg camber all around, rolled fenders and tires stretched 30mm past their intended rim size.

gogmorgo - rowing gears in a Grand Cherokee > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:47

I have a bit of a love-hate relationship with trucks. I do enjoy driving them, as has been said it’s largely about the ability to hit speed bumps at speed without caring and about being able to toss any old thing into the bed or hooking up a massive trailer and then dragging it further into the bush than any van is going to make it. I’ve hauled 15000lb trailers around in the mountains and there’s not much else out there if you have to do it. I’ve also hauled trailers around downtown Winnipeg and it’s stressful because of how much space you take up and how much room you need to manouever, just changing lanes takes planning, but you deal with the extra stress because you know there isn’t really another solution. But even driving a crew-cab long-bed 3/4 ton with no load is stressful. Turning circles are awful, you have blind spots big enough cars can hide in them so you have bigger mirrors which also can hide cars, it’s just something I wouldn’t want to have to do every day if I didn’t need to.

My first “car” was a ‘91 Jeep Comanche. I still own it many years later. With over 530,000km on it, it still feels more comfortable pulling a 5000lb trailer than I feel with the same weight behind the lightest-duty 2017 f150. I almost suspect that’s because Ford is trying to drive buyers towards getting a bigger truck than they need... But I’m really digressing from the point. I wouldn’t want to put up with anything bigger than a half-ton if I didn’t have to, but also my almost-30-year-old midsize truck is nearly as capable as some modern half-tons so I still don’t quite understand wanting anything bigger for personal use. But, if you do have the need for a big heavy truck, you kinda don’t have a choice.

Spanfeller is a twat > DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever
06/09/2018 at 12:48

why are you grey

sony1492 > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:49

Overly specific Rural/Farm applications:

If you buy a truckload of chicken shit for your garden you will want a truck. When you buy an (over)load of gravel to patch your roads you will want a truck. Hauling trash to the dump, Hauling compost, Hauling soil, hauling your atv into town to get repairs, When it rains and the roads all terrible because you havnt rocked it that season you’ll need 4x4, when you have to drive over some small fallen trees you’ll want ride height, buying gas to power your generators and equipment you’ll want a bed to keep the fumes away, throwing firewood into the bed from 3 angles and then hoseing the bed out later (not possible with a van), hauling oversized lumber, an easily accessible space to hold a grimy chainsaw.

Berang > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:54

Pickup trucks are stupid.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 12:58

She’s also like the third weekend staffer this year. We’ve got Bradley Brownell on Sundays. Anybody know what happened to Alex Hevesy/Lance Tedford?

Spanfeller is a twat > DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever
06/09/2018 at 13:01

Actually, I wouldn’t find it odd if parking spots are bigger in texas, parking spots are bigger in Monterrey than in Mexico City... it’s just how it is.

but yeah, her complaints are mostly mundane annoyances that would occur as often with wagons or SUVs

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:02

No pity here, these people know what they are getting into, and it can be argued many shouldn’t have the positions to begin with. Asking some of these “editors” about the industry is like asking my 7 year old niece about valve guides on the fintail.

Spanfeller is a twat > Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever
06/09/2018 at 13:05

I disagree.

A sports car like a Camaro RS is always a smaller car than a Silverado, and even with the same engine, the aerodynamic gains of the camaro (and the fact it’s lower and lighter) would make it more efficient even when it’s not being used to it’s full potential.

On the brodozers... fuck em

jimz > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:05

Not everyone wants a charger r/t

Spanfeller is a twat > Berang
06/09/2018 at 13:06

why do you say so?

You do live in the US, right? maybe you can bring me some insight so that I can be insufferable to pickup drivers once again!

