Miata VS Cyclist Instant Karma

"Milky" (jordanmielke) 06/10/2015 at 10:28 • Filed to: Miata, Cyclist, Karma, Road Rage, Fail

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EDIT: Picture for the person who is dismissing my comments because I “hate cyclists”.

CCC (formerly CyclistCarCoexist) > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:31

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Tiny curbs: -a cyclists worst friend, incites hilarity

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:33

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The way I see it, the cyclist did nothing wrong.... Except run into the curb

davedave1111 > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:35

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You realise the cyclist was entirely correct there, right? Well, apart from being stupid enough to fall off while trying to look over his/her shoulder. Karma would have been if the MX-5 driver was instantly pulled-over and fined, which is what I was expecting to see.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:36

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wow, so this d-bag passes someone in the bikelane who had just passed him, but by passing him goes out of the bike lane and into a live traffic lane without checking for motorist traffic or signalling that he was coming out, then gets pissed he’s honked at.

Totally earned his wipe out.

Attention Cyclists - when car guys say they hate cyclists, it’s not all of you. It’s people like this idiot.

Milky > davedave1111 06/10/2015 at 10:39

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Going for a pass right when the miata doesnt have room to go around and not looking first and saying “fuck off” counts as a D-bag to me.

Milky > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 10:41

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I think passing at right when there is a median and saying fuck off counts as wrong.

blacktruck18 > davedave1111 06/10/2015 at 10:42

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Legally he may have been within the law but, he probably should have at least checked to see if it was a good time to pull out and pass. If the vehicle had been something bigger he could have been run over. Legal maybe, intelligent not so much.

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:42

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It’s in the fucking UK where they drive on the left and pass on the right... And if he didn’t pas the cyclist when there’s a median, the driver would’ve passed both cyclists at the median. This is called a pinch point and often causes car on bike accidents because motorists get impatient and pass where they shouldn’t. Now bicycles can fit so he did the right thing. In order for a car to pass a bike legally and safely, the motorist needs to give the cyclist 3 feet of space between his car and the bike

Milky > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 10:43

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Even when you switch “lanes” in car you check first. This guy straight went for it when there was a median too.

Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero > davedave1111 06/10/2015 at 10:43

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Yeah no completely the cyclists fault. Went to pass in live traffic without looking first. The miata didn’t do anything wrong

Autophile412 - what's the world got in store? > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:44

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I love the laugh when the rider bites the curb.

Berang > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:45

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I’m trying to figure out what the cyclist did wrong... other than take their eyes off of the road because somebody decided to honk at them.

(I’m not saying I wouldn’t have honked though)

TheVancen- In Pursuit of a Greater Payday and Car Parts > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 10:45

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I don’t like cyclists.

GTI Sprinks > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:46

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Sorry, bike has lead, has a gap, miata can wait. Horn was unnecessary. Miata was wrong, honking at a cyclist for such a minor grievance is wrong, middle finger is appropriate response. Crashing into curb or catching bar on light post (couldn’t tell which honestly) was just an unfortunate side effect.

Milky > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 10:46

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Disregard “at” in my sentence. The cyclist didn’t look to pass and went for the pass when there was a median aka no room to go around. For all we know the Miata could have been almost forced into the median to avoid the cyclist.

tromoly > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:47

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The Miata was in the wrong. Bicycles are to be treated as vehicles on the road, no different than another car or a farm tractor, as such the Miata would have had to wait to pass until traffic allowed.

The bigger problem is how that road transitions the bike lane out of the road, that’s just asking for trouble.

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:48

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And that would have been wrong on the Miata’s part. You never pass a cyclist in a car at a pinch point. What if there’s a pothole that the cyclist needs to suddenly avoid and needs to enter the street? That wouldn’t be a problem if a car passed a cyclist legally (3ft). Notice how the box van prior to the miata passed. That space would allow a cyclist to leave the bike lane for any given reason

Milky > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 10:50

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You look before switching lanes in a car right?

Milky > tromoly 06/10/2015 at 10:51

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As the driver of a vehicle on the road you look before switching lanes right?

Milky > Berang 06/10/2015 at 10:52

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IMHO switching lanes without looking at a point where the Miata could have been forced into the median.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > davedave1111 06/10/2015 at 10:53

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No look back before he pulled out to overtake, you can’t do that. Source: been cycling regularly for a decade.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 10:56

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Agreed, been cycling for a long time and this guy symbolises why people hate us. Always check before moving out, signal if possible.

