"Woa, a 964 RS America!"

"dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford" (dtg11) 03/14/2018 at 16:30 • Filed to: None

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[UPDATE: It’s a tribute, not the real thing. Still cool, but not as] A rare (701 made) track version of the 964 in its last years of production but...

oh no, it’s retarded!

I’m no manual elitist, but in a lightened sports car designed for track use, a 4-speed automatic seems like a hindrance.

Have another rare automatic Porsche as consolation:

E90M3 > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 16:31

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I bet the auto has a pretty large affect on the value.

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 16:31

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which dealer is this

Powershiftmedia-ResidentDSMGuru > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 16:36

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I literally just cried. Moment of silence for what could have been.

CB > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 16:40

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Meh. I’d still drive it.

WilliamsSW > Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero 03/14/2018 at 16:43

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https://isringhausen.porschedealer.com/

Looks like Isringhausen based on the plate tags- not Chicago

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > WilliamsSW 03/14/2018 at 16:52

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i never would have guessed springfield had a porsche dealer. i cant wait to check out the orland park porsche dealer once their new building is finished

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 17:00

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MUH TIPTRONIC®

WilliamsSW > Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero 03/14/2018 at 17:02

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They’re building a new building right now, too? I’m 5 minutes from Napleton Porsche, they’re operating out of their used car lot a block down Ogden while they build a new building, too!

Must be a good time to be a Porsche dealer...

RallyWrench > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 17:03

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It must have been swapped or very very special ordered as such, because RS-As were never built with automatics. They only had four options: an LSD, a stereo, AC, and sunroof. Truthfully they’re not that special, just a semi-stripped C2. The Euro 964 RS is a different story.

DaftRyosuke - So Long and Thanks for All the Fish! > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 17:10

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Someone in Bham has one, a proper one with a manual.

He drives a Giulia for a daily too.

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > WilliamsSW 03/14/2018 at 17:12

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yeah theyre getting a new huge building next to the black sheep bar and grill along 159th

wafflesnfalafel > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 17:20

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automatic (?!) (Maybe ordered for somebody with a disability who still wanted to blast around a track occasionally?)

WilliamsSW > Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero 03/14/2018 at 17:22

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Yeah, I think the one in Westmont will be huge, too. Dealers complain, but in the last two years, Ogden (between Downers and Hinsdale) has gotten a new Tesla store, huge new Ford store, and Ogden Lincoln says they’re getting a new building too (good cuz their current one is a dump).

And a few others aren’t that old either - we must have the biggest Aston Martin dealership on the planet.

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > WilliamsSW 03/14/2018 at 17:27

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yeah and across the street from where rizza porsche is moving theres another new dealership building going in but i forgot who its for, i think maybe bettenhousen but i feel like they just built their new dealership not long ago

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 17:29

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Beat me to it. Heck, that might make this RSAm more valuable than the rest?

Thomas Donohue > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 17:57

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Yeah, I’ve never hear of a Tipronic RSA. Could be a knockoff C2, with RS door panels and badges. One tip-off would be if it has power steering.

If I recall, the RS without any of the options was $10k less than the C2....pretty much the opposite of how Porsche now prices the ‘less is more’ limited editions.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero 03/14/2018 at 18:04

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yeah, it’s actually fairly nice. We had 8 918's and have had a slew of GT3 RS’s, including 6 4.0's and 3 911R’s.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 18:06

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I’m fairly certain it is legit, one of my friends who works there believes it to be and he’s a very trustworthy source (and the reason why I’ve seen 6 918's)

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > E90M3 03/14/2018 at 18:07

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according to tfritsch, the RS was pretty much manual only and this had to have been either a replica or a one-off. Either would have massive effects on the value.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > CB 03/14/2018 at 18:08

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same, it just seems liked a missed opportunity.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > wafflesnfalafel 03/14/2018 at 18:08

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that is very possible, and for that it’s be fairly good.

interstate366, now In The Industry > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 18:09

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Tiptragic

RallyWrench > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 18:21

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I’m really curious. By boss has one, it’s a permanent resident in the shop. Can you find out if they’ve got the Porsche certificate of authenticity for it? Used to be called a Kardex.