Spanfeller is a twat > jimz
06/09/2018 at 13:07

In reality if you see the sales numbers of rear wheel drive american cars (the SS and the charger mostly) they don’t sell that well. I wonder what edge trucks have over those if it is truly missing big, v8 barges of old.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:10

One of my old friends moved to the US from East Germany. The first thing he did when he got here was to buy an F-150. He then put German and USA mini flags on the dashboard. I asked him why and he basically said this was the only place in the world were you can easily live with a pick up on a day to day basis and it had always been a dream of his to own a Ford Pick up. His previous car was an audi a4 quattro.

merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc > gogmorgo - rowing gears in a Grand Cherokee
06/09/2018 at 13:11

I’ll second the usefulness of the smaller, lighter duty trucks. I’ve had my 99 Dakota since early 2000s and have found it to be about the perfect size for most truck jobs.

The beds not too big, and hasn’t been too small either. I’ve even hauled a car trailer and car, which was not very fun, but it pulled it without too much drama. Plenty of grunt and size for most tasks. And not too big for daily use.

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail
06/09/2018 at 13:16

I mean, I do have pity for them.... sometimes experience takes time, and I’d hope Kinja was a place where journos could learn form more important people than them!

Spanfeller is a twat > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever
06/09/2018 at 13:18

well, I mean... the first thing half of oppo would do if they moved to europe would be buying a twingo... so I guess each car makes sense in each region.

Berang > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:21

The issue with pickups, as I see it, is mainly that they’re inflexible. There are things you can’t put in the pickup bed, and things you shouldn’t put in the bed, but which are fine in a car/wagon/van. The pickup is a niche vehicle, and has among the other a vehicles, very specific uses. About 99.9% of the time pickup beds are empty, because most of the things people need to carry, can’t be (or rather shouldn’t be) carried in a pickup.

Spanfeller is a twat > Alfalfa
06/09/2018 at 13:33

Well, what if you slow down? I’m sorry but a truck with a heavy load attached at 70-80mph is just not safe.. not for you, your family or your dog.

No one in my entire life has told me that their issues when towing/hauling were centered around speed. Ever. But that might be me living in Mexico.

Berang > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:39

You’re forgetting the bigger issues, that boating is inherently stupid and nobody should be doing so unless they’re getting paid to.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:42

Early 80’s Ford Escort or 90’s civic type R.

Spanfeller is a twat > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever
06/09/2018 at 13:43

Chavs already fucked those up.

In the same sense that good e30 325is are going away because of track day bros crashing them in their second outing.

Berang > DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever
06/09/2018 at 13:44

I live in Texas, and can say pickups are almost always parked stupidly as a rule.

Kinja'd!!!

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:49

I don’t think Kinja is the place where one gains the experience to become a legitimate automotive journalist. Those important people aren’t here. It’s a fun place for youngster hot takes.

E92M3 > fintail
06/09/2018 at 13:51

My guess is she lives in an apartment full of Ikea furniture. Or maybe they wanted to drive up FP traffic?

If you have a house, and can have ONLY one vehicle, nothing is more versatile than a truck. It’s the “swiss army knife” of motoring.

Alfalfa > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:51

80 mph is excessive, yes, but there are still all the other factors to consider. A big truck still makes it a LOT easier to do even 60-70 to keep up with traffic.

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail
06/09/2018 at 13:52

But some have

Chris Harris

Doug Demuro.

And Jeremy Clarkson used to have praise for Jalopnik (who knows if under PG’s leadership) ;it’s a promising site.

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:55

Who?

Chris Harris was born from Kinja? Nah, he wasn’t.

DeMuro is a quirky personality who appeals to kids on Youtube. He’s not the legitimate motoring press.

Clarkson was a part of the legitimate motoring press for a couple decades before Kinja was born. And to be fair, the Jalopnik of 5+ years ago isn’t the Jalopnik of today, and I don’t mean that in a good way.

fintail > E92M3
06/09/2018 at 13:57

Definitely clickbait. Hell, you’ll want a pickup or larger van for many Ikea pieces.

wafflesnfalafel > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:59

I loved my little Nissan - but I only paid 4 grand for it. Part of the problem with modern trucks, even a decent used one, is that they are so expensive I don’t feel comfortable using them, banging them up, throwing junk in the back, etc..

