Summit Point HPDE & BMW CCA Club Race (Video)

"BKRM3" (BKRM3)
07/30/2014 at 17:00 • Filed to: bmw m3, summit point, track day bro, hpde, because racecar, bmw cca, club race, driver school, HAPPENINGS

AKA - Track day bro! Spoiler alert: no deer. Sorry I'm not sorry.

Dudes: this past weekend I had another track event (representing days #5 and 6 on track so far this season) at Summit Point Raceway in West Virginia. I've been there before, back in 2012, but had only driven the Jefferson circuit (newly expanded) up until this weekend. The main circuit is a whole other can of worms. Learning a new track is always exciting and challenging, so I knew I was in for a good weekend if the weather held off. It did.

Saw a bunch of this ^^ stuff, as usual. The 430 Scud was actually a shared car (see the two sets of numbers?) and the "slower" driver was in the intermediate group with me - got to spend quite a bit of time listening to the symphony that thing makes. Awesome.

This was my crew: Z4 M coupe, E92 335i and my E90 M3.

Looked like it was going to rain but never really did. Some sprinkles (which you can see blasting off my windshield at the tail end of the Run 4 video, below). Track was an absolute blast, part technical and part flat out speed. I saw an indicated 143mph on the front straight, half of which (including the braking zone) is downhill.

Here's a video of me working through traffic, which should start at the 13:30 mark. Yes, that is a 997 GT3 being driven rather slowly. Gotta start somewhere I guess.

SO - aside from me dawdling around out there, there was also a club race each day. Those are fun to watch. It's multi-class, all BMW, and it's great racing.

The picture above is the racers lined up on the false grid before going out on track for the first race, and the 66 car belongs to my friend and sometimes instructor Lou. Like most of the people there, Lou is an awesome dude. When the track is cold the custom is to break out the libations.

Those beers were later replaced by the Macallan 12 and a variety of bourbon - oh, and boxes of cigars. It's fine guys, it's the south, ok?

Here's the final session of the event, wherein I follow my friend with the 335 around. In the last session the goal is always "dial it back, have fun." I hope you like the Heart that happened to be on the radio at the beginning. I sure as heck did.

DISCUSSION (56)

Meatcoma > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 08:33

Star for the Oppo sticker on your helmet.

I'd love to take my car out for this. Being my DD, I have second thoughts.

BKRM3 > Meatcoma
07/30/2014 at 08:43

This car is my DD. I buy HPDE-specific insurance (cheapest if you buy a multi-event policy) from Lockton Motorsports: http://www.locktonmotorsports.com/product/track-…

If you're totally new to the track I wouldn't even worry about it for your first event. You're going to be going....adequately slowly. =) You absolutely should give it a try! Some clubs (mine included) do special events for first timers that include skid pad time and slalom. Really a great way to learn your car and have a ton of fun.

GTiceman > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 08:48

Glad to see you included me in the last video. A great weekend indeed.

Kinja'd!!!

BKRM3 > GTiceman
07/30/2014 at 08:50

Ahh, there's the bourbon! Mmmmmmmmm. Also, I re-LOL'd at his 3/5 sticker.

Meatcoma > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 09:57

Speaking of which there is an autocross event here local this weekend. Maybe I'll go watch this time and get some photos since the registration is closed. Ended yesterday... fate?

AM3R > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 12:24

Let me know next time you go to summit point, I'm only an hour away!!

BKRM3 > Meatcoma
07/30/2014 at 16:01

Autocross = standing around all day for 4 minutes of driving. Don't tell anyone else here I said that. I had 3h 20m of track time at this event. Sign up for an HPDE, you'll have a blast!

BKRM3 > AM3R
07/30/2014 at 16:04

Will do, but it won't be until next year. I have two more track weekends this year at NJMP that are set in stone and I miiiiiiiiiiight do an event at Pocono in between if I can swing it. Summit is a hike from Philly, about 3 hours. Not toooo bad, unless you drive home the entire way in one gigantic freakshow of a thunderstorm, which I absolutely did on Sunday. Yargh. At least it didn't rain at the track!

AM3R > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 16:18

No problem. I've been thinking about VIR but that's 4 hours away so a bit of a drive when I can get to summit point in an hour.

