Have you ever owned a car that was worth more dead than alive?

"Steven Lang" (StevenLang)
12/09/2014 at 19:31 • Filed to: None

Back in 1999 I could have invested in Apple stock for a mere $10 a share. Or, I could take my piddling sub-$1000 savings at the time, and pour it straight into an eight year old Peugeot 405. A car that I found at an auto auction in the thick of Georgia's Deliverance country.

Guess which one I invested in?

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

I don't know why I fell in love with the idea of owning a Peugeot. At the time I was working at five to seven different auto auctions a week as an auctioneer, and looking back, I must have breathed an awful lot of gas fumes to get to that extreme state of delusion.

It was actually a whole lot of little things that put me on the road to the terminal cancer that is French car ownership. I started noticing a Peugeot 505 wagon at a house nearby in the typical abandoned state. Flattish tires. Exterior covered in dirt. A license plate that expired three years ago and next to it was... a 1988 Jaguar XJ6.

I wish I had a friend who told me this...

But what I ended up doing was befriending a guy from the old Car Talk bulletin boards with the handle, The Headless Chevalier. His real name was Marty, and somehow Marty was getting the types of deals on cars that us enthusiasts salivate over.

The low-mileage high end European vehicle that somehow goes for less than $2000? Marty had three of them thanks to his work as a probate lawyer in Pennsylvania. A 405 MI16, a 505 diesel wagon, and something else that required a lot of free time and fluency in French to maintain. The descendants of the dead wanted nothing to do with a French orphan car, which meant Marty could share and experience his love for what were seemingly cheap unloved cars.

So the mind trap of me buying a piece of failed French engineering was pretty much set. As the weeks wore on I went deeper into the hole of human stupidity. I started following the old BBS boards that had the name alt.autos.peugeot. It should have been named alt.peugeot.cananyonefixmyrollingpos because everyone there seemingly had an old Peugeot laying in the weeds, but all I heard between the moans and pangs of financial agony was an opportunity to do something new car wise.

That fateful day of financial self-mutilation finally came at a small auto auction in north Georgia. An auction that should have been issued a hanging banner that said, "We Only Sell Junk! Really!"

I saw a 1991 Peugeot 405 with less than 100k and for all of $225, I bought it. Keep in mind that back in 1999 you could buy a lot of cars that weren't running for less than $100.

This "Poo-got!" as the cashier at the auction called it, seemed to run great. The engine was fine. The interior was surprisingly nice. Seats were fantastic. I pulled onto the winding one lane road and went from first to second gear.

KA-PLOW! It was like I got shot on the ass. Nevermind... let's see how third gear is ... third gear? third gear?.... anyone?....aw !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! fuuudddggee!!!

Actually I was expecting failure, and boy did I get it. I drove home in the car I came to the auction with, and the next morning, I called a nearby junkyard to find out if they had any Peugeot 405s.

"Yeah, we have three."

"Great! Can I get a tranny?"

"Nope, that's why they're all here."

I came to find out that the ZF transmissions were about the 27th fatal weakness of these models. Like the timing belt on an old Daewoo, once the Peugeot tranny decided to deep-six itself, everything attached to it was pretty much toast.

I kept the car at the auction and a month later, I got lucky. Someone wrecked a 405 and it wound up at an impound lot auction for a wrecker service. I bought it for $125, had a transmission shop nearby the junkyard install it for $600, and with about $1000 in it, I finally had my Peugeot. It was great... for three days.

Then the fuel pump went. That was another $250. The power steering leaked. I fixed that. A coolant hose had a small leak. Fixed that too. The power steering leaked again and this time it was a bad rack.

I soon found out about an old axiom frequently cited by two automotive philosophers named Click and Clack who had the deep misfortune of repairing dozens of these rolling French turds, "The French copy nobody, and nobody copies the French." I put it in an auction that I did on Thursday evenings and sold it for $800.

I lost money. But I got an education. In the car business, the tuition you pay is called experience and this one lead me as far away from the romanticism of owning unique cars as Mercury is from Pluto. When someone offers me a broke down piece of nostalgia for a price premium at my dealership I always have three answers in the back of my mind.

"No!"

"Hell no!"

and...

"Are you talkin' to me???"

These days !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! to folks who haven't been immersed in the brutal free market that is buying and selling used cars. 15 years and thousands of cars later, I have learned an awful lot of unique lessons. So feel free to read !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , and... before I forget, let me ask you.

Have you ever owned a car that was worth more dead than alive?

DISCUSSION (100)

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 19:34

I could easily part my AW11 out for more than I can sell it for. I've probably owned a few cars like that. My Elantra and Tercel were definitely like that. I scrapped both for about the same price that I could have sold them for.

