Here's Some Food for Thought

"flyingmetalbird" (jonsavage) 11/01/2016 at 00:07 • Filed to: None

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Would you pull a 1,500 lb Civic 1,000 miles with a ‘94 Miata? Because I want to. Would the Miata make it? What kind of damage would it suffer? The way I see it, there’s only one way to find out...

bob and john > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:15

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erm. absolutely not.

did you watch that trailer dynamics video? you do realize you are suddenly adding another 75% of the cars weight for the stock brakes to stop?

5 or 6 miles down the road, MAAYBE. 1000 miles? this has to be one of the stupidest ideas on oppo.

TheLOUDMUSIC- Put it in H! > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:16

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Well, for that distance, you’d need a trailer, which adds at least another 500lbs, so it’ll weigh almost as much as the Miata, so you’ll pretty much die over 30mph. Tbh I wouldn’t try to do that with anything less than a half ton.

flyingmetalbird > bob and john 11/01/2016 at 00:18

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But wait, you haven’t heard my best idea yet... add brakes to the trailer!

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:18

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A few years back, an Opponaunt whose name escapes me (I seem to recall he isn’t on here anymore) asked if it would be an ok idea to tackle a snowy mountain pass in the winter in a Mustang GT on sporty summer tires.

Your idea is on par with that one, but I feel as though it is stupider by some considerable margin.

HammerheadFistpunch > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:19

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Pull, as in tow rope? I guess if your idea of fun is 1000 miles of stressful 30 mph...sure. should only take a few horrible days

flyingmetalbird > TheLOUDMUSIC- Put it in H! 11/01/2016 at 00:19

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Too late I just left Minneapolis. Bozeman here I come!

(I’ll message you when I’m on the side of I-94 watching a burning pile of Japanese metal seep into the atmosphere)

bob and john > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:20

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wait wait wait, you were planning on a TRAILER too?

thats double the weight of the miata.

this is as bad, if not worse then that idiot who thought not stopping at stop signs in a snow storm was a good idea.

Sam > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:20

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Ludicrously dangerous. Its not about the damage to the Miata but the fact that you cant stop, turn, accelerate, or change lanes. The combined weight of the trailer and the car are heavier than the Miata itself, meaning that it’ll be like having no brakes at all. Your insurance likely wouldn’t cover anything if you crash, since you are using the vehicle for an unintended function. You’d also be at a crawl the entire time, and any hills (up or down) would be a no-go.

The moral of the story is - just rent a truck for a couple hundred bucks.

bob and john > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 11/01/2016 at 00:21

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far dumber.

HammerheadFistpunch > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:21

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Well, you’ve met the minimum legal standards now (1500 lbs or more trailers require brakes in most states), but still a bad idea

flyingmetalbird > HammerheadFistpunch 11/01/2016 at 00:22

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Actually I do a rally every year called “The Stressful 1,000" where you pull something heavy with something not made to pull something heavy for 1,000 miles. It’s great fun you should join us sometime

flyingmetalbird > HammerheadFistpunch 11/01/2016 at 00:24

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What if I take out my passenger seat and spare tire and put it on the trailer to save weight?

Sam > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 11/01/2016 at 00:25

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Merry Halloween.

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/snow-driving-with-summer-tires-1738992281

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > bob and john 11/01/2016 at 00:26

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True. The Mustang would’ve wound up backwards in a ditch, whereas the Miata will likely end up upside down in a ditch.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Sam 11/01/2016 at 00:27

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Yeah that.

bob and john > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 11/01/2016 at 00:29

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you ever feel sometimes that oppo in general is becoming dumber? I feel like thats happening.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > bob and john 11/01/2016 at 00:30

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Feel it? Hell, I contribute to it.

DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:41

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At this point I’m only 90% sure your joking.

flyingmetalbird > bob and john 11/01/2016 at 00:42

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Who stops at stop signs in the winter even? I have a blizzard light so people know I’m coming. Why waste perfectly good brake pad?

bob and john > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:43

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you know, there is a point where the joking stops being funny and starts being really really stupid.

you past that point a while back.

flyingmetalbird > bob and john 11/01/2016 at 00:46

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You’re right. I really should have two blizzard lights

Mr. Ontop, No Strokes, No Smokes...Goes Fast. > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 00:46

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There’s enough power, but the car really isn’t geared for it. You’ll really screw up the tranny.

flyingmetalbird > DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time 11/01/2016 at 00:48

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I am 100% joking. I think it would take a special kind of person to attempt a feat that large

flyingmetalbird > Mr. Ontop, No Strokes, No Smokes...Goes Fast. 11/01/2016 at 00:49

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Good point. I think I’ll have to pass on this trip

facw > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 01:01

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Have you considered using the Civic to tow the Miata instead?

flyingmetalbird > facw 11/01/2016 at 01:17

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You sir, are a genius. I’m going to hire you as my Automotive Advisor. The pay isn’t great, but it’s enough to get by. If you don’t eat or drink or use electricity or live inside

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 01:21

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Cake, provided you have suitable towing equipment. Is the Miata manual or automatic? Manual should handle it no problem.

gogmorgo - rowing gears in a Grand Cherokee > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 01:22

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If you can figure out a way to get a hitch system rated for say 3000 lbs, I see no reason it couldn’t be done. I’ve known a guy who would pull much heavier loads with a ‘90's Hyundai, although only around town. My biggest concern would be stopping, as you’ll be stopping about twice the mass, so you’ll probably want upgraded brakes. Make sure your tires are in good shape and properly inflated, might even want to add a little extra to the rear to compensate for the added weight. Stick to 55mph, don’t do anything stupid.

It’s definitely not an ideal row vehicle though, so I’m going to say that all liability is on you if something bad happens, which is probable, cause it’s not the greatest idea.

Sam > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 01:43

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I mean, I towed a Geo Storm GSi (one of the coolest POS I’ve ever dealt with) with a Miata. But it was a flat tow at 25mph for about 5 miles.

Sam > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 01:45

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The Stressful 1,000 is what I call any road trip in my BMW. Never know what’s going to fail/unfail (seriously, things just fix themselves at random) at any point in time!

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > Sam 11/01/2016 at 02:07

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Driving around in an S600 summarized.

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 02:07

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Uhhhhh. To where ?

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > bob and john 11/01/2016 at 02:10

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He’s definitely serious about this. Totally.

bhtooefr > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 06:00

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So, European towing capacity for the NA is 750 kg. That’ll be assuming the typical 4-7% tongue weight that European trailers tend to run, and that’ll be assuming you never exceed 50 mph - European towing limits are silly high.

You will be above that once you add a trailer, too.

Potential damage is to the drivetrain in the form of the clutch, transmission, and differential, to the unibody in the form of the rear structure of the car, to the rear suspension, and then there’s inability to control the trailer either due to braking, or due to oscillations.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 06:42

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Might hurt the clutch a bit but otherwise I cant see too much of a problem.

shop-teacher > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 11/01/2016 at 07:24

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Upside down in a ditch, with a Civic on top of it.

shop-teacher > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 07:25

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Unless you’re dead, as you likely would be.

duurtlang > bhtooefr 11/01/2016 at 07:49

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I will have to add that the 700 kg limit is with a trailer with its own brakes. A NA Miata can only tow 350 kg of trailer if the trailer has no brakes. So no, you would not be allowed to tow that Civic with a NA Miata in Europe, not even with a theoretically weightless trailer.

I don’t think those limits are silly high to be honest, given the other towing restrictions (tongue weight, speed limit).

bhtooefr > duurtlang 11/01/2016 at 07:57

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Well, the tongue weight is the big thing - American recommendations tend to be 10-15% tongue weight, to improve stability.

RacinBob > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 08:14

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Actually having towed a 4000 pound trailer for 5 years with a chevy citation X-11 in the past, I think you would be fine assuming it is relatively flat country you are traveling through.

First, the pros - You will find that assuming you are keeping it under 65, you will have plenty of engine for towing. You won’t have much acceleration but I bet you still get about 19 mpg.

You also will need a good trailer hitch that can take about 300 pounds tongue weight.

Now the cautions. - Don’t expect to stop or turn worth a darn. You need to be in full survival mode and leave plenty of stopping room.

The engine isn’t really that loaded towing. you won’t hurt it. Now if you are thinking about climbing the Rockies, you might think twice as the climb will be a crawl and the trip down the otherside will be maybe too much for your brakes. But relatively flat country will be fine. Just be very careful as the miata has a short wheel base.

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > flyingmetalbird 11/01/2016 at 08:54

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I think it would be worth it for a rental Tahoe or something at that point.

duurtlang > bhtooefr 11/01/2016 at 09:25

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Well yes, but you need those tongue weight percentages at higher speeds. Lower the speed and a lower tongue weight becomes acceptable. Different priorities I guess. Europeans can tow with most cars, but have to do with lower speed limits when towing (and get a trailer with brakes). Americans usually need a truck for towing, but don’t have to lower their speed while towing.

flyingmetalbird > Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap 11/01/2016 at 12:06

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I’d have to agree with ya to be quite honest