TheRealBicycleBuck > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 13:59

I can second the smell argument. My mom’s destroyed a car by loading a bunch of bags of manure into the trunk then leaving it for a couple of days. This wouldn’t have been an issue if she owned a truck. Come to think of it, she always had a truck nearby after that, whether it was mine or later, the small truck she bought as a second vehicle after I went to college.

Spanfeller is a twat > TheRealBicycleBuck
06/09/2018 at 14:05

Bigger question, why did she keep bags of manure in a car for days?

Spanfeller is a twat > fintail
06/09/2018 at 14:09

Maybe not born of Kinja, but both personalities used Kinja to grow.

Tastes and interests change over time, so does motoring journalism... I think my favourite motoring website is still Top Gear, but they seem to only talk about corporate car taxes nowadays.

DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 14:10

It’s a new burner, after deleting my cookies and history and all that, Kinja wouldn’t accept the passcode for my old burner, even though I’ve already done that twice with that account, so I had to make a new one.

FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 14:33

Former pickup owner. I am (well used to be before kids) a pretty frequent mountain bike rider. I can fit my bike in my crossover now and I can also use a hitch-mounted rack, but throwing it in the bed of the truck was so convenient. Especially when it was covered in mud or snow. I honestly think I rode more when I had the truck just because I could toss the bike in the bed and go whenever I felt like it. Sure the bed was empty most weekdays but at least once every weekend it was hailing a dirty bicycle to a park somewhere. I miss it.

fintail > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 14:34

But are they the legitimate motoring press? Especially with the second one, that’s a tenuous claim at best. And for Harris, he was also at Autocar and EVO, did Kinja really do more than expose an already established name?

Many people read the automotive press to learn, not as much for credibility-free hot takes and jokes. Sometimes it is apparent which writers have any background in the industry or engineering, not to mention journalism itself.

IdleInCA > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 15:27

It’s a western Canadian problem too. 80% of vehicles sold in Alberta are trucks. 90% of those trucks never carry more than a hockey bag and never leave pavement.

Mall parking stalls are sized for compact cars, so they spill over. Home garages are sized for compact cars, so they park on the street. Leaving my laneway, I cannot see in either direction, so I have to cross my fingers and inch forwards and hope if someone is coming, that they honk or stop.

So, yes, I would say they’re a plague.

Full-size pick-ups are popular in Alberta, Saskatchewan, and Manitoba. In Ontario, Quebec, and the Maritimes one sees mostly cars and CUVs. Most trucks one encounters are working vehicles.

In the BC interior one sees more Tacos than F150s, but mostly cars.

Future Heap Owner > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 16:00

Honestly I’m kinda disappointed. I thought you were really gonna bring it in part two, what with your comments about “if I said what I really thought about trucks they’d ban me.”

gogmorgo - rowing gears in a Grand Cherokee > merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc
06/09/2018 at 16:00

Yeah. I might like deeper gears than the 3.55's (got a set of axles with 4.10's waiting to go in) in the MJ as things did slow down a bit going up hills, but when I moved out here it was about 4000lbs on the hitch and a full load in the 7' bed, from Manitoba right up to the continental divide. No issues, including a panic stop from 50mph in Edmonton traffic.

I’m pretty into the long bed. I’ve had FSAE cars go for rides back there, chunks of a Taurus, an entire XJ power train still assembled, none of which would have happened in a short bed. It’s also a bit more stability for towing, with the small bump in wheelbase. But no crewcab. I’m not even big on extended cabs. Seems to me the extra space doesn’t really make up for the loss of visibility and increase in turning radius.

Kinja'd!!!

When work has you in places like this, you kinda don’t want the extra turning radius... that Dodge felt BIG. We may have made a couple walking paths in that campground a little wider that day...

Spanfeller is a twat > Future Heap Owner
06/09/2018 at 16:04

trucks are like priavte gun ownership; it only makes sense in niche cases outside the United States.

