Nonsense At The Museum: "The Turbine Went From 0 to 60 Seconds."

"SteveLehto" (stevelehto)
08/02/2015 at 09:00 • Filed to: None

You walk through a museum and you stop at an interesting exhibit. “Hey, there’s one of those Chrysler Turbine Cars. Let’s read the sign and see what we can learn.” If you are at the Gilmore Museum near Kalamazoo, this sign is what you will be reading. And what you “learn” will be wrong.

The “Experimental Engine” paragraph is not bad. Calling the turbine engine “experimental” is a little bit of a stretch - they were past the experimental stage with the engines at this point but I understand that “experimental” to some people means “new and confusing.” Like that experimental internet. I don’t get pissed off until the next section.

“It’s One Hot Car!” According to the second paragraph, its exhaust smelled “bad” and measured a “scorching 525 degrees!” Wow. That sounds dangerous. If only it were true. The 500+ degree figure which they are quoting is the temperature of the exhaust gases as they pass out of the regenerator. At the front of the car (red arrow).

Those gases then pass through a very long, wide dual exhaust system to the back of the car (blue arrow). Most people - when they read that language - assume that the figure is for the tailpipe. As in “I heard those things melted the asphalt as they drove down the highway!” Does anyone measure the temperatures of piston engines at the exhaust port and freak out? Think of the children!

The exhaust was not dangerous. It was actually cooler than the emissions from a tailpipe of a regular car at that time, below 200 degrees f. George Huebner’s handkerchief is not about to burst into flames in this picture. And, for what it’s worth, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and when the owner pulled it out of his garage I walked behind it and felt the exhaust, just so I could say I did it. And yes, I still have full use of my hand.

The sign then says “Although not as prone to breakdowns as a piston-powered auto, the car’s ‘jet’ engine spewed superheated gases and gobbled up fuel like a 747.” The Turbine Cars in the user program had a very good reliability record (they logged over a million miles) and I suspect they got slightly better mileage than a 747. Of course, it’s hard to know: Chrysler never released figures. But from what I’ve read, a 747 burns several gallons per mile in the air; when “driving” on the ground it burns even more.

“Chrysler built 50 Turbines in all.” They built 55. I hate to quibble but 50 does not equal 55.

“[T]he Turbine received a big ‘thumbs down’ for its poor efficiency and economy.” Again, not true. The car was popular with those who used it and Chrysler could have sold the cars quite easily. The problem was the cost of the cars and the fact that the cars did not meet coming tailpipe emission standards.

“All but ten of the cars were scrapped.” Nine cars were saved. At this point, I might be willing to concede that, for these purposes, 9 = 10. After all, it is less inaccurate than other things on the placard.

“The Turbine went from 0 to 60 seconds.” Yes, yes, it did. Wait. Huh? Okay, I know this is just a ridiculous typo. But still, if you are going to publish nonsense, can’t you at least proofread it first?

“[I]t got only 12 miles to the gallon.” They’re just making this up since Chrysler never released actual figures on this and as far as I know, no one has ever done an EPA-style mileage test on any of the surviving cars that run.

“Chrysler abandoned the car just in the nick of time - the gas crisis was right around the corner.” This is the one that kills me. Chrysler didn’t “abandon” the turbine program until the 1980s - more than two decades after this car was parked. Chrysler built turbines until 1983 and did not close their turbine program for five more years after that.

Ironically, this car was a potential answer to “the gas crisis.” It was multifuel. It was demonstrated on alcohol, diesel, home heating oil, tequila, VO5 hairspray, peanut oil and more. Any liquid that burned would fuel it. The photo above is of the more conventional fuels it could run. This car laughed at your “gas crisis.”

The entire sign in front of this magnificent car at the Gilmore paints a picture of the car being a loser, a sad sack whose only place in history is that of a curiosity which Chrysler wisely rid itself of. My understanding is that the sign was lent to the museum with the car - the car is on loan to the Gilmore from the Detroit Historical Museum. I have no idea who wrote the sign. I just wish they would correct it or take it down.

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This website may supply general information about the law but it is for informational purposes only. This does not create an attorney-client relationship and is not meant to constitute legal advice, so the good news is we’re not billing you by the hour for reading this. The bad news is that you shouldn’t act upon any of the information without consulting a qualified professional attorney who will, probably, bill you by the hour.