Milky > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 10:57

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Wait so now you’re saying when there is a bike lane, a car lane and median you can’t pass the cyclist? What the hell happened to “same road, same rules”. If you’re switching lanes at least look first …. riding or driving anything. You can’t just pull into traffic whenever you want, I don’t care what you’re on/in.

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:57

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He wasn’t switching lanes

GTI Sprinks > Milky 06/10/2015 at 10:59

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Of course. But i also tend to use situational awareness to know where cars are before i even consider a lane change as well thus not always needing a quick glance. Granted, i’ve cycle commuted for over 10 years, so it’s certainly something developed as part of defensive driving.
As you said earlier, not every cyclist is terrible. But no one is infallible. 99% of people who use their horns on a cyclist deserve a middle-finger. From video, it appeared miata was quite a distance off of lead vehicle and had ample breaking time. Miata didn’t need to honk and was a dick.

haveacarortwoorthree > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 10:59

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Cyclist is completely in the wrong. Moved right into traffic to overtake without even glancing to see what was there. Exactly the purpose of a short honk — “Hey dude, car here. Please don’t do that again because I don’t want to hit you.” Response was cursing and the finger. Then karma strikes! Even the other cyclist laughed at him.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 10:59

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I live in the UK and cycle regularly. The cyclist was very much in the wrong.

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:00

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That’s what I’m saying. This is a pinch point and if the Miata passed, it would put the Miata dangerously close to the cyclists. Ie that would be wrong

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:01

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he passed someone, without signaling that he was changing lanes. We ARE treating him as a vehicle. he moved out of the bike lane and into the motorist lane. No signal and didn’t check to see if it was safe.

tromoly > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:01

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Problem is the road doesn’t look wide enough for the Miata to safely pass the riders at that spot in the first place. As the driver of a vehicle you ensure you can safely make the pass before attempting it right?

Apparently I’m in the minority here, but I give as much room as possible for anything moving slower on the road, be it a cyclist, person walking, someone with car trouble stopped on the shoulder, or if passing a slower farm implement. If that means slowing down until traffic in the other lane is gone and I can move over before reaching whatever is moving slower I’d do it every single time no questions asked.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:02

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Imagine if he changed lanes with the miata a little closer, and someone next to the miata, he’s got no where to swerve out of the way of the cyclist.

How are people not getting this? guy didn’t check to see if it was safe and just passed with no signal moving lanes. wtf?

Bouldaru > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 11:03

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We don’t know he didn’t signal. But you’re absolutely right, he didn’t check. But he’s not in the wrong, the Miata should not have initiated a pass maneuver

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 06/10/2015 at 11:04

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it’s insanity. I get most roads don’t have bike lanes, congrats you actually got one, this should help you to stay SAFE on the road. Why would you move out into traffic without seeing if it’s safe?!

Milky > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:05

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Agree to disagree.

GTI Sprinks > haveacarortwoorthree 06/10/2015 at 11:05

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We can all disagree on this all day. :cheers:

Bouldaru > tromoly 06/10/2015 at 11:06

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I’m with you on this

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:07

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If you say so

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 11:08

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Exactly, it should be treated as any other lane change. You wouldn’t lane change in a car without looking, why would you do it on a bike.

LongbowMkII > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 11:08

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100% of people who change lanes without looking deserve to be honked at.

Milky > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 11:09

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For all we know the Miata had to brake first and then honk.

Thats really not that far either way.

Bouldaru > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:09

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Just tell me. Do you see anything wrong with this pass?

Berang > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:11

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We don’t know that the cyclist doesn’t have a helmet mirror (they do after all have a camera). It’s sort of beside the point since there was space to move over anyway. Miata driver may have honked to say “hey there’s a car behind you” or they may have just gotten mad that their commute was lengthened by a fraction of a second by somebody else using the road. Either way the cyclist didn’t do anything wrong at that point.

LongbowMkII > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:13

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so he was passing in the same lane. even worse.

(it’s a lane change)

GTI Sprinks > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:13

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As you said in other comments, agree to disagree. 25mph road (evident from slow moving lorry in the lead), that’s all you need man. That and the miata had the entirety of the other lane to bare right to which the driver does only after honking.
Agree to disagree. I see you’ve also defended the miata in nearly every other comment, so clearly, your bias and my bias will tend to be on the other ends of one another. Good day.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:16

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A pass maneuver?

No.

Just no.

The cyclist left his lane and moved into the Miata’s lane without signaling. That’s the cyclists fault. It is correct to honk to alert the cyclist that he’s moving into you. Cyclist is 100% in the wrong.

