Long-Term Quality - Mazda: The Devilish God

"Steven Lang" (StevenLang) 02/20/2015 at 11:20 • Filed to: None

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It takes a meaning to catch a meaning. Case in point. When I mention the brand Mazda to an auto enthusiast, their eyes tend to light up and their mouth starts to proclaim the virtues of the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! or the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! models.

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Then there's everyone else...

Take a look at this graph and you'll see at least four rolling catastrophes.

Mazda 626

Mazda RX-8

Mazda CX-7

Mazda Millenia

No brand is as downright schizophrenic as Mazda when it comes to long-term quality, and it all comes down to two issues.

1) Mazda has a horrific record when it comes to handling chronic reliability issues. Even with their late model vehicles, it's often times a lost cause for the owner.

2) Mazda has a tendency to discontinue models with substandard reliability.

When enthusiasts ask me why Mazdas aren't more popular, I point them out to their overall ranking on the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

If you click on this graph or !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , you will find that Mazda holds the unique honor of representing the only active Japanese brand in the United States with a below average overall ranking. Over 14,000 Mazdas have been traded-in thus far, and the tale this brand tells is either one of outstanding success or a Dante's Inferno of ownership despair.

There is some good news, and before I delve deep into the dark side of Mazda, let's revel in what is truly great about the brand.

Mazda MX-5

That above average score for the Miata is no historical fluke. Engine issues for the most beloved of Mazdas are a less than a 1 in 30 occurrence. Transmissions? Even better at 1 in 38. All told, nearly 95% of Miatas that are traded-in thus far have no major powertrain issues whatsoever.

Is this due in part to the owners? Absolutely. Like the BMW Z3 and Z4, the Miata tends to attract a clientele that wants to invest in the vehicle. The Miata is arguably the most iconic of modern day roadsters, and Mazda's diligence in keeping the car as a quintessential representation of Mazda's virtues has paid off handsomely for the brand.

Mazda 3

The Mazda 3 has been a continuation of the success of the Protege which has also performed well compared with its peers. However there is a little fly in that ointment of good results, and that is rust.

The Mazda Protege, the predecessor to the 3, had severe rust issues to the point where most professional car buyers will typically look at this vehicle from the bottom up. At the dealer auctions, a northern Protege can be a rolling money pit in a way that few other compacts can match. The older Aveos, Rios and Accents of the Y2K era are almost bulletproof compared to a compact Mazda with a swiss cheese sub-frame.

Everything is a disaster in those models if it comes from a rusty locale. But those in temperate climates are truly top notch. If you're spending money on a used compact and find a well-kept Protege that isn't a Mazdaspeed (which we have separated out to help out the fellow enthusiasts) get that vehicle to an independent mechanic. If he gives it the thumbs up, buy it. They typically cost thousands less than a Corolla or a Civic and are every bit their equal. Especially if you want to row your own gears.

Another hidden gem is the Mazda 5 which is arguably the most underrated minivan of today's market. While the Honda Odyssey and the Chrysler minivans have transmission issues that are well-known to even the hardcore enthusiasts, the Mazda 5 has been able to outperform that low bar. The Mazda 5 should optimally have a drain and fill every 30k for the transmission, but thankfully Mazda made this model easy to service.

If you want a minivan in the used car market that is several thousands less than the Sienna and Odyssey, definitely consider the Mazda 5.

As to what not to consider, let me offer you the Cliff Notes version.

Severe engine issues with the Mazda CX-7 — namely turbos and engine timing chains — has led to a shockingly high defect rate in our study. As with many of the other vehicles already mentioned, the problems have been widespread enough for several CX-7 owners to attempt a !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

Over 40% of Mazda Millenias have either a fatal engine or transmission issue; both of which are chronically defective. The Millienia was a one-generation wonder which went completely against the orthodoxy of Mazda's strengths, and it showed both in sales and their overall longevity.

You may expecting us to profile the Mazda 626 since the automatic transmission for that model is rumored to have the structural strength of recycled tin foil. Nope! Since Jalopnik is an enthusiast site first and foremost, we're saving the Mazda RX-8 for last.

There is a lot of controversy with the now defunct flagship of Mazda due to the oil consumption that comes with owning any RX model. As the owner of an 05' RX, I have to say that the problems go far deeper than an occasional oil spritzer. These models are like gardens. There is always something that needs tending to with an RX-8, and if it's not one thing, it will be another.