505Turbeaux > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 19:34

Yup been there many times. Greatest story ever told. You are my hero of the day Mr lang

The Transporter > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 19:50

My first car was a '79 Fiesta. You could sit in the car and slowly watch it return to the Earth.

The Real Dacia Sandero > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 19:51

I paid $3200 for my Miata which should have been about $1500-2000 when I really found out what was all wrong on it. Now it's maybe worth $3500 if I find a desperate enough buyer. I think I've got around $7000 total into it in the past two and a half years.. That is with me doing all the work myself. I could part it for more than it's worth for sure.

VonBelmont > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 19:54

Back in September, there was an old Jaguar parked in the sole vacant lot in town. It was gonna be the site of a church, but that's been on pause for almost a decade now. Never took a close look at it (I may be stupid, but I ain't dumb), but it seemed to be in OK shape. May've changed locations every now and then. Haven't seen it since, so I guess it got hauled off by the city, reclaimed by the owner, or torturing some other unfortunate schmuck.

Mr. Ontop, No Strokes, No Smokes...Goes Fast. > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 19:58

Thanks to cash for clunkers, the answer is yes. I got $1000 for my old Intrepid rather than the $300 trading value....fuck you very much Carmax!

Lee Wilcox > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 20:25

Well yes. I had two mid size GM SUVs that vied for which was the bigger lemon. 2002 Saturn Vue (1st year) and a 95 Olds Bravada. The Olds was not intentional as I helped out a daughter. I stopped doing that (on your advice) and feel much better in the house of Toyota. I liked them both but they kept breaking. My dad used to tell me that stuff like that was like hitting yourself in the head with a hammer. It felt so good when you stopped. Dad was pretty smart.

v8corvairpickup > Steven Lang
12/09/2014 at 20:41

I think I'd categorize my 2001 Jetta as worth more dead than alive. It's currently dead and I'm not sure that I'm interested in replacing the failed injection pump. In August, I had to replace the transmission and trans cooler. I'm not sure I want to dump any more money into this money pit, I mean car.

pip bip - choose Corrour > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 02:25

car i'm driving now worth $200 , 04 Lancer with 545K on clock

ciscokidinsf > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 03:43

Replace your Peugeot with the 84 Renault Alliance I had in college. (The pride of Kenosha!) And we have the same story as yours, mine with 2 sets of radiator hoses, 2 head gaskets later, even the local Chrysler dealer gave up repairing it after sending the towing truck twice for me - Had a Palestinian college buddy called his dad international long distance to help it diagnose. Old French cars sometimes are an automotive education dressed as torture.

MonkeePuzzle > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 09:48

yes, I have a 96 jeep grand cherokee and the best offer we got to sell it was ~$6k. I got rear ended and insurance paid nearly $12k.

worth more dead than alive

Dan T. > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:16

My turbo 98 trans am is like this. Running its worth maybe 11k. Blown up (like it currently is now) maybe 9k. But if I break it into pieces 13k no problem. The f body market is messed up

Pibbs says once you go Swede > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:17

I'm pretty sure my 944 is worth more parted out than it is as an entire car. Strong rebuilt motor, good transmission, fresh rubber and half way decent cookie cutter wheels.

marshknute > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:18

My 2001 BMW 330xi was scrapped after I sold it. They gave me $4K on the trade without inspecting or driving it first. If they had, they would have discovered the broken heater, cracked suspension coils, oil leak, CEL, leaking washer fluid reservoir, broken washer nozzles, shot window motors, dented bodywork, and scratched interior upholstery.

This was the car that taught me never to buy an BMW out of warranty.

Mr. Ligier 812 GTC4Lusso Rubicon Pista > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:20

1985 BMW 535i... As a write-off donation, it was worth easily 2X more than I could sell her for after 240K miles.

 > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:20

I bought a beater 1996 Crown Vic at an auction for $250 back in the day. Coulda sold it for scrape for $500 and doubled my money.

Coan Arcanius > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:20

Debatable with my fox body. I could probably part it out for more than I paid for it, though I'm pretty sure a coat of paint is all it needs to sell for well above what I paid for it at this point. I've had it break small things (tfi, fuel pump) at bad times which certainly put ownership into the red for me I'm sure.

The latter being rough on my mind as I watch my common sense wrestle with my emotions and my love of the sound of a v8.

gdebruin82 > pip bip - choose Corrour
12/10/2014 at 14:21

My first car, an '87 LeSabre Custom. Paid a mere $1,975 and by the time I got rid of it 4 agonizing years later...I estimate I'd sunk at least $3,500 into that pile of junk.