The Cyclist LEFT his lane. He was in a bike lane. I get he has the right to pass slower traffic in his lane as well. WHEN IT’S SAFE.

Bouldaru > LongbowMkII 06/10/2015 at 11:16

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A bike lane is not a “lane” per se. It’s a small amount of road that cyclists are allowed to deviate from if the conditions call for it. That’s why it’s illegal to pass cyclists too close

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 06/10/2015 at 11:17

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Exactly.

Seriously, Miata traveling along minding his own business.

Cyclists crosses over into another lane.

How could anything be Miata’s fault? For honking? It’s 100% correct to honk at someone who changes lanes without signaling and is getting close to you. It’s called syaing “HEY I’M OVER HERE WATCH IT”

Milky > tromoly 06/10/2015 at 11:18

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IMO its not a “pass” if you’re just staying in your lane . Which is what the Miata was doing and cyclist was not. Also seeing how the box truck fits in one lane there seems to be plenty of room.

Milky > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:18

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You seem confused on who “initiated a pass maneuver”.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:20

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As Milky has shown you, the cyclists have their own lane in this scenario.

When they leave that lane without signaling that’s an illegal lane change.

You want the same rights and rules for cyclists, this guy is the reason motorists hate cyclists.

Come on. That’s a lane change that was dangerous. The Cyclist made the dangerous move.

Rainbow > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 11:21

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How do you know he didn’t signal? And how do you know he doesn’t have a helmet-mounted mirror?

Quattro-luvr, Powered by Datsun & Stinger > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 11:22

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Does seem like he hooked the light pole doesn’t it.

GTI Sprinks > Quattro-luvr, Powered by Datsun & Stinger 06/10/2015 at 11:24

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Looks that way. Immediate pull to left as light pole exits frame. Hard to tell as curbing would typically yield a similar reaction, although there should be a moment where it’s a bounce from the curb followed by overcorrection.

tromoly > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:25

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Your picture shows when the box truck goes around the bicycles, they are still in the bike lane. When the Miata tries to go around the bicycles, the bike lane has ended and they are now sharing the same main-road lane. Completely different scenario.

haveacarortwoorthree > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 11:26

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And that’s the way you can have a pleasant disagreement, even on the interwebs!

Milky > Berang 06/10/2015 at 11:27

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I’m confused on how “there was space to move over”, he crossed the dotted line into another lane. Granted he could have had a mirror and signaled, but thats a positive assumption for the cyclist.

LongbowMkII > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:27

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the conditions clearly did not call for it. either it was a single lane or it isn’t. if you want to claim that the median presented a dangerous area to pass, why is the cyclist allowed to pass? either bikes are to be treated the same, or they aren’t.

it’s also illegal to run redlights (0:30)

Bouldaru > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 11:27

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How do you know he signaled or didn’t?

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:29

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Fine, maybe he signalled. Everytime you signal doesn’t mean it’s safe to go. judging by the movements of the camera it didn’t seem like he took the time. He sure as hell didn’t look.

If he signaled great. It doesn’t even matter it was an unsafe time for him to pass another cyclist.

Milky > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 11:30

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Well I’ve defended the Miata because I said “instant karma” in the title, thats just how I view this situation.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 11:30

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I commute most days on a bicycle. It’s the motor cycles that I hate. And this is California, Land of Lane Splitting. Anarchy.

Milky > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:32

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Yea the cyclist was in the lane and so was the truck. Avalanche should’ve waited for clear traffic to go around …. just like the cyclist we’re talking about. Same road, same rules.

Berang > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:35

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There is no vehicle in the space the cyclists moves into in the “other” lane. Further if you watch closely you will see the bike lane actually ends at that point anyway.

Milky > tromoly 06/10/2015 at 11:37

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Ahh no the cyclist is already crossing into the car lane in that photo. The Miata could be right by his side for all we know … because the cyclist never looked.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 06/10/2015 at 11:40

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Thankfully I don’t deal with Lane Splitting.

Honestly I’m just always paranoid and double/triple checking to make sure I don’t squish anyone on any type of cycle.

that’s what pisses me off about this guy vs miata above. Guy on the bike pulled a hugely dangerous/dick move and people are saying it’s the miata’s fault.

Milky > Berang 06/10/2015 at 11:43

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The Miata could be there, the cyclist didn’t look!

The bike lane also ends after the median.

Also, also you quoted me wrong. Sorry, pet-peeve of mine.

tromoly > Milky 06/10/2015 at 11:52

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You can see his front wheel? I sure can’t, unless you’re assuming by the peak on his helmet, which considering the peak isn’t centered in the video means it’s a poor indicator of where the front wheel is.

