Oppo Poll – Trade E30 325i for E46 ZHP?

"ZHP Sparky, the 5th" (e30s2k) 04/24/2018 at 18:18 • Filed to: None

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Oppo, I have an E30 that has been my baby for the last 10 years. We’ve been through a lot, fought many gremlins, and she’s been very reliable for the last few years. 285k miles on the chassis and as solid as she’s ever been (newer engine put in a few years ago). Also has some light popular upgrades (suspension, various “is” bits etc.) to keep it at a stock+ level.

But we have an actual baby on the way (like a human one!) and the E30 rarely gets driven. Pregnant wife understandably doesn’t feel comfortable going anywhere in it, and no way we’re ever getting an infant seat in it. Here’s my (current) baby –

Meanwhile, browsing local CL I noticed an ad for a E46 ZHP, with the owner willing to take other BMWs as a trade. High mileage at almost 190k, but is the owner’s DD so presumably maintenance and reliability has been a priority for him. Pictures on the ad look a little unclean, but doesn’t seem like much that a nice deep clean and a wax job won’t cure for the most part, I’m not going to shit on a working man not being able to keep his DD waxed 24/7. I’m weary of E46 maintenance issues (vanos, cooling system, control arm bushings, etc.) – any input on how much more expensive/difficult to repair these things are?

Not actual car, one in question is actually Mystic Blue (which is apparently a pretty rare color?)

If he ends up finding my E30 agreeable, and seems to have decent records on the E46 and kept up with maintenance etc. , here’s the subjective bit – would you consider a trade?

Especially with a baby on the way (rear doors, better safety systems, etc.) it’s appealing to me – just because it’s a car that will actually get used in my household, instead of the current state of my E30 where it only comes out for cars & coffee a few times a year and a solo grocery store run every now and then. I’m perfectly fine with my track day and weekends of canyon carving being behind me, having more important responsibilities to take care of. So in my shoes would you give up the infrequent old school pleasures of an E30 for the more consistent modern amenities of a ZHP?

Also any specifics on E46/ZHP issues to watch out for are thoroughly appreciated.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 18:33

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Party-vi is the man to ask on this one!

gettingoldercarguy > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 18:33

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Ppi or walk.

CompactLuxuryFan > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 18:35

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I don’t think an E46 is particularly gonna cut it as far as safety nowadays (especially with half of drivers rolling around in SUVs looking down at their Twitter feed). To me, getting this leaves you in pretty much the same place except for the additional doors. That said, E46 ZHPs are sooo nice. Why don’t you post the ad and let me take this option off the table for you? :P

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 04/24/2018 at 18:36

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I thought I saw something about him buying or selling an E46 recently...hopefully he sees this post.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > gettingoldercarguy 04/24/2018 at 18:39

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Does not doing a PPI on my vehicle mean I shouldn’t do a PPI on his? Do non-PPIs cancel each other out?

I guess the potential shit stains from a missed E46 PPI are worse than those on my simple old E30, so I’m likely on the riskier end of the deal even though my car has higher mileage.

gettingoldercarguy > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 18:43

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It’s really up to each party to ask for that and to determine if they want to pursue the sale of the other party declines.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 18:46

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My limited understanding from the outside was: he loved it when nothing was broken, but things were often broken.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > CompactLuxuryFan 04/24/2018 at 18:47

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Hey bro, I put a generic ZHP photo and didn’t link the ad for a reason haha! JK here you go, I call first dibs. I’ve always liked them too - know much about maintenance/reliability issues?  

This will never be a daily driver/family car/road trip vehicle. Wife has a subie for that. This will purely still be a weekend car for local trips, but one where if I go “hey let’s go to the beach and take the BMW!” it won’t result in eye rolls and accusations of it being a secret attempt to kill off my family.

arl > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 18:50

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Go buy a lightly used, newer minivan and keep the Bimmer for weekends. Seriously.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > gettingoldercarguy 04/24/2018 at 18:53

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Yeah, it’s the sensible thing to do. Just don’t want it to devolve in to a “well if you are getting one, i’m getting one too!” and it turning in to fight over whose car has more issues.

But I guess in all honesty that’s exactly what is needed. And while the E30 does run well I guess part of me is a bit worried about discovering some currently unknown issues through that as well.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > arl 04/24/2018 at 18:55

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Never a minivan! We already have a family vehicle, so don’t really need to go to such extremes.