Kinja'd!!!

einszweidrei > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:21

Owned a peugeot 205 in brazil. Every year I would spend more in maintenance than the whole car was worth.

J-BodyBuilder - Never stick to sports > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:22

A 1989 Ford Thunderbird Super Coupe 5 speed I purchased in 1994. I loved that car. It loved me back by either shedding or breaking a new part each and every week. I literally could not get things fixed as fast as they broke. I finally sold it for I can't remember and it doesn't matter.

Salmanorguk > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:22

i spent my childhood (age 11-14yrs) being ferried around by my parents in a Peugeot 405 GLDT.

A very wise choice by you

jamisparker > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:23

I bought my 944 for $1600, it was probably only worth $800 or so, but I'm stupid. I have put about $1600 into it now and it still has a good ways to go before being fully sorted. It is probably worth no more than $2000 now. It does drive though and working on it has been fun, so still not bad to have a poor-sh.

owbeee > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:24

For me, that honor will go to my 1991 Jaguar XJ6. Bought for $500, and is at my mechanic as we speak. It's like the car equivalent of the battered-wife syndrome.

Someone Else's Projects > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:25

LOLSaab. Though living with one might be more doable than your French experience.

Toyotathong! > VonBelmont
12/10/2014 at 14:27

I may be stupid, but I ain't dumb

I'm getting this printed on a t-shirt very, very soon.

Caddyman > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:28

Dealing with it right now. My dads old 01 Grand Marquis. It is truly a fine specimen for it's age. No scratches, dings, not even a crease in the leather. It is maroon with a tan rag top., 93k miles, pristine inside and out, runs and drives perfect with no CEL nothing.

Carmax's offer.....$1200

On CL now for $2800 obo, no solid leads yet.

It's just not a car that has any value, regardless of how nice a car it actually is. I should keep it and ditch my beater 99 C230, but I love that little car.

TheDouble-ClutchBandit > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:29

I think technically most cars are worth more in parts than they are as a whole, but who has the time to part out a car? I know I don't. I guess that didn't really answer your question though, I apologize.

alan > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:30

my 2004 monte carlo LS. i loved the car and it served me well for almost 10 years but i did not feel like buying new tires and brakes for it and needed something more practical. i traded it in for around $2000 and was upset because i bought it new, but i knew it was not a very desirable car when i bought it, and bought it new very discounted because of that. had i sold it i could have got no where near what the KBB value was. the most money i could have got for it was if it was totalled and i collected the insurance money for it. i was sad to see a car that served me flawlessly go, but i needed 2 more doors.

Speakerboy1114 > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:32

I had a 1985 300D with 208K miles. Ran really well, but it was a northern car it's whole life, and had more fiberglass and bondo than steel on it. After my brother-in-law backed into it while it was parked and pushed the rear quarter panel in about 5 inches, it really wasn't worth anything. I parted it out and got about $1400 for the pieces. Not bad for a car that I paid $2700 for 2 years earlier.

Jason Parker > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:33

I have a 2004 RX8 with 180,000 km on it. I had to get a different car since there were quite a few issues that required fixing/$$$ and I needed reliable daily transport. Now, almost a year later, I still have the car and it's just gotten worse. I don't think I could give a high-ish mileage RX8 away from scrape prices.

I want to make it into some sort of weekend or streetable track day car but I don't want to throw in even more cash at it when I could get a mid-00s sport bike and have something cheaper and easier to store.

What should I do Oppo?

Pending Approval > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:34

Yup, when I recently upgraded from my 2001 passat with nearly 400k on it, the best offer from a trade in I got was for $500. And not just "i'll take it off your hands" offers, but that was really about all it was worth. I ended up selling it to another passat owner for quite a bit more so he could pull my leather seats, wheels and other parts off the car. Didn't even have to bother signing the title over since he was going to scrap the frame. Win win for the both of us.

BeaterGT > pip bip - choose Corrour
12/10/2014 at 14:35

Holy mileage. Pics!

mcbenz > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:36

I bought a beater Civic Si clone 5 speed back when I was in high school. Totaled it. Originally paid $2300, insurance paid $6000. Profit.

.jdb. > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:38

Call this one a close call. I was about to start my senior year of college. I had a bit of money saved. Not a ton, but enough to get something serviceable (ballpark of $1600, this was summer of '94). I wanted something sporty. I looked at a Fiero (it ran well, but the mechanic I wanted to check it literally said "YOU ARE NOT BRINGING THAT IN HERE"...and I looked at a Lancia Beta. The handling was shockingly good. It was comfortable. It looked COOL. I was awfully tempted, even with the small rust hole in the fender.
I passed and got a 280z instead. It was a wise decision, I think.

