Canon's 7D Mark II - I don't get it... *completely unrelated to cars* rant.

"I park in a garage" (karlisindanger) 09/15/2014 at 17:58 • Filed to: None

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Why is the camera !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! Unless you have an investment in Canon glass, why would you pay the premium?

Pentax K3 - $1100

Sony a77 Mark II - $1200

Nikon D7100 - $1200

The specs on these are quite similar, and seem to shoot at that mid to high end pro-sumer market.

Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:02

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BUT THEY USED THE 7D IN THE AVENGERS, BRO!!!!!!1111one11111eleven!!1!11

blackchair > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:04

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I don't know much about the 7D, but I assume it would complete against a D400 if Nikon ever decided to give us what we want. If so, the price doesn't seem to bad.

mcseanerson > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:05

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Video

Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 09/15/2014 at 18:05

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Should I trade in my-still-under-warranty-70D and pay the extra $400?

twinturbobmw > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:13

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Well, it's full frame and has a large amount of lens options. Other than that, I can't see why you wouldn't buy an A7 or D7100. Or why you wouldn't spend the extra for a 6D.

JGrabowMSt > twinturbobmw 09/15/2014 at 18:17

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It's not full frame. The 7D never has been, and will likely remain as the gatekeeper between crop and full frame.

I park in a garage > mcseanerson 09/15/2014 at 18:17

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I don't shoot video, so I may not understand the difference quite, but it still doesn't seem to be much of a boost from the 70D. Both shoot 1080 with 24-60p.

I park in a garage > blackchair 09/15/2014 at 18:17

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It's just strange that all the competing cameras are $400 or more less.

I park in a garage > Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert 09/15/2014 at 18:18

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Sure, if you want a better AF system, and better ISO (assuming you're into stills). The AF is really the biggest upgrade I think in this iteration.

mcseanerson > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:19

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Video is a lot more complicated than just that. Just like stills are a lot more than just Megapixels and ISO.

I park in a garage > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 09/15/2014 at 18:19

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4 realz. sell everything and upgrade! lolzBBQwtf BUTTS!

I park in a garage > twinturbobmw 09/15/2014 at 18:21

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the 7D is APS-C. If the Canon was full frame, then i'd say 1800 is a steal!

twinturbobmw > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 18:23

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Ah, I always thought it was full frame. I would still go with 6D or A7, even though they're a bit more expensive.

I park in a garage > mcseanerson 09/15/2014 at 18:23

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Agreed, and maybe when its available for review it would clear up the difference. but if you're buying this for video, wouldn't you just jump to a 6D or to a dedicated video camera? just seems overal pricey for APS-C.

Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:24

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so its basically my current sensor housed in a 7D body and mated with a better processor, right? But I'm losing wifi?

I park in a garage > Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert 09/15/2014 at 18:29

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Sorta. You get a better image processor (2x Digic 6), no wifi, 65 point AF system with more Cross-type, better viewfinder (100% coverage), more storage slots, and better video recording capabilities.

HammerheadFistpunch > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:29

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Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:30

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huh. Does the screen flip out/touch?

I park in a garage > HammerheadFistpunch 09/15/2014 at 18:30

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I don't get it.

JGrabowMSt > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:30

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The 7D is a competitive upgrade for users who don't want to re-invest all their glass. It's also a "cheap" way to get some extra stretch in certain applications.

I own an older 7D that I bought new on sale for under $1200 at the time, before the price shot back up (around when the first firmware upgrade was released).

The thing about the 7D is that it shares the lenses with all the other "lowly" EOS Rebels. Someone who buys a T x or T x i can upgrade to a 7D, keep all of their lenses, and move to an incredibly more capable camera. Oh the joys of buying body only.

Then you get into the hardware specs, and the 7D is the wolf in sheeps clothing. Dual Digic CPUs, massive buffer size, specs that rival the 5D everywhere but the CMOS sensor itself. It's the choice for people who don't need full frame. Lets also keep in mind that buying a full frame zoom lens will give you extra stretch from a crop sensor. My 120-400 is more like a 180ish-640ish lens on my 7D. It's awesome, because finding a longer zoom lens would have cost me a lot more than what I paid for my Sigma. The kicker is that no one needs to know.