Photo clips of the sign are courtesy of Levi Stombock.

DISCUSSION (100)

PS9 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:11

Maybe their turbine car is actually a time machine, and can go from t=0 to t=60 seconds. Didn’t stop to think about that one did ya, Mr. Smarty pants lawyer person!?

...for real though, that is some nonsense multiple people failed to catch. Shame. Shame.

AeroStang > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:14

It is very frustrating when people make poor exclamations on things they are not educated on. But hey, I found you on twitter! :)

SteveLehto > PS9
08/02/2015 at 09:14

I was curious about that. Why was I assuming it was a measure of accelleration? Maybe it was a measure of something else (more sinister? More science-y?). Who knows?!

SteveLehto > AeroStang
08/02/2015 at 09:15

Yes, where I make all kinds of crazy exclamations (although, they are not carved in stone).

Thanks!

PS9 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:16

A time machine the size and relative operation of a car with only a 60 second delta would be pretty useless. It would take at least that long to get in/out of it, so you’d never have a chance to undo anything worse than a text message. Maybe the turbine hellcat can give us at least a 5 min delta?

SteveLehto > PS9
08/02/2015 at 09:18

60 seconds forward or can it also go back in 60 second increments? Maybe (if the fuel economy wasn’s so bad) it could go back repeatedly and get somewhere useful. Like 10 or 15 minutes ago. Before I did that thing . . . that BAD thing.

Oh Yes They Will > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:19

Broad Cut?

It ran off of tobacco?

Garrett Davis > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:20

Holy jumping Jesus, Batman! How incredibly unprofessional. From the looks of it, they didn’t even do the bare minimum of checking freaking Wikipedia for this. Even if they just watched Jay Leno’s excellent feature on this car, they would have had everything they needed for this.

Were their other signs this inaccurate? I really hope they see this post. How lazy can you be?

SteveLehto > Oh Yes They Will
08/02/2015 at 09:22

Not familiar with that. Could it be liquified?

MrBloodMuffins > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:22

They don’t know what they are talking about. They didn’t even mention the belt the through which the engine gets its power. Unless because it is a turbine, it is closer to a turbo which runs off of its own exhaust gasses.

SteveLehto > Garrett Davis
08/02/2015 at 09:23

I didn’t fact-check their other signs (and my depth of knowledge is not as good on other cars eeither). I did check their Tucker display but that appeared to be accurate from what I recall.

Leo Tauer > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:24

That sounds exactly like the articles on the “Cool Cars” page of my girlfriend’s Glamourpolitan I resort to reading when I forget to take my phone to the restroom.

jalop1991 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:24

Did I just read this paragraph on Gawker Media?

REALLY?

PS9 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:25

Engineer 1: So we’ve made a time machine that can go backward 60 seconds on a full tank! Wait...how long does it take to refuel the tank?
Engineer 2:...60 seconds.
Engineer 1: * slams fist on table* Damnit! The Time Travel Refueling Paradox strikes again. Well played, Stephen Hawking. Well played...

SteveLehto > MrBloodMuffins
08/02/2015 at 09:25

Not sure what belt you are referring to. The output of the turbine was a fan which blew air over another fan which was the input to the transmission. But you are right, the car was not pushed by the hot exhause simply being blasted out the back.

SteveLehto > jalop1991
08/02/2015 at 09:26

Yes, yes you did.

BrentOwen > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:27

Can’t trust museums, I once read that dinosaurs existed before Jesus. Wrong! Bristol Palin in 2032

SteveLehto > PS9
08/02/2015 at 09:27

What if we make the refueling device ALSO a time traveler (in 60 second increments)?

Leo Tauer > jalop1991
08/02/2015 at 09:27

Gawker affiliates proofread their nonsense, you know..

SteveLehto > BrentOwen
08/02/2015 at 09:28

You visit the wrong museums. There is one that clearly shows the Bible heroes and their pet dinosaurs frolicking in the displays together.

Jeeper1 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:29

Typo? Or, time machine, with limited capability?