Since Im mexican, I cannot understand the urge of your contrymen and countrywoman to buy guns, trucks, boats, barbacue pits, or light beer. It must be part of living in America.

Spasoje > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 16:26

Counterpoint – trucks are terrible for carrying long items.

Had we bought a pickup instead of an SUV, we’d have had to rent a cargo van (or a trailer) for almost every Ikea or Home Depot run we’ve ever done... Folding rear seats (and a folding front passenger’s seat) beat a pickup truck every time, especially since it lets me carry a longer load in a 1m shorter vehicle.

Spasoje > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker
06/09/2018 at 16:27

They probably gave him the boot, since couldn’t decide what his real name was...

TheRealBicycleBuck > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 17:13

Good question. I was a little kid at the time, but it probably had something to do with her trying to do too many things in one day and needing help that I was too small to give. At the time she was a full-time college student and single mom. When she realized what she had done, we worked together to unload that car. Then she opened it up and left it for several days. I know she went after it with some cleaners, but that car never smelled the same again. I’m pretty sure she traded it in for her first truck.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 17:28

It’s not just about the engine. Consider towing:

Kinja'd!!!

Towing is as much about the suspension and brakes as it is about the engine.

Consider cargo:

Dodge Charger - 17 cu.ft. (with the rear seats down)
Dodge RAM - 90+ cu.ft. (with a tonneau , more with cab-height bed cap/topper and even more without a bed cover at all - and still with seating for four )

A truck’s cargo capacity is usually measured in pounds , not volume, so it can be difficult to compare.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 17:34

I still think they’re equally useless, but the pickups are more of a hazard on public roads where they block visibility and take up too much space (and gas).

TheRealBicycleBuck > Spasoje
06/09/2018 at 17:36

Counter-counterpoint - cars are terrible for carrying dirty items. My wife asked me to pick up some pine straw for the garden last weekend. I didn’t want to drag out the trailer, so I grabbed the Outback, folded down the seats, and went to the store. Four bales later, the entire back of the Outback was filled with straw. Even with super-duty carpet protectors, it took an hour of cleaning to get the pine straw out of all the nooks and crannies. I should have taken the extra time to get the trailer.

Spanfeller is a twat > TheRealBicycleBuck
06/09/2018 at 17:45

Well, because the charger wasn’t made to tow. in a sense we’ve gotten so used to the idea of buying a truck to tow that sedans aren’t equipped to handle towing anymore!

The f150 and the transit connect (V6 NA, i4 TDI) have around the same torque, and the van can tow a bit more. However, the F150 has a lot more power, which I suspect is what makes highway pulls easier.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 18:00

There’s a trade-off between power, performance, cargo and towing capability. A “performance” sedan might have the power to tow, but the suspension is tuned for handling, not cargo. That’s why the Scat Pack, 392 and Hellcat aren’t rated for towing at all. A standard sedan’s suspension is tuned for passenger comfort, not towing. That’s why the towing ratings are only 1,000 lbs.

Keep in mind that when it comes to towing, our rating system in the U.S. is different than in the rest of the world. Allowable tongue weight here is much higher, placing a greater portion of the weight on the tow vehicle. This makes it much easier and safer to tow at higher speeds, but it means that the tow vehicle has to have a more robust suspension to carry the weight.

In contrast, European tow ratings are based on a much lower tongue weight. This means the tow vehicle carries much less of the load and allows for much greater trailer weights. The trade-off is a much lower maximum towing speed because it’s much easier for the trailer to start oscillating. HammerHeadFistPunch put together an excellent article about it. https://oppositelock.kinja.com/tow-me-down-1609112611 . There’s also a great video that demonstrates the idea.

Future Heap Owner > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 18:02

Yeah, me neither really, except for the light beer. It’s really nice to relax in the sun with a cold carbonated drink, and all the other ones I’ve tried are too sweet for me.

It did take me many years to come around on that one, though.

