What Do You Think Makes A Great Winter Vehicle?

"Andrew T. Maness" (theroadlessdriven)
12/09/2015 at 18:00 • Filed to: Car Buying, Winter Is Coming, AutoTempest, Andrew Maness, The Road Less Driven

If you’d asked me this question 10 years ago I would have just shouted Subaru until you walked away. Back then the answer to every question was Subaru, because that’s what I drove, and whatever you drive is the obvious answer to any automotive question right?

These days just about every automaker offers an AWD variant of some kind, so Subaru is no longer the obvious choice that it once was for people frequently dealing with those damn “elements” we keep hearing about.

However, capability is just one small part of the winter vehicle picture, and to see the whole thing, one must take a number of other factors into consideration.

Heated front seats are obvious, but what about your rear seat passengers? What about keyless entry, or an automatic tailgate when you have your hands full? Remote start, and a heated steering wheel for when it’s bitter cold.

These are a few of the things I think make for a great winter vehicle, what are yours?

DISCUSSION (34)

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:03

Kinja'd!!!

Tracks. Tracks make a great winter vehicle.

TheHondaBro > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:04

Jalopnik would say RWD V8 Miata. Common sense would say FWD/AWD and a reliable engine.

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:05

Something with heated seats, a working heater, and snow tires. You get those 3 and it will do just fine. I suppose you could live without the heated seats, but what are we, cavemen?

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > TheHondaBro
12/09/2015 at 18:11

I would contend my younger brother’s AWD Astro LT. Good heat, AWD, 4.3V6, some ground clearance, nice fuzzy interior - it does quite well.

fourvalleys > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:15

At a minimum:

Snow tires

Working heater

Inexpensive* (so you don’t get too worried if you back into a snowbank, or if the guy behind you slides into you and leaves a mark) - seriously, don’t go out and buy a brand new car to be your winter beater.

Decent ground clearance (basically not a lowered car - you need to clear those big chunks of ice and snow the trucks drop!)

Other stuff that’s nice to have

AWD/4WD (by no means is it a requirement!)

Good visibility/safety (Just in case!)

Rear defroster (You can do without it, but it’s a really nice thing to have!)

Heated seats/mirrors/steering wheel

Remote starter/engine block heater

Good sized trunk/hatch (Because you should be able to carry a sufficient emergency kit!)

Manual transmission (seriously - the control is great to have if traction is low)

Not too much power/torque (I know! But we’re talking about winter cars - you probably won’t be able to put down a ton of power. And even slow cars can be fun in the winter.

*Most manufacturers DO offer AWD nowadays, but buying a brand new car for a winter car is a bad idea. I ignored this issue and assumed someone was looking for a used car, otherwise I wouldn’t have been able to list everything above :)

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:16

I really enjoy my Miata in the winter. As much of a stereotypical answer that is, I enjoy it because I actually hate how stuffy it gets during the winter in a fixed roof car. I can actually run the heat to keep my feet warm but also still be able to breathe without having to open the windows. The whole lightweight rwd in the snow thing is just supplementary. It also helps that the car was so cheap that I really don't worry about rust eating away at the car eventually.

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > TheHondaBro
12/09/2015 at 18:19

Certainly agree with the reliable engine part! And then I don’t really care what drive it is as long as I have some snow tires. But yeah nothing is worse than breaking down in the cold, dark, and snow.

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
12/09/2015 at 18:19

You could just cut a hole in the floor and remove the heat shield from your Cat. Then your seats will be nice and toasty!

PatBateman > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:20

Why do you need a “winter” car?

-Texan

Redhondamike > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:23

Ideally a nice optioned out Audi of some variant (Quattro, heated stuff, etc.)

My mom has a ‘05 G35X that is an absolute tank in the snow with blizzaks on it.

Both piratical choices.

PowderHound > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:23

Kinja'd!!!

Can I just say my car? Because my car. Sure it doesn’t have heated seats or mirrors but who cares? Pic is without the snow tires. Picture it with these on.

Kinja'd!!!

Textured Soy Protein > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 18:30

I love my ’05 Grand Cherokee. It’s my winter car that I got for “cheap,” but a little too nice to call a beater.

It’s comfy and roomy, with heated seats that aren’t so heavily bolstered that you can’t fit in them with a big coat on. It has the Quadra-Drive II 4WD system which makes all 3 diffs eLSDs.

In the year I’ve had it, I’ve taken care of pretty much any and all maintenance and repairs that needed to be caught up on, added Rugged Ridge floor liners to catch all the grime that gets tracked in by my boots, Power Stop “extreme” truck/tow brake pads, and General Grabber AT2 all-terrain tires with the severe snow duty rating (because while it’s my winter vehicle, it sees warm-weather road trip use, and that would burn up winter tires).

The main downside is because Quadra-Drive II only comes with the Hemi engine, and there’s no way to put it in 2wd mode, and the tires are so heavy, I average about 11 mpg in mixed driving and 15 on the highway.

Hey, at least I don’t put a ton of miles on it.

Andrew T. Maness > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
12/09/2015 at 18:57

Kinja'd!!!

Andrew T. Maness > fourvalleys
12/09/2015 at 18:59

You win.