Big Block I-4 > The Real Dacia Sandero
12/10/2014 at 14:40

Geeez, what was wrong with it? I got lucky and bought a Miata for $1200 and have run it 6k miles with the only problem being a radiator and heater hose that had to be fixed. Everything else is/was cosmetic and not mechanical.

tylinol > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:42

Kinja'd!!!

My Alfa Romeo Milano was purchased for $400, and despite what all reason would suggest it has actually been the best purchase I ever made. A new clutch, timing belt, water pump, brake master cylinder, and clutch slave cylinder are all that it has required over 3,000 miles.

Ok, when I put it like that it doesn't sound that great. But most of those problems I fixed as soon as I bought it, and the rest were just preventative maintenance. It really has been a lot better than I was expecting and I still have less than $1,000 in it.

My best friend has purchased six Mercedes for less than $1000 each - a '72 220D, '72 280SE, '73 350sL Euro, '86 350SD, and '86 190D 5 Speed. They have all been unnaturally reliable over the past three years, and he drives them 100 miles a day.

ravichandran > marshknute
12/10/2014 at 14:44

Correction: Never buy a abused badly looked after old BMW !
Source: Among my friends we own 11 BMW e46's between years 2001-2006 including a couple of ZHPs

Anthony Miller > The Real Dacia Sandero
12/10/2014 at 14:46

Let me guess, it's a NA or early NB? I'm in the same boat, although I'm staring down a complete engine rebuild right now.

dreygata > Jason Parker
12/10/2014 at 14:47

As much as I love the RX8, get a sport bike. Just make sure to spend the money on gear as well!

sflash868 > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:48

Range Rover classic.

Absolutely worthless vehicles in running condition. Parted mine out.. Diffs are $800 new/rebuilt from the dealer, used at the time $500, axles- $500, seats, gauge clusters, doors that weren't rusted out, steering pump, rims.. I think I got 7K in parts. would have been 1500 if I sold it running.

snakem > pip bip - choose Corrour
12/10/2014 at 14:50

54K miles a year?? Jesus, what do you do?

yg17 > mcbenz
12/10/2014 at 14:51

*starts searching AutoTrader for Civic Sis and the nearest brick wall*

abgwin > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:51

Currently driving an 85 Mercedes 300D turbodiesel. Well, not driving it, per se, but using it to ferry the dogs to the dog park and back because MBtex (read as: vinyl) seats and other vehicles are 2 door (Lancia Beta, Jag XJS, Ram 1500 reg cab) and not good with basset hound hair.

California will gimmee $1000 to take it off the road, and since I paid $800 for it, everybody wins.

KirkyV > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:53

I don't know much about the 405 - though I do know that it was far from 'high end', by any means - but its successor, the 406, along with pretty much every other nineties Peugeot - that is, Peugeot model introduced in the nineties - was actually pretty reliable. I own a 106 - a design introduced in '91 - and it's been faultless.

alan > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:53

my grand father bought a used Peugeot diesel back in the 1980s. I remember my grandmother telling me he was very excited about it as he was a marine diesel mechanic and always wanted a diesel car. it was a project he never was able to finish. same thing, kept breaking on him faster than he could fix it. after that he bought only new jettas. which he was at least able to keep up with fixing

bobrayner > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:56

I bought a Mercedes C220 CDI (estate) at auction, for £2750 . It was a great price, but over the next three years I drove it hard and treated it rough. I drove about 60,000 miles. I had a couple of brake fires and a couple of broken springs. It spent 2 years parked next to the sea and one month parked in chest-deep snow. The W203 was a shameless ruster. It got scratches and stains and even some natty yellow paint acquired from concrete bollards in Belgium. I put surprisingly large dents in the roof, when trying to move a Chesterfield sofa. Almost everything that could break had been replaced badly, or just glued or soldered; and anything that couldn't break was rusty.

Then somebody tried to drive a Peugeot through the B-pillar, and their insurer offered me £4000 to replace the damn thing. It was worth more dead than it was alive.

Kinja'd!!!

Sir HoonsAlot > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:56

I haven't owned a car yet, so no

tsmit > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:56

i own one right now lol, 94 gs300, needs 1 of everything ><

marshknute > ravichandran
12/10/2014 at 14:56

The real lesson I learned with the BMW (and the Audi A4 I traded it in for) is that you should ALWAYS buy a moderately priced version of the base engine over a cheaply priced version with the premium engine. There are far more 325i's than 330i's, and an $8K 325i will almost always be in better condition than an $8K 330i.