RallyWrench > Thomas Donohue 03/14/2018 at 18:25

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It has the right seats, wheels, and trim, at least. My boss here has a white RSA, fun car but not as special as the current price tags would indicate. You’re right, they were cheaper than the base Carrera of the day. Porsche was nearly bankrupt, the RSA was more a trim package to generate interest than anything else.

RallyWrench > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 03/14/2018 at 18:28

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I hope not! Those automatics ruin the 911. Slow to respond to the Tip buttons, and only a 4 speed. If this is a real RSA, that automatic combined with the lack of power steering would make a fairly pointless car.

AuthiCooper1300 > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 18:43

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!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Exactly. Comparing a 964 Carrera RS with an RS America is a very good example of the difference between special and rare.

No disrespect intended for the RS America, a very nice car indeed (although I personally disliked the fact that it had a rear wing)

Thomas Donohue > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 18:45

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Here’s some info on what option codes should be on the ID sticker under the front hood. VIN ranges are slightly above the option codes.

http://rsamerica.net/faqs/index.htm#4

In brief, for all RS America s the first 8 digits of the Vin number the same, these are WPOAB296 , then there is the check digit (see below), then PS for ‘93 or RS for ‘94, followed in all cases by 41 [NOTE: the thirteenth digit is a “ 1” ONLY if the car is an RS America ] followed by the four digit serial number, the ranges for which and details of how to read an RSA Vin# are below.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 18:45

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I’ll have to see, I’m not in town and my friend isn’t a very good responder to text. But I would be curious too...

AuthiCooper1300 > Thomas Donohue 03/14/2018 at 18:46

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I understand that by “RS” you mean in fact the RS America?

The 964 Carrrera RS was quite more expensive indeed than the standard Carrera 2.

Thomas Donohue > AuthiCooper1300 03/14/2018 at 18:57

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Sorry, I was referring to the RS America/RSA version.

AuthiCooper1300 > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 18:59

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At some stage Porsche must have been really worried about the Tiptronic sporting credentials (or lack thereof) so for a Christophorus feature they put Röhrl in an Cup car fitted with that gearbox - allegedly in order to “find out” if it was really that much slower on a racetrack than the manual.

I cannot remember right now whether he actually entered a Cup race with that car. Maybe he just did some practice laps with the rest of the competitors.

AuthiCooper1300 > Thomas Donohue 03/14/2018 at 19:01

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‘Tis OK, no sweat. Otherwise it would have been a very strange statement!

RallyWrench > AuthiCooper1300 03/14/2018 at 19:08

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I think I’ve heard some version of that story, I wonder how Walter felt about it! The autos of this era are sluggish 4-speeds, they’re not quick to respond to the shift buttons, so I have to imagine there was some loss of performance. Look at the gearing differences between them!

Manual:

Auto:

AuthiCooper1300 > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 19:25

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I’ll post the article here if I ever manage to find it!

Michael Caine once told an interviewer that an acquaintance had asked him why in the 70s and the 80s he had acted in so much dross.

Caine answered that he did not remember much of those films nowadays, but his villa in the south of France [or something like that] still looked magnificent.

That’s how Walter must feel today.

RallyWrench > AuthiCooper1300 03/14/2018 at 19:36

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I’ve spent a fair amount of time behind the wheel of my boss’ RSA, and put a limited slip in it, as it didn’t receive that option from the factory. It’s fun, certainly, but it just feels like a 964 C2 with hard steering and better seats. The RSA was more a model run-out trim package to generate traffic as Porsche faced bankruptcy before the 993 came out. The Euro models are properly special. There’s a reason our “RS” is valued at 100k or so (and overpriced, at that) and the Euro RS is now four times that.

For what it’s worth, I rather like the wing on the RSA, it’s a unique piece, a little lower profile than the proper whale tail, more like the RSR wings of the mid 70's. Not exactly understated though...

