A $30,000 post

"Torque Affair" (torqueaffair)
07/05/2014 at 16:01 • Filed to: None

I convinced a friend of mine to buy a $30,000 car just so I could write about it. I'm joking, of course - but I'm glad he ended up buying the car because it is awesome .

The Story

I was looking through cars for sale the other day, as I'm sure the most of you enjoy doing…but this time it was to actually buy something. Not for myself (I wish), but for a friend. It's definitely not the same as buying something for yourself, but if anyone I know is wanting to buy a car - especially something fun, then count me in! I will be more than overjoyed to help.

I found a 2005 Mercedes CL65 AMG that looked pretty good and without a lot of hesitation my buddy jumped on it. He liked it instantly. With only 69K miles, this car was in such good shape, I was blown away. It only had two previous owners and when we went to see the car, I literally could not find a single imperfection on the exterior. And I looked hard.

The best part was that it was only $30K....9 years later, the price dropped from $180K new to $30K.

I have never experienced a car sale quite like this. The owner, SW, of the Elite Motorsports where my friend bought the car from is really well known in the car community in Austin, Texas and for treating his customers really well. SW has tons and tons of cars and does some crazy things - like modifying a Gallardo to produce over 1600 hp . It's crazy.

But this time, he took customer service to a whole new level. He fixed the car for free when a couple things weren't working - no questions asked! He had no reason to, of course - when you're buying a used car you typically just buy the condition it comes in, right? I'm pretty sure there was nothing in the contract that said "the car will be perfect before you buy it...or we will fix everything on this used car that is broken."

He sold the car for a good price and he fixed stuff. Amazing.

Oh, he also had his team detail the crap out of it. It looked brand new.

This is a lot of car for the money

Generally people (like our co-workers) thought that the car was much newer than it is. For many of them it was the first time for them to lay their eyes on a CL65 AMG. Me too....I think. I may have seen one before, but I can't remember.

People were definitely shocked to see a gigantic V12 producing over 700 lb-ft or torque and were really impressed with the quality of the interior quality considering the car's age.

I loved all the features and the buttons and all the cool stuff they did.

Maybe in today's world these features won't impress anyone, but if you put yourself back in 2005, think of all the cars that existed back then. An auto-dimming rear view mirror was a mind-blowingly awesome feature! Right? And a 6-CD in-dash changer? Unthinkable!

With that mindset, take a look at some of the features on the CL65 AMG. Now remember..this is a 2005 model.

Seat massager - after all that torque and power, this will help you relax

A seat that is heated AND cooled!

Pushing a button to open your trunk - AND pushing a button to close it

Rain sensing Adjustable speed wipers

Adaptive cruise control - they had this 2005? I guess so.

Adjustable suspension height - raising and lowering at the push of a button.

Many others, but I don't want to bore with a laundry list of features.

I felt compelled to demonstrate some of the features below.

I was driving a 1997 Pontiac at the time this car came out and I remember being excited just to able to adjust my side view mirrors from the inside. What can I say? I'm easily impressed.

So I'm sure my mind would indeed have been blown had I been in one of these cars 9 years ago.

But even now, the car seems great. The interior is solid with hardly any rattles at all. The seats were great with great support - you could tell that this car had been very gently driven and hardly sat in really. The Biturbo V12 is as strong as ever - even for a car weighing 4600 lbs!

As great as the car is, I made sure to tell my friend to sell it before too long to avoid having to fix something super expensive. Let's cross our fingers and hope that doesn't happen anytime soon!

Check out more posts at !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!

DISCUSSION (100)

PanchoVilleneuve ST > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 16:02

If the Germans are good at any one thing, it's building insane cars that depreciate like a penny thrown from the top of a skyscraper.

Torque Affair > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 16:04

Yeah no kidding - 150K worth of depreciation in 9 years!!!

PanchoVilleneuve ST > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 16:06

I'm not a German car fan by any means, but even I can appreciate the amount of JESUS SHIT THAT'S A LOT OF WHOAH they offer you on the used market.

If, say, Lexus built this thing you'd still be paying like 90 grand for it.

Torque Affair > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 16:14

Absolutely - it's actually pretty ridiculous.

oldirtybootz > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 16:19

"An auto-dimming rear view mirror was a mind-blowingly awesome feature! Right? And a 6-CD in-dash changer? Unthinkable!"

My mother's 2002 Explorer XLT has the former and my father's 2007 Fusion SEL has the latter.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 16:24

Isn't that car famous for being the most expensive thing to maintain this side of a pet killer whale?

Torque Affair > oldirtybootz
07/05/2014 at 16:30

I probably picked the wrong features - probably should've used the adaptive cruise control instead?