Pibbs says once you go Swede > jamisparker
12/10/2014 at 14:58

Welcome to the club! I spent about 1500, made about 250 off ridiculous parts the previous owner had installed, and then sunk about 600 back into it. And it at most is worth $2k. Now I want it gone so I can buy another slightly less stupid vehicle.

JBanke > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 14:58

No story behind it but my 98 Oldsmobile Eighty Eight scrapped for more than its trade in value.

Jesse > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:00

I drive derby cars, so yes. However my hobby usually requires I bring them back from the dead before I send them back for good.

Pibbs says once you go Swede > Someone Else's Projects
12/10/2014 at 15:01

My trips to Autozone always end up with me leaving empty-handed because they stock nothing for a Saab 9-5.

Walleth > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:02

December 29th 2013. I pick up a lovely Alfa Romeo Giulietta for R155 000 (ZAR), two months later on Feb 24th 2014 my sisters drown in some standing water. Insurance paid out R223 000 a month later.

ravichandran > marshknute
12/10/2014 at 15:02

Yup ! I own a 325ci while most of my friends have a 330ci. My car has largely been in a "better" condition over the last 30k miles

Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing. > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:06

Kinja'd!!!

Technically it cost me $1, but I never gave them the money. Three whole liters of wheezing V6 power. No A/C, no power locks or windows, mirror glass had to be pushed for adjustment (no power, no remote), no rear defroster, only 1 slider - an absolute no-frills, base-model stripper.

Over three years of ownership I needed a fuel injector, a master cylinder and a few tires. Oh, it had it's quirks, but it always ran (when the sagging brake pedal didn't drain the battery). The day I sold it (for $350, nobody in their right mind would give me anything close other than a scrapper), it fired right up even though it had been sitting for 9 months, only being used as sleeping quarters for Finnish tourists and probably the local homeless population. Like the ugly dog with the scraggly fur, cataracts and limp, you can't help but love the mangy thing despite its faults.

It's pronounced "Deer-Tay" > Mr. Ontop, No Strokes, No Smokes...Goes Fast.
12/10/2014 at 15:06

I cashed in a clunker as well. $3500 for a 97 Chevy S-10 SS (Like an Xtreme before they were called Xtreme's) that was worth maybe $2000 if it was running right. Was overheating like crazy to the point that I carried gallons of water with me and just topped it off before I left the house every morning. Bought a 2009 GTI when I traded it in. Sold the GTI earlier this year for $10k, bought an E34 530i 5 Speed for $2800 and used the remainder to...pay bills. Damn student debt.

jlnbos > tylinol
12/10/2014 at 15:08

"A new clutch, timing belt, water pump, brake master cylinder, and clutch slave cylinder are all that it has required over 3,000 miles." ROFL.

Jason Parker > dreygata
12/10/2014 at 15:09

Already have the gear. The lady friend and I got a 2011 CBR250 in the spring and I've road the shit out of it.

Though if I was honest and asked the Line Splitter guys, I should probably get a proper gauntlet rather than these.

Kinja'd!!!

'70dime > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:09

I bought a 1974 620 for $100 with a blown headgasket. fixed it put some wheels on it. cruised it for about two weeks before someone cut me off and totaled the truck, I got $1500 from insurance and they let me keep it and I made another $400 parting it out, plus I still have whats left to scrap.

Best investment to date.

It's pronounced "Deer-Tay" > Caddyman
12/10/2014 at 15:09

I may be in the same land yacht soon enough. Will try to sell my grandfathers 05 Grand Marquis. CEL just came on, my guess is coil pack but we'll see. Other than that, just need to get the cigarette smell out. Definitely over 125k miles, but has a brand new Jasper transmission in it. If your Marquis isn't getting bites at $2800, I have a feeling I'll be driving the Grand Marquis around with a For Sale sign on it for a looooong time.

wilderthanthehate > marshknute
12/10/2014 at 15:10

It's been years since I've seen a 325i the was even listed listed for 8000, much less actually going for that amount. I can see a pristine 330ci 'vert being that much, much I don't think there are any non-m e46s in that price range anymore. I test drove a 325ci coupe last year, noped out of it when the power window failed during the test drive.

pyramidofgreatness > ravichandran
12/10/2014 at 15:11

agreed. I've got MANY friends (and family) that drive out-of-warranty BMW's from all through the 90's and 2000's —- no issues*

JayHova > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:12

Our family's trusty last Skoda Favorit - made it into black figures by a few litres of fuel

Kinja'd!!!

Bought for 1000DM (€510), my father ended its life prematurely on a crossroad one and a half year later.