But there is good news among those looking for an RX-8. If you find one that has excellent compression, you can enjoy cheap junkyard parts for many years to come. Mazda extended the warranty on certain parts of the RX-8 rotary engine for 8 years and 100,000 miles. That means a number of their high-mileage units that made it just past the warranty with a blown engine are already !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! with plenty of company at the local auto-recycling centers.

If you hit the proverbial used car lottery and find an older Mazda RX-8 that has just been given the complimentary Mazda overhaul, you may have a winner. For those who want to hit em' where they ain't, the RX-8 may be the real-world pearl amongst Mazda's swine of quality issues.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:27

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You're not wrong about the Mazda 3 rust issues. My 2005 Fiat had a few spots where there's been stone chips (since fixed) I saw a 2004 Mazda 3 yesterday and it looked like someone had just dragged it out of a lake.

Kate's Dirty Sister > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:28

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Mazda : good enough for a quick lease.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:28

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Duh. Rotary.

2 Wheels awesome! > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:28

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I suspect some this comes with the caliber of the owner.
Miata drivers know what an oil/atf/brake/coolant change is, probably do it themselves, and can hear/smell/see a minor problem and correct it before it becomes a real issue.... a CX-7 owner probably goes to the stealealership and does whatever maintenance they say is needed.

occamsrezr > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:29

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The Mazda 5: the only car offered to me for free that I turned down.

My mom tried to give me her 5 and I turned it down without a second thought. It may be reliable, but good christ, is it an uncomfortable car. Horrible designs for the fold down seats, anemic engine (at best) and a single-minded efficiency-loving transmission were all deal breakers.

On top of that, if you live in a hot climate, the placement of the power steering pump can be problematic. Idling with very little air movement under the body of the car will cause the pump to overheat and auto-shutdown, rendering you to manual steering. Mazda knew about it though, since it's one of the few cars I've ever seen with a "Power Steering Pump Warning Light"

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:31

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Other Mazda3 issues that may extend even into the new models are issues with the rear brake calipers. They have a tendency to seize for no reason. It's been a known issue for like ten years, but Mazda hasn't bothered fixing them yet.

JohnnyWasASchoolBoy > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:31

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Great article. We've had a few Mazdas go through the family. My father-in-law has had two Mazda 6s. They were great.

I am genuinely perplexed by the rust issues you mentioned with the 3. My brother has a Mazda 3. It's a gen 1 and he bought it within three months of the model launch. He lives in a rainy climate where the car is subjected to road moisture almost constantly. The car has 200,000+km on it and the body and interior are still fresh and solid.

ezeolla > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:32

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None. You have none reliability

EDIT: I am focusing in on the "0" part

Trevor Slattery, ACTOR > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:32

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I am a serial Mazda owner. I drive the last generation MPV with the 5sp and 3.0 Duratech V6 currently as the family hauler.

Coil packs and oxygen sensors, cracked manifolds, transmissions that are fragile is fluid is not changed yearly...like you said, it is always SOMETHING. The CEL is rarely off in the car.

Having said that...I am looking at a Mazda 5 to replace it. Sigh.

William Clavey > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:33

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I once owned a Mazda 626 with a JDM KLZE engine and manual tranny. Loved the thing. It was a real sleeper that sounded amazing and was great to drive. Then I raced a Cobalt SS and blew third gear. After swapping a new tranny in, I raced a Honda and blew the engine.

So I bought a Honda. Nothing ever happened again.

bubbajoe123456 > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:33

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Outside of the sports cars (Miata, RX-8, etc.), the Mazda pitch is essentially "don't buy a Honda, we're more fun to drive." In the midsize sedan or SUV/crossover segments, fun to drive is a plus, but gets far outweighed by "will reliably get me to work/kids to school."

Jeb_Hoge > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:33

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Mazda has problems with forced induction, I've noticed.

Tatanko > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:34

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Simple solution to RX-8 powertrain issues: swap in an LSx.

Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:34

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this is odd, considering most former, or current Mazda owners I know love or loved their cars, and had minor issues, my father's MX-6 included.

Despite the rust on their 2004 Mazda 3, one couple I know bought a CX-3 for family hauling to replace the 3 that had a disintegrated rocker panel. The said it drive fine, no problems other than the crippling rust.

Takuro Spirit > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:35

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I..... I'm just gonna stay out of this one.

dogisbadob > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:35

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still higher than VW tho

1oner > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:36

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How does the Mazda2 rate? I was looking into buying one but now I'm thinking Protege.