Wishin & workin for an E39 M5 > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 17:02

Kinja'd!!!

Hey guuuuuuuurrrrrlll!!!!!

Manuél Ferrari > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 17:19

Why does the Scud have 2 numbers on it?

BKRM3 > Manuél Ferrari
07/30/2014 at 17:22

Two drivers in different run groups. One (the 100) was instructor and the other (38) was in my run group.

BKRM3 > Wishin & workin for an E39 M5
07/30/2014 at 17:23

Bwahahahaha.

nermal > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 17:28

Love me some Summit Main, I've done a few days there on my bike. T5 is my nemesis though, on a bike it's a super fast turn followed by heavy braking into T6. I always slow down wayyyy too much because the wall on the outside is a bit intimidating.

MINI COOPER POWAH! > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 17:28

Niiiiiiiiiiice, i was going to come out, but i was at VIR racing, ill pop out there this weekend for majors, then njmp next weekend for lemons. ahhhhh racing

Manuél Ferrari > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 17:43

ahh, got it

thanks!

BKRM3 > MINI COOPER POWAH!
07/30/2014 at 18:24

Awesome! Just DEs for me at the moment but I would absolutely race in chump or lemons if I were offered the opportunity. So far it's been 4 days on thunderbolt and 2 on summit this year - next up is 4 days (two separate events) on Lightning. Might try to break those up with a weekend at Pocono if I can swing it. VIR is on my bucket list, along with Lime Rock, Road America, Road Atlanta and Laguna Seca. I would add the Glen to that list but I'm certain that I'll make it there in 2015.

Why can't all weekends be track weekends???

BKRM3 > nermal
07/30/2014 at 18:27

Diggin the Nermal handle and avatar! I think I'd be terrified of a race track on a motorcycle. I grew up on dirt bikes so the knee dragging doesnt quite click lol. T5? Heck, you don't even need to stop for that - just take the 5 - 8 expressway through the grass! =P

MINI COOPER POWAH! > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 19:05

haha i wish i was racing, just working for now lol

BKRM3 > MINI COOPER POWAH!
07/30/2014 at 19:16

You're not driving!? Man, you gotta drive! Well, actually, any day at the track is a good day. Wish I could get paid to do this lol.

MINI COOPER POWAH! > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 19:38

i raced last weekend, but thats probably it for me for the year, money talks and bullshit walks

BKRM3 > MINI COOPER POWAH!
07/30/2014 at 19:49

Truth. Best hobby ever but the shit ain't cheap.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > BKRM3
07/30/2014 at 20:50

Nice driving. Have to give any point-bys?

BKRM3 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
07/30/2014 at 21:14

Thanks! Oh, sure, I gave some points. Some of those E36 track cars are fast as hell. I have a heavy car on street tires, definitely fast but not the fastest!

GTiceman > BKRM3
07/31/2014 at 09:31

That bourbon was awesome .... as was the aged Bolt Cutter later. I will add the video of you when it is done.

MINI COOPER POWAH! > BKRM3
07/31/2014 at 10:04

trust me on that, realize it more and more since its what i do for a living

slickrickinaz > BKRM3
08/04/2014 at 10:18

How is the snap oversteer on this car?

BKRM3 > slickrickinaz
08/04/2014 at 10:21

Transition to oversteer is really smooth under power. If you get there by lift-off there's an awful lot of weight swinging around. Power on is preferred =) Chassis is extremely well balanced at the limit and forgiving. It's really a delight on track. Doesn't go out of its way to try to kill you like some cars. Not terrifying in the least. Drive one if you have the chance!

slickrickinaz > BKRM3
08/04/2014 at 10:48

Thanks for the reply! Yes, I'm dying to drive one, as I've owned an E90 335i and have driven an E60 M5. I did not experience snap oversteer on the M5 (short test drive), but the 335i I did and it was a little terrifying. I was curious if the M3 was similar in that regard given it has LSD and slightly less torque.