Spanfeller is a twat > TheRealBicycleBuck
06/09/2018 at 18:05

Well, in Spain it’s illegal to go faster than 60 if you’re towing, so I guess their laws account for their system.

Future Heap Owner > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 18:09

You must understand how deeply individualism is rooted in American culture. We want to believe that we could do anything by ourselves without needing anyone’s help. This manifests in many ways, and one of them is a tendency to buy things like guns and trucks so one can tell oneself that one could pack it all up and head to the woods and hole up and live entirely alone.

Spasoje > TheRealBicycleBuck
06/09/2018 at 18:30

Totally agreed. We carried some cacti home once, and the soil/pebbles spilled a bit during the drive home...all that tangled itself into the fibers of the cargo floor nicely. Years later, and I still can’t get it out!

Spanfeller is a twat > Future Heap Owner
06/09/2018 at 18:42

I sort of understand the individualist urge (everyone is a bit like that) but I think it’s manifested differently in different countries.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 18:53

Yes! Exactly!

BigBlock440 > Spasoje
06/09/2018 at 20:23

How so? You’ve got a nearly unlimited length you can haul.

Kinja'd!!!

BigBlock440 > Berang
06/09/2018 at 20:25

There are things you can’t put in the pickup bed, and things you shouldn’t put in the bed, but which are fine in a car/wagon/van.

Like what?

Berang > BigBlock440
06/09/2018 at 20:37

Well, people for one.

BigBlock440 > Berang
06/09/2018 at 21:20

How many more people do you want to bring? Also, my truck seats more people than any of my cars do (6 vs 5).

Spanfeller is a twat > Future Heap Owner
06/09/2018 at 21:24

Kinja'd!!!

Today at the G7 summit

Future Heap Owner > Spanfeller is a twat
06/09/2018 at 23:14

Hahaha, that is perfect

Spasoje > BigBlock440
06/09/2018 at 23:50

That’s exactly the problem, though: a pickup requires you to add to the length of the vehicle in order to carry long items. An SUV/van will fit the same long items within the existing footprint:

Kinja'd!!!

(the utility rack is equal to an SUV’s roof rack, so those two cancel out)

MrDakka > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 01:00

Its how they get you.

First you get a barbeque grill thinking, ‘hey now I can grill stuff when my friends and family are over’. Then either a friend or family member will mention that your kegger/party/family gathering would be so much cooler if it happened at a nearby park where there’s more room to do stuff. Then it’ll be at a lake/beach. Then you’ll buy a boat because hey a boat is fun on the water.

Next thing you know, you’ve bought a truck to haul your boat and the rest of your stuff. Now that you have so much stuff, you’re worried Canadian beavers will sneak across the border and steal your stuff on their way to drink tree blood, so you buy a gun to keep those varmints away from your stuff.

Not sure about the light beer, because to me all beer tastes like pisswater and isn’t fit for drinking.

Spanfeller is a twat > MrDakka
06/10/2018 at 01:03

Sounds like a pretty grim representation of the American Dream. I’m sure Margaret Atwood will turn it into a dystopian novel, call it “the beaver’s tale”

Ash78, voting early and often > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 01:08

Simple: a city might have a playground, a barbecue grill, and a lake, but YOU can have a playground, a grill, and a swimming pool in your yard and be BETTER than the park.

Then you never have to speak to anyone again. Including your wife, who is divorcing you over spending all the family’s money.

Then you’re 50 and single, so you move to Florida and become a news story.

Spanfeller is a twat > Ash78, voting early and often
06/10/2018 at 01:13

Truly combating nature with bleach to keep the pool clean

SHARPSPEED > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 01:36

The way I see trucks is that unless you have a very “utilitarian” job, they really aren’t something you’ll need. Expect for the one time you do, which by god you’ll be happy you have it.

His Stigness > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 02:38

Abe’s face is probably the best in that picture:

“I’m so tired having to deal with the petulant little man child. What the fuck did *I* do to deserve this?!?”