The baseline scrap value was roughly a hundred euros and this was even still sort of running (albeit without cooling) This wasn't that acceptable so we started digging through the local classifieds, whether people were looking for parts - after selling the rear hatch and bumper, taillights, exhaust & catalytic converter, spare wheel, battery and radio & speakers and still getting 80€ for the remainder, we managed to break even and we even had 10 litres of siphoned fuel left.

*fondly remembers breaking the front window by ramming the edge of the hood in it while removing the battery*

Galileo Humpkins (aka MC Clap Yo Handz) > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:13

Back in 1999 I could have invested in Apple stock for a mere $10 a share.

This got me thinking, if I'd taken my $5500 I got from my bar mitzvah in 1997 and invested it all in Apple and let it ride until today, how much would I have? Approximately $763,000 (adjusted for splits and dividends).

Does anyone here know where I can procure a time machine? There are some vehicles I'd currently like to buy but can't afford.

pyramidofgreatness > Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing.
12/10/2014 at 15:13

you know, i've come to realize, that even the nastiest of cars are acceptible if you keep the windows clean (yes, all of them), and you have a drivers seat that won't poke your balls/taint/whatever.

n54 & s38 > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:18

Hmmm...I'll bet that if I parted out my E34 M5, it'd be worth more than I paid for it. Parts on these things are getti8ng hard to find and are pricey. Mine has a new S38 in it with under 100K kms. The engine alone would be worth about $10K. I only paid $9500 for the whole car and it's in amazing shape. Lesser (albeit lower-mileage examples w/o rebuilt engines) are going for ~$15K on BringATrailer.

It's pronounced "Deer-Tay" > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:19

Two if I'm honest with myself, but 1 if I want to keep lying, which is more fun.

First was a 1979 Camaro Z28. Didn't pay anything for it, just had to get it towed off the previous owner's property. I would estimate I dropped at least $1500 in parts into it over the years, finally realized I didn't want to go any further with it and its 3 speed slapstick auto, and sold it for $1,000. A year and a half later, bought a 1980 Z28...but with a 4 speed! I even drove it on the road a couple times. Currently sidelined until I buy a set of swaybars and take it in for alignment.

Second is my current beater, 1994 Dodge 2500, bought last year for $3500. 5.9L V-8 w/ Auto Trans, 4x4, Snow Plow, all terrain tires. Every time I shut the door, the truck weighs less from the rust that falls off. Only reason I bought it was for the plow and a friend of mine, who is an excellent mechanic, rebuilt the entire drivetrain. Cost me $3,500. The more I drive it, the less it will be worth in scrap as it shakes rust off all over the road. Have had to replace plow hydraulic lines, trans cooler lines, speedo gear (because the speedo was off, not failure), battery terminals, A/C pressure switch (it has A/C though!), and the 3rd brake light. Only bonus so far has been I sold the bed cap for $250, didn't want that thing anyway. If I had plowed for money during NJ's winter last year, I would have paid for the truck by now. But, I like to think just plowing my own driveway was worth at least $1,000 last year in saved time and back aches. If the exhaust stays together long enough to pass inspection this month, I'll be golden!

dreygata > Jason Parker
12/10/2014 at 15:20

Haha I completely understand. I've nearly completely worn out my first ever pair of gloves (bought in 2009), some non gauntlet cortech things. I've already started shopping around for some better gauntlet ones for warm weather use.

What bike are you looking in to? I love my 06 Honda 599.

amaakaams > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:21

2008 Dodge Nitro SXT. I was trading it in for what would become my current 2013 Fusion Ti. I owed 10k on it, the Ford Dealership offered me 9k. Since this was 1st quarter of 2013 the new Fusion and specifically the Titanium's were having stock issues. So I had to submit andorder. They locked in my 9k and I went home and started going to all the forums to see what I was going to expect with my Fusion. A week later I totaled it in bad weather, it was my fault, but random slush buildup around a bend on a mostly clear highway was what did me in. The insurance agency paid me 13k for it. Was carless for 2 months after that before my Fusion came in.

CharltonHestonsColdDeadHands > The Transporter
12/10/2014 at 15:23

My high school car, too! Silver with red plaid & cardboard interior. It had been my aunt's pigeon-hauling car and she finally ponied up for something nicer. I actually kind of liked it, mostly because I only went through $10 a month in gas (this was '94, though)

Couldn't make it up a hill without a running start, though. And a windy day required actual hill planning.

Still, great 1-calorie car.

patman > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:25

My Sierra that got hit with an ugly stick several times over may be worth more in cash dead between the good running 5.3L, solid shifting 4l60E and scrap metal for the rest than I could find a willing buyer for as a whole but it's much more useful as a functioning truck to me. Of course, it's not French and weird so it doesn't cost me much more than gas to keep it going.