Torque Affair > sm70- why not Duesenberg?
07/05/2014 at 16:31

Haha, yeah I think it can be as it continues to get older with more miles.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 16:51

It's a shame. I hope he gets some good use out of it without getting screwed over. That generation CL-class is one of my favorite modern Mercedes, and the CL65 is obviously the best of the bunch. Very cool car, I have my fingers crossed!

Torque Affair > sm70- why not Duesenberg?
07/05/2014 at 17:06

Yeah, I'll have to get updates from him on how his car is holding up as he racks up the miles.

Iwaswonderofwonders > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 17:24

I had a 1976 450SEL that was worth zero dollars and nothing but trouble, but I loved that car dearly.

Collin > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:25

Just think, the depreciation on that car comes out to a little over $2 per mile.

bobrayner > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:27

The CL really is an awesome car - a lot of the best bits aren't numbers, aren't highly visible; they're little details that just feel right once you drive it. The ergonomics are perfect. I love mine but it's insanely expensive to run in the UK.

Good luck with the first ABC repair bill. ;-)

Torque Affair > Collin
07/05/2014 at 17:27

Thats crazy right?

Torque Affair > bobrayner
07/05/2014 at 17:27

Yeah I bet. You know of one of the things I was mentioning SW fixed for free? It was the ABC sensor!!

Maxaxle > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:30

Kinja'd!!!

WHAT

monkeymouth > oldirtybootz
07/05/2014 at 17:30

My '96 XJ6 has an auto-dimming mirror as well.

Maxaxle > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:30

Kinja'd!!!

Wait what?

fintail > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:31

Good luck! Cool cars, they look best showing off the true hardtop profile. I am sure you know a good indy mechanic, as it is always just a matter of time. Benzworld and MBWorld can be handy, too. These top of the line cars are relatively rare, under 200 units for 05, less in 06.

Some things like auto wipers and cooled seats MB started before this car, but I think distronic and airmatic were introduced for the 220/215 cars.

Collin > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:32

For comparison, I thought I got a steal on my E39, and depreciation on that car came out to only $.40/mile for the previous owner

Then again, $180,000 sports coupes are almost exclusively bought by people who have enough money to buy what they want with little or no concern for the price tag, so I have a feeling that the first owner of your friend's car couldn't care less about how quickly it depreciated.

jimz > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:37

this doesn't really sound like a good deal. He may have paid $30k for the car, but it's still going to have the cost of ownership of a $180k car.

Torque Affair > jimz
07/05/2014 at 17:40

That's what I'm really curious to find out. Hopefully cost of ownership won't be that much but we'll see.

jimz > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:42

well, if he stops talking to you sometime in the not too distant future, you'll have your answer ;)

Torque Affair > Collin
07/05/2014 at 17:44

I think he could sell it in a couple years if he takes care of it and not lose a whole lot of money. Sell it for 20K perhaps?

Torque Affair > jimz
07/05/2014 at 17:44

This is definitely on me!

PanchoVilleneuve ST > Iwaswonderofwonders
07/05/2014 at 17:46

I do like pre-80s German cars quite a bit. Back when Mercedes built cars that were covered in enough paint to make you grunt if you were to pick it up and BMW wasn't chasing the lucrative "I LIKE FANCY BADGES" market and was instead going after the "I just want a simple, efficient car and I'm willing to pay a bit more for money spent on sportiness but I'm well aware that owning an Alfa Romeo means ruining my life and career" market.

Torque Affair > fintail
07/05/2014 at 17:46

SW actually has a great team of mechanics. He should take good care of my buddy and his car.

ethanheisler > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 17:46

Late 2000 Lexus 460s are worth under $20k. Any large sedan, or even less sought after a large coupe will depreciate like a stone.

PanchoVilleneuve ST > ethanheisler
07/05/2014 at 17:49

Lexuses (Lexii?) depreciate because they are old luxury cars. The big Germans depreciate from a combination of being old luxury cars and "I know something is about to go wrong and I'll have to get a second mortgage to fix it".

ScreenShot > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:54

$30~32k seems to be the going price for these around the US right now. Lot of car for the money any way you cut it, tho.

tsmit > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:56

i thought about buying one of these once, then i put the crack pipe down and sobered up :P seriously love this engine but my god these things love to shit themselves like no tomorrow

Hifrequency > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 17:56

Perfect example of why I never buy new, depreciation at it's best. I bet Mercedes didn't complain at all sluffing it new.

Torque Affair > ScreenShot
07/05/2014 at 17:57

Absolutely. At the end of the day, the car still was $180K brand new...