And Merkel’s face is pretty good: “Are you fucking serious???”

duurtlang > Alfalfa
06/10/2018 at 03:28

It’s not about being able to keep up with traffic. The issue is stopping, safely and quickly.

duurtlang > TheRealBicycleBuck
06/10/2018 at 03:34

European here. The superior alternative is to have a (rented?) trailer in which you can load the manure. A trailer you can tow with almost any car. You don’t have to own a clumsy pickup truck for jobs like those.

duurtlang > Berang
06/10/2018 at 03:44

Exactly! I get vans, but open bed trucks? Sure, as a niche vehicle for a landscaper or farmer or similar, but why anyone would want one as a private non-work vehicle is beyond me.

Frequent towing not-huge loads: car. Dirty loads: car plus trailer. Big loads: van. Bigger loads: van plus trailer.

I’m 35 years old and I don’t think there has ever been a point in my life where I needed a pickup truck. Ever. I have rented Sprinters and the like though. Also, I’m not American.

duurtlang > sony1492
06/10/2018 at 03:48

Not being a farmer or rural, all I can say is that most of those things can be done with a trailer towed by almost every car. Which will save you a lot of money, plus you’ll be able to drive a much better driving vehicle.

sony1492 > duurtlang
06/10/2018 at 04:14

Camry won’t tow a cord of wood easily, won’t drive up a dirt road that has a grade (with a trailer), won’t haul any meaningful amount of gravel(same can be said for soil), will be a bitch to park(because trailer), would be impractical to haul trailer to town for the sole purpose of picking up gas on a weekly basis(and or propane), is fwd so will damage the road more(also may not make it if its too muddy), will bottom out on dirt road if your not careful(oil pan, splash shield, fuel lines).

duurtlang > sony1492
06/10/2018 at 05:55

From a rural/farm application, you’re absolutely right. It’s quite different for those that live in suburbs though.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > MrDakka
06/10/2018 at 06:58

Then these outings happen only once a year, at most. The drivetrain on the boat is damaged every time you go out, too.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > duurtlang
06/10/2018 at 07:02

In the US the solution is to have someone in your extended family or a good friend with a truck. Owning one is stupid because people will expect you to help them haul things or borrow your truck. This is probably what originally spawned brodozers, which parody purpose built off-road trucks: take 1 gas guzzling truck, lift it until the truck aspect is impractical to utilize, install huge tires that make it guzzle more gas, and always keep it clean/shiny so nobody will feel comfortable asking if you can help them move a washer with it... Congratulations, you just converted a fairly impractical truck into a completely senseless car that looks sort of like a truck but has none of the utility.

Also, keeping a utility trailer around is hard for many of us (I have absolutely nowhere to store one), so those can be like trucks, except nobody has cars with hitches here. As a result, those that are more enlightened rent them from U-haul.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > Alfalfa
06/10/2018 at 07:11

This is why GM invented the Suburban.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever
06/10/2018 at 07:21

Parking lots are bigger in Texas, even in the major cities. I dare you to drive around congested areas of a major coastal city like San Francisco, Seattle, Boston, NYC, or even the area west of downtown Los Angeles. Even bigger SUVs are impractical in these places. It’s why cute compact and subcompact CUVs/SUVs are so popular in these areas.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > E92M3
06/10/2018 at 07:24

IKEA furniture is designed/packaged so you can take it home in a hatchback or carry it home on public transit. Dead serious here.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > fintail
06/10/2018 at 07:29

All the commercial kinja blogs are angsty, completely disconnected with reality, echo chambers of hand-wringing butt-hurt. They’re completely insufferable. It’s like a tabloid, only the bar to getting printed doesn’t exist and the business pushing them to produce any content on a sinking ship is high.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 08:09

