As if we needed more evidence on the sad state of Lincoln

"sm70- why not Duesenberg?" (sm70-whynotduesenberg) 07/16/2015 at 19:07 • Filed to: None

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Car and Driver ranks every vehicle they test within its own segment, and displays that rank on the home page for that model. Right about now, I’m guessing Lincoln wishes they wouldn’t.

Yes, according to Car & Driver, the only luxury cars ON THE ENTIRE MARKET that are worse than a Lincoln are that weird Infinti hatchback thing, an outdated Cadillac version of the Lexus RX, and the absurdly expensive ( !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , please don’t kill me) Cruiser twins.

Cherry_man1 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:09

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Doing better then Caddy!

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Cherry_man1 07/16/2015 at 19:10

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That is the only segment in which that is true. Plus, the SRX is due for a (very badly needed) replacement.

scoob > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:12

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I thought the Land Cruiser and LX were solid choices?

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > scoob 07/16/2015 at 19:14

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They’re good cars, but unless your are looking for off-roadability and longevity as your primary two objectives in buying a full-sized luxury SUV (which 90% of buyers aren’t) then you’re better off with something else.

El Rivinado > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:16

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Keep in mind, Car and Driver is also strongly biased towards the Germans as well. For them, “Everything must be sporty” and “Everything must carve corners” and “If it’s not made in Stuttgart is crap!” While I will agree that most of Lincoln is not competitive in comparison to the others, I would also argue that they represent a vastly different segment of luxury cars than most. I mean, I think that putting the G-Wagon in third place is tantamount to that, as much as I like it, it’s not refined in the slightest compared to others in the full-size luxury class and at over 100 grand, I would want something that didn’t ride like it was on a rock-tumbler and had more accouterments than just chrome and a V12 engine.

Carl (@stuffcarlsays) > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:18

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I argue the S80 is still a magnificent steed.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > El Rivinado 07/16/2015 at 19:19

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I will agree that the Lincolns are often put in categories with unsuitable cars (no one cross shops a Ghibli and an MKS). But my main point is that even against the cars they should be compared to, they don’t stack up.

Also, despite what you see here, I don’t think Car & Driver is particularly strongly biased towards German cars. I’ve read pleanty of articles where they’ve triumphantly announced that the American/Japanese underdog has outgunned the German competitor.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Carl (@stuffcarlsays) 07/16/2015 at 19:19

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Which it is, for 2006.

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > Carl (@stuffcarlsays) 07/16/2015 at 19:23

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Yeah, I’m a bit saddened by Volvo’s low rankings.

El Rivinado > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:31

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Fair point to be made, but I also think that this list has a lot of head-scratching stuff that to me at least, seems a lot more questionable. I will admit that most of the cars that are in last (With the exception of the MKZ I would argue) are in desperate need of refreshes/being killed off, but I also argue there’s a lot of head scratching stuff as well.

Comparing the Navigator to and saying it competes less than the Escalade or Range Rover is a fair comparison, against a G-Class though? That I think is a huge stretch, since both are so vastly different it just doesn’t warrant a fair comparison. The MKZ against the 3-series or C-Class, plausible. Against the Buick Regal and Volkswagen CC, again bit of a stretch. The MKC against most of it's competition, fair enough, against the XC70, X4, and RDX? I don't buy that.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > El Rivinado 07/16/2015 at 19:33

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Honestly, I think the MKZ competes much more closely against a CC or Regal than a C-Class or 3 series. You’re right about the G-Class, I guess they just don’t have anywhere else to stick it. Same with the XC70 and the X4.

The RDX is Acura’s competitor the the X3, Q5, GLK, and as such, the MKC.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:46

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They haven’t even tested the redesigned 2016 model, and if it’s at least as good as the new Edge, I’m sure it’ll move up at least a few spots once they do test it.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:48

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Most of the cars in this class, you can’t even compare the MKZ to fairly.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:50

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Another case of unfair comparison. The Navigator is more fairly compared to vehicles like the Chevrolet Suburban LTZ, GMC Yukon Denali, and the Citadel trim Dodge Durango.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:50

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This...is to be expected.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:52

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Again, this doesn’t seem like a fair comparison. The only ones here that seem to fairly compare to the MKC are the SRX, QX50, RDX, RX, and maybe the XC60.

Heck, the XC70 is a station wagon, so it doesn’t really belong here in the first place, otherwise you could easily throw a top trim Outback into the mix, along with the A4 Allroad Quattro, but neither of them are here.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:52

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Also expected.

Brian, The Life of > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 19:54

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And yet they seem to sell the piss out of the MKZ

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > carcrasher88 07/16/2015 at 20:44

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What you’re essentially saying there is that Lincoln shouldn’t be considered a luxury brand, but more of a top trim Ford. Which is the entire problem.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Brian, The Life of 07/16/2015 at 20:48

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Plenty of people want a high trim fusion. It’s not a bad car, it’s just not a true bespoke luxury car.

carcrasher88 > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 21:55

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They’re a luxury brand, but they just don’t match up to the big three German brands, or even Lexus and Infiniti just yet.

They’ve still got a ways to go, I’d say they’re above Buick, on par with Acura at the moment, but behind Volvo and well behind Audi, BMW, M-B, Cadillac, Infinti, Lexus, and luxury models from Hyundai and Kia.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > carcrasher88 07/16/2015 at 22:33

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Exactly. As is, they slot somewhere between “top trim Fords” and true luxury cars. Just saying, “they’re a luxury car that just happens to be not as good as other luxury cars” proves there is a problem. And Acura isn’t a good thing to be on par with right now, as they’re having a similar problem.

Vicente Esteve > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 23:06

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I LOVE HER

Seriously, it isn’t anywhere near as bad as every journalist says. They have become so pedantic that a simple, good, big SUV with great comfort isn’t enough because Sync makes you wait 0.03 seconds more for a response and it doesn’t corner .96 G. In the week I drove it I found it to be excellent.

Spasoje > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 23:11

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What is the S80 doing behind the ES? I’ve driven both and the S80 beats the ES in basically every tangible way, at least...

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Vicente Esteve 07/16/2015 at 23:19

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The Navigator is very good, most of the reviews say so. They just like the other bug trucks better.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Spasoje 07/16/2015 at 23:20

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Dunno. Only explanation I can think of is the Volvo’s age.

Vicente Esteve > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 07/16/2015 at 23:23

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*Very VERY good.