Mugochap > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:36

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The first car I bought out of college was for my wife (then fiance) was a 2003 Mazda6. We still have the car today and it's still in great condition. It's been a daily commuter, cross country traveler and now a kid-shuttle for the past 6 years. It has around 90k miles on it and has only been in the shop twice in the past 11+ years for unscheduled service... both times in the past 4 months. I just recently made the somewhat sad decision to start looking for it's replacement and after all the shopping I've done I'm going to be replacing it with a 2015 Mazda6 despite getting big discounts on Ford, GM and Nissan vehicles through work. It's simply the most reliable, fun, comfortable and good looking mid-size family car on the market... not to mention the great value.

X-cchannel-M > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:36

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Mazda is not great on the perceived quality either. For instance the 6 does not have the solidity of build aesthetic that the Camry and Accord have. Mazda's interiors have a drab black look too.

blah > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:37

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Check auto trader, or Kijiji or Craigs list or whatever. You'll see a bunch with "blown" engines. The 2.3 likes to spin bearings like its an Olympic sport. The MZR likes to do the same and through rods. While I like these cars, I can't see past those engine issues. Also, up here in Canada, it's hard to find one that hasn't suffered immense amounts of rust.

jv > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:37

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Love these posts, please keep making them. Looking foreword to MB and Lexus.

shop-teacher > occamsrezr 02/20/2015 at 11:38

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I sat in one last week, just out of curiosity (I'm not in the market for a minivan). I also found it terribly uncomfortable.

Crossed > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. 02/20/2015 at 11:38

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This is purely gut but I think they've finally solved the long term reliability problem. It's one of those gut feelings that you can tell if a car is going to last. I bought a little Toyota a little earlier than my dad and it's had more issues, TSBs than his 3. Only problem he's had is the infotainment didn't turn on 3 times. But that's as easy as pulling out the fuse and putting it back in. He's surpassed me in miles too. I've had a replaced 2 gear synchro, taillight leak and fuel pump which doesn't help the gut feeling for my car. I knew what I was going into though.

Think they've finally got the rust issue fixed.

Vintage1982Benz > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:40

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My Mazda 3 was (a 2003 model) one of the most problem free cars I ever owned. As far as reliability, I still see some of these around even today.

Mazda is always on my test drive list when I am considering a new vehicle.

sounbwoy > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:41

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YES to this. My 2010 has been, so far, bulletproof - bought new in 2010, now with almost 93,000 miles on the clock. Regular trans service (roughly every 25,000 for me). No major repairs of any sort..

George > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:41

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Agreed.... I loved my friend's supercharged Miata, and always had a blast with it. Unfortunately, my '96 626, remains the single worst car that I've ever owned or driven, by a long, long way. Anemically underpowered, continually faulty sensors, rust galore, a clutch that would slip if you sneezed too hard in the car, and electronics that would make the Brits proud.

I think the only thing on that car that didn't break, was arguably one of the coolest features (Cool is a relative term in a 626. It's like rolling birth control). The oscillating heat and air vents in the center stack, that would swing back and forth from passenger to driver, was always commented on by every passenger in the car. I actually missed that for a little while when I got rid of it.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > bubbajoe123456 02/20/2015 at 11:42

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That's what most of this site doesn't understand. Sure the Civic or Corolla may not be fun, but 5 years down the road and few oil changes later, they still won't be a problem. That is what most people look for, not driving dynamics.

Aremmes > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 02/20/2015 at 11:42

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I bet that in most cases people started the engine cold and shut it down quickly, a big no-no with the Wankel engine.

occamsrezr > shop-teacher 02/20/2015 at 11:42

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Yep, if you happen to be over say about 5'7" the armrests are too low and the seats are too high.

It also doesn't help that it has the weakest retention clip? spring? for the Hi/Lo beams switch on the stalk. Every time I drive the car after my mom has driven it, the headlights are in hi-beams. Every. time.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Crossed 02/20/2015 at 11:43

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I hope they have got the reliability sorted, the new 3 and 6 look great. If they stand the test of time I'd consider buying one used.

Canadmos > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:43

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I owned a 2005 Mazda 3 hatchback for about 5 years and I had conflicting views on the car/brand. But I'm sorry, I doubt I'd ever look at owning a Mazda ever again.

The good, was that I didn't have a single mechanical issue with the car. The engine ran perfect and I didn't ever have to spend any money on it, other than regular maintenance stuff. And I had the car for just over 110000 km. Okay, I lied. There was ONE mechanical issue with the car; the god damn upper rear shock mounts. Towards the end of the life of the car, I broke 3 of them in less than a year. Were they made of cheese or something???