Tzantushka > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:02

Great find! Your friend must be surely impressed with your eye for a rare find.

I am always perplexed why enthusiasts love comparing the the purchase price today with the 'brand new' purchase price back then... Especially with expensive cars that depreciate like a lead baloon.

Is it because we cant't smell, touch, or hear depreciation that we choose to misunderstand it?

That was then. This is now.

Comparing today's purchase price with the 'brand new' price is like saying you're dating a supermodel. When in fact, she WAS a supermodel quite a few years ago (when you weren't on the scene). And now she's older she's a bit wrinkly, blown-out, and higher maintenance compared to what she was.

That was then, this is today.

Rather than compare to the 'brand new' price, a good reference measure of value in this case would be comparing what $30k buys you today.

And I bet you couldn't get a V12 biturbo coupe with heated/cooled seats for that amount of coin!

I guess depreciation has two sides of the coin, the winner and the loser.

Your friend was the winner here.

Torque Affair > Tzantushka
07/05/2014 at 18:04

You're exactly right. And the best thing about buying these cars is you can always sell it after enjoying it for a short while.

Audistein > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:14

It's possible to improve the performance even more with just a simple ECU flash; your friend should definitely look into that. Also, try to get a set of the AMG gray factory wheels, they look awesome:

Kinja'd!!!

Hoff > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:15

Kinja'd!!!

Is this the AMG that has the same motor as a Pagani Zonda??? You can change the exhaust and it'll sound like a monster?

Dy-no-mite Jay > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:16

well typically when people buy these German cars they only think they are getting a good deal in a used example. The reason why depreciation hits them like a ton of bricks is because it is an almost 10 year old German luxury car. These things have a lot of tech to go wrong with them and when stuff does break or needs replacement and your hit with an astronomical bill it will become painfully obvious why you purchased it so cheaply. Good luck!

Torque Affair > Audistein
07/05/2014 at 18:17

Thanks for the tip! I'll let him know. So how much more power are you getting?

DipodomysDeserti > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:18

Only 69k miles on a German biturbo V-12? I'm guessing you've never owned or worked on a car like this before. These aren't Honda Civics. There is a reason the car cost 1/6th of it's original sale price. If you have the time and money it's no problem, but if you're buying it because of the price it's a terrible idea.

DipodomysDeserti > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 18:20

That's because they're not actually very good at building insane cars. Hence the depreciation.

Torque Affair > Dy-no-mite Jay
07/05/2014 at 18:21

Yeah, there's always a chance. Hopefully nothing major happens anytime soon.

DipodomysDeserti > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 18:21

That's because the Toyota would have more than a a year left on it before you have start spending tens of thousands to keep it running.

Torque Affair > Hoff
07/05/2014 at 18:22

Hmm that's a good question. I actually don't know. I was surprised at how muted the exhaust is actually.

Torque Affair > DipodomysDeserti
07/05/2014 at 18:24

Well luckily SW has a great team of mechanics that can fix things at a reasonable price should anything go wrong. Also, there's always the option to sell the car if repair bills keep piling up.

IloveSquareCars > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:24

LOVE the humor in the video!! Thanks for the great post!

Torque Affair > IloveSquareCars
07/05/2014 at 18:27

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!

ja9ae > bobrayner
07/05/2014 at 18:28

I'm thinking of a CL500 next, what would you say from your experience should I allow for running it? Should I just have my salary paid to my local MB independent and have them send me what's left?

NotUnlessRoundIsFunny > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:40

Friendship Is Convincing Others To Spend Money On Cars

And thus Tom demonstrates the Art of the Compelling Headline.

I liked this story before. I like it even more with this headline. :-)

AMGWTFBBQ > oldirtybootz
07/05/2014 at 18:46

Wow! All they need now is (at that point in time) the most powerful engine ever placed in a production car and they'll be just as good!

All Motor Is Best Motor > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:47

"An auto-dimming rear view mirror was a mind-blowingly awesome feature! Right? And a 6-CD in-dash changer? Unthinkable!"

I'm guessing that's sarcasm, but if not, I just want to say that my car 2001 Acura has both of those. It also has the seats that automatically move forward at the pull of a lever. I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade, and my car definitely doesn't have nearly as many of the features of this Mercedes. $30,000 for that car is a steal. Now watch as it gets stolen back through maintenance and things breaking.

OtizzyStarBai > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:54

As a 2005, you should be able to get a 4 year 48k mile warranty from AAA or USAA... I would seriously consider looking into this. They typically only require 10% down and take equal payments for 18 months after zero interest. The list of stuff they cover is pretty damn comprehensive and I've had good experience with them in the past. They even pro-rate the difference if you decide to sell the car or cancel the coverage at any time. Think its a worthwhile investment in something like this which can be pretty expensive should stuff start to go wrong.