BKRM3 > slickrickinaz
08/04/2014 at 10:54

I didn't like my 335i with the open diff. Had I kept that car it would've needed to have a Quaife LSD installed, which my friends all swear by. I prefer every aspect of the M3 to the 335 though, including the power delivery. Glad I made the jump.

slickrickinaz > BKRM3
08/04/2014 at 11:06

I would love to make the jump as well. However, I just picked up a 2014 S1000RR and am enjoying the heck out of that at the moment. Hopefully will have an E90 M3 in the next 2 years or so. Take care and stay safe out there!

BKRM3 > slickrickinaz
08/04/2014 at 11:16

Excellent! Thanks, you too!

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/05/2014 at 17:07

I was out there with you in the intermediate run group. I was in the red #39/#8 330i ZHP, and you pass my dad in the #40 750Li at 15:22 in the video.

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 17:23

I remember both cars! Haha how could I forget that 750? Heck, I remember the first time I saw it... Lightning, either August or October of last year. He came up behind me on the straight like a freight train. I let him past but then got around him again a few laps later. I figured his brakes probably got soft but never did ask him. I think we were both still in the beginner group back then.

This July event was my first time on Summit main, although I have been there before (on Jefferson). I had an absolute blast and can't wait to go back.

Are you planning on doing some other events this season?

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/05/2014 at 17:43

He and I were there at Lightning last October, and we were both at Thunderbolt in June. Shockingly, he does not have issues with fade, although at lightning he did kill a set of pads and wound up warping the rotors with the new pads because he didn't get time to bed them in after we swapped them. He pretty much chews through a brand new set of front rotors, pads, and tires each event, the rear brakes last 2-3 events, and the rear tires have lasted for at least 4. Although the local BMW dealer keeps replacing them under warrenty. They know how he's killing them, they just thing its so hilarious that they don't care. The only thing he kills during the event is his windshield washer fluid, his reservoir is behind the passenger side brake rotor and it boils it all off sometime around the 2-3rd run.

I do love Summit Main, its the course I have the most seat time on, and I've basically got the whole course memorized. I finally sorted out my turn 5 issues, now I just have to grow the balls to go through 4 flat out.

We usually go to Shenandoah as well, but we aren't going to make it out there this year, but we are going to Pocono, it looks pretty cool, and we are skipping Lightning, as it really put a hurting on the tires last year(Thanks Lightbulb!)

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 18:03

Wow! I thought the consumables were bad on the M. I got 8 days out of my first set of Pagid RS-19s (and I saved them because I think they have another day or two in them, in a pinch) and I've used my AD08s for ten track days so far, which have plenty of life left. Of course, I do rotate them around to each corner to even out wear. The rear pads and rotors get virtually no wear on my car. In fairness, the 750Li isn't exactly "made" for what he's doing with it - I'm glad the dealer has such an awesome sense of humor. I mean, I get a kick out of it too but I'm not submitting the warranty claims to BMW NA!

I might see you at Pocono. That course is flat, fast and has nothing to hit. I think it's a good one to try with DSC full off. I'm buying a house and moving right before then so I'm not 100% sure I can make it, but I'm going to try. I'm also doing Lightning this month with DelVal and again in Oct with the NJ chapter. That'll probably be it for me this year. Feels like just yesterday I was just going to Thunderbolt for the April event...this season has really been flying by.

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/05/2014 at 18:17

My first course with the DSC partly disabled was Shennadoah. That was interesting, and I really do like that course, I'm pretty bummed that I'll end up missing it this year.

Part of his issue with pads is that his only choice is OEM pads, nobody makes any performance aftermarket pads for a 750. Once his warranty expires, he is looking at getting a BBK so he can get better pads for track duty, as it won't take too long for the price of new pads and rotors every event to just pass the price of a BBK.

There are actually quite a few people that submit their warranty claims to BMW NA for track abused rotors and pads, at thunderbolt last year I was talking with a guy that was lamenting that he'd have to cut back on his track days since his warranty was about to expire and he'd have to start actually paying for his pads and rotors. I think he said he was up to his 4th or 5th set of OEM pads.

Do you swap your pads at the track, or do you drive out with them on? I run Hawk HP plus pads, but they seem to have gotten eaten a bit at the last event, so I was thinking about a pure track pad, but I don't want to have to do brake pad swaps at the track if I can avoid it.