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 20:00

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it’s a tribute, not the real thing

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > Thomas Donohue 03/14/2018 at 20:00

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it’s a tribute, not the real thing

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > E90M3 03/14/2018 at 20:01

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it’s a tribute, not the real thing

RallyWrench > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 20:04

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Aha! Thanks for following up, that had me going. I guess RSA in this case is Really Sweet Automatic. Somebody spent some coin making it look right!

E90M3 > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 20:07

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That makes it slightly ok. Still don’t understand why you’d start with an auto car.

RallyWrench > AuthiCooper1300 03/14/2018 at 20:08

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Please do! I’ve read an interview with him (Walter) that says much the same. He keeps a slightly older 911 as I recall, but expressed no real sentimentality for the past. I think there was one of his racing cars he’d like to track down, but I’ll have to see if I can find that article now. We’ve got our homework cut out.

dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford > E90M3 03/14/2018 at 20:09

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inability or unwillingness to learn, severe price discount, or even a disability would all make sense

E90M3 > dtg11 - is probably on an adventure with Clifford 03/14/2018 at 20:21

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The last two are about the only excusable reasons.

AuthiCooper1300 > RallyWrench 03/14/2018 at 20:30

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A 964 RS is now 400,000 bucks? Wow. I knew Porsche prices had gone crazy, but that’s extraordinary. That’s what people used to pay for a ‘73 RS (also a stupid price, of course) quite a few moons ago. How much for a Cup one then?!

I remember that at the time seasoned Porsche owners more or less grumbled that the 964 Carrera RS was nice but probably not worth the huge markup. Who would have thought they were such a wonderful investment.

Isn’t the RS wing the same as the one in the Carrera 3.2.? I know perfectly well why they are there but I am simply not a fan of wings on narrow-bodied cars.

An IROC, on the other hand...

RallyWrench > AuthiCooper1300 03/15/2018 at 12:04

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It seems so! Jobjoris shared that tidbit last week over on LALD (his pic). They sold two for this money!

Even the RSA has been a good investment. I found my boss’ car for him 11 years ago for $32k, with some needs. They’re now trading over $100k, though his car has higher miles and has been painted so it’s probably worth around $90k. Still, not bad.

As to the wing, yes it’s almost the same to the Carrera wing, but has its own part number, unique to the RS.

And yes, an IROC is my dream 911! I’ve hung on to a 12 year old issue of the British GT Porsche magazine just because it has spectacular pics of the famous green IROC RSR. So good.

AuthiCooper1300 > RallyWrench 03/15/2018 at 12:24

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Ah, but that’s an N/GT! A very different animal from the “cooking” Carrera RS! Even lighter, caged, no interior trim. It was such a pity that th N/GT category did not come to pass, damn.

When the IROC cars reached the US they still had the Bürzel (rear spoiler). They looked magnificent with the wide 3.0 RS body and their little ducktails.

I still have a few issues of VW&Porsche/European Car from the time when IROCs were, well, expensive, but not astronomically so. Was it Viper green, Irish green?

Nowadays I miss those funky 964 colours a bit.

As to the wing, yes it’s almost the same to the Carrera wing, but has its own part number, unique to the RS.

Maybe a special “add lightness” part? I wonder if then it would be the same wing as fitted to the SC/RS?

About the 964 RS... they were extremely usable. An acquaintance had one - – not exactly a Touring one: not too many comforts either. I was his “fast” everyday car. The front air dam used to get bent quite often though.

RallyWrench > AuthiCooper1300 03/15/2018 at 13:57

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Suppose the N/GT is worth a fair bit more, seems the “standard” RS is doing 150-250k GBP. Thanks for that!

The IROC is this one. Think I still have this European Car issue as well :) This green is Pistachio, it seems, also called Lime Green. One of many great shades of green Porsche had then! So, so good.

Looking at some pictures, I think you may be on to something with the SC/RS wing, but the RS piece doesn’t have a hole for the rear wiper. Maybe that’s all there is to it.

I’ll bet your friend’s airdam got bent, they’re really weak on the bottom! We reinforced the one on the boss’ car so it stays more or less straight (coworker’s pic):