Behold, the C&D subcompact SUV of the year

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch) 12/06/2016 at 15:03 • Filed to: Everything is stupid

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No, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

Look, I’m more liberal than most when it comes to applying the “SUV” moniker, but a tall hatchback thats built like a hatchback, to do hatchback things...but only a little boxier...doesn’t really make it into the books for me as being an SUV, or even crossover. =

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:07

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If they make enough categories then they can name every car from every manufacturer a car of the year. Next year they will have subcompact SUV, small subcompact SUV, and large subcompact SUV

S65 > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:07

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WhyHow

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:09

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So by the new, insane, definition, a Scion xB is an SUV, and so is a Volvo 245DL.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:09

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“Dwarf Minivan Without Sliding Doors” isn’t a category, apparently.

The Crazy Kanuck; RIP Oppositelock > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:09

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I’m sad it’s not a Juke.

Tekamul > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:12

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Subcompact SUV = hatchback with +1" wheels/tires.

Nothing in that field (including the Renegade) is anything but a hatchback.

HammerheadFistpunch > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 12/06/2016 at 15:13

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Yup. Actually an XB would have been in contention had it...you know...still existed.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 12/06/2016 at 15:14

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Actually, yes, except for the Volvo. Scion xB? “Truck”. PT Cruiser? Was a “truck”.

The 245 just missed the window for Outrageous CAFE Shenanigans.

mcseanerson > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:14

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To be fair they’re classified as trucks for CAFE purposes.

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:14

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If this is an SUV, the Scion toasters were SUVs. I don’t think the toasters were SUVs and neither is this.

These are incredibly practical, really nice inside, pretty big inside, and surprisingly cheap. Probably the best value in the class, IMHO.

for Michigan > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:16

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How is this not a crossover?

I understand that some people think AWD is a requirement for a crossover, but that’s an arbitrary requirement. Basing the definition of a body type on drive train layout seems strange to me as well.

The Soul is a tall, car-based hatchback with truckish styling. That’s pretty much the exact definition of a CUV as far as I’m aware.

And an SUV and CUV are just the truck-based and car-based versions of the same thing respectively, so putting both in the SUV of the Year competition seems to make more sense than adding a CUV of the Year competition.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > mcseanerson 12/06/2016 at 15:16

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Nothing like gaming the system

Milky > The Crazy Kanuck; RIP Oppositelock 12/06/2016 at 15:18

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Richard Hammond isn’t.

HammerheadFistpunch > Tekamul 12/06/2016 at 15:18

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hence the tag

Tripper > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:19

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That whole article from C&D is a joke

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:20

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No automotive categories make any sense at all.

HammerheadFistpunch > for Michigan 12/06/2016 at 15:20

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Its, at best, a crossover crossover. In between a crossover and a hatch.

HammerheadFistpunch > Eric @ opposite-lock.com 12/06/2016 at 15:20

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they were, sadly.

HammerheadFistpunch > Tripper 12/06/2016 at 15:20

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kinda, yeah.

Tekamul > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:21

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Looking at the whole thing, I see 1 SUV, 2 trucks (some will argue with 1 of them) a van, 2 wagons and 4 hatchbacks.

But wagons and hatchbacks are dead in America.

Wacko > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:26

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sucks they don’t make these with AWD.

I would seriously consider one with AWD and a manual.

I need a cure for my crashed SX4 itch.

Tripper > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:26

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The mid size SUV, full size pickup, and van comparros seem fair. The rest are laughable.

HammerheadFistpunch > Tripper 12/06/2016 at 15:28

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I’ll also give them the mid-sized truck, because there is such a small pool to draw from.

Tripper > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:34

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Forgot about that one. Weird to see the almighty Taco ranked #4.

for Michigan > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:35

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The Kia Soul is a front-engine, front-wheel-drive , five-door subcompact   crossover manufactured and marketed worldwide by Kia and now in its second generation.

Wikipedia

It’s closer in height to other subcompact crossovers than most subcompact hatchbacks. Accent: 57" Fiesta: 58", Fit: 60", Soul: 63", Encore: 65", EcoSport: 66".

Milky > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:36

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XJ Cherokee is a wagon. Kia Soul is a SUV. Nothing makes sense, “everything is stupid”.

m-b-w loves his SUBAROO > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:37

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It doesn’t even come in AWD...

Berang > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:37

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They probably understand more than anybody, except marketing firms, that most people buying “SUVs” don’t actually need an SUV and really just want a boxy hatchback. And so far as boxy hatchbacks go, the Soul is probably among the best.

Mid Engine > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:39

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I hate CVT’s, somehow CD makes Honda’s implementation “okay”

“Both mate to a continuously variable automatic transmission, which isn’t our favorite kind of gearbox, but Honda’s is among the best of its type. It’s programmed to imitate a conventional step-gear automatic to avoid full-throttle mooing and is otherwise imperceptible in regular use”

HammerheadFistpunch > for Michigan 12/06/2016 at 15:41

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Well...yeah...I know its taller (as I said) and KIA was smart to slide it into the “light truck” EPA classification but unless you are suggesting that classification is anything BUT a farce then we are kinda back at square one.

Your height comparison actually neatly demonstrates my point. Its right there in the middle between hatches and crossovers. C&D used to have a minimum height to be called an SUV, and it was 65 inches....kinda right where the crossovers start.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:42

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10Best is a reasonable number for cars.