The bad, as most will know is the rust. It exploded with rust. Chunks of the car would fall off. Every day it was noticeably worse. The bottoms of my rear doors were completely rotten. And the bad thing is that it was rusting from the inside out. What you saw on the outside was only a fraction of what was laying underneath. I even had the rear quarter panels touched up while I worked at a body shop during college. The rust came back within 3 months and by the end of the following year, you wouldn't be able to tell that it was ever touched up.

Though, when I look back I had a lot of fun times with this car. The interior space with the hatchback was simply amazing. I could carry more stuff in my car, than what my friend could fit into his equally crappy Chevy Blazer. This makes for good road trips. It was pretty good on the road as well, never a complaint from the car while doing day long drives across the continent.

My Mazda 3 was a blue hatchback and now I moved onto a 2009 Subaru WRX, also in blue and a hatchback. No looking back here, I do not miss that car.

space_captain_steve > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:43

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A post about RX-8 reliability, this one's for me!...

RX-8's should require a screening process to be sold. Not enough owners, probably not even a majority of owners actually understand how to do the most basic care for rotary engines (Warm up before revving over 4k, regular oil top offs, rev it high *every* time you drive it, no start-stopping, etc.)

This horrible reliability is compounded by the fact the renesis auto's cannot rev past 7.5k RPM which is a prime suspect for carbon buildup and compression failing. So there's also the fact that the Autos were basically flawed to begin with.

Combine these two things together, an uninformed owner and most likely non-enthusiast (therefore auto owner), it's a complete recipe for disaster.

Get a manual, do the basic things to care for it, and it WILL last. At the very least, it won't be "unreliable." Proper cared for by driver engine rebuilds before 100k seem so few and far between that I'm not even sure I believe those few owner stories. Rotaries have so few moving parts if you "do it right" they will last a long time.

remission12 > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 02/20/2015 at 11:43

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Salt is the killer with these cars. I haven't seen one older than 2007 without rust in at least the rear wheel wells in all of Canada (excluding BC).

Ash78, voting early and often > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:44

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I love the Mazda5 and the Ford Transit wagon, but we ended up with an Odyssey because the larger vans simply offer so much more for the money. In hindsight (virtually hating the Ody), I would have worked harder to convince the wife the full-sized vans are just too big. She believes me now, but we both believed bigger was better. It's the same flawed logic that keeps compact and midsize pickups from getting more popular.

shop-teacher > occamsrezr 02/20/2015 at 11:44

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Width was also an issue for me. I'm a wide person, so the center console is right where my knee needs to go.

Admiral Asskicker > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:45

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...how do you score lower than an RX-8?

I love my 8, but it was a constant "gee, I hope this doesn't explode today", mixed with "Shit did I forget to rev the engine before shutting it off", topped off with "I wonder how much oil is left"

Steven Lang > space_captain_steve 02/20/2015 at 11:45

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Amen!

JohnnyWasASchoolBoy > remission12 02/20/2015 at 11:46

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Got it. This particular 3, while always wet, never sees salt as it lives in Vancouver.

Wild Weasel > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:46

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I just traded in my 2007 Mazdaspeed3. Here's the thing... it was a BLAST to drive when it worked properly. Everyone knows this. In fact, it was so good to drive that I would consider buying another Mazda in the future.

BUT... I had a headlight and the turbo and a set of rear shocks replaced under warranty. After the warranty ran out I had to replace the rear shocks again, and I put on Konis with a lifetime warranty. Then the swaybar bushings went. Also, some bolts weren't tightened properly from the factory including those holding on the front doors.

There was rust forming on the rear hatch that seemed 100% like a design flaw. It wasn't from a scratch or anything. It was from water just naturally pooling at the bottom of the windscreen and there was no way to properly grind this and touch it up. I tried. It came back. Twice.

Then the electronic throttle body decided to give up the ghost. That's a $400+ part.

So... would I recommend Mazda for it's quality? Hells no. But it was A BLAST to drive and I'd probably buy another one... though maybe I'd get a Focus ST or something else instead...

Steven Lang > Admiral Asskicker 02/20/2015 at 11:46

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All too true. But if you can buy em' right, they can be fantastic deals. I bought mine for just less than $2300.

electricbikequestion > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:47

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Rotoray owner for a decade (0) failures, a little bit of knowledge and bouncing it off the rev limiter transforms these cars from unreliable to bulletproof.