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 18:22

Also I've been running Super Sports, the wear on them is incredible, my rears have survived all 9 track events the car has been to, the fronts made it through 7, and I'd probably get even more if I dialed in a bit more front camber, its always the shoulders that wear out. Thanks to the racers, and my GF being in the beginner run group(which went out just after the races), I'm fairly sure I came home with more rubber on the rear passenger tire then I went out with.

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 18:48

I swap my track pads on before the event. Usually a week or so in advance so that when they're cold and abrasive on the street they can clean off any transferred material from the street compound, thereby creating a fresh surface for re-bedding once I get to the track. Same after the event - leave them on for a few days until they're loud as hell then swap back. If I have another event in less than a month I just leave the track pads in. With the weight and power of the E9X it doesn't make sense to attempt a jack of all trades pad. My friend tried it with stoptech street performance but pretty quickly went to the Hawk (DC10 I think?) full race pad up front. It's a night and day difference and be doesn't even bother with swapping the rears - ok in this instance because the compounds are similar enough not to alter the brake bias. I suggest picking up race pads for your fronts with a compatible street/track pad in the rear. You'll be glad you did!

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 18:52

LOL. Yeah the PSS is great up to a point. If you reaaaaallly work them they get way greasy. They're not a track tire after all, although I'm sure the weight of my car doesn't help matters. I switched to the AD08s toward the end of last year and have absolutely loved them. Of course, it's easy to run a tire that extreme when you have track-only wheels. If I had to do both track and street with one set I'd probably stick with the PSS and just figure out when to back off some.

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/05/2014 at 19:08

I guess the extra mass of your car over my ZHP is enough to get the tires to the greasy point, I haven't had any issues with mine hitting that point, but when/if I get around to track only tires, I'll probably look for something thats a bit cheaper. My dad runs them on his 750, mostly because the other tires he's tried start falling apart on the track, the PSS are the only ones that can go a full event and make it home safe.

I think I'll have to swap out for full track pads though, I put a pretty good hurting on my HP plus pads, and they only have 3 events on them. By my guess, they've got enough for Pocono, but I'm bringing a second set of pads just to stay safe. I had the stoptech pads on my car for lightning last year, between my GF and I both running the car the pads were damn near on the backing, so they are not track pads, the OEM's did better than they did.

When I went to the HP Plus pads, I decided to go all 4 wheels separate pads and rotors for the track, that way I don't have to worry about bedding in the pads, and I always have a functional set of brakes to swap back on the car, and in the long run, it doesn't really cost more. Also, I've gotten really good at fast brake swaps.

If you decide to go to Pocono, look for the 750 parked next to the red ZHP and come on over!

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 19:22

Will do - and same for you if you spot me first! Did you guys take any video at any of these events? Always try to subscribe on YT to other CCA people so if you did hit me with a link!

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/05/2014 at 19:44

I've got video from both cars, I haven't gotten it up yet though. Actually I have a bit of a backlog, I still havens gotten my Thunderbolt stuff up yet. I might go ahead and get some of it ready for internet tonight after work.

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/05/2014 at 21:58

nice, keep me posted!

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/06/2014 at 19:47

This is the video from my last run. I started overdoing things and did a full lap in 4th in the middle to slow myself down.

I've got a bit more editing to go to fix the whine in the backgound, and I really wish I'd remembered to put the foam thing on the mic, that removes the little bit of wind noise that still sneaks into the helmet.

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/06/2014 at 20:57

Your car looks fun! Man you got out on track in the right spot. You had like no traffic. Surprised to see you go down to 2nd gear for T5. The track is all 3rd and 4th for me, except for the straight. I caught myself "racing" toward the end of my third session on Sunday when I was following that E36 on r-comps. Bad idea, but I'm happy I caught myself and slowed down. Gotta look out for that!

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/06/2014 at 21:13

To be honest, the 2nd gear thing was kinda an experiment to see if 2nd would help me throttle steer a bit better going through those turns, which it did. Also, when I'm in 3rd there, I'm right in the middle of the ZHP 4k dip. Granted speed was not a huge issue going though there, but I think it helped power through/out of T6 a little better. I'm not sure that I'll be doing it all the time though, as its probably a bit too aggressive and isn't really getting me a ton of extra speed.

also, it looks like the sound for my dad's runs in the 750 are totally borked, so that's going to suck a bit.

