OK Oppo, School Me

"Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection" (itsalwayssteve) 11/29/2016 at 08:56 • Filed to: e39, touring, wagon

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It looks like the wife and I will need to get a second vehicle soon. Meepster is great, but I hit 17k this morning and we’ve had the car eight months. A large part of that is the fact that we have a 37-mile commute every day.

My wife loves European wagons, and my experiences with old Volvos has taught me that “Durable,” and “reliable” are two different things.

For what it’s worth, both of us find the E39 5 touring is about the best looking wagon we know of. In the spring we’ll start looking. The only requirements, I think, are good maintenance records, sunroof, and dark interior. I’d love to find a blue or black 540iT with style 5s or M-parallels but that’s just a plus. Also sub-20 mpg in a vehicle that requires premium can get expensive if we don’t end up moving close to work and school soon.

In the spring, we’re looking at a budget around $5000-7500. This is still several months away, of course, but we’re aiming for no car payment after taxes come back. (We don’t have kids, but this year has been brutal with education and medical expenses so we’re itemizing deductions this year.)

So, Oppo, what questions should I ask, and what should I look for when we’re shopping? I’m about to dive into forums, too, but I trust y’all more at this point.

Thanks!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:01

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I thought a rule of thumb with BMW is avoid the V8 unless it is prefixed with an S?

Party-vi > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:03

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Education and medical expenses? Don’t get an E39.

random001 > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:04

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37 miles each way, or combined? Gotta be each way...

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > random001 11/29/2016 at 09:05

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Each way. Every day.

Matt Nichelson > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:05

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As much as I love BMW, that is not a good choice if it means moving closer to save money. If you would end up doing that, you’re defeating the purpose of buying another vehicle since you’d cut down on the miles for the Jeep by doing that.

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > Matt Nichelson 11/29/2016 at 09:07

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I’ll find out Saturday - when I register for classes - what my schedule will be and if we’ll be able to hack it on just one vehicle.

We’re moving closer anyway but any time my wife has a medical issue and needs to leave work I also have to go. The boss won’t let me take my accrued PTO time unless it’s scheduled at least 2 weeks in advance so I’ve lost almost a half a day each pay period. That adds up.

Tripper > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:11

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Stick to the straight six, and get a PPI from a BMW specialist. Like you said, find one with a well documented maintenance history. While you’re scouring forums make sure you find out what is involved with all of the major services for that particular car/engine/trans and make sure those services have been done on whatever car you’re thinking of buying. Some of them may seem over the top, but it has been my experience that these cars do not tolerate neglect. I have been religious with maintenance on the E46 and it has paid off. I had the exact opposite experience with my E90 because two previous owners probably did the bare minimum.

Good luck with your search! 

random001 > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:13

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Ugh. I’m down to 20 each way right now. In the past, I had 63. Each way. Every day. That put a lot of miles on my Z06....

Matt Nichelson > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:20

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Gotcha. Well if you go the BMW route and it has the 4.4, be ready for less than 300 miles to a tank if it is mainly city miles. Iirc the tank in the 03 540i I had was 18.5 gallons with a 2 gallon reserve. I dunno how much premium is where you live but I am sure it is probably more than where I live in MS. That being said, I absolutely loved that car. Very comfortable and had plenty of room for a sedan. Obviously with the wagon you’ll have even more.

Aside from the obvious Vanos stuff depending on what year you would end up getting, the pixels on the radio and dash will go out. I bought a refurbed radio face on ebay when I got my car because of that. I took it off after the accident I had and still have it somewhere.

CalzoneGolem > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:23

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I shopped for a Volvo and came home with a Subaru.

OPPOsaurus WRX > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:36

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thers this current trend on OPPO and its all based on accepting adult life. It sux but what good is a pretty wagon going to due for you when your wife has an issue and the damn things on jack stands? I could have fixed the Allroad and they guy that ended up with a Camry the other day probably could have fixed his ride, but in the end, some people need reliability. I’m one, and i fear you may be another.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:36

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I would focus on reliability and inexpensive repairs.

I’ve been in a similar situation, but with two reliable vehicles. If I were determined to get a wagon, I’d look at a Mazda 6 or perhaps a Passat.

