spun out in the snow.

"Frank Grimes" (FrankGrimes) 12/15/2015 at 22:47 • Filed to: None

0

40

went off the road. I am ok no damage to car. got stuck and some nice people helped pull me out.

the bonus is the highway patrol showed up a little while after.

They gave me a ticket for speeding. How can a cop give a ticket for speeding when he wasn’t even around?
he called it a citation and wrote in “speed too fast (75)“ He told me he could have given me a speeding ticket for going 75mph. I dont know what the heck is going on. he didn’t fill in the little form area for speeding.

The Highway Patrol dude wasnt even around prior to me going off he did not pull me over he just rolled up when we were trying to pull my car off the shoulder onto the highway asked me how fast I was going. and I said I didnt know and said 70-75 the speed limit is 70mph and almost certain that is what I was doing keeping pace with the other cars.

Should I fight this ticket?

bob and john > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 22:48

6

hell yes you should. cop wasnt even there. no way he can write you the ticket

whoarder is tellurium > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 22:51

0

Alfalfa > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 22:52

0

That’s ridiculous. Not unlike all the fucking snow we got yesterday. That shit was nuts.

daender > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 22:54

1

Ask for video evidence and if his speed detector equipment was properly calibrated . Should help you get out of that ticket.

MLGCarGuy > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 22:56

0

Appropriate right now.

And yes, fight that ticket. It would be bad not to.

Spaceball-Two > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 22:59

0

Hell yes!

Master Cylinder > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:00

4

Well, on one hand, if you spun off the road, then you were going too fast for conditions. That said, I’d fight it. There’s no way the officer would have known how fast you were going, so you may have a shot. However, he will be able to say that you admitted going 70-75mph.

So in the future, don’t volunteer that kind of information in a traffic stop. It’s ok to just say you’re not sure exactly how fast you were going and that you were just keeping pace with traffic.

HammerheadFistpunch > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:02

0

yeah, fight it. He meant to scare you because I suspect he is already sick of helping stranded people and dealing with accidents and wanted to just get you out of his life with a stern warning.

Frank Grimes > Master Cylinder 12/15/2015 at 23:04

0

I got to a certain point on the highway and my lane became covered in snow so I changed lanes and thats when I spun off. They suck at clearing the lanes with plows its like they just get lazy and dont clear the roads in random spots.
It wasn’t a traffic stop the officer just pulled up I guess to help and turn on his flashy lights and then just asked me how fast I was going this was after I had just spun out and got stuck in snow so I didnt have my wits about me. He was a jerk he stopped us from pulling my car out to stop us and ask me for my license. It was weird.

Agrajag > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:08

1

I’m glad you and the car are okay, and that sucks about the ticket.

Every time you have some bad luck, I can’t help but think you have the most apt username/avatar.

Master Cylinder > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:10

1

I’m not saying you did anything wrong, but most traffic laws have a separate violation of “speed too fast for conditions” or something like that. Even if you were going under the speed limit, you can get ticketed for it since technically you could’ve been going 35mph or something and not spun out. It sucks, but that’s the law.

It’s a dick move on the cop’s part to ticket you after getting shaken up like that, though, especially since you didn’t cause any damage.

I guess the important thing is that no one got hurt, and hopefully you are able to successfully contest the ticket.

Dusty Ventures > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:11

3

Fight that motha

Frank Grimes > HammerheadFistpunch 12/15/2015 at 23:13

0

Kinda was my thinking. He didn’t know how fast I was going and kept trying to tell me to slow down and be safe. I felt like talking back to him because I was going the same speed as other cars not speeding because I was going the limit he tried to tell me all the other cars were going 40-60 which is not true and how would he know. I understand to slow down in bad weather but the road was fine until I was in the left lane and it got really crappy in that lane.

Frank Grimes > Agrajag 12/15/2015 at 23:14

1

Lets hope I never have to teach myself to feel pain. Seriously I have been hit by a semi and was not my fault but could not prove it and then a hit and run which resulted in me getting screwed once again. And now this crap.

Caleb "If a rally car can do it, so can my Malibu" M. S. > Master Cylinder 12/15/2015 at 23:16

0

Unfortunately for you, the State Patrol can issue tickets sight unseen, and if you go off the road, they can write you up for reckless driving, speeding, or a number of other offenses. Also, if you lose control under hazardous conditions, they can write you up for not driving accordingly.

Not an expert, but the son of someone who is.

