Cheapest powertrain combo to 140hp?

"MentalJuggernaut" (mentaljuggernaut) 08/27/2015 at 02:34 • Filed to: None

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Trying to figure out an engine transplant for my beetle. What’s the easiest way to 140hp? Was thinking of an MR2, or some subi engine as a swap.

DrJohannVegas > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 02:38

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I think the NA 2.2 or 2.5 EJ Subaru engines will get you there. Plus, bellhousing adapters are easy.

jester74 > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 02:38

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You could always get a bigger VW engine, (1776, 2332), etc.

jester74 > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 02:41

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http://www.backyardbuild.com/custom-vw-bug-…

MentalJuggernaut > jester74 08/27/2015 at 02:43

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Was considering it, but haven’t seen a good build under 5K

MentalJuggernaut > DrJohannVegas 08/27/2015 at 02:44

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That’s what I was considering. What do those typically cost?

jester74 > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 02:44

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I linked a step-by-step video series of an MR2 into a VW. Maybe that'll help

MentalJuggernaut > jester74 08/27/2015 at 02:45

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Holy hell, 400hp is about 200 too much...lol but that is an awesome build and I will def be checking it out :)

jester74 > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 02:46

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Oh I agree. I have a 67 VW and if I threw an engine like that in it, I'd kill myself in a hurry. I would drive the hell out of it.

armandthegreat > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 02:59

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Don’t be a pussy Democrat. Sell that jap trap and get some cold hard AMERICAN steel

Bytemite > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 03:05

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Pretty sure the 1ZZ of the MR-S is a good bet.

facw > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 03:20

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Why swap in one engine when you can swap in two?

http://jalopnik.com/5799726/emerso…

StoneCold > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 03:57

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I have a dream. And that dream includes an Evinrude V4. That dream soon turns into a nightmare.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Johnson-Ev…

StoneCold > StoneCold 08/27/2015 at 03:59

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And then that nightmare fades into another dream! This involves 2 LS blocks and lots of welding. O_o *twitch*

http://ls1tech.com/forums/convers…

StoneCold > StoneCold 08/27/2015 at 04:15

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The fever dreams continue. The haze of horsepower from unexampled sources aren’t ceasing:

Two Kawasaki triple engines, one for each set of wheels:

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 08:08

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Aren’t Subaru swaps pretty well supported? You won’t even need a turbo model, just get a normal 2.5 na engine. An na Subaru engine should be cheap.

TheJWT > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 08:39

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Sr20de’s are dirt cheap and make 140hp. Or you could pay a little more and get a ve with 180 or a det with 200+

As Du Volant > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 09:26

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Subaru EJ22 engines are cheap and freaking bulletproof. Depending on where you source them you could probably get a used engine/tranny combo for $600-$800, even less if you luck out at a U-Pull junkyard. 130hp stock, so I’m sure it wouldn’t be that hard to coax another 10hp out of it.

I once met a guy running a stock EJ22 in a Beetle, and that amount of power plus the lightweight chassis had it popping wheelies.

GTI Sprinks > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 09:31

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140 hp seems like a perfectly easy number to get from a diesel powered bug. :D

vwbeamer > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 09:36

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I built a 210 hp 2332cc engine for around 7K. That was at the crank, it was dyno at Jake Raby’s place in Cleveland Ga.

I had a 1915cc engine that ran high 13’s. On the dyno it made 120 hp to the rear wheels, it more than likely was right around 140 hp. It was easy under 5k to build.

If I was going to do a swap, it would be Subaru, and I would use a Subaru transaxle also. There are special Ring and Pinions that can get the rotation going in the right direction.

The VW transaxle is by far the weakest part of the car. I have never blown an engine, but the transaxles are to numerous to even count.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 11:05

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For ease-of-swap you want a carbed engine, but you’ll have a hard time finding one that will both fit in the Beetle AND make 140 without significant mods.

As for fuel injection, a 2.0 out of a Neon makes 132hp stock. If you can find one from a later model the head gasket issues will be nonexistant and it’ll be fairly bulletproof. The twincam version is good for 150.

SantaRita > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 11:11

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I’d go with a 2.5 NA forester engine. 1000$ basically. The air cooled vw motors are pricey to build up beyond 100hp.

Unless you are just crazy like me. You’re vw is light enough to consider using a motorcycle engine of some sort as well. BMW’s R1200 is a good match but not quite 150hp more like 100-150 depending, but a Honda VFR 1200 motor would be amazing in a bug. tightly packaged and 170HP and uses a driveshaft with dual clutch/tiptronic like in a late model GTI. that would be uh..clutch.