SteveLehto > Jeeper1
08/02/2015 at 09:30

There is a thread developing on this here. Or there will have been, 60 seconds ago.

jimz > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:30

“The Turbine went from 0 to 60 seconds.”

how do i car

SteveLehto > jimz
08/02/2015 at 09:30

Muchly. As muchly as you can.

Jeeper1 > Jeeper1
08/02/2015 at 09:30

Guess I should have read the comments before commenting. Obvious joke is obvious. If only there were a way to go back in time one minute.

MrBloodMuffins > MrBloodMuffins
08/02/2015 at 09:33

replied to myself

MrBloodMuffins > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:33

I am referring to the old CNN article about the return of turbo engines to F1 which was an incoherent mess. One such thing they wrote was that N/A engines are powered by a “belt” connected to the crankshaft.

http://jalopnik.com/how-much-can-c…

SteveLehto > MrBloodMuffins
08/02/2015 at 09:34

Oh, sorry. Yes, sometimes they have articles written by people without even the most rudimentary grasp of how cars “work.”

jalop1991 > Leo Tauer
08/02/2015 at 09:35

Actually, I didn’t.

For that matter, I don’t separate out affiliate work from the union worker crap. Maybe I should make more of an effort.

For that matter, maybe Gawker should make the effort. Maybe a big flashing red popup: “WARNING WARNING WARNING YOU ARE LEAVING THE GAWKER MEDIA CRAP ZONE AND ENTERING THE WORLD OF RATIONAL THOUGHT AND REASONED DISCOURSE WARNING WARNING WARNING”.

RevMatch > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:36

Did you ask the Museum where the information came from and try to help them correct it?

Bruce Daugherty > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:37

I wonder if they were forced by big brother to cancel the program as it could run on anything combustible? O.o

SteveLehto > RevMatch
08/02/2015 at 09:38

The sign was drafted by the Detroit Historical Museum and came with the car. I did tell one person there (who was in a position of authority) about it but the impression I got was “Well, that’s the sign that came with the car.”

Stuttgart Shuffle > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:51

0-60 seconds? Thats impressive, but how far does it take to do the Kessel Run?

SteveLehto > Stuttgart Shuffle
08/02/2015 at 09:52

3 Metric tons.

Stuttgart Shuffle > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 09:56

That’s ridiculous, no wonder no one wanted this failed experiment. Good thing they only made 22 of them.

SteveLehto > Stuttgart Shuffle
08/02/2015 at 09:56

What do you expect for a car that bursts into flames when you start it and is made entirely out of fiberglass?

CharlieKellyKingofTheRats > jalop1991
08/02/2015 at 09:57

Why would you need this warning? You have to actively get here unless it is a cross post and if it is, the header will tell you where you are located.

Leo Tauer > jalop1991
08/02/2015 at 10:00

I was making a light hearted joke about Gawker’s bullshit not having spelling errors...

webmonkees > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:00

Turbine owner Jay Leno should foot the bill on a new sign after doing a routine at the museum.

SteveLehto > webmonkees
08/02/2015 at 10:02

Not really sure why it’s HIS problem . . .

Actually, it’s never the cost of doing these things - that sign can’t cost that much. It’s getting someone to actually pay attention. I got a historical marker changed in Michigan and it took me 8 years. Cost was not the issue.

Leon711 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:10

What do you know Steve? It’s not like you wrote a book about it.

pintowgn73 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:10

I saw one of the Turbine cars at the Henry Ford Museum a couple weeks ago. I of course don’t have any pictures of it, though I do have tons of pictures of most of the rest of the cars there.

BrentOwen > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:11

Didn't they clear a part of the Red Sea to set up a kickball field.

PS9 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:12

Hey, hey, hey now, watch it there! Do you want to cause a time/fuel paradox that will fill every cubic meter of the universe with kerosene?

SteveLehto > Leon711
08/02/2015 at 10:13

Wait. Maybe I should . . .

SteveLehto > pintowgn73
08/02/2015 at 10:14

I was there in June and saw it. Nice display but it also has a few errors in the signage. Just nothing as bad as the Gilmore’s.

Dpanzerman > PS9
08/02/2015 at 10:14

Only if it hits 88mph, McFly!

SteveLehto > BrentOwen
08/02/2015 at 10:15

Well, it stays parted during the games.