TysMagic > Matt Nichelson 11/29/2016 at 09:37

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I ended up steering away from a 540i (though I still desperately want one, how could you not) due to all the poor things I read about with the engine. However you only ever hear complaints, people don’t go out to brag about how normal it was to own a car. Was the engine as magical as it seems like it would be? The early models were pre-vanos and the later had “fixes” that still had problems, is that right?

OPPOsaurus WRX > Party-vi 11/29/2016 at 09:38

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but it looks so good

E90M3 > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:50

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Back in 2013 I was serious about getting an E39 M5. E39 production ceased in 2003, meaning at minimum the car would be at least a decade old. The average American drives something 12k per year, so assuming that I’d be looking at a car with over 100k. Now, the E39 is 14 years old, and has probably done over 160k, and you know what’s not cheap? A 14 year old high mileage BMW. They claimed it got 17/21 mpg when new, my 4.0L BMW V8 gets 14 around town. As cool as the E39 is, I’d look elsewhere unless you’re comfortable with the phrase “oh that part was only $700".

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 09:59

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Looking at potential internships for next summer I am kinda terrified of the mileage I may end up putting on the Mini. I am looking at potentially a 100mi round trip every day. For 3 months that’s 6000mi before accounting for other driving I need to do. On a 140,000mi+ car.

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > TheRealBicycleBuck 11/29/2016 at 09:59

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We once paid too much for a poorly-maintained B6 Passat wagon. It ended badly.

She LOVED that car but alas, burning lots of oil through the turbo, and electrical issues abound...

LongbowMkII > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 10:04

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Sounds like you want a Corolla and a wagon.

Vibe/Matrix it is

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > CalzoneGolem 11/29/2016 at 10:06

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I’m a fan of Subaru. I’d love to find her a Fozzy turbo with a sunroof.

Autophile412 - what's the world got in store? > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 10:14

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You’re about 11 months too late. I had a nice E39 wagon for sale.

The main issues I had in the three years and 70k miles with my wagon were as follows:

- electrical. Switches and sensors start going bad at about 100k miles. My tail gate switch went bad twice. $300 part and about three hours of your time. I had a voltage draw that I couldn’t find and if I didn’t drive it at least every other day there was a chance she wouldn’t start.

- suspension. The self leveling air suspension in the rear went bad at about 90k. Luckily it is a reasonably easy and inexpensive fix $600 for both air springs and about four hours of labor. I also replaced front control arm bushings at around 100k.

- motor. If you don’t use premium, low to zero ethanol fuel you will experience a stalling sensation that pulls a code associated with the crankshaft position sensor. I replaced the sensor and found the same issue until I went through three tanks of premium fuel.

- clutch. My clutch was going bad at the time that I traded the vehicle for my current F150

I loved my 5er wagon and would’ve kept it if I had the space and didn’t need the down payment money for my new truck.

Just know that if you plan on driving it quite a bit you will spend about $2500/yr in maintenance on a high mileage vehicle

TheRealBicycleBuck > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 10:15

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I believe in the KISS principle when it comes to reliable cars. Take, for example, my old Mazda truck. It has traveled over 269,000 miles. It’s a simple design with robust wear items. For example, it has a timing chain instead of a belt. It is two-wheel drive. There are no turbos or superchargers to wear out.

When looking for reliability, I search for something that doesn’t include performance items.

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 10:16

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Is 17k miles in 8 months a lot? I have done similar mileage in my Miata with a 15 mile (round trip) commute. So most of my mileage is just driving around for fun or going places on the weekends. I imagine if I had an actual commute there is no way I would drive less than 25k a year.

On second thought, I think I just drive a lot lol.

Klaus Schmoll > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 10:42

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If you are looking for a non-expensive, reliable mode of transportation, look somewhere else. E39s are beautiful cars that are great fun to drive when they uhmm ... drive. When they reach a certain age, they tend to let go completely. Unless you can find a very clean, one-owner, sub 100k mile car, be prepared for four figure repair bills every few weeks.

My mum’s 2002 E39 539d wagon with 145k miles has racket up 5-6 k euros in bills, left her stranded/wouldn’t start twice this calendar year alone. The last 2k euros were simply spent to buy her time for car shopping. It was a bit of everything, exploding clutch, power steering pump and lines, getting the stereo/nav working again, brakes (that thing eats brakes for breakfast), a battery.... I can’t even remember it all.