Kate's Dirty Sister > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 02/20/2015 at 11:47

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AeroStang > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:47

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I fail to have any understanding of why the RX is a thing. I never hear good things. The best I hear is, "it's cool." That always comes from current owners. Let me make a note...Mazda still makes the CX-5, and MPV/MP5/M 5 as standard transmissions. Yes. Minivan and CUV with standard trannies. Thank you, Mazda. I almost bought a CX5...but my Mustang slightly edged it out, with rear wheel drive. Also, allegedly a standard is coming to the CX-3. Thank you Mazda. I cherish you.

remission12 > blah 02/20/2015 at 11:47

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My parents had a silver first-year 3 Sport (2004). I had to buff the rust spots coming through the paint every time I washed the damn thing - the finish quality was horrendous. Probably would've lasted a bit longer without a handful of rookie driver fender-benders cracking paint at panel gaps. My 2011 is in great shape so far though.

space_captain_steve > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 02/20/2015 at 11:48

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rebuilds every 30k herp derp wtf am i doing wrong

thanks obama

Just talked to a *former* RX-8 owner in person the other day who was disgruntled about his decision to buy the car as it "was a lemon". He had no idea the oil needed to be topped off regularly. Queue "areyoufuckingkiddingme" face.

AdmiralAkbar > dogisbadob 02/20/2015 at 11:48

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Audi can't even read your comment from down here.

Gary Yogurt > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:48

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Damn. I was about to take a look at the Mazda3 tonight, early SkyActive 6MT. (2012/2013)

Any reasons why I should or shouldn't? It seemed to be a good compromise between everything I want and good enough to tolerate/enjoy for 5+ years.

spanfucker retire bitch > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:49

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Holy shit, no wonder they killed the CX-7.

Kate's Dirty Sister > Vintage1982Benz 02/20/2015 at 11:49

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I had one brand new (2003) kept it for 3 years and had to let it go because it had become a total Jalopy in just 3 years.

I guess we have different standards

Steven Lang > shop-teacher 02/20/2015 at 11:50

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You guys may be right. I owned for about three months (I won a dealership) and I am right at 5'8" and 170. It was comfortable for me, but I can easily see how a taller and wider person would have problems.

Canadmos > Canadmos 02/20/2015 at 11:51

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Also, for what its worth. If you have a power window that seems to jam on your older Mazda 3, once again the rust could be to blame.

My window would always jam at the front of it. One day I took the little speaker off near the mirror and found this, the INSIDE of the door had literally rusted and split apart. It was the cause of the window getting stuck.

The door handle cable ends are also fragile. Use caution was removing them or you'll end up with a Porsche GT3 inspired door handle until you can find some super glue;

But good times....good times...

?1

Steven Lang > ezeolla 02/20/2015 at 11:51

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The lowest 1% out there.

alwaysmiata > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:52

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I love Mazdas I really do, as you can tell probably tell by my username. I grew up with all sorts of mazdas even really weird ones, my mother who is not a car person at all owned an old rwd MPV and a supercharged millenia S when I was a kid.

However.... mazda has some seriously bad rust prevention, even their new models aren't great, and while I loved my RX8 to death I managed to deal with both a transmission that had dead syncros in 2nd and 3rd (the previous owner was not easy on the car apparently) and the fairly common broken clutch bracket issue. I have no idea how you design a manual sports car that has a clutch bracket that fails with less than 50k of regular use....

Pastor of Muppets > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 02/20/2015 at 11:52

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They don't salt the roads in winter? Just plow? Something else? Or is Vancouver warmer than I realize?

Steven Lang > Trevor Slattery, ACTOR 02/20/2015 at 11:52

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Mazda minivans are highly unique and a great fit for his (cough! cough!) unique enthusiasts.

Vintage1982Benz > Kate's Dirty Sister 02/20/2015 at 11:53

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I had a Mazda 3, not the Protege. The only issue I ever had was the AC compressor went on it when it was 9 years old.

I'm amazed how many Proteges I still see being that I am in a climate where the roads get salted for 3-5 months every year.

Steven Lang > Gary Yogurt 02/20/2015 at 11:53

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It depends on where you live.

BigBlock440 > Aremmes 02/20/2015 at 11:53

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How do you not start an engine cold? Does it come with a block heater you have to plug in whenever you park?

DLu > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:53

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So when consumer reports slams a car's reliability or some other mundane aspect, even if it praises the fun-to-drive characteristic, they get ripped a new one; but if a Jalop trashes the RX-8 (which beat out the M3 in C&D for best handling car under $100k), it's "because rotary" or some other lame complaint about reliability or oil burning. I have a minivan for reliable, practical transport.

The RX-8 is the last rotary made on the planet. You know, never mind. The bad reputation weeds out the poseurs. Sorry for the rant.