SteveLehto > PS9
08/02/2015 at 10:15

But that won’t happen until 60 seconds from now!

webmonkees > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:18

Maybe look at the owner’s manual. So many people don’t. Brake air pressure? Oh yeah, no vaccum.

Kinja'd!!!

jalop1991 > Leo Tauer
08/02/2015 at 10:20

OH yeah, I got that...

But if you ask the early 20-something Gawker union writers—who are convinced they are discovering the new world, that whatever they see has never been seen before—they’ll tell you, due to their superb public school upbringings, that by definition they do not have spelling errors in their writing.

Because “correct” is what they define it to be at any given moment.

Never mind that they are in the business of, you know, communicating with OTHERS.

yung bramblepelt > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:20

“Chrysler built 50 Turbines in all.” They built 55. I hate to quibble but 50 does not equal 55.

Oh, you lawyers and your crazy lawyerese. I’ll never understand it!

Mark Alan > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:21

Someday technology will allow us to go from from 0 to 60 seconds in under a minute. Mark my words luddites!

Leon711 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:27

I’d buy it.

GTOrelly > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:34

Just for the record, I went to that car museum and it’s awesome, easily the best car museum I’ve ever been to. They’ve got an incredible collection and the whole museum experience is awesome, multiple barns and building you can visit. I highly recommend to any car enthusiast. The diner is awesome too, well themed and the food is great. I miss Michigan a lot...

SteveLehto > yung bramblepelt
08/02/2015 at 10:34

Numbers are hard!

Equana > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:35

It was written by the same folks who wrote the insurance commercial that used the line “torque ratios.”

SteveLehto > Mark Alan
08/02/2015 at 10:35

Or maybe it happened a minute ago already.

vdub_nut: scooter snob > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:35

Kinja'd!!!

The Harley Davidson “Factory Tour” in York, PA has a sign that proudly proclaims that the Iron 883 Sportster has 883 CUBIC INCHES(!!!) of displacement.

A simple mistake of swapping out to units, but, like... really? Sorry for the terrible image quality.

SteveLehto > GTOrelly
08/02/2015 at 10:36

I agree 100% The ONLY complaint I have is this darn sign.

SteveLehto > vdub_nut: scooter snob
08/02/2015 at 10:38

That must have been one big bike motor!

Think! aka anotherburner111122223333 > PS9
08/02/2015 at 10:41

From http://sploid.gizmodo.com/short-film-hav…

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:41

It would be neat if they were to revisit this concept. With today’s technology they could maybe double or triple economy from that unsubstantiated 12mpg and cut emissions way down with a lot of the same technology that’s used on modern diesels.

imgonnamakeyouloveme > webmonkees
08/02/2015 at 10:43

That’s pretty neat! I didn’t know that concept cars had owner’s manuals.

SteveLehto > AMGtech - now with more recalls!
08/02/2015 at 10:44

Or got turbine-electric and eliminate the issues from starting and stopping in traffic and so on.

me > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:45

Whoever keeps that wonderful vehicle and that useless piece of signage together should have the car confiscated, as they are unworthy of owning such a chunk of engineering.

I’ll take it off their hands, if you want...

Tohru > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:48

Kinja'd!!!

The turbine car and I have something in common - we can both go from 0 to 60 seconds.

desertdog5051 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:49

It is sad that the museum, using the name of a truly great name in racing, could make such a mistake. I remember Jim Gilmore for his connection to racing names like Johncock and Foyt.

Tohru > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:50

You could always take the sign down yourself, and place it in the proper waste receptacle. Then when you are ticketed for petty vandalism, you can represent yourself in court with this very post!

SteveLehto > Tohru
08/02/2015 at 10:50

But how long does it take?

Tohru > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:51

If you chewed it.

Tohru > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 10:54

It says right on the sign: 0-60 in 12 miles to the gallon. Come on man, get it together.

SteveLehto > Tohru
08/02/2015 at 10:55

Without knowing the WEIGHT of the trip, we are missing a key variable.

ColdSlaw > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:01

Of note, George Huebner then blew his nose into the handkerchief, causing an explosion that leveled the facility and set back turbine research 20 years.