AM3R > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 18:59

is he gonna go for a 3rd party warranty?

oldirtybootz > AMGWTFBBQ
07/05/2014 at 18:59

Indeed.

oldirtybootz > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 19:00

That'd probably be a good one. I was just pointing these out.

torchbearer2 > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 19:11

If that is true, that makes me giggle a bit at a boss I used to have. I forgot what it was that he drives but the car retailed for like 300k, he didn't want to wait for it so he paid something like 500k to jump the line, and if he ever tries to sell it he probably won't get that much.

syaieya > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 19:11

I own a 99 E320. Doing any significant maintenance will see me put a notable percentage of the car's current worth into the vehicle. Heck, even filling the tank will increase the car's value 5% of what I paid for it.

Brickman > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 19:12

Kinja'd!!!

AMG + V12 = Auto? something doesn't compute.

Crackerjacktype0 > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 19:12

So why buy it if he's going to sell it "before too long"? From the sound of things this is definitely not going to end up in the same condition it was purchased.

Mike Kopstain > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 19:14

Just paid $2400 for misc repairs on my A8 so yeah, this is pretty accurate.

BigGatorChris > sm70- why not Duesenberg?
07/05/2014 at 19:14

That made me laugh so hard my dog started looking at me funny.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > BigGatorChris
07/05/2014 at 19:15

anytime

Crackerjacktype0 > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 19:16

BMWs in the 80's and early 90's weren't exactly durable and reliable anyway. Case in point, I saw an E34 530 that had its front seat twisted into a near unusable condition, and the owner still kept driving it. Mind you, this looks like the original owner with everything looking spotless EXCEPT for those crappy/paper thin front seats.

PanchoVilleneuve ST > torchbearer2
07/05/2014 at 19:17

The sad part is, I totally understand the appeal of the whole early adopter thing. I've camped out for more consumer electronics than could be deemed healthy, starting with the Playstation 2.

BigGatorChris > Tzantushka
07/05/2014 at 19:20

I'm going to be thinking of the supermodel comparison in a few hours, when I'm watching the UFC fight, and they inevitably pan the camera across the crowd. Eventually, the producer will decide to stop on an ancient, weathered, beat up punching bag of an organism, and her husband, Tito Ortiz.

BigGatorChris > Collin
07/05/2014 at 19:21

You did it wrong.

The owners of my 1998 540 ate over a buck a mile.

JayHova > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 19:22

Lexus LSses are also awesomely depreciating.

BigGatorChris > Brickman
07/05/2014 at 19:25

I think most/all of them are.

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Earth moving torque prevented them from using anything but a 5spd auto.

torchbearer2 > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 19:26

It gets funny when you start having hundreds of millions of dollars you didn't really have to work hard to earn (fully vested at a dot com that took off) and absolutely no business sense. The perk was we got a shit-ton of toys and when the company folded he gave us a good severance package.

PanchoVilleneuve ST > DipodomysDeserti
07/05/2014 at 19:34

I know, and it's sad. German cars are kinda like getting a blowjob through the fly in your pajama pants.

Goofnik > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 19:42

> And a 6-CD in-dash changer? Unthinkable!

Was it? My Eclipse in the year 2000 had that from the factory. The late 90s/early 2000s was the era of manufacturers providing stereos with more functionality than a potato (the birth of manufacturer premium audio packages), because they realized how much money people (and how many people) were spending on replacing the barebones audio systems that came in nearly every car.

Note how many cars now offer one or more premium audio packages: Nearly every car on the market. Once the manufacturers realized how much money they were leaving on the table, they smartened up. The aftermarket car audio market is nothing compared to how it was 15-20 years ago in its heyday.

Audistein > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 19:48

Ha, I don't have a CL 65 (I prefer my monster german/british luxury cars with 2 more doors and a lot more reliability). I've heard many times of people getting well over 600 hp at the wheels and over 850 lbft at the wheels with just a tune. I don't know which is the best out of Evotech, RennTech and Eurocharged, but considering that they each only charge a few thousand bucks for such an increase in performance, it's definitely something to look into.

PanchoVilleneuve ST > DipodomysDeserti
07/05/2014 at 19:56

They're really good at building numbers, though. I mean, look what the Germans did to Bugatti.

RotaryLove > JayHova
07/05/2014 at 19:57

For sure, my 17 year old self can afford a 90s one easily. I also want one :D

AMG OMG > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 20:05

I recently bought an 08 S63 and bought it for under 40k. Have had a similiar experience as your friend. So far the car has been incredible. If you have a good MB mechanic or garage nearby, a used AMG can be a real bargain

DipodomysDeserti > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 20:13

with your zipper rubbing against the base of your shaft. Yep, that's the perfect analogy.