Lets be honest, yes, there are cheaper cameras in the world. It's like buying a car. Why do you have what you have? There are cheaper things you could have bought. You bought what you did because you wanted a specific set of features, and you wanted it to look a certain way, and you didn't bother justifying those reasons to anyone else. You bought what you wanted.

The 7D and now 7Dmk2 are monsters. If I had the money, and I needed to upgrade, I would totally get a 7Dmk2, because I can keep all of my lenses and keep doing exactly what I have been doing.

Once you going through post processing and you crop an image, and put it on the internet, the only people who know what you used are the people checking the exif data. If you stripped the exif data, you could be using a Galaxy Note 2, a Lumia, a point and shoot, or a Nikon. It doesn't actually matter.

I'm not a Canon fanboi, but yes, I'm full invested into Canon. I'm also fully invested into crop sensor. I can point my camera, frame a shot, and take a picture with any camera you put in my hands. I just have my preference, and it happens to be Canon. I find the quality of the images to be extremely great, and it fulfills all of my wants out of the system. My girlfriend shoots Nikon. I can't stand the interface and button layout, but she feels exactly the same way about my Canon, but in the end, the best camera in the world is the one you have with you.

Is it worth $1800? Consider what it has "under the hood," and pretty much, yes, it is. Is it the perfect package? No, certainly not. It's not unlike the Toyobaru twins. Great at a lot of things, but it's still got a pretty wimpy engine under the hood, and prius tires. The 7Dmk2 will be worth $1800 to the people who spend $1800 on it. It'll be worth whatever I spend on a used one when it comes to market, because I'd love to have one, but don't need a brand new one, as much as it would be nice.

I park in a garage > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 18:32

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It just seems like a terrible middle ground, as its so close to the full frame options in price, but so close to the APS-C competitors (including 70d) in specification.

I park in a garage > Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert 09/15/2014 at 18:33

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nope. they added "durability". body is slightly heavier/more rugged.

Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:33

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huh.

JGrabowMSt > twinturbobmw 09/15/2014 at 18:36

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6D is really targeted for it's video features. Sure, it takes nice photos, but in the end, you're not going to be able to tell the difference unless you check the exif data.

I dropped a little change on a Beachtek audio box, Rode NTG-2, and custom follow focus. Buying all of that and a 7D was cheaper than a BNIB 6D, so to each his own. After talking to a lot of people in the industry, it's not the gear you have, it's what you make of it. I don't need to have super expensive gear, I just need to know my gear well, treat it right, and know how to polish up the end result correctly.

I was really really tempted to move to a micro 4/3 system, but I like the gear I have, and wouldn't be able to replace it easily or cheaply. The Blackmagic Pocket Cinema is what was pushing me. Unfortunately, that fell through, and in the end, I'm still happy with my 7D.

I park in a garage > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 18:40

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Haha, not to pick on you, but I did say "unless you already have an investment in Canon Glass".

I agree, at least with the dual digic 6 processors, its gunning for the full frame in everything but name, but unfortunately for it, all of the competition has recently upgraded their specs too, and the price/spec point just seems off now.

But while the "internet" might not care, I find that photographers are still quite willfully ignorant of APS-C sensors. Just like how "you have to shoot canon/nikon in order to be a pro" even though there are plenty of pro people shooting with other competitors.

JGrabowMSt > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:43

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From a technical standpoint, the 7Dmk2 isn't going to have much competition. It has a unique feature set that cannot be matched by the 70D. They have different target audiences. I have every reason to believe an introductory sports photographer would be running for a 7Dmk2 for it's burst abilities alone. Now that it has a wider ISO range, it can be used at more events, rain or shine, cloudy or bright as all hell. Putting it with the crop sensor lenses doesn't mean a damn thing other than I can pick up lenses just as good for 2/3 the cost a full frame lens, brand new.

I really don't see any reason to believe the 7Dmk2 is going to have competition. If it's marketed properly as a substantial upgrade for EOS Rebel users, and offers enough of an upgrade for 7D owners that are itching from upgrade fever, Canon has no competition against the 7Dmk2. It's including a huge amount of features that are video friendly, which means film sets will be running for these as well. Anything with good enough focus sensors and a quiet enough focus system will be extremely useful, with clean HDMI output, they couldn't ask for a better unit. They wont even have to drop major coin on lenses.