SteveLehto > ColdSlaw
08/02/2015 at 11:02

20 years and 60 seconds.

With-a-G is back to not having anything written after his username > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:02

Steve, how can you possibly be as prolific as you are on this site and still maintain sufficient billable hours in your practice? Unless you've been submitting invoices to oppo....

Tohru > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:03

Good lord, do I have to hold your hand through this? 0-60, in 12mpg, at 525 degrees. Then you rotate it at 50,000rpm, then 0-60 in 12mpg at 525 degrees again. Then the pizza should be ready to eat.

SteveLehto > With-a-G is back to not having anything written after his username
08/02/2015 at 11:03

You’d be surprised how fast I can hammer out these pieces when they are on topics that get me riled up [shakes fist at cloud].

DamnTheNoise > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:04

This sort of thing happens everywhere. There is a motorcycle “show” going on around 41st street in NYC all about ‘70s euro bikes, specifically MV and Ducati. A lot of the info presented is wrong, but I didn't feel like wasting my time doing anything about it.

SteveLehto > Tohru
08/02/2015 at 11:06

I think the answer to that is still only something which can be graphed. In three dimensions. There must be a way to reduce it to a symbol.

Tohru > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:18

Kinja'd!!!

Done. Wasn’t even very hard. Though it’s the first time I’ve had to find the derivative of an equation since high school calculus.

Shiyal > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:18

Kinja'd!!!

Probably about 30 speed.

Biodegradable Wiring Harness > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:20

They weren’t even all that creative with their nonsense. They should have said it was cancelled because its ability to run on V05 gave it a reputation as a “hairdresser’s car”.

The Opponaut formerly known as MattP123 > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:22

It went from 0 to 60 seconds in one minute flat, and could run the quarter mile in only 1320 feet.

Sam > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:23

Mayne you should correct the sign and submit it to the museum? They may be grateful. Or they may shrug you off.

Clown Shoe Pilot > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:24

Kinja'd!!!

SteveLehto > The Opponaut formerly known as MattP123
08/02/2015 at 11:31

But what is that in metric?

SteveLehto > Sam
08/02/2015 at 11:31

The language would be easy to write. Just not sure how much the sign would cost (or if they would care).

RichardNixon72 > Leo Tauer
08/02/2015 at 11:32

“Turbine Cars...They’re Just Like US!”

Clown Shoe Pilot > PS9
08/02/2015 at 11:33

I dunno. I’ll bet a lot of things have happened in the back of a car that took only 60 seconds and people wish could be un-done.

wkiernan > Tohru
08/02/2015 at 11:36

You wouldn’t want to eat a pizza cooked in Alberto VO5 hairspray, however; it would taste funny and stick to the roof of your mouth, which is always quite unpleasant. On the other hand, if you fuel your turbine with first-press olive oil, molto deliziosa !

Tohru > wkiernan
08/02/2015 at 11:39

I fuel my turbine with diced lions. Well, I would, but that asshole dentist didn’t bring me the corpse for processing.

chronoso > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:45

About a minute, roughly.

shop-teacher > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:46

I think we will see turbine range extenders for electric cars in the next few years.

K5ING > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:47

This was the concept behind Neal Young’s LincVolt Lincoln . It was an electric 1959 Lincoln which used a 30kW Capstone microturbine genset to charge the batteries.

Kinja'd!!!

4b11t > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 11:59

Kinja'd!!!

No, they’re right, you’re wrong.

It can time travel and skip forward straight from 0 to 60 seconds without experiencing, seconds 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc, up to 59. And time traveling ahead from 0 seconds straight to 60 seconds gets you 12 miles per gallon. What don’t you understand about that?

SteveLehto > 4b11t
08/02/2015 at 12:01

Per gallon of WHAT?

bottsdotts > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 12:01

Kinja'd!!!

If only it was grounded to the ground, they might have kept producing it.

K5ING > SteveLehto
08/02/2015 at 12:02

Just as an aside, I was going though a Turbine car website awhile back and found this styling buck of a 1962 Chrysler Typhoon Turbine. Enjoy!

Kinja'd!!!

SteveLehto > K5ING
08/02/2015 at 12:04

Yes, that is very cool. There is some question as to how complete or real that car was.