When you’re on a bike you can hear cars around you, and your perephrial vision definitely still works on a bike. I highly doubt the Miata was at his side when he made the move.

Further, he gained speed and made a move to show intent several seconds before actually passing, judging by how the Miata had to slow down and swerve it looks like the Miata was not expecting the road to narrow and did not leave enough side gap between itself and the riders and was caught out.

Forgetful > GTI Sprinks 06/10/2015 at 11:58

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Sorry, but if bike wants to change lanes, bike should signal and shoulder check like every other road user.

Wacko > Bouldaru 06/10/2015 at 11:59

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no but he crossed over the lines, meaning he was no-longer in the bike lane and in traffic without looking. So he cut off the miata to pass someone.

Milky > tromoly 06/10/2015 at 12:02

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Everytime he looks down it looks pretty damn centered to me.

Also the other biker laughed at him ….. that might be all the evidence you need.

tromoly > Milky 06/10/2015 at 12:12

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Um, that tire and helmet peak are not centered in any of those glimpses.....

You hate cyclists, you don’t give a shit that the cyclist may not have done anything illegal, you’re going to blame the cyclist. For these reasons I am done posting in this thread, any further replies from you will be dismissed and will not be reciprocated. Good day sir.

Berang > LongbowMkII 06/10/2015 at 12:19

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I’m just curious if you have ever compared the width of a bicycle to the width of a car?

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > davedave1111 06/10/2015 at 12:32

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What, pull out in front of a moving vehicle? Karma would have been getting hit.

LongbowMkII > Berang 06/10/2015 at 12:37

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that’s beside the point if you want the law to apply universally. Either bikes are the same or they are different. “sometimes” is a term to be avoided in law.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 12:38

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YouTube is filtered at my job. Will have to view tonight.

William Byrd > Milky 06/10/2015 at 12:38

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I’m with you on this one. Cyclists want “the same courtesy and rights as drivers” which I agree they should have. However many (esp. here in DC) don’t extend that courtesy back.

Bottom line - If the cyclist was in a car and changed lanes in front of you driving your Miata without looking (and while going much slower) and then yelled “fack off” after said cut off, he would be in the wrong. Same thing here. He was in his bike lane, he left that lane and moved into the lane next to him and obviously cut off the Miata who registered their displeasure.

Not saying he derved the curb rash. But it was funny.

Berang > LongbowMkII 06/10/2015 at 12:43

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I don’t know what England’s laws are (and it appears the only person here who has any idea is getting told they don’t know anything by everybody else) - but in many states there are practical exceptions made to road law regarding bicycles. Most of them are made to benefit us drivers of motor vehicles.

A good example is the 3’ passing rule. You have to leave at least 3’ between you and the bicycle you’re passing. In some states a bicycle is treated the same as a Slow Moving Vehicle, meaning you must by law give the bicycle the whole lane when passing. Of course since nobody knows anything about driving cars nobody does this anyway, and they only get ticketed for it when they kill somebody. Obviously though a bicycle is not as big as a tractor so the 3’ rule makes practical sense.

The Dummy Gummy > Milky 06/10/2015 at 12:59

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There are two wrongs here; Biker not checking before passing, but he had the right of way and space before the lane shrinking quickly; Miata getting butt hurt for basically no reason as you see the biker attempting the pass 4-5seconds prior the Miata honking; meaning the biker didn’t cut him off.

/awaits the pain of irrational disagreement

Milky > William Byrd 06/10/2015 at 13:00

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Thank you, thats exactly how I feel. These comments have gotten out of hand.

LongbowMkII > Berang 06/10/2015 at 13:01

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A Miata can easily pass a bike with room to spare in that lane provided that the bike doesn’t pull into the lane without looking.

Milky > The Dummy Gummy 06/10/2015 at 13:02

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I’ve already commented too much in here, so I’ll leave this.

Berang > LongbowMkII 06/10/2015 at 13:06

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Let’s say just for example the cyclist was instead driving a car, and he moves over 3’ feet to pass the slower cyclist. Then the miata rear ends him. Miata is still at fault.

OldRoadster939 > davedave1111 06/10/2015 at 13:14

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Nope. He swung out into traffic without looking. He got honked, he mouthed off to the car driver, then ate the curb. Entirely his fault. Glad to see that apparently only his pride was injured.

