Is Carmax full of shit? 2015 used car pricing

"TheOnelectronic" (theoneelectronic) 07/07/2015 at 14:28 • Filed to: None

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Found a gorgeous 2015 STI launch edition at Carmax with 10k miles. Problem is, they want a hair under $38k for it.

That is literally the sticker price of the car brand new. I checked their website, and they have roughly the same price on all 2015 STIs they have. Is this some quirk of used car pricing because the 2016’s aren’t out yet and 2015 is still “technically” new? Or is Carmax just figuring they can so they will?

I honestly probably wouldn’t be considering this except I’ve been trying to get an STI in this color combination since my youth. It’s my white whale, so to speak. 996 Turbo vs. E92 M3 vs. 2015 STI is a weird choice to make.

LongbowMkII > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:32

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They can probably get away with it since there’s likely a wait for a new STi at the Subaru dealership. Don’t underestimate instant gratifaction.

jkm7680 > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:33

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Carmax is consistently overpriced. I don’t even bother with them.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:35

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I’ve seen it said in this space that CarMax is usually either spot-on or wildly optimistic. You could wait them out and see if they lower the price. And as someone else said in this space - see what dealers are getting and if there’s a waiting list. And then there’s that CarMax warranty ... mmmm, DeMuro.

OPPOsaurus WRX > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:37

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i was looking at the values for my hatch and its the same as the day I bought it. I looked on cars.com and kbb for that.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:40

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Get the turbo or M3 now, which are nearing the bottom of their depreciation curves, and then buy an STI once the “new”ness has worn off some.

Doug DeMuro > Steve in Manhattan 07/07/2015 at 14:43

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Spot on or wildly optimistic is my assessment too.

Remember you can always go somewhere else!

TheOnelectronic > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/07/2015 at 14:46

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I have a feeling the E92 still has a loooong way to go down. E46’s are being sold for pocket change these days.

996 turbo is probably AT the bottom, if not coming back up, but the maintenance on those is absurd. Changing the clutch is a 22-hour job if you go through a mechanic, and if you do it yourself nobody will touch the car at resale because it wasn’t done by a “professional.”

Not to mention how expensive the parts are.

But yes, that is one of the major things holding me back on the STI (besides the compartitively uninteresting engine).

Textured Soy Protein > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:48

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They’re probably trying to charge the “so you want to buy this limited production car right now but can’t find a new one at any dealers around here” tax.

There are 758 new 2015 or 2016 STIs posted on Auto Trader in the US right now. Not exactly super scarce, but also may not be distributed evenly around the country, and depending on where the Carmax cars are located, there may not be many other cars in those locations.

dogisbadob > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:49

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ummmm, Carmax prices are famous for being high. They’re not exactly Harry’s Cheap Cars.

TheOnelectronic > Doug DeMuro 07/07/2015 at 14:52

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Honestly I like working with Carmax because there’s no bullshit to deal with. Also, while you’re here; one of the other cars I’m looking at is the 996 turbo, but since they’re all hundreds of miles away and people aren’t keen on test drives, I thought I’d ask your opinion since you’re the one who made me look at them in the first place;

I’ve driven a 997 Carrera 2 pretty extensively, but that’s my only 911 experience besides a brief freeway loop in a 991 C4S a while back. (which was actually the subject of my first oppo post. HISTORY!)

Can you offer any insight as to how the two are similar/different? The engine’s pretty easy to figure out, but I’m more interested in the chassis as many people have described the 996 as being more “sports car” to the 997’s more GT-biased nature.

TheOnelectronic > Steve in Manhattan 07/07/2015 at 14:53

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One of the big draws of the STI (Or the M3, even) over the 996 is they’re both still under factory warranty if anything goes tits-up. It reduces some of the stress of making sure you get something mechanically sound.

TheOnelectronic > Textured Soy Protein 07/07/2015 at 14:54

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That sounds super plentiful to me. There are 80 996 Turbos on autotrader nationwide.

TheOnelectronic > dogisbadob 07/07/2015 at 14:56

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Honestly I’ll tolerate a bit of a markup to not have to deal with the bullshit that Harry’s Cheap (totally not stolen) Cars would entail, but the irony is that with a car this new there’s less to be concerned about in terms of vehicle quality.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:56

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Beat up, high mileage E46s. Well-kept, mostly stock, low mileage ones still bring a decent price. Same will be able to be said for E9Xs, but you’re right, they still have some room to fall. They are the last naturally aspirated ///M car, and the last with a hydraulic rack, so we’ll see how that factors in going forward. Mine’s a four door, and a manual - only ~3000 of those in North America.

When are they planning to update the STI’s engine?

Steve in Manhattan > Doug DeMuro 07/07/2015 at 14:59

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Like Japan, as you did - although he’d have to wait 25 years.

TheOnelectronic > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/07/2015 at 14:59

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I don’t know. Subaru’s response is “The EJ25 is proven, we want to see how the FA does in the WRX before putting it in the STI. If STI owners want more power, there’s a very large aftermarket to cater to that.”

I got a test drive, but the cars I’ve driven in the past week include a 458, Aventador, GTR, and an S6, so my sense of “fast” is horribly distorted. Going back today with my FoST to try to drive them back-to-back and compare.

dogisbadob > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 14:59

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So do a lot of people, hence why Carmax charges what they do. And now they have to subsidize DeMuro too!