BKRM3 > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/06/2014 at 21:30

Balls! Was looking forward to some in-car from that beast lol. There's actually a trick to the T5 exit and entry to T6 that the pro racer told my instructor (he hired him for $100 to ride with him for a session in the E36 LTW). Basically open as much as possible on the exit of T5 and floor it. Feels like you're heading straight for the grass, then a quick brake to shift weight and turn in super tight on 6. If you watch my session 4 when I'm following my friend in the 335 I take that line and catch him like crazy in there. He takes the usual wider line. I guess the pros do know what they're talking about =)

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/06/2014 at 22:20

I don't remember what last years instructor told me to do with it, but my first instructor had me entering T5 full left, let the car go halfway out, then bring it back to the left for T6. My guy this year finally got my T5 entry fixed, basically he wanted me to get as far right as I could without upsetting the car. As you carry more and more speed through T4 you'll start having to move T5 entry more and more to the left, until eventually you are doing T5 entry full left. I still chicken brake going to T4, so I'm hitting T5 from about the middle of the track. They've all had me running a bit wide on T6 to make it a single radius, I'll have to try playing with it next year.

e36Jeff now drives a ZHP > BKRM3
08/06/2014 at 22:26

Well, we have the video, and its going to get posted, there just won't be any audio to go along with it. Or at least I hope he removes the audio, cause 2 videos are just a low whine, the the rest are all cracks and pops.

750Li > BKRM3
08/08/2014 at 23:38

it was my 750 Li, I have not had a problem with fade yet, they are stock brakes, nobody will make track pads for the ONE 750Li that races. at lightning i warped my front rotors and had to back way off. on sunday at Summit main my rotors were getting real hot and had a slight warp. Throwing 5000 lbs around a track has consequences ( whoda thought!). Perhaps i need to bring a spare set of rotors that I change saturday night.

This course is hard on my car since i am hauling it down from over 100 mph plus several times per lap.

Personnally i like shenandoah the best. My son, his gfriend and I are going to pocono oct 4-5 if you go, stop over and talk, we are easy to find, there aren't many 7 series out there.

750Li > BKRM3
08/08/2014 at 23:38

This course is hard on my car since i am hauling it down from over 100 mph plus several times per lap.

Personnally i like shenandoah the best. My son, his gfriend and I are going to pocono oct 4-5 if you go, stop over and talk, we are easy to find, there aren't many 7 series out there.

750Li > BKRM3
08/08/2014 at 23:44

WEIGHT! you think you know what weight is?? My floor mats weigh more than your car!

750Li > e36Jeff now drives a ZHP
08/08/2014 at 23:51

It takes a while for the instructors to "believe" in my car, they usually start out pretty conservative and slowly build up. My guy had me going into T5 down the center of the track and cutting it tight, then setting up of T6 on the far left, ride the outside of the track, then dive for T7, balls to the wall through T8. I never felt that i got 9 fast enough(never forced all the way to the track out). T10 i was coming out of at 80 pretty consistent.

BKRM3 > 750Li
08/09/2014 at 06:19

Point taken. Of course, we know floor mats must be removed before tracking! (At 3700ish my car seems light indeed compared to a 2.5 ton 750 - guess I never looked at it that way)

BKRM3 > 750Li
08/09/2014 at 06:30

What you need is a nice big AP Racing front kit with the j-hook slots and some real endurance compound pads. And some 3" ducts. Although if you do get your brake issues sorted and can carry more speed then you'll overheat your PSSes, which I did, and you'll want more aggressive tires. Then you'll get those but realize you can't hold yourself in the seat well enough so you need harnesses, and possibly a half cage. Then where would we be? A 750Li caged with R-comps or slicks and racing brakes? Actually, now that I think about it, I'd love to see that!

Never done Shenandoah but it sounds fun! May or may not make Pocono, although I'm going to try. I'm moving a few days prior to the event so there's going to be a lot going on. Don't you hate when real life gets in the way of track time?