LongbowMkII > Berang 06/10/2015 at 13:20

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this actually happens quite often, it’s called being cut off. the one changing lanes dangerously is at fault. the vehicle staying in-lane has NO obligation to yeild to the one changing lanes.

no one hit anything in this instance. just a honk because the miata was cut off. honking was a completely appropriate response to being cut off. cyclist responded...poorly.

Berang > LongbowMkII 06/10/2015 at 13:27

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He’s not really changing lanes though because the bike lane ends. The bike lane doesn’t even exist on the portion of road where the cyclist passes the slower cyclist. He is in the lane passing the other bike, exactly the same way the miata passes the other bike only a few seconds later.

If the bike lane had continued it’d still be hard to fault the cyclist for passing the slower cyclist - nobody is in the lane to his right, and they’re moving fast enough that they’re not holding up traffic.

Nobody in any of the vehicles here is doing anything crazy.

Meatcoma > Milky 06/10/2015 at 13:39

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isn’t the bike lane to the right of the white line? It looks like the cyclist wasn’t even in the bike lane. If that is one. The avalanche could have moved over some easily. Dangerous and dickish but no one died.

BigBlock440 > Berang 06/10/2015 at 13:40

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So the bike lane ends and he has to merge left. So he merges left without looking and cuts off the car. Typically in America, the lane that does not end has the right of way, and if you merge without looking and hit someone, you are at fault.

Berang > BigBlock440 06/10/2015 at 13:45

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It’s a false comparison, even in the U.S. bike lanes are not treated the same as “regular” lanes - the fact that cars aren’t supposed to drive in them (nor are they the same size as car lanes) says enough. If we want to go down that tack, thousands of motorists break the law every day when they turn across bike lines without first merging into the bike lane. But I don’t know what U.K. laws are.

BigBlock440 > Berang 06/10/2015 at 13:50

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So you’re in the “sometime cyclists are cars, sometimes they’re not” camp? Ok. What are the guidelines for when they should be expected to follow “car” rules, and when should they be expected to not follow “car” rules and instead act unpredictably?

Berang > BigBlock440 06/10/2015 at 13:56

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Check your state’s laws. They’re different everywhere. I’m not saying I want them to be that way. That’s just the way they are. I know in at least one state (Idaho I think?) bicycles don’t even legally have to stop for stop signs. I didn’t write that one, but it’s there.

Most of the time bicycles are treated the same as motor vehicles, or in some places as Slow Moving Vehicles. But sometimes in some places, laws make exceptions for bicycles. When and where? Depends on the state. Most of these exceptions are actually intended to make sharing the road more convenient for motorists, not cyclists though.

BigBlock440 > Berang 06/10/2015 at 13:57

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Well how about that. The answer is sometimes.

Berang > BigBlock440 06/10/2015 at 14:11

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It’s kind like how “sometimes” you can drive through an intersection. But “sometimes” you can’t. Depending on which lights are showing what colors? Absurdity this “sometimes” stuff.

BigBlock440 > Berang 06/10/2015 at 14:20

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But a stop sign doesn’t change colors?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 06/10/2015 at 23:15

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Miata was justified in giving the guy a toot.

Cyclist never looked back before invading the Miata’s lane.

The fall was karma.

#IMHO

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Milky 06/10/2015 at 23:15

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Cyclist was dumb. Fall was karma.

davedave1111 > Milky 06/11/2015 at 03:46

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The cyclist had absolute right of way. The MX-5 tried to overtake a slower vehicle where there was no room to do so, almost hit them, and then hooted at them.

davedave1111 > blacktruck18 06/11/2015 at 03:47

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Defensive riding is always a good idea, but there’s no question that the cyclist was in the right and the MX-5 driver was being a complete dickhead. If a traffic policeman had seen it, the driver would have got a ticket for that at the very least.

davedave1111 > Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero 06/11/2015 at 03:48

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The cyclist had absolute right of way. The MX-5 had no right to do anything other than follow patiently, in that situation.

davedave1111 > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 06/11/2015 at 03:49

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Defensive riding is a good plan wherever you are, because right of way doesn’t matter when you’re in hospital. But the cyclist had every right to pull out there. The MX-5 driver was driving dangerously, not giving the cyclists their equal right of way.

It’s not the cyclist’s fault that the driver decided to pass in a dangerous manner.

davedave1111 > OldRoadster939 06/11/2015 at 03:50

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No, the cyclist was traffic. That was just an insane overtaking manoeuvre from the driver, in a totally insane place. Very dangerous, against the law, not the cyclist’s fault.

Of course defensive riding is always a good plan, but the cyclist unquestionably had right of way.