Why the 2016 Civic and 2016 Maxima don't make sense.

"LJ909" (lj909) 10/21/2015 at 14:07 • Filed to: None

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While both of these are lookers (The Maxima is really a looker in person surprisingly) they both don’t make sense. Why? Because, in the case of the Civic, the Accord exists, and in the case of the Maxima, the Altima exists.

According the Motor Trends recent test of the new Civic, the one that they had for the test was optioned up to $27,335. That’s a lot of coin for a Civic that’s about the same size now as the Accord was 10-15 years ago.

See when the customer looks across the show room and wonders why he would get a smaller car when the Accord I built here is only a few hundred dollars more, the Civic wont make sense to them.

Same goes for the Maxima & Altima.

You can get an Altima 3.5 SL for 33k. Now that’s loaded with no options.

For 60 bucks more you can get a base Maxima. That’s damn near overlap. Now days the Altima is comparable so the Maxima starts to make much less sense, unless you really have to have a Maxima. So do these two cars make sense? Which would you guys choose?

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:14

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You can option up a ‘16 Civic to 27k+? Seriously? WTF Honda. I guess the $18,200 I paid for my ‘15 Civic SE wasn’t too bad.

You know, I get inflation and all that crap, but this just seems ridiculous to me. It was only 15 years ago that Honda introduced the Fit in the US, for something cheaper to market under the Civic. At this rate, I say there will be something below the Fit inside of 3 years.

PotbellyJoe and 42 others > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:16

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The other thing to keep in mind for Altima vs. Maxima is noise.

The Maxima, IMO, has consistently killed the Altima for road noise. It’s like the Avalon/Camry conundrum, when it is not size you pay extra for, it is a premium for a better experience.

The Accord is simply size. You’re buying up.

Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:16

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The maxima is totally ruined by front license plates....

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:18

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From what I’ve read, the Maxima is far more luxurious than the Altima. A lot less boring to look at too imo. The Civic and Accord though? Beats me.

gin-san - shitpost specialist > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:19

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Is it just me or is it starting to look a little hatchback-ey around here? Is this still just a sedan?

LongbowMkII > gin-san - shitpost specialist 10/21/2015 at 14:21

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it’s a lowered Murano

Teleph0nes > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 14:21

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Everyone is pushing “premium” small cars. Price out a fully loaded 3 with the 2.5, a Focus Titanium, Golf, etc. They all come in around 25-27. That being said, I can look at those 3 cars without becoming violently ill. These are marketed towards yuppies with no kids or maybe a small child. They want a new car, but just want something sensible. You know, good mileage, reliable, and not ostentatious. They could afford a low level BMW or something, but don’t want to pay the money and don’t need the cache. They do want all the cool tech features though. So suddenly, their cheap sensible compact is almost 30 grand.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 14:26

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It’s just more features... it starts at $19... It’s not like other cars in the segment can’t be optioned up that high.

Are you opposed to choice?

gin-san - shitpost specialist > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 14:31

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Even previously basic cars are becoming silly expensive; around here, the fully loaded Civic (Touring model) goes for over 30k CAD with taxes. The Si Sedan is another 1500 CAD on top of that - it’s actually becoming a bit silly. Even if I wanted a Fit, MSRP after tax is over 18k.

I really want to buy a new car, but given that I’ll drive around 5000kms per year or less I’d essentially be forking over thousands of dollars to look better while I’m driving around.

I'll probably just keep an eye open for a 2011 (or that generation) of Si sedan which still has the high-revving K20 instead of the base Accord engine that the new Si gets.

Tripper > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:32

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I can’t be the only one that thinks both cars are fugly...right?

gin-san - shitpost specialist > Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras 10/21/2015 at 14:33

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I think Euro style plates might work but Ontario plates would look fucking awful on that. I really wish front plates were not a legal requirement in my province.

Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras > gin-san - shitpost specialist 10/21/2015 at 14:34

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Here in NJ you need front plates...and they go right underneath the chrome. It looks horrible

gin-san - shitpost specialist > LongbowMkII 10/21/2015 at 14:35

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That would explain its size - the outgoing Altima is already a massive car, and if this is following the trend of becoming bigger, it must look like a tank in person. I don't think it's ugly, just unnecessarily large.

gin-san - shitpost specialist > Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras 10/21/2015 at 14:37

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That's no good; then you gotta sit there at the gas station waiting for someone to fill-up your car while everyone can see your poorly placed front plates.

Uug > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:37

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The Civic ended production in Japan a few years ago because of this. The Accord is similar in size and the Fit grew into the Civic’s slot in the lineup. Factor in taxes based on size/displacement and it didn’t make sense to continue.

Ash78, voting early and often > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 14:39

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This is nothing new. If there were no financial overlap at all, under all situations, then there would be a gap in the lineup.

Further, you can’t compare “models” (sub-brands) across generations because in reality, the Fit is the Civic from a decade ago, the Civic is the Accord from a decade ago, and the Accord is...um...a sporty Avalon. Or something.