I own quite a few guns. They’re also quite impractical on the coasts and more of an unusual hobby than they are in places like Texas, the south, or almost every land-locked state. I spent less than a third of my life in the area where owning them is fairly practical (and even less of my adult life), but I purchased all of them when I lived there because they were actively useless in CA (in fact, I left most of them with friends because they were illegal, impractical, and/or I didn’t want to deal with the paperwork...to the point that I’ve never fired a gun within the borders of CA ever, unlike many other states) and I don’t have the time to do it much where I live now (plus it is an expensive hobby). Surprisingly, the most practical place I’ve lived with them was Bainbridge Island (which is a radically left-wing place) since I was just around the corner from a shooting club and a fairly short drive from numerous safe spots off island, followed closely by a tiny rural town in WY, then if I was into hunting birds (which I’m definitely not) I live very close to a place to do that now (but slightly further away than the shooting club was). I now live a longer drive from an established range than I ever have in my life, too...

Trucks are sort of like that, except you can suffer through their impracticality just about anywhere cars are accepted because nobody has yet decided to put draconian laws in against them. It wouldn’t surprise me to see somewhere like CA implementing a tax scheme that makes them prohibitively expensive to own, though.

TheRealBicycleBuck > duurtlang
06/10/2018 at 08:24

Here in the U.S. the towi ng regulations are quite different than in Europe and as a result, most passenger sedans don’t even have a hitch. There’s also the need to go down to the shop, waste at least half a n hour renting the trailer, do the work, then clean the trailer, then waste yet another half an hour returning the trailer. Just last weekend I needed to pick up some pine straw from the gardening center. I thought it would be easier to take the Outback than to install the hitch, hook up to my own trailer and drag it out of the side yard. (It’s not easily accessible). I was wrong. It took me longer to clean up the car after getting pine straw everywhere.

Ash78, voting early and often > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 09:12

Pools, boats, and pickup trucks: it’s always better to be FRIENDS with the guy who has them than it is to BE the guy who has them.

Spanfeller is a twat > His Stigness
06/10/2018 at 09:29

Abe is just smug he has Kei cars

PyramidHat > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 10:33

There’s a documentary about the very issue with speed and hauling (and beer). It’s about two guys that had to get 400 cases of Coors from Texarkana, TX to Atlanta, GA.

Maxima Speed > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 10:47

Come visit Southern Ohio and spend a week with me, on the edge of Appalachia .We’ll turn you into an American right quick.

His Stigness > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 11:38

That doesn’t look like a smug face.

Spanfeller is a twat > His Stigness
06/10/2018 at 11:43

You’re right.

I don’t know who’s side Abe is on. He has seen to be pretty cuddled up with Trump, specially as the North Korean summit comes up. Right now the world is a bit divided in that sense.

Alfalfa > duurtlang
06/10/2018 at 11:49

I’ve seen them stop quickly pretty effectively. I’ve also driven by a LOT of holiday weekend accidents, and the ones I see rarely involve a trailer.

fintail > Eric @ opposite-lock.com
06/10/2018 at 12:19

They seem to be places for likely parentally funded new grads who live in NYC or LA to vent their feelings - Jalopnik is often that. Not that something interesting doesn’t show up now and then, but a lot of it is shameless clickbait.

That being said, Splinter also amuses me for a weird combination of echo chamber, and daring to point out recent corruption that legitimate media sources won’t dare touch.

JCAlan > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 14:38

I should know that a troll article like that would bring out the worst in people, but I did not expect the level of vitriol I experienced when I took 20 seconds to formulate a half-hearted defense of truck ownership. I did not realize that was out there, I honestly have never heard anyone complain about trucks (other than bro trucks rolling coal).

His Stigness > Spanfeller is a twat
06/10/2018 at 14:40

Although I no longer follow the news like I once did when I was in college, I would bet he’s just kissing his ass, because that’s the only way you get things from him. But from the reporting I’ve been listening to, he’s very worried that the dumb fuck won’t get any concessions on medium-range missiles, and instead just focus on long-range missiles because he probably doesn’t even know how close Japan is to Korea.

bubblestheturtle > Ash78, voting early and often
06/10/2018 at 15:30

This is my retirement plan.