[Oppo]nion - Volvo 850 Wagon

"edu-petrolhead" (edu-petrolhead) 07/17/2014 at 15:55 • Filed to: discussion

1

20

Guys, I'm itching to buy a Volvo 850 wagon, but my heart is divided between two cars I saw. One of them is dark green (one of my favorite Volvo colors), much closer to my home (~60km), but with automatic transmission (blergh). The other is dark grey (also quite nice), but ~230km away from where I live. However, this one is manual (hooray).

(not the actual car I'm interested into, but this is the color)

I can't simply drive ~500km only to see a car and not buying it, but this is the only 850 Wagon with a stick I found for sale in Brazil. It's not a turbo, though, but all the turbos are automatic.

Someone own/owned a 850? Is it a good car? Is it possible to do some basic maintenance at home? Even if I know what opponauts/jalops would say, should I get the manual or the auto? I fear that if I didn't buy it, I'll never find other manual 850 for sale.

EL_ULY > edu-petrolhead 07/17/2014 at 16:01

1

ex Volvo Master Tech at your service :]

Jagvar > edu-petrolhead 07/17/2014 at 16:09

1

I do know that it was the first production car to offer side airbags. That doesn't really help you in your decision, but it's the one 850 factoid I know.

edu-petrolhead > EL_ULY 07/17/2014 at 16:11

0

How is the maintenance of this car, compared to others? I never serviced a car before, but I have a good understanding of engines, and I downloaded what the website called "Volvo greenbooks": Over 1200 pages of technical manuals to service anything.

The parts aren't too expensive, even for Brazil standards. Even if I need to do some maintenance after buying it, R$10,000.00 (something around $4,500) isn't too much.

Also, I drive almost 100km a day, from home to university, from university to home, making a small detour to pick up my girlfriend in the way. The manual 850 is not a turbo, so I imagine it doesn't gargle too much gas, but a reasonable amount for a 2.5l engine, right?

EL_ULY > edu-petrolhead 07/17/2014 at 16:42

0

Well sir, like ALL used cars, it all depends on the previous owner(s). Look it over well for the typical used car issues. Common things like tire ware, suspension, weather seals, drivability, brakes, interior bits, rust, etc. These are not Volvo only things that are really important when looking at any used car.

As for Volvo specific things, you are in luck. Why, because these cars do not have the infamous oil trap box seen below.

For this car, be sure to find out when the timing belt has been changed. Usually an easy job but the climate specific belt tensioner is tricky to set.

All rubber suspension components wear a bit quicker than most cars.

Other 850 things that your potential car might see are...

-fuel rail presser sensor

-leak detection pump for canister

-air pump

-stuck seat belts

- Alt, Comp, p/s

-steering column switch

- lights switch

-ABS accumulator

-brake booster

-Fuel pump/sending unit

-engine seals.

and a couple other things that I can't remember that 850 would usually come in for.

Again, I'm not saying all of these thing will happen to what you are looking for. If you think about it, most are common used car issues.

The 850 is a solid car sir. If maintained well, they will not give you any headaches. As for working on things your self, they are basic mechanical buddy. I doubt you'll run into anything complicated trust me :]

edu-petrolhead > EL_ULY 07/17/2014 at 16:52

0

Huge thanks! At home, we never bought any new car, so we have the habit of extensively checking many things when studying a potential buy. I know a trusty mechanic, who I pretend to take with me to check some more specific stuff. I don't know who many previous owners the cars had, but I guess the dark green, auto, had very careful owner(s), because the car still have the owner's manual and receipts.

I'll write down a checklist to check for this. You, sir, is great. Have a cookie as acknowledgment

EL_ULY > edu-petrolhead 07/17/2014 at 16:56

0

no problem sir. If you do go that route, I can send you detailed diagrams and break down images. Any question at all about Volvo, Merc, Aston, Lotus, or Lexus... use this to call me

edu-petrolhead > EL_ULY 07/17/2014 at 17:24

0

Thanks!

twochevrons > EL_ULY 07/17/2014 at 22:17

0

Pretty sure that 850s all do have the oil trap box under the inlet manifold... At least my '96 850R does.