Car marketers discovered a long time ago that it’s better to grow the models ALONG with the target market.

When the Altima first came out (yes, I remember it as an adult), once I got over the horrid stock Altezza taillights, all I could think was “Why would anyone buy a Maxima anymore?”

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > gin-san - shitpost specialist 10/21/2015 at 14:44

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The base Accord engine and that Si (2012 gen) have completely different engines. The former is a brand-new DI motor, and the latter is the K24

LJ909 > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 14:44

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Thats exactly wht I was thinking. Hondas reshuffling their lineup. The Fit is where the Civic used to be and the Civic is where the Accord used to be.

LJ909 > PotbellyJoe and 42 others 10/21/2015 at 14:46

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True, but its not that much of a difference to justify it. Especially with them being so close in price.

LJ909 > gin-san - shitpost specialist 10/21/2015 at 14:47

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The Civic too. Both look like hatchs. Like the old Mazda 6 hatch.

LJ909 > Tripper 10/21/2015 at 14:48

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Nah your not the only one. They are fugly and handsome at the same time to me. The Civic looks more grown up, the Maxima looks good in person, like I said Especially in black. Nissan’s design language works better on the Maxima than the new Murano, which looks over done.

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 10/21/2015 at 15:04

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I’m opposed to cost, not choice. I'm also opposed to model bloat. And while I do like choice, I honestly can’t figure out why automakers are making most of their radios touchscreen. That just screams stupid to me. It’s annoying in the Civic. Why can’t I get a radio with buttons or knobs? As it stands right now, the damn touchscreen is a dust magnet. So much so that I keep a duster in my car and dust it off probably 3-4 times a week. And it looks good for maybe 10 minutes.

Daniel Newman > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 15:31

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You can option a Mazda 3 S GT up to almost $34,000

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 15:37

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If you’re opposed to cost, get a cheaper Civic grade (which is what you did with the SE, I suppose). Nobody is forcing you to buy a fully loaded one. Is $19k too much for a Civic for you? The competition is right around the same price and this new Civic seems like a much better equipped car than them all.

OEMs make radios touchscreen because that’s what the majority of consumers want and pay for. They’ll get better

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 10/21/2015 at 15:47

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And all of the touch screen radios I’ve dealt with have been crap. It would be so much better if we could just mirror our smartphones (basically android auto or Apple CarPlay)

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 15:57

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......which is what this Civic does have, along with the Accord

gin-san - shitpost specialist > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 10/21/2015 at 16:01

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Was the K24 not a base Accord engine in previous generations, then? I didn’t know that they had replaced the 2.4L 4-cylinder in the current generation of Accord.

Textured Soy Protein > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 16:17

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Sorry, but your math on the Civic and Accord doesn’t add up.

The $27,355 Civic in the Motor Trend article is a fully-loaded Touring model which has more features and options than the outgoing EX-L Navigation trim.

Since the Accord Touring also includes a V6 engine, the highest I4 Accord trim level is the EX-L Navigation, which costs $31,390, a full $4,055 more than the Civic Touring that Motor Trend tested.

Short-throw Granny Shifter is 2 #blessed 2b stressed > LJ909 10/21/2015 at 16:22

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Every carmaker has been doing this forever, and it intentional. It’s like saying “why would anyone buy a base 528i when you could get a 335i with 2 more cylinders and a bunch of options?” Yet time marches on and BMW still manages to sell 528i’s.

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 10/21/2015 at 21:01

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If they actually work I’d be amazed. My car came with a completely half baked system that Honda stopped supporting about 6 months after it came out.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! 10/21/2015 at 22:47

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try it.. I’ve tried the system (Android Auto) in my friend’s A7 GTI and I liked it a lot

Stapleface-Now Hyphenated! > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 10/22/2015 at 06:12

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I hope that’s the case for the next vehicle I buy. Or hell, maybe I can just retrofit a new Civic radio into my current Civic.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > LJ909 10/31/2015 at 00:47

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This is Why The Dodge Dart had Such a hard time. Because You could buy a bigger Avenger for less money, A LOT less money. Maybe the MSRP was more on the Avenger, but Chrysler always had big intensives on them, and the dealer mark up was bigger so, at least at the dealership I worked at, more of the MSRP could be cut out there too. Of Coarse the Dart is/was a better car, but the Average American car buyer only sees size, and engine displacement.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > LJ909 10/31/2015 at 00:53

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The Civic really is WAY too big. It should be an Accord, and the Accord should be called something else. The Honda Civic used to be a nice simple small car, with a good engine that was pratical, and cheap, but still enjoyable. Now it’s trying to THE BEST “COMPACT CAR” every. Mr Regular hit the nail on the head when he said “the problem with Honda is that they are always trying to go upmarket.”. Pretty soon there will be no reason for Acura to exist, oh wait...