Collin > BigGatorChris
07/05/2014 at 20:14

Wow. What kind of mileage was on it when you bought it (oh, and 540i solidarity)?

DipodomysDeserti > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 20:15

Definitely. My 2011 335d makes 425 lb-ft. of torque. More than a Gallardo of the same year. It also had to have close to $10k of warranty work done on the engine at 34k miles.

Collin > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 20:16

You never know. Put it on CL for $35k and see who bites.

DipodomysDeserti > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 20:26

Mercedes + V12 + turbo + turbo does not equal reasonable repair costs. 69k miles on that car is like 169k miles on a normal car. I just had close to $10k in warranty work done on my 335d with 34k miles. Not trying to be Debbie Downer. I just thought it was funny you said the car only has 69k miles as if it's a used Accord or something.

syaieya > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 20:26

Those early 00's AMG's may be from the darker era of Mercedes quality, but oh that power is so obtainable right now.

If not for some sort of family impediment, I'd totally be rocking one of the monsters from that era.

RosarchII > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 20:44

Put $10,000 aside for repairs, seriously.

Planktron > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 20:50

Kinja'd!!!

No ABC for me. The Nivomats in my car are plenty expensive enough.

Grim99CV > monkeymouth
07/05/2014 at 20:53

So does my '99 Crown Vic. I can also adjust my mirrors from the inside.

Musabasjoo > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 20:57

your pyjama pants has a metal fly?

pyjama pants?

who talks like that?

Arch > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 21:20

Fabulous post! Mad walk-around skills. You could do really well on the ride & drive circuit. And yea, those cars are crazy bargains. A cream puff like this for $30k is just nuts. Friggin thing puts the GRAND in Grand Tourer.

porschephile463 > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 21:22

mmmm that sweet sweet V12TT. Tune dat bitch up and get it to a drag strip ASAP!

Skillbilly > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 21:23

I convinced a female friend of mine to buy a 1977 Cadillac El Dorado once. In 2006. It was white with, I want to say, red leather and chrome everywhere. It wasn't the most practical choice, but I'd be lying if I said she didn't look damn sexy in it.

t1oracle > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 21:37

What is it going to cost to fix it when it breaks in 3 months?

PaAudiZS4 > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 22:27

Probably going to be very expensive for work , or if you are a diy it will probably be a pain in the ass.

BMWF10 > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 22:37

I had a 2003 CL and paid 42k and owned it for 3 years. Amazing car. However, over 3 years, with an extended warranty I spend 32k in maintenance and repairs. I kept track of everything if anyone is interested. The most costly item on the car and it's nightmare for most is the notorious ABC hydraulic system. I like can cost anywhere from 1000 to 9000 dollars to replace. I replaced 2. 1 of them required dropping the entire subframe. Keep this in mind. There is nothing more expensive than a cheap Mercedes

Gino King > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 22:46

What's great about this whole endeavor is that you helped your friend purchase a car that will retain its value (purchase price) more than any vehicle he could have bought for $30k or less. You should and deserve to be excited.

Phuk > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 22:49

Holy shit, that thing produces 604 hp and 738 lb-ft of torque.... Holy shit. Looks like I found my next car.

protodad > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 22:52

Hey Tom, serious question here. Although irrelevant to the post, I figured it was the first chance I would have to ask. So here we go:

How much affect does the release of a new model year have on pricing?

Case in point, my wife wants a new Odyssey. We have a 2006, she wants a 2011 (first year of the new body). I keep hearing a "new" one will be released for 2015. Should I wait for the 2015 to come out? My theory is it wont change the price by much of my 2006, but will drastically change the price of the 2011. Also, assuming I am correct, how quickly would a price change happen?

KatzManDu > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 22:56

Excellent car. ENJOY IT!

I'm Abe Froman > sm70- why not Duesenberg?
07/05/2014 at 23:28

He's the "Zissou"!

I'm Abe Froman > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 23:33

Quite possibly the best sounding exhausts out there. The biturbo would sound even better! They also cost $10k+ (maybe they can be found used as well?)

WhatsUpDOHC > PanchoVilleneuve ST
07/05/2014 at 23:39

Sooooooooo.....that means......good?

I'm Abe Froman > Dy-no-mite Jay
07/05/2014 at 23:41

Buying from a reputable seller vs. a "$24,995 buy here pay here" special counts for something.

I'm Abe Froman > Torque Affair
07/05/2014 at 23:42

Exhibit A: