Thinking of buying a thing

"Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow" (chriskf)
09/17/2015 at 09:19 • Filed to: None

Someone please convince me that this is a bad idea, or if you live in Florida go check it out and reaffirm why I need to buy it. I would be buying this sight unseen, and it’s 1,200 miles away from me...

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DISCUSSION (34)

pip bip - choose Corrour > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:23

never knew they made a 4x4 version.

at $1500 you can’t go wrong.

LongbowMkII > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:26

how could this possibly be a bad idea?

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > pip bip - choose Corrour
09/17/2015 at 09:26

Yep, they briefly made AllTrac Corollas!

If the price stays low up until the end of the auction I may have to jump in on this. That thing is in seemingly great shape for its age.

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:28

Cant’ be that bad of an idea.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > LongbowMkII
09/17/2015 at 09:29

Because I’d be buying a car site unseen 1,200 miles away... lol

It does seem to be a great deal though. And all logic would say to make it a winter vehicle in Chicagoland, but I’d feel awful subjecting such a nice AE94 to the snow/salt; especially with 80s/90s Toyota’s propensity to rust like a tin can. haha I’d likely end up storing it in the winter and working on a transmission conversion.

JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:33

wow, I’ve never seen an alltrac corolla sedan! There was a guy back some time ago in my town that had, now get this; 5spd, turbo, Alltrac Camry!

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t
09/17/2015 at 09:35

Yep! The AllTrac Camry’s are awesome.

The sedan was only made in 1989, with only 900 being produced according to the ad. Seems like a reasonable number. It shares an engine and most of the chassis with the normal AE92 sedan of the time, so parts wouldn’t be all that tough to come by. Apparently the rear end is interchangeable with the AE86 Corollas too.

MonkeePuzzle > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:35

I suspect you’ve come to the wrong place to be talked out of it. it’s cheap, a little unique, likely to run for an age, and seems pretty acceptable.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > MonkeePuzzle
09/17/2015 at 09:36

Yeah, I didn’t really expect anyone to talk me out of it. haha

I wouldn’t mind a Florida Oppo offering to go give it a once over though!

spanfucker retire bitch > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:38

I would be buying this sight unseen

Kinja'd!!!

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:40

I was like...” who cares” until I got to the last picture and saw the Alltrac badge. To bad it’s an auto.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
09/17/2015 at 09:48

Yeah, but from this guy’s post in 2013 on AllTrac.net it sounds like everything needed can be sourced from other models.

I’ll have pictures up shortly, I am in the process of the swap right now, got the old 4A-FE engine/trans out. I wanted to share some research I’ve done, and I cannot believe more people haven’t done this swap.

Corolla All-Tracs were mostly AE95 wagons, but for one year only in the US they made a 1989 Corolla All-Trac sedan. I decided to go with a 91 wagon because they are just much easier to find and only weigh about 100lbs more, but still hundreds less than a celica all-trac.

They use the same front suspension as any other corolla of the generation, including the red top Corolla GTS. They share a the same exact suspension in the rear as the AE86 Corolla GTS minus a flipped panhard bar. So the options are numerous, and the sold axle in the rear is plenty strong. Most people don’t know but the AE85 rwd corollas actually had a weaker rear axle than the GTS, the AE85 having a 6.3” ring gear and the AE86 GTS having a 6.7” ring gear, which Toyota was nice enough to bless the corolla all-trac with.

A ST205 swap is not hard at all. Since 3 of the 4 engine mounts bolt to the transmission they are a direct swap into the corolla! (because the corolla all-trac also uses an E-series transmission). The corolla all-trac actually uses the same trans as the 1st gen Rav4’s, both have center locking differentials. Because of this the corolla all-trac CV axles are the same as a Rav4, but they are not the same as the ST205 trans. ST165-ST185-ST205 transmissions all use the same CV axles so long as they do not have the manual locking diff like the early 165’s did. To clarify, only the drivers side is different due to the locking differential. The Corolla/Rav4/early 165 passenger side CV axle will all slide right into the ST205 trans. So 3 out of 4 engine mounts and the passenger side cv axle all bolt on.

But wait what do we do about the drivers side CV axle? Buy a ST185 axle, it will go right into place because the corolla all-trac already comes with the bigger hub splines to fit E-series axles. The difference between the LSD center (st205) and the Locking diff (corolla/rav4/early st165) drivers axles is the axle seal surfaces. I am also going to use a ST185 passenger cv axle, the corolla one fits fine but uses an older/weaker tripod inner joint vs the double cardon of the later model axles, but atleast I have a free spare.

Then you may ask what about the driveshaft to the rear axle? Slides right into the ST205 trans no mods, right length and everything. Shifter cables hook up, speedo gear goes into the trans, etc...

The only custom work is to fit a 88-91 camry alltrac passenger side engine mount to the 3SGTE and then cut off the corolla engine mount, slide it 2” and reweld, easy for any fabricator shop for less than $100. And then the wiring which isn’t hard since you can just ship them off these days and have it done for you.

Also the 88-91 Corolla GTS gauge cluster will pop right in giving you a 9k tach and 155mph speedo. Corolla GTS rear LSD will pop right into the solid axle. With a 4 link coil setup can anyone say drag launch lol?

The best thing I’ve found is that the fuel pump, has an access plate about 2 inches inside the hatch under the carpet lol. Just open the lift gate and theres your fuel pump access, don’t even have to remove the rear seat cushion.

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:55

It’s auto tragic. That said it would probably be a good winter beater here in illinois

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 09:58

Oh shit. NO! MINE!

davedave1111 > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 10:00

You know Ebay Motors auctions aren’t binding, right? So if you’re willing to risk the cost of a trip to Florida, and it turns out to be a complete dog, you’re only down the price of the tickets, you don’t have to buy the car.

That aside, of all the cars to buy sight-unseen for a 1200 mile journey, one of those is pretty good. Toyotas of that generation run forever with even half-decent maintenance, so if it all drives fine to start with, it’ll almost certainly keep doing so more than long enough to get you home. And if anything does go wrong, they’re cheap and easy to fix.

I bought my 1989 Camry off Ebay (UK) for £550 or so last Jan, sight unseen. It only had a genuine 60k on the clock, but that doesn’t make a lot of difference with Toyotas of that generation. I only went about 120 miles to pick it up, but by English standards that’s about equivalent to 1200 American miles ;)

Since I got it I’ve done a few thousand miles in all conditions and the only non-cosmetic issue has been a hole in the silencer (muffler) that I had to patch.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie
09/17/2015 at 10:06

No! You stay away!!!

I figured you’d jump in here at some point and try to swoop on me. haha

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > davedave1111
09/17/2015 at 10:07

I was not aware. I definitely appreciate the info! I really hope the price on this stays low.

uofime-2 > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 10:08

listed as for sale by dealer....interesting.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero
09/17/2015 at 10:09

The Toyota stuff is interchangeable enough that there are a few options to convert the transmissions and/or swap the engine.

Yeah, turning it into a winter beater is the most logical thing... But I would feel terrible subjecting that thing to the Illinois winters when it’s already free of the rot! I’d likely store it in the winter and continue to hoon the FR-S in the snow. haha

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > uofime-2
09/17/2015 at 10:10

Yeah, I noticed that. The pictures and language don’t seem that way though. Perhaps it’s just someone with a license that’s flipping cars, although it doesn’t seem like a flip either...

uofime-2 > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 10:19

the pictures are in front of a church!

It is suspicious to say the least, hopefully the oppo network can check it out for you.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > uofime-2
09/17/2015 at 10:22

That would be fantastic.

Yeah, it seems odd. Could be a good thing, just an honest person selling a decent car, or bad with someone trying to look like an upstanding Christian while pulling a fast one. Either way, at around $1,500 it can’t end up being that bad.

uofime-2 > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 10:24

yeah pretty much, as long as it isn’t complete fraud.

Birddog > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 10:24

Looks like Grandpa parked on the lawn at the Bingo Hall again. Time to sell the car.

Looks like a deal. I bet it’s a riot in the snow.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > Birddog
09/17/2015 at 10:25

I’m sure it would be, but it’d also rust through like a tin can!

Perhaps in time it would become a rallycross/winter rallycross car, but still be stored while not racing.

Birddog > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 10:28

Ooh! Rally X would be a great idea.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > uofime-2
09/17/2015 at 10:28

Doesn’t really seem that way, especially given the YouTube videos of it running.

Might give the guy a call tonight.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > Birddog
09/17/2015 at 10:29

Stage rally eventually. Or just a track/autox car.

I’m sure with a 3SGTE it would make a decent little drag car, but that’s not quite my scene.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 11:55

Too bad the auction ends Saturday. If you were super serious about it and there was more time, I’d be willing to check it out, but it would be Saturday morning at the earliest.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 11:56

I was surprised at how cheap 3SGTEs are when I was looking for a new engine for Charlie. I was seriously considering it before deciding that I want to stick with 4As.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie
09/17/2015 at 12:17

Well if I win it the money has to be paid within 3 days. In that time I believe I could potentially back out still too. So maybe you could still go check it out Saturday morning...

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 12:39

Are you the bidder? If you’re still in the money on Saturday, I can probably take a look. What kind of issues are deal breakers for you? I’m guessing that the big one other than mechanical issues is rust. How much rust do you consider too much rust (he says no rust, but it’s an 80s Toyota so I don’t believe him)?

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie
09/17/2015 at 13:51

I haven’t bid yet. Waiting to see if it stays low and if so I will jump in at the last minute. haha

Any mechanical issues that would indicate that they might require major overhauling in the next year or so would be a no go for me. I don’t mind replacing a few pumps or anything. Issues with the AllTrac system are a bit of a concern too, since parts are somewhat rare and can be expensive/difficult to come by. As for rust, I don’t mind minimal rust. As long as the frame rails and floor boards aren’t rotting through. haha

It does look like it’s pretty free of rust, but it could be a different story underneath.

RockRam > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow
09/17/2015 at 14:23

I've bought a used car sights unseen a few months ago. If you can wrench and have extra funds to put into this, then not a bad deal. If not, then pass it right by. Only time I would do sight unseen again is on a new car