Either car will always be a weekend vehicle. Just that we like doing things together, and the E30 is only less likely to get used for weekend activities with a baby on board. Whereas the E46 at least has a chance of getting used (although with a higher potential for maintenance headaches, I guess).

HondoyotaE38: A Japanese and German Collab...wait a minute > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 19:06

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That E30 is worth at least an E46 M3

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HondoyotaE38: A Japanese and German Collab...wait a minute 04/24/2018 at 19:19

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That’s very kind of you to say and I’d like to think so too, but not really. If it was meticulous, all original, and low miles with service history going back to day 1, maybe. But this thing is nearing 300k miles and is a hodgepodge of random used parts. It’s a solid car and my true goal really is to step up to an E46 M3 as the “toy car”, but that will involve at least $5k cash on top on my end, and that’s something I can’t justify right now or for the foreseeable future.

ZHP feels like a safe bet to me as far as retaining value as it does have a bit of a following – especially if I manage to clean it up visually a bit over time. But the maintenance cost is really the unknown for me right now.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 04/24/2018 at 19:21

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Yeah that’s what worries me. My E30 doesn’t get driven enough at this point. Selling it outright and shopping for a replacement fun car will take a lot of legwork. So the idea of doing a straight trade is appealing...just don’t want to end up with a maintenance nightmare I didn’t prepare for though.

M.T. Blake > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 19:23

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You have a kid on the way. Four doors is a must. I do it just fine with a G35 sedan and TWO car seats. You’ll be getting rid of the e30 soon unless you can afford/store/justify keeping it has a third vehicle.

CompactLuxuryFan > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 19:29

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Hmm that ad leaves me pretty cold. Those blacked out headlights look awful, and there’s something up with that lower grille. Most importantly, the tone of the ad is just... bizarre. Especially the “I am not really interested in selling but would be firm at asking if your serious” bit.

I would not go for a trade in this particular scenario.

As far as E46s, I’ve only owned one briefly but my perception is that you have to replace a lot of major parts ever 100K or so. Seeing as this is approaching 200K, it’s either already had a lot of recent work is about to need it (again).

I say keep your own baby and enjoy it whenever you can! Taking two cars to the beach is legal!

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > M.T. Blake 04/24/2018 at 19:30

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That’s exactly where I’m at. It currently is a third vehicle that doesn’t get much real use. It’s silly for me to hold on to it. If I’m paying for the luxury of having a third fun weekend vehicle, I need to at least make it one that we’ll use as a family.

Selling the E30 and separately going through the process of buying something else sounds like a lot of legwork - so the prospect of a straight trade is appealing. And I’d be happy with a ZHP, it’s a car I’ve always been curious about. Just don’t want to sign up for significantly higher maintenance costs is the main thing.

The G35 is a great car...I eye those as well. If someone locally wanted to do a straight trade of a 6MT G35 sedan for an E30 I’d certainly consider it. Maybe I need to put my E30 up for trade to see what responses I get...

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > CompactLuxuryFan 04/24/2018 at 19:36

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Yeah I was skeptical about those same bits - waiting for more pictures and details from the owner. I loved the “drift slut” comment too, just a little bit below “I know what I’ve got!”.

In good faith I bulleted out literally all the info I have on my car and emailed the owner along with a bunch of photos. I’ll see what he responds with. If it’s a bunch of one liners with no real detail I’m walking. If he opens up with specifics on the car, details on work that’s been done etc. I’ll continue to listen and take it one step at a time.

What I’m learning though is maybe I should put a feeler out for trades. I don’t have the time to go through two different buy/sell transactions...but if the right trade comes along, it could be a lot simpler. Maybe this just isn’t the right trade.

M.T. Blake > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 19:40

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You’d probably get more for your money if you sold and bought exactly what you want. If you don’t enjoy the hunt, trade is a great way to go or if it’s just what you want.

Mines a 6MT. 2006 with the rev up. It enjoys drinking copious amounts of oil. A sedan with a manual trans is fine with kids. Most people will steer you towards an automatic. I have no issues with a manual and kids. I just don’t turn around every moment to cater to them!

kanadanmajava1 > M.T. Blake 04/24/2018 at 20:17

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How are modern time babies so much harder to handle than the earlier ones? I was 15 and my brother 12 years old when my parents got their first 4 door car.