Still, it isn't the end of the world to replace, and in all other respects, I agree wholeheartedly. They're great cars, and certainly capable of interstellar mileages (mine's got 213,000 miles on it and still going strong).

twochevrons > edu-petrolhead 07/17/2014 at 22:31

0

I wouldn't count the automatic out completely. I have an 850R with the four-speed automatic, and it really isn't too bad. Would I rather have a manual transmission? Yes. But the automatic transmission is still very reliable (mine has 213,000 trouble-free miles on it), has sensible shift points (especially in sport mode), and suits the relaxed and civilised nature of the car, especially in turbocharged form. With all that torque, you don't really need gears all that much anyway.

In all other respects, too, they're great cars. They're certainly not sports cars, but they still drive nicely, the station wagons are hugely practical, and although they may not look all that exciting inside or out, they're very pleasant cars to be in. The turbocharged models are quite quick, too.

There are a few weak points that I'm aware of, but nothing terribly serious. The PCV/oil-trap system, which will cause oil leaks if it clogs up. It's not a terribly pleasant job to service it (doing it properly requires removal of the intake manifold), but it isn't complicated to do. To check for a blockage, pull the dipstick out with the engine warmed up and idling, and look for puffs of smoke. Heater cores tend to leak – check for damp carpets, or a sweet smell coming from the vents with the heater on – but are very easy to replace. The air conditioning evaporators also tend to leak, but are much harder to fix, requiring removal of the dashboard and heater box.

EL_ULY > twochevrons 07/17/2014 at 22:51

1

on s60/80 xc70/90 they do not last too long like the 960's and 850s and so on. I guess I was thinking of another model. Some ex master tech I am lol

twochevrons > EL_ULY 07/17/2014 at 22:55

0

Good to know... I know nothing of the rest of the lineup, only the quirks of a rather well-used 850R. Thankfully, mine had the oil trap and associated plumbing serviced just before I bought it (although not soon enough – the rear main seal seems to leak pretty badly now).

EL_ULY > twochevrons 07/17/2014 at 22:57

0

lol yup, we seldom worked on pre 2000's cars. Yup, if those things clog up, out goes the seals :]

twochevrons > EL_ULY 07/17/2014 at 23:05

0

On that topic... How would you rate the S60/V70 R models? I'd quite like to upgrade to one of those one day – more power, AWD, and the possibility of manual transmissions all have their appeal. Are they any good? I know that the 5 speed autos have their problems, but is there anything else to scare me away from them?

EL_ULY > twochevrons 07/17/2014 at 23:23

0

they are good but think of them like the 850R but with more premature suspension wear and everything cost waaay more :] Active chassis is amazing!

edu-petrolhead > twochevrons 07/18/2014 at 07:43

0

Thanks for your opinion, it helped me a lot! I'm more inclined to a manual version mainly because, in Brazil, automatic cars are famous for being unreliable and expensive to fix. Even if this car is swedish, they still got the fame. You bought your new or second hand? How can I check if the auto transmission is good?

Other thing driving me towards the manual, is the fact that I preffer to have total control over the car. I never drove an automatic car, so I can't really say, but the picture I have in my head about automatic cars is that the driver only accelerates and brakes, and the gearbox chooses which gear to use. I'll give that dark green automatic a shot, and test drive it. Maybe, if I like it, I can decided in favor of it.

Both of the specific cars I'm looking aren't the R version, they are the common 850 2.5l wagon. I know they aren't sports cars, but I love that brick shape, and everytime I look at it, this comes to my mind

Also, bonus points for being a wagon, and being from the land of the vikings :-)

edu-petrolhead > EL_ULY 07/18/2014 at 08:30

0

How about the suspension of the 850s? Brazilian roads are, let me say, otherworldly. There are so much potholes, and they're so big that we can say they're craters. The federal highways arelike lunar highways.

I read in some places that 850's suspension isn't so strong. Is it easy to put stronger shock absorbers, suspension arms, bearings and so on?

Sorry, I don't know the english terms for the suspension parts, in portuguese they all have nicknames, like "batente" (something like 'knocker'), "bucha" ('sleeve'), "bandeja" ('tray') and etc.

edu-petrolhead > edu-petrolhead 07/18/2014 at 08:32

0

Sorry for double posting, but here it is. The "bandeja" is indeed the suspension arm. But I don't know the term for "batente". It is in this diagram

twochevrons > edu-petrolhead 07/18/2014 at 09:29

0

I totally understand your feelings about automatic transmissions. I'm originally from New Zealand, where attitudes towards automatics are similar (although they are changing) and the first automatic car that I owned (1984 Rover SD1) had endless gearbox trouble. In sporty cars, I still definitely prefer the extra control of a manual transmission, but more luxurious cars like the 850 work well with the automatic, in my opinion – they're not so much about involvement in the driving experience, as covering long distances quickly and comfortably. Just point it in the right direction, and it will do the rest. Also, the 850's automatic has a sport mode switch that makes the shift behaviour much more aggressive, changing up later and down earlier, like I would with a manual. Mine stays in sport mode all the time ;)

Judging whether an automatic transmission is OK or not is a bit tricky without having driven others for comparison, but the main thing to watch out for is harsh shifting. Unless you're accelerating hard, the only sign of a gearshift should be a change in engine RPM and acceleration – there shouldn't be any jerking or clunking or anything like that. Rough changes under hard acceleration aren't necessarily a sign of a bad gearbox – a bad upper engine mount can cause it, and is an easy fix – to check for that, try pushing and pulling on the engine, and see any splits in the engine mount open up.

The other thing to check is the transmission fluid. When the car is warm, move the gear selector through the gears a few times, stopping at each gear for a second or two. Then pull the transmission dipstick, located between the engine and the air filter (on mine, it is hidden under some air intake ducting), wipe it down, and check the level. The fluid should be a medium to dark red, depending on when it was last changed. If it is black and smells strongly of rotten eggs, run away – the transmission is slipping internally, and won't last long.

There is also a transmission warning light on the dashboard that looks like an orange "up" arrow. It will come on to indicate that the transmission is in winter mode, or if the gear selector is in 3 or L. However, if it flashes, or comes on in any other situation, the transmission ECU has detected a fault.

I bought my 850 used, quite recently, but it has a full service history with it. Aside from some suspension repairs (I live in Minnesota, where the roads are terrible!) and a few sensor replacements, it has needed very little work in its 18 years on the road. I made a post about mine a little while back - read it here .

EL_ULY > edu-petrolhead 07/18/2014 at 09:32

0

SPRING SEAT!!!!!!!!

in the picture above shown as number 8 is the most common wear item on the 850. Very similar to that batante.

as for the rest of the suspension, you would need a press to do the control arm bushing. They can be replace but most people do not have a press of do not know exactly how to set the up right so they just buy entire control arms which are not too expensive an way easier to replace, seen below

on a sad not, I made an error yesterday, 850's do have oil traps. see below

Volvo engines run negative crankcase pressure. When the oil trap (flame box as some call it) starts to get clogged, the crankcase will slowly start to go into positive pressure. Before it reaches positive pressure, you will have to replace (or clean) the oil trap box. If you do not, the motor will go into positive pressure and your engine seal will start to leak. It is a bit of a job but not too crazy. A 6/10 in the difficulty scale. The good news is that the oil trap on older Volvo's last up to 4 times longer than the 2000's era which were not very reliable. Make sure to add that to the list to look out for when shopping.

More than anything, the oil trap and timing belt are your main things to look out for. The older the Volvo, the stronger. If it is in good shape, you are not going t worry about much soon. components just lasted longer in those day. Tank status for sure compared to the Ford era on the 2000's

edu-petrolhead > twochevrons 07/18/2014 at 11:27

1

THANK YOU!!! You made what I tought it was impossible: Now I'm considering an automatic car. The wagon, in question, is this one (please, brazilian opponauts, don't buy it, I saw it first).

Have these Volvo Wagons in retribution