C4 Corvette Fans of Oppo: School Me? 

"Noah - Now with more boost." (antriebverliebt) 06/08/2015 at 10:27 • Filed to: None

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These have caught my eye lately. Correct me if I’m wrong; I’ve made the following assumptions:

- I can buy a “driver quality” example with a manual transmission for ~ $5000

- They are easy to work on and cheap to maintain (compared to the 80s BMW I used to DD)

- They are fun! Seems like a great bargain jalop car to enjoy over the Summer, no?

Sam > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:31

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Just don’t be under the impression that they’re fast. The only fast C4s are ZR1’s (which will run you north of $10k) and ones which have much modification.

Laird Andrew Neby Bradleigh > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:32

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I’m by no means an expert on the C4, I just love them to death. I have driven a few, but the main thing for me is how they look, I’m a true child of the eighties :P

But I’d say you’re right about your assumptions.

DrScientist > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:34

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i love cars so-obviously-from-the-80s. and these look great from the outside.

the only thing that would keep me from one, is i can’t imagine wanting to spend much time surrounded by the interior. i would say, at least make sure to budget for a more recent model leather seat swap if it has cloth, and an updated sound system, with bluetooth or whatever you need.

mcseanerson > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:35

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I can’t really answer any of these all that well so I’ll let the roadkill guys do it for me.

Also I saw a pretty bitchin’ C4 at an autocross that owned the majority of the cars there.

Noah - Now with more boost. > Laird Andrew Neby Bradleigh 06/08/2015 at 10:36

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Awesome! That’s great to know. And hopefully it will feel quick to me! I’m used to a 4,000 lb barge with 200 hp lol.

Noah - Now with more boost. > mcseanerson 06/08/2015 at 10:36

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this was SO good. watched it twice

Noah - Now with more boost. > DrScientist 06/08/2015 at 10:37

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much appreciated! they do look great.

Noah - Now with more boost. > Sam 06/08/2015 at 10:38

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I bet they will feel quick to me! lol I am used to a 4000 lb boat with 200 horsepower

mcseanerson > DrScientist 06/08/2015 at 10:38

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Only way I’d buy a C4 is with the intention to race it and with that said the interior would be gutted.

DrScientist > DrScientist 06/08/2015 at 10:38

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not including the dash that is...

i could watch these gauges all day.

Sweet Trav > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:38

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The 80’s Tuned Port Injection 350 looks cool, but lacks any real power, especially at the top end, the good news however is that because it's a normal gen1 small block you could rip the engine out and stuff a 383 crate motor in, or rebuild the 350 for some speed, they came with pretty good aluminum heads IIRC, but the TPI intake chokes the motor to death, don't know if there is an aftermarket solution that fits under the stock hood. But Holley makes a stealth ram that can wake these motors up. LSx swaps are a pretty big undertaking from what I remember. If I found a cheap one. I'd probably gut it and stuff a 383 crate motor in it and run the piss out of it

Laird Andrew Neby Bradleigh > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:38

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The C4 isn’t fast as such, but not slow either, I drive a 3200 lb Saab with just 130 hp and any C4 is a damn sight faster than that :P

DrScientist > mcseanerson 06/08/2015 at 10:41

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hopefully you’ll enter a series where the original dash is required. :)

Noah - Now with more boost. > DrScientist 06/08/2015 at 10:42

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The digital dash is awesome, I’d be 100% ok with it!

boxrocket > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:42

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Thoroughly test drive one before driving. I find them cramped, especially the transmission tunnel, which takes away a LOT of right leg room.

Noah - Now with more boost. > Sweet Trav 06/08/2015 at 10:43

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Good to know! yeah there have to be some performance parts available for the 350 to hot it up a little.

Noah - Now with more boost. > boxrocket 06/08/2015 at 10:44

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Noted! I am a small-ish dude (170 LBS) so hopefully it won’t be too bad

random001 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:52

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I owned a '92 for a good while. AMA!

