US vs EU Safety Regs - Planet Money Podcast

"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction) 04/23/2014 at 08:55 • Filed to: None

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Spoiler alert: we can't have universal safety standards because Americans refuse to wear their seatbelts (among other reasons).

And Euro pedestrian crash standards are dictating modern limits of automobile design.

Also, you will want to curse at Zoe for saying "Porsh".

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BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 04/23/2014 at 09:17

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I thought it was a form of non-tax-based domestic production protection for the US. They don't want to tax anything made abroad, but by forcing them to redesign their cars' safety structures from their home market it protects those producing cars solely to that specification.

Clever, I think.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 04/23/2014 at 09:25

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But US makers run into the same problems when trying to sell their cars abroad. It would be better for all involved, including consumers, to have universal safety regulations.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 04/23/2014 at 09:30

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Very true, but very few US carmakers sell their domestic-market cars abroad, especially in any sort of volume. I think I've seen maybe a handful of CTS', a 300C or two, a couple of Cruzes and inexplicably a Chrysler Sebring over here.

I think they stand to lose more by opening up regulations than they stand to gain.

Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 04/23/2014 at 09:34

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Ford is going for that very strategy.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 04/23/2014 at 09:38

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They are very different markets, for sure, but there are plenty of smaller, "global" cars that would benefit. It's cost savings for all manufacturers, and it opens up a world of choice for consumers (more wagons and manuals for us US Jalops - ha!).

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 04/23/2014 at 09:47

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It's actually the Not Invented Here Syndrome . It would cause the fiefdom at the USDOT responsible for the FMVSS (and the one sending the document to Canada to have the CMVSS) to be redundant. Because they would be made redundant, any plan to harmonize vehicle regulations means that:

They will give it the most serious and urgent consideration, and insist on a thorough and rigorous examination of all the proposals, allied to a detailed feasibility study and budget analysis before producing a consultative document for consideration by all interested bodies and seeking comments and recommendations to be included in a brief for a series of working parties who will produce individual studies which will provide the background for a more wide-ranging document considering whether or not the proposal should be taken forward to the next stage.

Meaning: They'll block it. Out of their own sense of preservation, no matter how much sense it actually makes.

" Well, almost all government policy is wrong, but… frightfully well carried out." -Sir Humphrey Appleby

KirkyV > Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs 04/23/2014 at 09:47

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I thought the only US domestic market car Ford were planning to sell abroad was the Mustang?

Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs > KirkyV 04/23/2014 at 09:55

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Fiesta, Focus, Fusion, Mustang. Maybe there's more.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 04/23/2014 at 10:12

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Ugh. Exactly. Once a government program is in place, good luck every getting rid of it.

KirkyV > Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs 04/23/2014 at 10:21

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The Fiesta and Focus - and, to a slightly lesser extent, the Fusion - aren't really US domestic market cars though, are they? I mean, Europe's had the Fiesta since the seventies while, with the exception of a few imports of the first generation, the US didn't get it until 2009, and the Focus was developed by Ford of Europe—the US never even got the second generation model. A better argument could perhaps be made for Fusion, but it's still a descendent of the European-market Mondeo.

Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs > KirkyV 04/23/2014 at 10:23

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But once a car becomes worldwide you could argue that point becomes moot. The fact is that they are selling relatively the same car in both markets, slightly augmented for local tastes and safety standards.

KirkyV > Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs 04/23/2014 at 10:29

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That's undeniably true. I think it's just the way you phrased it that threw me.

Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs > KirkyV 04/23/2014 at 10:32

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Ah right on.

In the end I would be all for major automotive markets bringing their safety standards in line with each other. I doubt a car fit for any Western market would be considerably off the mark as far as the standards any other Western market would hold them to.

But then we have the next problem, varying mpg standards. For truly global cars those would likely have to be the same too.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs 04/23/2014 at 11:40

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The difference comes in that the US safety regulations are more stringent than EU ones, so it's easier for a USDM company to conform to another set of regulations than it is for an outside company to break into the US market. Think sealed beam headlights mandated for all cars for no real reason whatsoever. Regulations on the height of brake lights that caused this monstrosity:

Other markets got this:

It's all a bit conspiracy theory, but I've heard some very good arguments for it. Also, in some cases it's a very useful addition, such as the inclusion of small overlap crash tests.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 04/23/2014 at 11:42

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Opening up a world of choice is not a particularly great idea if you're Ford or GM. They'd much prefer it if you were only allowed to buy Fords or GM products...

Great for you guys though :)

Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 04/23/2014 at 12:17

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What are small overlap crash tests?

And wow, they managed to turn that thing into a monstrosity for sure!

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > Yowen - not necessarily not spaghetti and meatballs 04/23/2014 at 12:21

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They're tests t osee what happens when someone swerves in a head-on collision, but not enough to get out of the way. Basically, you hit the other car or a pole or wall or something with the corner of your car, but still heading forwards.

Look some up on youtube. They're utterly terrifying.