Andrew T. Maness > Textured Soy Protein
12/09/2015 at 19:00

Would like to see pictures of that thing at some point!

Andrew T. Maness > PowderHound
12/09/2015 at 19:00

Mmmmmm, gold 2.5RS 15s...nice.

Textured Soy Protein > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 19:17

In its natural habitat:

Kinja'd!!!

PowderHound > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 19:44

Kinja'd!!!

16s actually. Here’s a bad quick photo of the current set-up

Andrew T. Maness > Textured Soy Protein
12/09/2015 at 19:45

Haha, that’s great.

Andrew T. Maness > PowderHound
12/09/2015 at 19:46

Oh that’s right, I was thinking of the previous sport wheel that I had back in the day that was a 15.

Master Cylinder > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 20:21

Well, if the answer is what I’m driving, then it’s a 944S with Blizzaks and a stripped interior.

For some reason it’s mid-December in Michigan and there’s no snow, though, so really it could be a friggin’ Viper with all-seasons this year.

ranwhenparked > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 21:09

Functioning heater and good snow tires?

That’s about as much thought as I’ve ever put into it.

fourvalleys > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 21:09

In short, buy a winter car that will get you through the winter (1) safely, (2) reliably, and (3) cheaply.

Spend the rest on your summer car :)

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > Wrong Wheel Drive (41%)
12/09/2015 at 21:52

Excellent, I like your thinking.

dr861 > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 22:24

Kinja'd!!!

99 Corvette Convertible. Pop’s has got one and the top is really easy to operate. It also runs f*cking AWESOMELY in the cold and sounds loud as hell.

Levitas > Andrew T. Maness
12/09/2015 at 22:43

Sorry for the long post ahead of time, but hear me out. I’m going to offer up a much more engineering-based quality that makes a vehicle great in the winter:

A vehicle that is neutrally stable dynamics-wise, mostly related to aerodynamics.

Let me explain: in the world of airplanes and rockets, a vehicle that has an aerodynamic center (AC) ahead of the center of gravity (CG) is considered unstable. When in flight, the CG will attempt to move ahead of the AC and flip the vehicle around to become more stable.

The same applies for cars above certain speeds where aerodynamics start to dominate (say, 30mph). A car that is intrinsically longitudinally stable will, when perturbed, return to the stable direction. Tires, suspension, etc. can all play into the response, but the aerodynamics of a vehicle are incredibly important. And complex.

But, consider this: say you’re doing 60mph on an interstate that appears to be mostly clear. You hit a patch of ice, and lose traction. Your vehicle starts to rotate, you try to counter but the grip just isn’t there. But, assuming the perturbation wasn’t too great, the vehicle snaps back the direction you were traveling originally, all on its own. Your pants are now saved!

I can personally attest to this: my MINI was absolutely brilliant in the snow because you could get a serious amount of side-slip, and the darn thing would rotate around back to normal. It was the only thing that made me feel somewhat comfortable in near-white out conditions on an interstate in several inches of snow. Being able to feel when the MINI started turning, and feeling it turn right back without ever touching the wheel.

Needmoargarage > TheHondaBro
12/10/2015 at 08:53

Honestly I had a lot of fun in a Miata (no V8 though) last winter. I cheated and got a hard top and some good snow tires. Good driving dynamics translate well to driving on snow and ice...just at much lower speeds. I would safely pass AWD cars and 4x4’s on the freeway all the time. Only time you get in trouble is if there is more than like 5” of standing snow :)

Liked it better than a WRX I used to have on all-season tires, and it was a lot more fun than the F-150 I’m driving now.

wiffleballtony > Andrew T. Maness
12/10/2015 at 10:50

If you live in a place that has “winter” then probably something that you don’t care about if it gets rusted or crashed.

Andrew T. Maness > fourvalleys
12/10/2015 at 11:42

I’ll have to disagree with you on number 3, I’m an advocate for spending a little more to get you through winter as comfortably as possible. I’d rather drop $15k-$20k on a vehicle that’ll dominate winter, and then $4k-$7k on a summer runabout. Doesn’t take much to have fun in sunny weather.

Andrew T. Maness > Levitas
12/10/2015 at 11:47

I would have read a post 4 times the length of this if you had continued with the engineering based explanation. This is really interesting, and has the wheels turning in my head big time. Can you give a basic explanation of how AC and CG are calculated? It would be fascinating to do comparison tests with vehicles that claim to be “winter ready” and see how they stack up against each other.

As for the MINI, I know a number of mountain folk who swear by em. I’m even considering suggesting on to my parents.

Andrew T. Maness > dr861
12/10/2015 at 11:48

Looks like a diecast model in that photo!

Andrew T. Maness > Master Cylinder
12/10/2015 at 11:49

944S with Blizzaks sounds like my idea of a good time.

fourvalleys > Andrew T. Maness
12/10/2015 at 13:53

I disagree, but I think it’s easier to have cheap fun in winter than in summer. I guess that’s up to preference.

Andrew T. Maness > fourvalleys
12/10/2015 at 19:16

Yep, all comes down to what makes ya happy.

Look at that, civil discourse on the internet!