It seems way too many for trucks/SUVs. I could see a 5Best: full size truck, small truck, large SUV, mid-size SUV, small SUV (replace SUV with crossover in pretty much all these categories).

HammerheadFistpunch > Berang 12/06/2016 at 15:42

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k, its the best boxy hatch. I’m okay with that.

HammerheadFistpunch > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 12/06/2016 at 15:43

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And ditch the price cap. I mean, there are a lot of great products above 80k that at least deserve the chance to compete with a price caveat.

Berang > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:47

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All this means is that “boxy” is the main selling point of SUVs.

HammerheadFistpunch > Berang 12/06/2016 at 15:47

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Can we just start a new category called “boxcars”. I think it would solve so many of these semantics meltdowns. is it a box, but also a car? Boxcar.

Probenja > m-b-w loves his SUBAROO 12/06/2016 at 15:48

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These don’t come in awd either:

They aren’t SUV’s but they are Crossovers and there doesn’t seem to be a prize for them so they just gave them the SUV award.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:55

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I don’t get calling it an SUV either I have always compAred it more to the Xb and Fit, than the Patriot or Compass. Even when it came out comparison videos put it up against the xb and Cube.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 15:57

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Then we have to have sloped roof cars, which fits most hatchbacks better.

HammerheadFistpunch > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 12/06/2016 at 15:57

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pretty much, but since the cube and xb are dead it has to fit into a category? Its kinda the same logic that the Wrangler is in the “compact suv” category. I mean...sure? But it really doesn’t actually have any competitors so...

HammerheadFistpunch > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 12/06/2016 at 15:58

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we already got hatches, they are pretty well defined as being 3-5 door cars that aren’t wagons.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:00

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Has it always been $80k? I’m not completely opposed to a cap (other magazines & sites award more expensive cars), but it seems like it should at least rise with inflation or be based on the average price of all cars for sale that year times some multiple. A hard cap does arbitrarily exclude any great cars whose base price might start at $80,000.01, though.

Average X 3 puts you squarely at $100k this year, fwiw. They could make it 2.5 if they want to start close to their current limit.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/05/04/new-car-transaction-price-3-kbb-kelley-blue-book/26690191/

HammerheadFistpunch > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 12/06/2016 at 16:02

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This is the first time they’ve done this, but they do the car version with a cap too, I suspect its floating but there are a LOT of people buying 80k vehicles these days...its not like 78 grand is a working class vehicle anyway.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:02

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It exists solely in the minds of those more wisened citizens that tended to buy them, much to Toyota’s chagrin.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 12/06/2016 at 16:06

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Volvo is actually a company that is based completely on shenanigans. Actually, all Swedish car companies are based on shenanigans.

Case in point, Saab. Here’s a Saab 92H.

And here’s a silly Volvo

Oh dear, I don’t think Volvo actually intended for the Swedish Mafia to use its estates to commit murder.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 12/06/2016 at 16:08

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HURRR

for Michigan > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:09

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It isn’t neatly in the middle, though. It’s on the short end of the crossover range (63"-66"), but still 3" taller than the tall end of the hatchback range (57"-60"). Which means it’s much closer to the crossover average (1.5" below) than the hatchback average (4.5" above).

HammerheadFistpunch > for Michigan 12/06/2016 at 16:10

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splitting hairs. its nearly as close to being a fit as it is to being a crossover. Also, you can’t include the soul in the crossover range, if you don’t also include it in the hatch range. Mathmatically speaking, its a bit of a cheat.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:12

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$80k and up you’re talking Z06, CTS-V, 911, M5, huge Euro luxo-barges and SUVs. An Escalade starts at $74k. I guess I could see raising the limit to closer to $100k, but I’m okay with the 10Best awards focusing on the heart of the market and 95% of buyers.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:14

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Unrelated: saw this recently and you came to mind.

HammerheadFistpunch > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 12/06/2016 at 16:15

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it just feels artificial since they are already subdividing by price class (i.e. midsized vs luxury midsized).

HammerheadFistpunch > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 12/06/2016 at 16:16

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Thats super cool. Its strange that Onion Creek is specifically called out. I mean its cool and all, but...

for Michigan > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:20

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So it’s closer to being a crossover than it is to being the tallest hatchback?

HammerheadFistpunch > for Michigan 12/06/2016 at 16:26

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well its 2 inches shorter than the shortest crossover on this list, and 3 inches taller than the tallest hatch on this list. for all intents and purposes...in the middle. Critically, it also misses out on other criteria that separate the categories; All weather capability. Granted its not a hard and fast rules but its at least worth an inch of difference.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:28

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Must mean something to him, personally. Done by this guy - http://jercollins.com/

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 16:31

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Yeah, I get that - I’m really speaking more to the 10Best cars, which seems much less segmented by price (the Accord took down the E-Class  http://www.caranddriver.com/features/honda-accord-2017-10best-cars-feature ).

bhtooefr > Probenja 12/06/2016 at 19:01

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The C-HR actually does come in AWD... in Europe... if you get the 1.2T and the CVT.

bhtooefr > HammerheadFistpunch 12/06/2016 at 19:03

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Of course, then, you’ve got Mercedes calling the GLA45 AMG, at 58", a crossover.

Crossover will soon just mean “hatchback, but with bulkier styling”.

HammerheadFistpunch > bhtooefr 12/06/2016 at 19:18

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Saw one recently...such a hatchback and I don’t care what Mercedes says