Frank Grimes > Master Cylinder 12/15/2015 at 23:27

0

Yeah those laws are stupid. They just assume guilt because of an accident. I don’t get that logic. It assumes people know what speed to drive to prevent accidents. How was I to know my lane would suddenly be clogged with snow? What speed is recommended for driving in snow? How do the police know that if I was going 15mph I wouldnt have spun out? Which is also illegal to go too slow.

I agree the more I think about the officer and the situation the more mad I get that he was such a douche. he never asked if I was ok or did anything but keep his smug face and condescending attitude we had my car on a chain pulling it off the road when he interrupted to get my license.
you do have a good point I wasnt hurt my car wasnt damaged and I didnt hit anyone or anything so thats good and I am grateful but I still dont think a speeding ticket is fair.

Textured Soy Protein > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:33

3

As a general rule, always fight the ticket. Often times that just means showing up and pleading not guilty.

At least here in Wisconsin, there’s always a pre-trial hearing where the cop doesn’t show up, and when you plead not guilty, you talk with the city/county/village/etc attorney. I’ve quite literally gone to a pre-trial hearing, pled not guilty, talked to the city attorney who asks what I’m looking to do, and I just straight up told them I wanted my ticket reduced. They knocked off a few mph and a couple points just for me asking.

In your situation, because the cop did not actually witness your exceeding the speed limit, he gave you a speeding ticket because he assumed you must have been going that speed in order to have spun out. But unless he actually clocked you, or at least was present while you were driving and made a visual estimate of your speed, he has no evidence to support his claim that you were speeding. So I would totally explain to the prosecuting attorney, court commissioner, whoever it is, that you were driving along, you spun out, some time later the cop showed up and gave you a ticket, but he never saw you until your car was off on the side of the road, so it’s impossible for him to have known how fast you were going.

Clown Shoe Pilot > Frank Grimes 12/15/2015 at 23:51

0

you can fight it but you kinda shot yourself in the dick when you answered a cop’s question. Here’s how it’s gonna go down in court:

prosecutor: officer, did the defendant say how fast he was going?

cop: the defendant stated he was going 75 mph

prosecutor: what is the speed limit on that section of road?

cop: it’s 70 mph

you lose.

Clown Shoe Pilot > bob and john 12/15/2015 at 23:55

0

By that logic, you can’t get charged with murder if there’s no body and a cop didn’t see you do it.

He ADMITTED doing 75. You can bet your ass that’s going to come up in court.

bob and john > Clown Shoe Pilot 12/15/2015 at 23:59

0

he admitted a ‘rough’ 70-75. maybe it was 70. maybe it was 75. maybe it was 60 and it just felt fast.

JGrabowMSt > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 00:01

0

Whenever Ive been asked how fast I was going, I say 5-10 under, and state some mechanical problem Im trying to have fixed.

Its not like the cop is going to crawl under a lowered car and listen to a carrier bearing. Right now my ABS light is on, thats a great one to use....

Id fight the ticket, but dont expect to win, its kind of a shitty situation. Best you can say is that conditions were driveable and you likely hit ice, where you could be going 25 and still lose it. I took out a mailbox once because of that, but I knew the homeowner (what a relief), so nothing ever happened...

In the end, youre okay, and thats bigger than everything else.

Clown Shoe Pilot > bob and john 12/16/2015 at 00:03

1

The number “75” came out of his mouth while he was talking to a cop. That’s all that matters in court.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 00:07

0

Something I learned long ago in inner city schools in Memphis, this one trick to prevent sharing too much information; “I don’t know you.”

That said, either lawyer up now or subpoena the traffic stop video, subpoena any and all willing witnesses (those who would actually strengthen your testimony). If he claims to have hit you with radar, subpoena the calibration logs for his car (this will take some doing, best to have a lawyer at this point because institutions love to penfuck documentation to attempt a little CYA)

You can also request a later court date to better prepare your defense.

This trooper is like a fever dream and I would love to fuck that dude up in traffic court with all the other citation bearers in attendance to show them that there is a proper and effective way to beat the system.

CAR_IS_MI > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 00:09

1

Problem is there you admitted to possibly speeding. it’s thin and would likely get dismissed. In the future, the best response would be “I not sure what my exact speed was, I was moving with the flow of traffic.”

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > Textured Soy Protein 12/16/2015 at 00:09

1

^there is your reasonable bdoubt defense right there.

911e46z06 > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 00:24

0

Never tell a cop you were going over the speed limit. You’re probably fucked.

BigBlock440 > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 08:51

0

They just assume guilt because of an accident. I don’t get that logic. It assumes people know what speed to drive to prevent accidents.