Steven Lang > sounbwoy 02/20/2015 at 11:54

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Exactly! This is one of the hidden gems of the marketplace.

mgeoffriau > Aremmes 02/20/2015 at 11:54

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Just out of curiosity...how does one NOT start an engine cold?

munter_vish > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:55

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wat the hell mini??

HideyoshiJP > occamsrezr 02/20/2015 at 11:55

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Don't ruin my 6-speed minivan dreams. I don't even have a family to need one. ._.

JohnnyWasASchoolBoy > Pastor of Muppets 02/20/2015 at 11:55

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Vancouver gets about two snow dustings/year. I don't think the entire lower mainland owns more than two plows and one sanding truck.

Steven Lang > DLu 02/20/2015 at 11:55

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Rant away. That's why we're here.

klipless > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 02/20/2015 at 11:56

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That's not fair. My first engine made it 92k and Mazda kindly swapped it out for a reman one on their dime (yen?). That one lasted 7k. Nevermind, you're right.

Gary Yogurt > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:56

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Salt Pile, Baltimore, Maryland

DougNuts > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:56

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Our garage is currently filled with two Mazdas.

2006 Mazda3 Hatchback 2.3L, 173K miles. No major issues except for rust. We replaced shocks, brakes, belts, idler pulley and alternator.

2010 Mazda5 GT 2.3L , 90k miles. Replaced shocks (Koni), brakes, motor mounts and front sway bar bushings. I also swapped in 2012+ rear springs, they are supposed to be stiffer.

They are economy cars, but they are both fun to drive and have been reliable.

Hooneriphic > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:58

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Doesn't the turbo CX7 and MS3 basically share the MZR platform? I've heard of smoking turbo issues within the MS3 community but hadn't heard of timing chain issues being prevalent.

HideyoshiJP > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 02/20/2015 at 11:58

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I think most people here *do* in fact understand that. And most cars can last five years without many issues. Your real issues happen a few years after that.

Captain_Spadaro > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 11:58

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We had a 98 Millenia from late 98 to some time in 05. Only thing that ever went wrong with it was the trans breaking because we had the fluid changed incorrectly (flushed instead of a drain and fill like we should have had done).

Kate's Dirty Sister > Vintage1982Benz 02/20/2015 at 11:58

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You sir are either in denial or having an agenda.

P5 were all the rage in 2002-2003 were I live and they disappeared completely.

Besides, there's plenty of Civics from the nineties bombing around looking clean.

Clean Protege are as rare as Pope feces compared to clean anything else from the same era.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > HideyoshiJP 02/20/2015 at 12:00

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With all the Camry and Corolla hating that goes on, I really don't think a lot do.

U Drive a Camry > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:01

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Dear Jalopnik Bros and Broettes,

This is why people still buy Camrys and Corollas. Yes, Mazda are funner to drive but the mass population wants reliable A to B transportation. Mazda might be getting better but perception and data still shows them at a disadvantage. Before everyone chimes in how every Toyota in their family has suffered from catastrophic failure but their Mazda has a million miles and is still on the original engine oil I have linked the Toyota data for comparisons.

http://tradeinqualityindex.com/reports/Toyota…

Deal Killer - Powered by Focus > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:01

2

I've owned two Mazda's, a '96 626 and an '03 Protege. Both were fairly reliable, with the 626 having a tendency to go through front axles and the Protege having a problem with coil packs. Both items were fairly inexpensive fixes, and both were more comfortable than my current '06 Focus. The Protege, however, was rusting away pretty bad, weirdly around the windshield header, which resulted in water leaking into the cabin when it rained. I couldn't figure out why the carpet in the driver side was always wet, then I came to the conclusion it was the rust around the windshield. If it wasn't for that issue, I'd have kept it another few years. I'm pretty hard on my cars, as I'm Real Estate appraiser, and put a lot of mileage per year on them, with a lot of stops/starts and inner city driving. A new Mazda 2 or 3 would be a perfect fit for me as my next car.

HideyoshiJP > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 02/20/2015 at 12:02

10

I think they're just opposed to the idea that a reliable or practical car necessarily has to be soulless.

Vintage1982Benz > Kate's Dirty Sister 02/20/2015 at 12:02

1

In relation to clean Civics, sure, but relative to overall sales numbers I feel like they did pretty well. I know of two within my dog walking radius here in Chicago.

I did just try searching for come good examples for sale in the area - of which there are none. I'm soon going to be purchasing a cheap used wagon, will consider any money pit or jalopy out there.