MK6GTI-now with added Miata > marshknute
12/10/2014 at 15:30

All sounds DIY-able. Your car was the type of thing Tavarish would buy and fix up.

marshknute > wilderthanthehate
12/10/2014 at 15:31

Used car prices in the New York Tri-State area are very high. According to Cars.com, within a 150 mile radius of my hometown, there are 342 e46 325i's , and 74 of them are priced between $7K and $8K (with the most expensive examples selling for $13K!).

In this region, you CANNOT get a good 330i for $8K, let alone a Ci, Ci vert, or ZHP.

The Transporter > CharltonHestonsColdDeadHands
12/10/2014 at 15:31

Mine was gold. Or flat tan depending on which body panel you were looking at. It didn't really matter because all of it had rust underneath.

Maxaxle > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:35

Kinja'd!!!

(Like this, but in white, and it was the EX model so it had a sunroof. Oh, and we had the original hubcaps instead of the tacky plastic garbage in the pic.)
Apparently '90s Honda parts are worth quite a lot. Thankfully, we* never needed to find out.

*Technically my dad owned it, and my mom drove it a lot too.

Octavian > The Real Dacia Sandero
12/10/2014 at 15:36

So the answer IS always Miata :)

monicainabeamer > v8corvairpickup
12/10/2014 at 15:36

If your anywhere near Delaware i can take it off your hands.

Octavian > Mr. Ontop, No Strokes, No Smokes...Goes Fast.
12/10/2014 at 15:38

Nothing like taxpayer-funded inflated used car values.

marshknute > MK6GTI-now with added Miata
12/10/2014 at 15:40

I envy the day when I'll be able to work on my own cars.

It is really annoying being a college student who street parks his car whose tool collection only includes a hammer and a box cutter.

Nisman > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:41

My current DD, a 2002 Nissan Maxima 6MT. It was in an accident, has a mileage discrepancy on the title, has not just one but three lights on (Airbag, ABS, CEL.) Allegedly has 139k miles and is going to need a clutch sooner than later. Burns and leaks oil. The drivers door is rusted out and several body panels have been repainted. The interior is in good shape, but it isn't without numerous rattles and a few small, jankily repaired leather rips. The tires and OEM wheels are undoubtedly worth more on CL than the car as a whole.

Jason Parker > dreygata
12/10/2014 at 15:42

2008-2012 Ninja 650R. Don't think I am ready for a 600 and the Ninja is just more comfortable and has usable torque.

Plus, dat offset spring!

Kinja'd!!!

MK6GTI-now with added Miata > marshknute
12/10/2014 at 15:44

I have a garage but no projects. My car is under warranty still and the only thing I've done to it is install a new exhaust. I plan on getting something interesting next year, but at that point I'll be street parking and working full time. One day!

Jason Parker > Jason Parker
12/10/2014 at 15:46

Or maybe an Sv650F. I like the plastic fairings and whatnot, but I just want to sit a bit more up right when riding. Easier on the back and wrists I find.

McPherson > The Transporter
12/10/2014 at 15:46

I had one too and must say, I loved that car. Other than eating water pumps (damn you US emission regulations), it was dependable, handled well and relatively fast (it weighed less than a draft horse).

In the end, not even the Ford dealer I bought it from would service it. I remember taking it to the Ford Store in the early 90s, the assistant service manager came out to look at my trusty steed. He scratched his head and said, "So this is a Fiesta, heard of them, never seen one."

I knew right then, my Fiesta and I were doomed.

Mr. Ontop, No Strokes, No Smokes...Goes Fast. > Octavian
12/10/2014 at 15:49

Mine was at the very end, so that's why it was only$1000 and quite honestly, I wish I could have been the one to throw the switch on the crusher. Intrepid...Not even once.

ReverendLoki > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 15:52

Ouch... I just did the math. Apple stock has split three times since then (2 to 1 twice, and 7 to 1 once). Assuming $900 investment to buy 90 shares, that would be 2,520 shares today. Right now the stock is at $112 - so, $282,240 total.

dreygata > Jason Parker
12/10/2014 at 15:56

I'm there with you on the upright positioning, though I tend to favor the fully naked look.
Either way, both are great bikes!

d.dutton9512 > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:02

Learned this lesson the hard way as well. At 17, after a year of saving my pennies I bought a 1984 Porsche 944. Within 6 months, out of necessity, I had changed: thermostat, radiator, coolant hoses, alternator, wheel bearings on both front wheels, power steering line, power steering pump, headlight lift motor, and rear hatch lock. When I sold it 6 months later it still needed: drivers side window motor, passenger window switch, dome light assembly, rear wheel bearings, power steering hose (the headlight lift arm rubbed against it, German engineering my ass), wiper motor, and rear brake caliper.