That’s kinda the point of driving. You are in control of the vehicle and that little laminated card in your wallet says you know that information. If you can’t safely pilot your vehicle down the road, you shouldn’t be driving. Conditions change, the number on the sign isn’t always the number you have to go.

BigBlock440 > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 09:05

0

At first reading my reaction was, yeah, the cop’s a dick. Fight the ticket. But reading some of your responses, your attitude at the time may have played a factor. Were you cocky or arrogant, maybe a jerk back to the cop unintentionally (or intentionally), or something else that made him want to write the ticket? You mentioned the left lane, that means you were passing and there was traffic going slower (not judging, I pass people too), could be why the cop felt you were going faster than traffic and needed a ticket.

uofime-2 > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 11:00

0

That’s a “driving too fast for conditions” ticket.

Why did you change lanes, was there perhaps some debris on the road that you had to avoid? That might get the ticket dropped if it were the case.

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 11:24

0

You can try to fight the ticket, but you’re screwed. You got ticketed for going too fast for conditions, and you admitted to the officer that you were going 75. You will not get out of the ticket if you fight it.

The fact that you ended up in the ditch is all the evidence the officer needs to give you a too fast for conditions ticket. The road conditions at the time are completely irrelevant. You are responsible for driving your car in a safe manner regardless of what the road and weather conditions are at the time. “Going with the flow of traffic” is not a reasonable defense when you end up in the ditch.

Since you admitted to the officer that you were going 75, the state has all the evidence they need to give you a speeding ticket for 75 in a 70. They can give you that speeding ticket on top of the too fast for conditions ticket if you try to fight it. If you fight it and the officer decides that you were a dick, or he feels like being a dick he can get your too fast for conditions ticket upgraded to reckless driving.

Don’t fight the ticket, chalk it up as a lesson learned. Slow down when the roads are crappy, even if traffic is moving faster than conditions allow. And don’t talk to the police.

Frank Grimes > You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much 12/16/2015 at 14:43

0

So my word is used as evidence against me when convenient even though I said I didnt know my speed. But when I say I wasnt speeding and that the lane was suddenly packed with snow which caused the accident suddenly my word isnt to be trusted?

Frank Grimes > uofime-2 12/16/2015 at 14:46

0

Yeah there was tons of snow. It happens alot on the interstate here some lanes will be totally clear but then there will be a ton of snow nearly covering the whole thing. I think the plows just dont do a good enough job for whatever reason.

Frank Grimes > BigBlock440 12/16/2015 at 14:51

0

I wasn’t cocky or arrogant at all. Which in no way justifies giving someone a ticket but whatever. I was literally getting into my car to try to drive out of the ditch with a truck pulling me out when he asked me about my speed which would have been minutes after spinning out. I never told him anything about passing or what lane I was in. I never had a chance to explain anything at all beyond saying I didnt know what speed I was going and guessing at it. He just asked me how fast I was going.

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 14:52

0

Anything incriminating you tell a cop is evidence. Anything exonerating that you tell a cop will get objected as hearsay by the prosecuted and the judge will uphold it. Watch the video, it’s enlightening and well worth your 45 minutes.

BigBlock440 > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 14:55

0

Just saying that a cop is more likely to give a ticket to an asshole than someone who’s polite. But I guess the cop was just a dick, which is something that happens.

Frank Grimes > Clown Shoe Pilot 12/16/2015 at 14:55

0

that makes no sense. The first thing I said was I dont know and then I said 70-75. They believe the 75 part but not the I dont know part?

Frank Grimes > Textured Soy Protein 12/16/2015 at 14:57

0

this is my thinking as well.

Frank Grimes > BigBlock440 12/16/2015 at 15:00

0

The fact that he said nothing to me like checking if my car or me is ok and did nothing as to inquire about what happened and the way he talked to me and lectured me when he didnt even know what happened. He was a jerk.

Frank Grimes > JGrabowMSt 12/16/2015 at 15:08

0

Thanks for your reply. The problem I have with laws allowing cops to write tickets like he did is just what you pointed out if you are going 25mph you can slide. So what mph do I go if the speed limit is 70mph? Do I go 69 or 40? or 15?
It just assumes cops have magnificent abilities to estimate traction and steering control over a wide range of vehicles.

No matter how it ends up I am glad I am ok.

Clown Shoe Pilot > Frank Grimes 12/16/2015 at 20:18

0

yes. exactly. the cop’s job is to help get you convicted. if you say something incriminating (“75”) it may be used against you in court.