Foremi > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:02

0

As the owner of an 05 RX8 I take issue with the "If its not one thing, it will be another"

My cars at 130k and I bought it from the original owner who just had the engine replaced under warranty at over 100k miles.

Are they more sensitive to a lack of maintenance than other cars? Yes. Are they worth it? Absolutely.

1995droptopz > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:02

0

I bought a used 2003 Mazda6 with the 3.0 V6 and 5-speed manual a few years back with right around 100k on it, and it was such a disaster that I unloaded it after 3 weeks. I shit you not it consumed over a quart of oil every 500 miles, which at the time was more than a quart a week. It had some other problems that were probably maintenance related, but that kind of oil consumption was enough for me.

Pending Approval > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:03

1

for me ( coming from a VW ) my 3 is amazing. Its a machine, machines break, but when this one does ( thankfully nothing in the year I've had it ) it won't cost me an arm and a leg and taking it to the only guy in town outside of a dealership who can work on them. ( though I generally do my own work too )

Megamullin > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:04

1

This is precisely what concerns me about the SkyActive technology. I appreciate Mazda's willingness to take risks, and I would be willing to take those risks with them if I could trust that they had done their best to make it a quality part. Sadly, my experience with the 626 has taught me to never trust.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > HideyoshiJP 02/20/2015 at 12:05

0

But history seems to disagree.

DLu > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:05

8

I'll go sob uncontrollably in my R3 now. Then rev to 9000 rpm and smile.

F50F60 > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:09

1

Had a Mazda Millenia S and a Mazda MPV both fucked their engines up around 110k miles. And I was up to date on regular scheduled maintenance. Prior to the engine failures, there were no indication of any issues. No burning oil, no performance issues, no odd noises....Yeah, no Mazda for me any more, even though they look nice and are sporty.

DropTopEnvy > occamsrezr 02/20/2015 at 12:09

0

When I worked as a Mazda salesman in the great recession of '08, we absolutely could NOT keep these on our lot. The minute we got one in, it was gone. People were on waiting lists. New, used, it didn't matter, they commanded a premium over any other car on the lot. They went for above-retail price most of the time, and this was during cash for clunkers and completely stagnant auto sales.

Speaking of Cash for Clunkers (C4C), a nice couple brought their daughter in, who had just turned 16, and test drove a new Mazda3. They were smitten, but for some reason couldn't get financing to go through. This was on a brand new, $17k ish Mazda3. My sales manager, the dick that he was, somehow finagled financing for them.. but only on a 4 year old Mazda3 with ~60k miles on it, for the exact same price as the new one. This meant their old Chevy conversion van was ineligible for C4C, they gave them $1000 in trade, as opposed to the $4k they were eligible for with C4C, and they walked away happy.. somehow.

On another note: I saw a Maserati, a new-ish (I believe it was an '04) Range Rover, several 99+ Grand Cherokees, a Corvette and an older Rolls Royce get their engines destroyed (among other less notables) during Cash for Clunkers. What. A. Waste.

TanukiAttack > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:09

2

I have a 92 Mazda Mx-3 1.6L I use as a commuter since my SVX (lol) gets pretty rough gas mileage. Mazda has over 220,000 miles on it. So far had to replace a distributor,alternator, and cat (plus regular maintenance of course) but that has been about it. Its still going strong.

James May is my spirit animal > Gary Yogurt 02/20/2015 at 12:09

1

I'm wanting to look at a 2007 Mazda3 MT. Same boat. 26201, WV

Bimmerman2002 > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:12

1

Really sad. Good friend has one and, the interior is already falling apart after 2 years.

Gary Yogurt > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:13

0

It's a pretty damning and frightening article to someone who is test driving these things, although you don't seem to specifically mention anything around 2012/2013. (The years I'm looking at.)

Ugh.

Steven Lang > TanukiAttack 02/20/2015 at 12:13

1

I love the old MX-3. My neighbor got almost 400k on his.

brian_nec > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:14

3

Ive had a 3 for 5 years. i have done oil changes, tire rotations, and a trans flush. THAT'S IT. it is absolutely the most worry free car ive ever owned. Jinxed now.

James May is my spirit animal > Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy 02/20/2015 at 12:14

3

Do people not spray their cars' underbelly with oil then run them down a dirt road, then repeat the whole process three or four times anymore?