Some rare models don’t depreciate, and maybe an unmolested Launch Edition is one of them, with the blue/gold color scheme that ALL WRX/STI’s should have!

Head gaskets. it’s what makes a Subaru a Subaru.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:01

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Hahaha - you may be ruined for life.

TheOnelectronic > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/07/2015 at 15:03

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I think riding motorcycles took care of that a long time ago. Of those cars, only the Aventador and GTR really felt fast.

TheOnelectronic > dogisbadob 07/07/2015 at 15:04

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I’m not going to put any stock into that. With a couple hundred bucks of powder coating anyone with a WR Blue STI can have gold wheels. Honestly my biggest thing is the lack of a sunroof. It’s why I have plenty of headroom in the STI, but when I looked at WRX’s last year I couldn’t drive it without my head being craned to the side.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:05

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I am a big fan of a warranty - the last car I had before I moved here, a ‘97 SHO, got 4 new in-trunk 6-CD changers after the first one failed. For the last 2, the car was out of warranty, but since the problem had been flagged, Ford took care of it. Of course, the fault was JBL’s, but Ford stepped up.

Doug DeMuro > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:06

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The 996 TT is a lot more raw. It’s clearly older and power delivery is like an old school turbo. I love it. The n/a 997 is way more of a luxury car — far more composed, slower, feels bigger, nicer interior, less “Porsche” and more “Lexus” (to me). I personally dramatically prefer the 996TT to any 997 except the GT cars.

TheOnelectronic > Doug DeMuro 07/07/2015 at 15:08

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Glad to get your input. I never know how much to trust guys on Porsche forums. They’d swear they could feel the difference after removing their cupholders.

jkm7680 > dogisbadob 07/07/2015 at 15:14

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I once saw an old ass Aveo on Carmax. It was a piece of automatic shit, it was a sedan. It was $12,000.

dogisbadob > jkm7680 07/07/2015 at 15:18

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Again, the Demuro tax :(

Gotta get that extended warranty! Probably the worst non-European car of the past 10 years. Thankfully the Sonic is 1000x better!

Tripper > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:19

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Current E90M3 owner, former owner of an E46 M3 and an 04 STi. I just recently drove a 15 STi, as we were tossing around the idea of trading my fiance’s Cooper S on one (shes keeping the cooper).

The STi was and is a great car but there is no way I take one over either M3. You can make a deal on an E9x if you’re patient. I found a CPO E90 that had been sitting at a BMW dealer for 3 months. Took it for less than the price of a new STi with an extended warranty, that was in Nov of 2013.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:31

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22 hours? How can that be?! Do you have to take the engine out?

Steve in Manhattan > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/07/2015 at 15:33

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Indeed - he might be.

TheOnelectronic > Steve in Manhattan 07/07/2015 at 15:35

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Bingo!

You have to drop the engine to do almost anything with that car beyond fluids/belts.

mazda616 > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:50

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The closest CarMax to me is always, always overpriced. On everything. From shitty ten-year-old GM products to practically brand new Benzes. All overpriced. Honestly I don't know how they sell any cars.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 15:52

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Interesting. I rode a CBR1000RR for years, and it was amazing! It doesn’t just distort your perception of speed, it distorts your perception of reality. I remember riding my roommates R6 once after I’d had the 1000 for a while, and thinking how slow it was. And then I thought “Who the hell thinks a 600cc sport bike is slow?!?”

I’ve also driven a 458, and I think there’s a nugget of truth to your statement. I haven’t driven any of the others, but I recall that while the 458 absolutely IS stupid fast, it’s so incredibly composed that you don’t feel it. Like, doing 120 feels just like doing 50. There’s sound and stuff whizzing buy and its kind of exciting but at the same time there’s very little actual drama.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 16:17

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I can imagine a Ferrari owner taking an engine-out diagnosis in stride. But for someone who spent half the cost of a 438 on a 911, I’m guessing that would be a game changer.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 16:19

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Something just hit me - why was this car sold to CarMax? Not even a year old, 10K - what happened here?

TheOnelectronic > Steve in Manhattan 07/07/2015 at 20:55

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My guess is he came across something cooler and faster. A lot of STI’s get bought so the owner can have the fastest car around, and especially anymore that’s not the case. It honestly felt a bit sluggish compared to my FoST. It had mountains of pull taking off from a start but it seemed to run out of steam very quickly.

TheOnelectronic > Steve in Manhattan 07/07/2015 at 20:56

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I think a lot of people buy the used ones thinking they’re getting a smoking fast car for $40k and don’t realize they’re going to be paying for parts and maintenance for a $150k supercar.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 22:08

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You would think the former owner would have test driven everything and not made that mistake.

Steve in Manhattan > TheOnelectronic 07/07/2015 at 22:17

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Yeah - I always talk about getting a Boxster if I ‘had’ to buy a car, but now I wonder what I would be letting myself in for ....

TheOnelectronic > Steve in Manhattan 07/07/2015 at 22:28

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Boxster wouldn’t be so bad; it’s mid-engine and if it’s anything like the Cayman, there’s an access panel to get to it from above.