This car has been in our family since 2005 and has always been meticuliously maintained at BMW dealerships (which charge absurd amounts for even simple stuff like an oil change) or a BMW specialist.

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > LongbowMkII 11/29/2016 at 10:44

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My wife doesn’t like the Matrix/Vibe. Although I may be able to talk her into a Vibe XRS if we can find one with a sunroof...

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > Tripper 11/29/2016 at 10:49

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So you’re the only one who has said much of anything other than, “RUN AWAY!”

Post-facelift 528iT would probably be the best bet, and from what I’m reading on forums make sure it’s had the VANOS service done, and service records are more important than mileage.

Matt Nichelson > TysMagic 11/29/2016 at 11:18

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That’s correct. Vanos was added in 1998. My car had issues but I still loved it for the short time I had it. If everything is working properly, then yes I feel it was a good motor. Horsepower was upped to 290 in 2002 so I was glad to have an 03. It was also an M-Sport so it had the nice wheels and the M-Tech II suspension which was quite nice imo. The sad truth, though, is that it can turn into a money pit fast.

Tripper > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 11:53

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Haha, well I think that used European cars get a bad wrap. People buy them and don’t adhere to the maintenance schedule, or buy them when they have been neglected/abused and wonder why they don’t run forever like their old Honda that they just put oil in every once and a while.

VANOS is one of those “scary” terms that gets flung around as if every BMW equipped with it will explode while you’re driving it. The horror stories are usually from new owners who notice a rattle or get an engine code go to a dealer and the dealer tells them the entire system needs to be replaced to the tune of 3 to 7 grand. I don’t think BMW has an official VANOS service, but most inde shops offer a preventive maintenance. They replace all of the seals and parts that can wear out over time. My inde shop does this and I have it done at every major service interval (every 30-40k).

Of course a catastrophic VANOS failure is just that. However, I’ve not heard of any instances of that outside of the internet.

It’s definitely true that service records are more important than mileage. If the car has made it to 100k or more, has all records in order and does not burn any oil, I’d rather have it than one with 20k miles and no records.

If you’ve got any reputable inde shops in your area, I would call one. Tell them what you’re looking for and that you’ll be looking to get a PPI from them when you find one. They might have some good leads for you, and or be able to tell you any red flags to look out for. It’s also nice to get a “feel” for the shop before you do any business with them.

RallyWrench > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/29/2016 at 13:20

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After reading the comments, it looks like Tripper is right on the money here, that’s good advice. If you want a really hard to kill, spacious, reliable German wagon (other than the E39), a W210 E-class is worth a look. Their V6 is a little coarse, and the interior isn’t as good as the BMWs (to me), but they’re a good car. Apparently they rust in some parts of the country, but I’ve never seen it.

RallyWrench > Tripper 11/29/2016 at 13:23

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All this, exactly.

RallyWrench > Tripper 11/29/2016 at 13:28

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All this exactly too. Except for the E90 part, I have no desire to own any BMW newer than my E46, unless the right deal comes along on an E90 M3 sedan someday.

Tripper > RallyWrench 11/29/2016 at 13:51

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My E90M3 was beat on for sure. I bought it with 50k on the clock and it burnt a quart of oil every 3 fill ups at best. Also, there are a lot more expensive complicated electronics on the E90's. The battery is $350+ and you have to have it registered to the car, throttle actuators, etc... Other Oppo’s have E9X M3's and have had much better luck than I. However, I grew spiteful of mine. Luckily I made a good deal on the E90 so it wasn’t the worst thing in the world to trade it in after 18 months.

I’m in the same boat (not wanting any newer BMWs). I don’t really like the look of any of their cars past 2006, except the M3.

I would only sell my E46M3 for another one, or for the perfect 911 (997.2 C2S or faster, RWD, 3 pedals). I plan to stick with Audi as my daily driver for the foreseeable future.

pip bip - choose Corrour > Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection 11/30/2016 at 05:33

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alternate thought. go to lefthanddriveutes.com and see if the guys there will do a wagon conversion on a Pontiac G8 for you?

Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection > pip bip - choose Corrour 11/30/2016 at 09:17

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Left hand utes goes from triple to six times my budget.

Whatever happened to your bertstrips?