Xelmon > pip bip - choose Corrour
12/10/2014 at 16:08

Indeed, I invoke the good ol' SR20 rule.

thedangler > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:23

My first car - a 1999 Saab 9-5 with the 2.3L turbo 4 cylinder. I put a few grand in between new brakes/tires/brake booster/other stuff. Loved the car, it was a blast to drive and I really wanted to keep it for a long time. 20k after I got it, and multiple tows/repairs, the transmission went. Completely. When it first started to slip, I went to a honda dealer and had it evaluated for trade. They didn't notice the slipping transmission, but wouldn't go above $500 for it. I drove it for another 6 months, enjoyed my heated/ventilated seats, then when the transmission gave up the ghost over the course of 2 days I sold it as a non-moving parts car to someone who drove 200mi each way to pick it up... for $1300. So essentially I got paid $800 to keep driving my car instead of taking on a car payment. Winning.

Steve in Manhattan > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:30

I remember the Click and Clack axiom. I also remember a C&D review of some French car that described the electrical system as being made of cobwebs, moonbeams, and wishes.

k4wht::lead singer, driver of the Winnebago > The Real Dacia Sandero
12/10/2014 at 16:31

Used parts or new? www.partsgroup.com saves tremendously over dealer / parts store.

sammyjay > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:31

Not myself, but my grandfather had an '85 or so Jeep XJ with no reverse gear, no heat, permanently locked rear doors, 2 plugged tires, and a rear windshield wiper that didn't work. Traded it in on a brand new S-10 Blazer in '92 or '93, but the dealer never inspected it beforehand. He already had set up everything nice and pretty with the dealer, so he went in one very snowy day to drop off the Jeep, sign the title over, and take the Blazer away. Now, naturally, it was incredibly cold and snowy out around 4PM, and nobody in the dealership wanted to go out and check the thing over. He threw them the keys, bill of sale, title, and paid for his new Blazer.

He got a call the next day demanding that he bring the truck back because his Jeep wouldn't move out of the parking spot it was parked in, but he said "sorry, title's in your name now!" and never looked back. Smart guy.

k4wht::lead singer, driver of the Winnebago > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:37

1991 Plymouth Acclaim. I only had it for 3 months in 2000 until the engine thew a connecting rod with....55k miles.

SoManyBlueCars > ravichandran
12/10/2014 at 16:40

Agree. Many friends have e39s without issue and over 150k miles.

duurtlang > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:48

As the current owner of both a 1988 Peugeot 205 GTI and a 2000 Peugeot 406 coupe (my daily driver, 30k km a year for over two years) I don't recognize what's written here. My 406 has exhibited cockroach-like reliability, had it been anything Japanese of the same size/era it would've been more expensive to maintain, because of the more expensive Japanese parts. The biggest upcoming expense? All four Michelins need replacement soon. My 406 isn't an outlier, the great reliability of these things is common among owners. 400+k on the odometer is common, mine is only at 230k so barely broken in.

I haven't driven the 205 GTI enough to judge its reliability, but considering the sheer amount of 205s I still see in daily traffic, 30+ years after its introduction, I think it's safe to say they're fine.

My guess is that these US market 405s had some fatal flaw(s) the normal ones didn't have.

Kinja'd!!!

RW53104 > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:50

Probably. After sinking north of $5k into my 2002 Mitsubishi Montero (after buying it for $3250), it still didn't work right. You basically couldn't drive it without overheating, which sucks in Arizona. The dealer valued it at $1700 in trade without even driving it, but we got a minimum trade allowance deal that basically doubled that figure.

After all the money sunk into that thing, I have no doubt that it was probably worth more in parts than what we ended up getting for it.

toddycc > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:52

bought a 2002 5-Speed Saab 9-3 Sport Edition Hatchback at Auction here in Toronto it had 47,000kms and was mint condition except for a clutch and I bought at $1,700. I put a new clutch and tires on it for around $600 and drove 100,000km care free (i drive about 80,000km a year). At appx. 147,000 a lady turned left at an advanced green that had expired and I T-boned her. Insurance gave me a cheque for $6000. SO all in I got paid $3,700 to put 100,000 hard kms of driving on a manual peppy saab for about a year and a half. WIN

Over-Heated > Steven Lang
12/10/2014 at 16:56

1998 Nissan Frontier

Paid $9,800

Insurance claim #1 : $3,100 hail damage

Insurance claim #2 : $3,800 right front hit by rental car who ran red light

Insurance claim #3 : $5,600 t-boned hard in front left. Frame damage. Totaled.

I don't know about you, but that looks like a profit to me!