My Volvo will never, ever rust. ever. My father's '92 caravan is starting to show signs of wear, but once a year we take the garden weed sprayer (hand pump thing) and hose the fucker down with 0W oil. :shrug:

Slo-Z > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 02/20/2015 at 12:14

0

I hate to agree with you, but your logic is irrefutable. Most people don't seem to care what they drive as long as it lasts awhile.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > BigBlock440 02/20/2015 at 12:14

0

He said start it cold, then quickly shut it down before it's warmed up, i.e. moving it on your driveway.

Barefoot Mechanic > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:14

0

Extremely interesting article to say the least. I own a 2003 Protege sedan and a 2006 Mazda 3 wagon. The sedan has over 100K miles and it is going STRONG. That little car is so much fun. I take exit ramps with it as fast as I used to with my BMW E36 328IS. The protege handles soooo well. I remember one recall during which they replaced the timing belt which mean I am free and clear for a while. I checked it, it looks new. I wanted a sporty car so I put RX-8 seat in my protege.. Ridiculous, maybe but when I take the corners, those seats hold me in place much better and the driver side is heated!!!!

Now, the 3. Well, it is an automatic for one thing.. (The protege has 5 on the floor) That is my biggest beef with the car. It pretty well shift whenever it feels like it as long as it is outside the power curve. This thing has a bigger engine but much more sluggish. Not too much maintenance issue her either but I had to take the Throttle body apart and clean it. I read somewhere it was the cause of sluggishness. It help a bit but not enough. I don't think that the build quality in the Protege is there in the 3. It feels cheaper and has more rattles. it has half the mileage and requires more TLC.

Still, they are both great cars. I live in Texas so rust is not a problem. I dream of a sports car and will get one eventually but as an extra. I will not part with my protege unless it parts with me.

As for the RX-8, It is simply about the owners. You buy a sports car, it require MAINTENANCE. It does, all the time. The BMW was a dream but the bitch needed to be loved every weekend. Exotic cars need more care. They just do! I am probably going to get a Porsche as a fun car. Yes, I will spend more time fixing it then driving it... I don't care, that is what I Do! I am as happy fixing and maintaining as I am driving.

My 50 Cents!

Aremmes > BigBlock440 02/20/2015 at 12:15

2

The 13B-RE was tuned to run a rich mixture for reliability and in order to pass emissions tests since it'd otherwise run very hot (increasing NOX emissions) and burn the catalytic converter (since it sits so close to the exhaust ports). This led to cold starts running VERY rich mixtures, which ended up leaving a film of unburned fuel on the side walls and the surface of the epitrochoid curve. If the engine then gets run up to normal operating temperature, that fuel eventually gets burned up and all would return to normal. If one quickly shut the engine down without first letting it warm up properly would end up with a case of quickly accumulating carbon deposits, which would harden and quickly chew up the apex and side seals. And when you don't have apex or side seals, you need either a rebuild or a new engine depending on how much damage the engine suffered.

TanukiAttack > Kate's Dirty Sister 02/20/2015 at 12:17

1

Proteges were actually quite reliable to say the least. The 1.8Bp engines were extremely solid. Seeing a clean protege in many places is not rare at all. Also saw many clean examples traded in to the dealership I worked at as used cars. They also just don't have the following that many older Hondas have. Meaning when they need some actual work done, people are more likely to just scrap them instead of swap an engine or do what it takes to keep them alive.

jsemerica > Admiral Asskicker 02/20/2015 at 12:18

5

Rev the engine before shutting if off....? I can't believe people bought into that, pretty sure that was internet hyperbole...

James May is my spirit animal > brian_nec 02/20/2015 at 12:18

0

What year, body and transmission?

Textured Soy Protein > Steven Lang 02/20/2015 at 12:20

3

I had an '06 Mazdaspeed 6 that I bought certified pre-owned in 2008.

The keyless entry/start system wasn't working right when I got it. Turned out it needed a couple new antennas and switches, which were replaced under the CPO warranty and gave no further issues.

I live in Wisconsin and drove the car year-round. By 2011 it had started rusting in the rear wheel wells, and over the next few years it rusted in more places like the front strut towers, inside some of the door skins and around the windshield frame. The rust proofing on that car was just not good.

It had the same basic motor as the CX-7 but I didn't really have any issues with the motor itself. It would occasionally hit the knock sensor pretty badly under hard acceleration, but no other issues.

The interior was super rattly. Just so many rattles everywhere.

The driveline liked to leak. The clutch slave cylinder went out at around 75k miles, and it had a few leaks around the rear differential.

I got rid of it in summer '13 because I wanted to escape before the rust became worse.

On the other hand, the car I had before the MS6 was a '99 Miata. It was significantly more reliable and didn't have any rust issues despite being driven year-round in Wisconsin as well.