Sweet Trav > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:54

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Im sure a camshaft, intake and some ecu tuning would wake the motor up. Only problem is the 88-92(I think) TPI system is speed density based and not a lot of people tune it.

Flavien Vidal > Sam 06/08/2015 at 10:55

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The base lt1 does 0 to 60mph in 5.1s... the zr1 does it in 4.7s... not exactly slow in my book. And yes I’ve owned one...

mr2gud2u > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:55

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If I was going to buy a C4 it would be the lt1 or lt4s of early 90s. The LTs lasted forever, but they didn’t make the big hp numbers that the LS does. They will run of 200k+ though.

KatzManDu > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 10:56

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Try to stretch your budget to an LT-1 based one if you can. More power, more kinks worked out, and slightly better body design, IMHO. I like the square tailights instead of the round; I don’t like the black middle plastic stripe all the way around the car on the early C4s. The color-matching stripe looks better. The rectangle tailpipe coming off the mufflers look better to me than the round, curved pipes which look almost cartoonish to me.

There are versions with more performance-oriented suspensions (Z51 package) to look for. Many came with run-flats which suck (noisy and hard compound) even though there is a spare!

The 84/85s with the scary “cross-fire” injection which I have no experience with but have been warned away from in the past. TPI/TBI-based ones produce better power, but still have weird emissions equipment (AIR pump) which sucks horsepower. They are all iron-based 350 blocks underneath it all. Rock-solid to wrench on, but also makes it nose-heavy.

LT4-based cars (1996 only) and some LT1-based cars have aluminum heads which fix some of the weight issues.

Noah - Now with more boost. > KatzManDu 06/08/2015 at 11:30

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Great stuff to know, thanks for taking the time to post! I will definitely stay away from the 84/85s then

Noah - Now with more boost. > mr2gud2u 06/08/2015 at 11:30

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I’d love to grab one from that period if my budget allows!

Noah - Now with more boost. > random001 06/08/2015 at 11:31

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How are the seats?!

Noah - Now with more boost. > Sweet Trav 06/08/2015 at 11:33

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aaah yeah that’s strange, it seems like chevy went through a bunch of fuel delivery/emissions setups with the C4

Axial > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 11:39

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I have a ‘96 LT4 and a ‘90 ZR-1. Both manuals; they didn’t come in anything else anyway. :p
I have also driven L98 and 4+3 -equipped Corvettes before.

Do they start around $5000? Depends how you define “driver” quality. There are some decent examples for $5000, sure, but most in a condition that I would consider buying start around $7000. That’s for a car whose paint isn’t faded, whose essentials all function without issue, and whose interior still looks presentable. The manual won’t really command a premium if it’s the Dough-Nash 4+3, but you can expect the ZF6-equipped cars to cost a little more.

Are they cheap and easy to maintain? If you are buying a pre-90, absolutely. The reason I say pre-90 is because interior components from 1990+ cost quite a bit more than those for cars spanning 1984 to 1989. If the car you have is a ‘94-96, then it’s even more expensive to refurbish your interior. The Bose-Gold audio systems are known to be flaky, and the air bladders on the power seats probably won’t work...not that it matters, since the seats are amazing anyway. On the engine, it’s cheaper and easier to replace a standard distributor of the L98 than it is the OptiSpark system of the LT1/LT4. The plugs are also easier to get to on an L98 than on the LT1/LT4. On the flip side, the 4+3 transmission requires regular attention every 10,000 miles or so to change seals and fluid. Never let the overdrive shift on its own, always clutch-in when engaging it. The ZF6 is pretty much trouble-free, just know that the dual-mass flywheel is irreplaceable if its seals go poof and you need to replace the clutch. You’ll have to switch to a single-mass flywheel at that point, or pay through the nose for somebody’s still-good dual-mass.

Are they fun? Hell yes. Mine are both properly fast, and very grippy (Continental ExtremeContact DW on ‘96, Goodyear Eagles on ‘90). The LT4 is more tossable since it has less weight up front, but the ZR-1 feels more precise. I think its the wider tires and resulting steering resistance making it feel that way. The L98 with the 4+3 transmission. It is exciting around town with all of that down-low torque, but a highway pull will leave you feeling a bit disappointed since it runs out of puff at 4400 RPM. It’ll at least start the sprint with enthusiasm! If the power is unsatisfactory, the number of modifications you can make is endless.

Axial > DrScientist 06/08/2015 at 11:41

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What? No. Any type of C4 seat is miles ahead of the seats in any more recent generation until C7. And if you have the cloth seats, KEEP THEM. They are not common; I’d go so far as to call them rare.

blacktruck18 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 11:51

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I am not a C4 expert but I have owned 2 of them. I personally prefer the later C4 body style, the 91-96’s, I like the more rounded body’s. Also the LT (92-96) motors are a big step up power wise from L-98.

I did pretty much all the maintenance on mine. The only things that are really a pain in the ass are the heater core and the digital dash in the earlier cars. If you buy one with the full digital dash make sure it works when you buy the car. You could spend the whole summer chasing electronic gremlins.

If you do buy an early one don’t buy one with the Doug Nash four speed manual. Parts are getting hard to find for those transmissions. Buy one with the six speed.

Ignore everyone that talks shit about the opti-spark. Aside from it shitting the bed if it gets wet there is nothing wrong with. They last forever if it stays dry which it wilk, as long as the water pump doesn’t go out and you don’t bash it through any huge puddles and your careful if you wash the engine.

blacktruck18 > Sam 06/08/2015 at 11:57

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I hate to argue but, the LT-1 cars are plenty fast. Also the LT-4 cars can beat up on base C5’s all day. I have owned both of them, and power wise they are perfectly fine.

blacktruck18 > Axial 06/08/2015 at 11:58

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Mmmmmmm LT-4 mmmmmnn

DrScientist > Axial 06/08/2015 at 12:01

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youre obviously more knowledgeable here than i. i have sat in exactly one c4. with some ratty cloth seats. (the whole car was rather ratty i must admit.) i only thought the seats might have been improved with time and new models. but i stand corrected. thanks!

random001 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 12:14

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They are amazing! But you can’t be much of a big guy and feel comfortable in them. I’m 6’4”, ~185 lbs, so pretty skinny. The seats are some of the best stock seats I’ve ever sat in. Supportive, solid driving seats. Excellent for an occasion track day or just canyon carving.

I definitely suggest going for an LT-1 car, though. 300/300, excellent support, and just a good engine.

random001 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 12:22

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Depends. Are you small at 5'0"? Or small at 6'0"?

Noah - Now with more boost. > random001 06/08/2015 at 14:25

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lol I should have been more specific, I’m 5’9” and I work out/run daily, so hopefully skinny enough to fit in the seat + short enough to have headroom

Noah - Now with more boost. > random001 06/08/2015 at 14:28

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I’ll shoot for an LT-1! Everyone seems to recommend that. Though this is more of a summer/fall romance situation, so at the same time, I’m sure a non Lt1 in good condition would be fun too? And that’s great to hear, I’m a similar size (6 inches shorter and only a little skinnier lol) so hopefully the seats will be good. The seats in my parents’ civic feel like cardboard covered in felt

Noah - Now with more boost. > Axial 06/08/2015 at 14:31

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So much great info here! Thanks a bunch. This will be a summer/fall romance, so I don’t need the mintiest example. Interesting to hear about the price of interior parts though, that’s a mark against the more modern examples I guess. I’ve heard that the doug nash is pretty iffy, but hopefully I can find an example that has been treated well.

Noah - Now with more boost. > blacktruck18 06/08/2015 at 14:35

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Not surprised re: the digital dash! That’s too bad though, they are so 80s. Good to know, I will avoid it if it’s not working well.

blacktruck18 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 14:42

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I don’t think they are prone to failure, it’s just when something goes wrong it seems to be huge. You should check out the C4 section of Corvetteforum.com, you have to pay for a membership but you can read everything on there. There is tons of good info. Especially the DIY thread.

Sweet Trav > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 15:42

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Rip it all out and slap a carb on it!

Noah - Now with more boost. > blacktruck18 06/08/2015 at 15:43

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Good tip! I was thinking of looking at forums for classifieds too

Noah - Now with more boost. > Sweet Trav 06/08/2015 at 15:44

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hahahah I’m sure that would sound/smell great but I need to get to work! Can’t be stopping to mess with the carb :p

Sweet Trav > KatzManDu 06/08/2015 at 15:56

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You mean Miss-fire injection? Also some 85’s had TPI, I have a complete setup from one sitting in my barn.

Sweet Trav > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 15:59

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Be mindful of the Optispark. It’s not the best system and hates continous high rpm use. Get a mechanic to install a good MSD box and optispark dist.

JayZAyEighty thinks C4+3=C7 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 16:42

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I really enjoy mine. I picked up a decent high miles 4+3 ‘85 for about $5,000 and daily drive it. Lots of fun, 25 mpg highway, reliable enough, damn quick up to a point, fantastic handling (‘84 through ‘87 have a very sporty suspension setup.

-I’ve done a clutch/flywheel job (around $1,000 with a good deal from a mechanic I know well) and I’m looking at a full suspension rebuild soon because these roads are hell on an ancient suspension ($1,495 DIY). That’s bad luck as people generally spend very little.

-L98s make ridiculous torque but little top end power. Waking them up is very simple as they are a gen 1 SBC and they are dead reliable. I can go from a dead stop in 3rd. My ‘85 did 0-30 in 2.4 seconds and 0-60 in 5.6 new, which is far from slow. They still can do over 150mph stock, so it isn’t as if they are completely gutless at speed.

-The Doug Nash 4+3 is by far my favorite transmission ever. They are high maintenance but I enjoy mine enough to make up for it. Change ATF and gear oil every 10,000 miles, disengage the clutch to engage overdrive, and don’t floor it in overdrive regularly and it won’t have problems unless it’s already noticably damaged.

-They are extremely practical with compartments for large cocaine brick storage along with a massive rear hatch area

-Targa top. Chassis flex is bad with the top off but those two words speak for themselves.

Ask me anything you are wondering about!

JayZAyEighty thinks C4+3=C7 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 16:53

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‘85 had TPI and was actually one of the best performing L98 years. ‘85s actually have forged pistons and catless headers (last year for both).

random001 > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 17:10

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Easily enough. A helmet might be an issue with the plastic cladding where the Targa fits in behind your head, but maybe not. You’ll love the seats!

Axial > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/08/2015 at 20:44

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I, personally, enjoy the Doug Nash 4+3. It’s really clicky and and that tickles me, and the overdrive functions give you something else to do with the transmission while driving.

If you have other questions, ask away!

Noah - Now with more boost. > Axial 06/08/2015 at 21:00

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That does sound like a lot of fun! More things to do while driving (as long as they’re driving related) is always good

GhostZ > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/09/2015 at 21:00

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Don’t get one with a digital dash, it will fail and it is a nightmare to replace is my guess. The 300ZX is the same way.

Early C4s had a port-injected small block that was pretty lackluster. The later LT1 models used a different cooling system, aluminum heads, and sequential injection instead of port injection so they made more power. The LT1 and the small block share a lot of parts however, but the LT1 generally has a lower aftermarket.

The early 80s had a 4+3 transmission based on a BW T-10, so it can probably take more power and is cheaper to fix/replace. The ZF one that came later is higher performing with better ratios, but weaker.

So LT1 and ZF6 = better stock, more expensive to buy, more expensive to fix and upgrade.

4+3 and Small block = worse stock, cheaper to buy, cheaper to fix and upgrade.

GhostZ > Sam 06/09/2015 at 21:05

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I’m not sure you could buy a ZR-1 now under $20k. They’re collector pieces.

But $5k on mods on a base LT1 will outrun a ZR-1 in a straight line. And honestly, if you want 400HP in your C4 Corvette... drop in an LS motor and be done with it.

GhostZ > Sweet Trav 06/09/2015 at 21:06

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Doesn’t the LT1 and the small block share the same motor mounts? So you could stuff a 383 crate motor where an LT1 was I think.

Tohru > Noah - Now with more boost. 06/15/2015 at 16:59

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The best year for the C4 was 1989. It was the only year you could get this combination:

Digital dash

L98 small-block with Tuned Port Injection

ZF 6-speed manual

In 1988, it still had the Doug Nash 4+3 (4 speed manual coupled to an automatic overdrive on the top 3 gears). In 1990 the interior was redesigned to have a driver’s side airbag, and they made it look like a Beretta or a Cavalier inside.

Folks rag on the L98, calling it underpowered. It had 240hp and 345lb/ft. of torque. The LT1 that everyone says is better had 300hp and 335lb/ft. of torque. If you want the extra power that much, it would take very little effort to get 60hp extra out of a Gen 1 small-block, and you wouldn’t have OptiSpark to fail.

My dad had an ‘89 Targa with the FX3 suspension package. With the L98 mated to the 6-speed, he could get 34mpg on the Interstate at 70mph.

Tohru > Sweet Trav 06/15/2015 at 17:01

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No power? The L98 has 240hp and 345lb/ft. of torque. I’ve driven an L98 Vette, and I can assure you it has plenty of balls right where you use it in 90% of driving. The LT1 has 60hp more, but how often are you doing 155mph+ speed runs?

Noah - Now with more boost. > Tohru 06/15/2015 at 19:37

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.... and now I have a year to settle on: 1989. Thanks!

Sweet Trav > Tohru 06/15/2015 at 20:37

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And above 4500 RPM these motors die. they need a new cam, and induction system. they are just an updated generation 1 small block. TPI is garbage. Anyone who is going fast has already replaced it.

A bone stock 91 vette would run about a 14 seconds in the quarter mile, a Neon SRT-4 posts roughly the same time as that.

240 and 345 out of a gen 1 SBC is utterly pathetic. a half competent mechanic can make one put out 400+ ft lb of torque and 400hp with nothing more than jegs catalog and happy thoughts.

Tohru > Sweet Trav 06/16/2015 at 06:46

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Exactly - tune up the Gen 1 and then you have more power without the utter garbage that is OptiSpark to deal with.

Also, how often are you driving over 4500rpm?

Sweet Trav > Tohru 06/16/2015 at 09:45

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LSX doesn’t use optispark. And makes a lot of dependable power very easily. It now makes more sense to build an LS motor over any gen I SBC and in most cases even big block Chevy engines. You can build a fuel injection 5.3l that makes 450 hp for about 4k.

A 383 would be a rebuilt on the factory block, and would max out engine speed about 5500-6000 rpm. The problem with these engines is induction and most aftermarket solutions won’t fit under the factory hood. Though I suppose you could do something with a FAST intake and throttle body if adapted correctly.

I quite often drive above 4500 rpm when driving spirited. It’s really easy when you have a fast car that likes to rev.

Tohru > Sweet Trav 06/16/2015 at 14:50

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If I didn’t know better, I’d say that you sound like a Civic driver. The L98 doesn’t rev high because it doesn’t need to. It has all the torque down low (more torque than the LT1) where you actually need it.

By your logic, diesel semis are awful because they redline at about 2500rpm and put out only like 650hp. Nevermind that they put out 1500 lb/ft of torque and can haul 80000lbs, let’s make the fucker rap out at 8500rpm for shits and giggles.