CompactLuxuryFan > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 20:19

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Sounds like time is exactly what you do have, considering you rarely even use this car, much less need it. Trades make the whole thing much more complicated because the two moving sides have to latch together precisely (capsule docking at ISS?) instead of two moving objects separately latching to two hooks that are standing still (car <-> money, car <-> money). Much like how dealers taking a trade will “give you a better deal” because they’re screwing you on the trade-in.

Since you seem to be into BMWs and have a BMW CCA badge on the kidney, my best suggestion would be to stop looking at Craigslist and start looking at the ads in the back of Roundel magazine or at bmwcca.org.

M.T. Blake > kanadanmajava1 04/24/2018 at 20:23

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And none of us were in car seats. I remember sitting on the front seat with no seat belt and only seeing sky the entire drive.

Spanfeller is a twat > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 20:37

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What are the other two cars?

E92M3 > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/24/2018 at 21:00

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Tough one. Both have a cult following, but both have high mileage.

jonny11quest > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/25/2018 at 11:53

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Keep the E30, seriously. It’s an awesome third car that you’ve had for a long time. Keep it forever and teach future kiddo how to drive stick on it. Even future beach trips you’ll be thinking safety for kiddos. That third car will be your escape. Something that is no-compromise yours and not for anyone else.

Edit: Or sell me the E30

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > jonny11quest 04/25/2018 at 13:17

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That’s not a bad option (and the default solution at this point which will happen if I continue to sit on my ass)…but it just feels a bit selfish and silly having a car that rarely gets driven eating up half our garage space.

It’s no money lost holding on to it, so I’ll continue to do that most likely – but just getting a bit of an itch for a car I can have fun with while enjoying family time at the same time.

If you’re in the PNW (Portland here) and don’t mind a high mileage E30 that isn’t perfect but plenty of records and runs reliably you might just be in luck given my above mentioned itch :)

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > E92M3 04/25/2018 at 13:27

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Yup...which kind of feels like the equalizer here to make it a reasonable swap. But not sure I’m ready for the maintenance on a ZHP, especially if it turns out to not have much records on preventative work performed.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Spanfeller is a twat 04/25/2018 at 13:30

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Subaru Crosstrek (wife’s commuter and family car) and a Spark EV (my commuter). Spark lease is up in about 1 year, so another alternative is to take my time til then cleaning up the E30, get them both out and find something else to do dual commuter/fun car duty for me.

Will also likely sell the Crosstrek at some point for something slightly bigger, but that will always be based on reliability/safety/resale value, so won’t ever be anything to exciting (and auto).

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > CompactLuxuryFan 04/25/2018 at 13:34

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Man you and your logic! Yeah that’s definitely the logical thing to do - was just hoping for a quick and easy swap...which I guess isn’t that easy/smart in real life.

Good call on Roundel...I do browse those classifieds every now and then when I’m flipping through the magazine but always forget its there, maybe I need to get more serious about it.

Spanfeller is a twat > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/25/2018 at 14:22

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I mean, the Crosstrek is ample... You could sell your E30/return the EV and get started on a 330e or a car of that nature

E92M3 > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/25/2018 at 17:36

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It’s not that much different than a regular E46 330i, as far as maintenance. I haven’t driven an E30 but I imagine the E46 offers a more comfortable driving experience. Maybe stick with the car you already know the history on.

jonny11quest > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/25/2018 at 17:58

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Haha fair enough. I think we all get “itches”. I’m pretty far from the PNW, but the car really is a knockout. I love the stock+ mentality and don’t think I’d change a thing. On the bright side, choosing between your e30 and an e46 zhp, there’s really no wrong answer.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > E92M3 04/25/2018 at 18:20

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I’ve read the ZHPs are more prone to VANOS problems, probably given that it’s a little higher strung than a standard 330i?

But yeah that’s precisely what I’ve learnt from forums about these two cars – E46 is more civilized and nicer to live with on a daily basis, at a higher risk of electronics etc. breaking. The E30 is a more pure driving experience and simpler/cheaper to maintain. So right now my main decision is do I go for the car that is more usable to me (E46) or the one that is a lower risk (E30, given that I know the car and the quirks).

E92M3 > ZHP Sparky, the 5th 04/25/2018 at 19:57

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Well as a Dad, I can tell you all of my vehicles have their specific purpose. 95% of the time I’m driving the DD because of kid stuff (and I only have 1 child). I should probably sell 2 and get a better DD, considering that’s where I spend the majority of my time.

Though it is nice having one vehicle that you don’t worry about spills or door dings. If I got something too nice, I would be anal about it too.