Where are you located? I would honestly just scrub copart.com and cragislist for damaged cars until a whole car shows up worth using so you’re not nickel and dimeing yourself on ecu’s and radiators etc. you can scrap the car later for some $$$ adn maybe even make some on interior bits.

MentalJuggernaut > jester74 08/27/2015 at 13:56

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Saw that, will drool at it soon

MentalJuggernaut > StoneCold 08/27/2015 at 13:57

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Dude i saw this build when it was first happening and got shivers

MentalJuggernaut > SantaRita 08/27/2015 at 14:37

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You know, I considered the bike route but I feel like the transmission and packaging would get difficult. I would certainly entertain it though - those motorcycle engines transplants tend to look a little amateur though, right?

MentalJuggernaut > As Du Volant 08/27/2015 at 14:38

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That sounds fucking perfect. ECU/wiring, included?

As Du Volant > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 14:47

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Probably going to have to pull it yourself if you want all that stuff. Pretty much every junkyard I know will chop the wires when they remove them.

But it should be easy enough to find at a U-pull yard. That engine only came in millions of Subarus, standard engine in 1990-99 Legacy and optional engine in 1995-01 Impreza I believe. And apparently they actually did make over 140hp in later iterations, but the early ones were only good for 130.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_EJ…

MentalJuggernaut > If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent 08/27/2015 at 14:48

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Neon motor is a really interesting thought. Sub $1k, engine/tranny?

MentalJuggernaut > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 08/27/2015 at 14:49

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They are, but cheapest combo I’ve found is over $1200

MentalJuggernaut > GTI Sprinks 08/27/2015 at 14:49

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Heavy!

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 14:56

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That’s cheap. I just dropped $1700 on an old Toyota motor from a Corolla. That’s just the motor. That’s not including wiring or the bell housing that you would need to adapt it. $1200 for 3x the power you have now is not bad at all.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 15:15

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Oh yes, definitely. They made like billions of the things, and many succumbed to rust or other issues rather than engine failure. It shouldn’t be too hard to find a trashed car with a good engine. I believe the head gasket issue was fixed for good after ‘97 or ‘98. Second gen cars had the same power output but I think the intake was revised to bring peak torque a bit lower.

SantaRita > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 15:17

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I think packaging of most of the conversions is problematic becasue they use an I4 so it’s too long in the back. Here is a 1000cc suzuki v-twin conversion that aside from the noise doesn’t look any different outside.

If you’re not going straight up vw motor you’ll have a lot of ancilliaries to deal with anyway, but my major strike against an MC engine would be maintenance schedule, especially over a 2.5l subie with more displacement and an obviously clearer path to success.

SantaRita > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 15:18

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copart.com is where i’d look...try to get a whole car you’ll be surprised what you end up needing later like relays etc. which can add up quickly.

SantaRita > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 15:23

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are you thinking chop the whole rear out, new cradle...whole FWD car powertrain in the back....

go look at saabs B204 engines. you’ll easily find a running 900 or 9-3 turbo car for 1200$, 185hp in the low pressure turbo, and up from there and those are 200k mile motors.

if you did this with any car, how would shifting work?

MentalJuggernaut > SantaRita 08/27/2015 at 15:28

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Yeah I’m leaning towards the Subi motor, but that 9k redline is damn tempting

MentalJuggernaut > As Du Volant 08/27/2015 at 15:29

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Maybe I’ll just get the whole car...what kind of pricing would i be looking at for that?

As Du Volant > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 15:58

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That depends a lot on where you are. In some places Subarus are gold, and in other places they’re trash.

Here in the rust belt you can often find a runner with a horribly rusted body and average-high mileage for under $1k or less. Helps to look somewhere that has a state inspection (i.e. not Michigan or Ohio). Once they start to rust out and need other miscellaneous repairs people tend to dump them cheap with the caveat “just needs xxxx to pass inspection!”

Like this: http://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/cto/5191706974…

Or this: http://altoona.craigslist.org/cto/5168077596…

They’re a little tougher to find with a manual trans though, I’m presuming that’s what you’d want.

As Du Volant > MentalJuggernaut 08/27/2015 at 16:05

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Alternatively if you feel like spending a day in the junkyard and eastern PA is accessible to you, you can probably grab everything you need at Harry’s for $500-$600.

MentalJuggernaut > As Du Volant 08/27/2015 at 19:02

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Def. I’m in CA so maybe a little more pricey than that...

As Du Volant > MentalJuggernaut 08/28/2015 at 07:58

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If you're willing to take a road trip and haul one back I hear you can find tons of cheap Subarus in the Pacific Northwest.