The dSLR market is no longer just photography, so there's features that most users will never touch, but people will be running for. The 7Dmk2, in my opinion, will be a very successful camera when it finally gets released.

Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To > Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert 09/15/2014 at 18:45

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Less noise, 60FPS video, and (thank Christ) better Autofocus makes it pretty worth the $400 in my very humble opinion

JGrabowMSt > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:46

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Honestly, if it weren't for the gear I have now, I'd switch in a heartbeat to a Sigma Merrill dSLR.

I would just have to replace every lens I've spent a ton of money on to do that. I only buy Sigma glass, so I'm sure there would be a Sigma mount for each lens I own, but between buying all of my lenses over, or just upgrading the body, I'll upgrade the body.

But every time I see a Merrill, I get tempted. I love Canon as a brand, but I'd be more than willing to try out a Merrill. That and the shutter sound of a Sigma is unmistakeable.

V8Demon - Prefers Autos for drag racing. Fite me! > Joshua "Dr. Science" Gilbert 09/15/2014 at 18:47

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I have a first gen 7D myself. My next camera will be full frame.

Refurbished 6d for $1500...... http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/catalo…

Noah - Now with more boost. > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 18:50

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Canon is definitely the Mac of the camera world. But maybe that body is designed to compete in a higher price bracket? It is 50% more than everything you listed lol.

I park in a garage > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 18:54

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You're preaching to the choir about "its not what you have, its what you do with it". That's a sentiment that I really think more people should judge by.

The 70D probably isn't the best comparison point, I mostly just used it to show how little of a jump it was between it, the 7Dmk2 and the 6D. Its just strange as only canon seems to have filled this "void". Nikon jumps it, and of course Sony doesn't bother. The Sony is quite close as they are really gunning for the video market (maybe someday they will get irtright in their non-video specific models). Granted, there are still some differences, but around that $2000 mark, I think people are looking at specific solutions, and not necessarily and all-rounder type setup.

I park in a garage > Noah - Now with more boost. 09/15/2014 at 18:56

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Yeah, its kind of on its own. Nikon and Sony skip this "segment". Pentax just is doing their own thing.

Stephen the Canuck > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 19:52

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I'm pretty certain that Sigma offers a service to remount your lens for another camera system. That way you don't actually have to completely replace your lenses. http://www.sigmaphoto.com/change-your-mo…

Stephen the Canuck > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 20:04

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This camera sounds pretty good. I use a T3i and a 20D though. I think the 7D2 will be a very viable in a year or two when the price has dropped a bit, and a sale is on, or a good deal on a used on is available.

The 10fps, ISO of 16,000, and the updated processors are what interest me mostly. The 20.2mp will be sufficient for me I believe. The dual Digic 6 processors with the updated sensor should provide excellent image quality, and I would bet that the high ISO is pretty clear too.

Most of the good lens that I want are Canon EF mount anyways, so I wouldn't really be too worried about the EF/EF-S mount deal. So I would get the extra reach from sticking with the crop sensor by going with the 7D2.

I'm curious to see what the 80D (or equivalent) will be like.

iforgotmyburnerkeyonce > I park in a garage 09/15/2014 at 20:24

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Nobody *needs* 65 cross-type AF. If you're not shooting sports, do yourself a favor and get the X-T1... I don't see why anyone would pay $1800 for a 70D with fancy AF. Seriously. I haven't seen the official specs yet, but isn't the sensor the SAME SENSOR that's in the 70D?

JGrabowMSt > Stephen the Canuck 09/15/2014 at 20:36

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oh dear. That is really tempting. Really really tempting.

Stephen the Canuck > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 21:11

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Yeah, it's just a limited selection of lenses that the service is available for. No 70-200mm f/2.8 on the list though.

JGrabowMSt > Stephen the Canuck 09/15/2014 at 21:17

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I dont have a 70-200, but regardless, i dont think any of my lenses are eligible.

10-20 f3.5|28-70 f2.8|50 f1.4|70-300 f4-5.6|120-400 f4-5.6

Then id also have to give up my lensbaby composer, as well as holga pinhole and 60mm plastic lenses.

Stephen the Canuck > JGrabowMSt 09/15/2014 at 21:54

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Sounds like you just need to run multiple systems at the same time.

Stephen the Canuck > iforgotmyburnerkeyonce 09/15/2014 at 22:06

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Apparently it's an updated sensor.

I park in a garage > Stephen the Canuck 09/16/2014 at 01:32

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that's amazing. I had no idea.

BATC42 > iforgotmyburnerkeyonce 09/16/2014 at 18:23

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Yes! And apparently the new XT-1 (the graphite silver, not the full black) come with lightning fast AF and a new EVF. And it's cheaper. And it will all be available with a firmware update on the black XT-1.

iforgotmyburnerkeyonce > BATC42 09/17/2014 at 09:58

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I've seen the Graphite Silver X-T1 and it looks sexy. Not sure why a special edition would cost less than the original, but the Silver is just that, a special edition. Probably will get the "special edition" tag dropped and turn to just be a color option... I haven't checked fujirumors.com in a while, though, so I could be wrong

Xyl0c41n3 > I park in a garage 09/25/2014 at 17:34

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The Canon 7D isn't competing against the Nikon D7100, it's competing against the Nikon D300s, which retails for about $1,700.

The D1700 competes against the Canon 60D/70D. They're both decent, but they're still very much prosumer level.

The 7D and D300s, on the other hand, are on the low end of the professional spectrum. And definitely worth the price. And it'd be totally worth it to invest in brand name glass at least for your wide angle— a 17-55mm f /2.8 for Nikon or 17-35mm f /2.8 for the Canon, each about $1,200 themselves. But you could get away with using a Sigma or Tokina lens for half the price. They're pretty solid, with just a little more distortion at the shortest focal length and a bit less sharpness.

Xyl0c41n3 > JGrabowMSt 09/25/2014 at 17:43

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Heh. I'm with your girlfriend. I've shot both and Canon's interface always feels foreign to me. Plus, you turn the rings on the lenses in opposite directions between the two to zoom and focus. It always throws me off when I switch between the two brands. I can operate a Nikon with my eyes closed, but I always feel like I have to look at where my fingers are going on a Canon. That little bit of extra effort disrupts my flow. Guess I'm saying I'm a Nikon girl for life. ^_^

JGrabowMSt > Xyl0c41n3 09/25/2014 at 17:50

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True fact: Not all lenses turn the same direction. I while I wouldn't say it's 50/50 with all my lenses, I do have a couple that are different from the others, and all of my real glass lenses are Sigma brand.

To each their own, right? Nikon isn't a bad brand, but side by side with the same settings, Canon has always given me the results I've liked better. And that's not comparing apples to oranges either, like saying my 7D is better than her D3100, I had directly compared my T1i to her D3100, and the T1i really produced images that were far less noisy and always crisper. Maybe it's a firmware issue? I don't know, I really don't know her camera well enough to get into it, but maybe one day I'll wrestle with it and see if it can improve. In good sunlight, the results are great, but that's about it to me.

I park in a garage > Xyl0c41n3 09/25/2014 at 18:25

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The problem is, Nikon currently doesn't sell the D300s, and it was introduced way back in 2009, otherwise I think I'd understand have understood the placement of an APS-C "pro" camera at that price point. Canon is currently the only company to offer such a camera. Nikon, Sony, Pentax, etc... stop their APS-C cameras at around $1200 or less, have very similar (but not quite as powerful) specifications at a significantly reduced cost. The only real market for this camera is people with lots of Canon lenses.

agjios > I park in a garage 09/26/2014 at 07:41

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Only the a77 competes with the 7D MkII as an action camera, but has much fewer lens options and much lower battery life. The D7100 is nice, but sorry, not competitive with the MkII. Go read the Nikon forums; many Nikonians are fuming that a true APS action-oriented camera doesn't exist yet, a true successor to the D300.

Pentax has awesome cameras, but it depends on your intended use. I have a friend that has an original K-5 (bought new), with 21mm, 17-70mm, 77mm, and 55-300mm for landscapes. I don't think it works quite as well for motion tracking, however.