Used RWD Manual Wagons in the US

"H4N5 GRU83R" (2jmotorsports) 08/07/2013 at 18:17 • Filed to: None

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Looking ahead I may have a need for a people/cargo hauler. I would however like it to be as fun as possible so I am looking for a RWD manual estate that I can depend on and occasionally take on some twisties or dodge cones with. The older the better. Please educate me on my options.

Volvos: dont know anything about them but I am curious.

BMW: love them but dont like the maintenance.

Benz: are there even any manuals available in the US?

Audi: AWD so not applicable.

Japan: IS300 Sportcross and what else?

US: ?????

Many thanks in advance.

Takuro Spirit > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:22

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America: CTS-V (but good luck finding one)

RMudkips > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:22

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240s are awesome. You could improve the handling by upgrading the sway bars, but stock I think the handling is alright.

Might wanna look after the engine mounts, the overdrive circuit on the manual, and some rust issues. Other than that you're mostly fine.

Source: pouring over iPd and some other sites, considering a car for high school (?)

Andrew Daisuke > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:23

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The Volvo 245 would be a good place to start. Simple. Safe. Effective.

Hoccy > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:25

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I'd suggest a Volvo 940, you'll get lots of space, reliability and decent power if you get a Turbo. They're still not that old, but old enough to not have too much electronics. They use some fuel but I guess that's not the biggest problem in the US. Your problem might be to find a manual?

H4N5 GRU83R > RMudkips 08/07/2013 at 18:25

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I like 240s. Will spend some time on swedespeed.com for education.

Saracen > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:25

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IS300 SportCross never had manual transmissions.

I think you'll just have to settle for BMW. When you want such a specific niche it's tough to be picky.

J. Walter Weatherman > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:27

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I am pretty sure the IS300 Sportcross wasn't ever available with a manual.

H4N5 GRU83R > J. Walter Weatherman 08/07/2013 at 18:28

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Shame. Oh well it doesnt look like it can hold much stuff anyhow.

H4N5 GRU83R > Hoccy 08/07/2013 at 18:30

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This is correct. My commute is thankfully very short so MPG is not highest priority. That red 940 looks mighty tasty.

Decay buys too many beaters > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:30

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Maintenance on German cars is not nearly as expensive as everyone makes it out to be, as long as you do the work yourself. If you have to take it in to a shop, be prepared to pay a lot however.

I'd say go with the BMW.

H4N5 GRU83R > Saracen 08/07/2013 at 18:31

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Noted. Scratching IS300 off the list.

J. Walter Weatherman > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:33

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When you say "the older the better", does that mean that '50s and '60s are fair game? Because you can actually get quite a few options if you go back that far. Otherwise, not so much...

190e30-Now with COSWORTH > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 18:36

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Lucky for you, this is my favorite category and have been looking into it for years. So here are some of my favorites:

-Volvo 240

-Volvo 122s (the wagons are hard to find, but gorgeous)

-Datsun 510 wagon- Because who wouldn't want one

-Acura TSX wagon- Really hard to find with stick, and probably not so cheap, but very cool.

-Mercedes 300TD wagon- I like them, I can't really explain why though. If you put a bigger turbo on you can do things like this.

-Any BMW with the letters "iT" in them. 525iT, for example, is fantastic. Here's a cool one.

-A BMW 540i M-Sport Wagon- IMO, the holy grail of RWD wagons. Hard to find a stick one, but if you do they aren't too bad in cost. Plus, its like an M5 wagon. This one's hideous, but try to picture it without the Bro-addons

Hope this helped...I'm sure I'll think of more later, so I'll update as I go.

H4N5 GRU83R > Decay buys too many beaters 08/07/2013 at 18:43

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Just recently sold my wife's E46 325i and that was pretty good to us mechanically. Considering either a E34 or E39 estate as far as BMWs go. I have no Audi or Mercedes experience though.

H4N5 GRU83R > J. Walter Weatherman 08/07/2013 at 18:45

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You know I almost bought a 2-door 64 falcon wagon once. I think for now Id like to keep it in the 80s and up.

H4N5 GRU83R > 190e30-Now with COSWORTH 08/07/2013 at 18:57

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A lot of info! Thank you!

It's a "Porch-uh" > Takuro Spirit 08/07/2013 at 18:58

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Yeah, you can buy new, if you have that kind of money. Used is damn near impossible. When they do come on the market, they're snapped up right away. Even used CTS (non-V) wagons are hard to find.

Though if you care about whoever has to go in and out of the rear seats, skip the CTS. I'm 5' 8" and felt like the door opening was tight. Trying to test fit my kids' car seats was quite a feat.

It's a "Porch-uh" > Hoccy 08/07/2013 at 19:00

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Depending on if you're close to our northern border or not, I head Canada gets a decent amount of stick Volvo wagons. Not sure what the import process is like.

Saracen > 190e30-Now with COSWORTH 08/07/2013 at 19:00

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TSX wagon is auto only. And FWD only.

I'm also almost entirely certain that we never got the E39 540iT with a stick.

JRapp: now as good as new again > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 19:09

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The E70 Corolla, early 80s, comes in Wagon trim, had Read Wheel Drive and a Manual.

Edit: And to add, while Audis come in FWD and AWD setups, some of the AWD setups have a rear bias.

crashonice > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 19:16

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turbobricks is also a good resource.

If you're looking at 240s, it is nice to get a later model (1990-1993 if I remember correctly?) with the true 5spd M47 trans. The previous M46 trans was a 4spd w/electronic OD.

They are pretty rare, but they are out there. I sold my '92 245 5spd earlier this year, and it was a fun and extremely practical car, but very slow. It felt old and dated, too.

If you DO go the Volvo route, and are looking for something that you can actually live with, the suggestion for a 940 turbo will get you a much nicer interior, and a lot more sporty feel, and I think you'll be a lot happier.

cuts_off_prius > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 19:28

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Going to propose a unique one.

Infiniti FX35, RWD, but auto. Since it's the same platform and drivetrain as the 350Z and G35, you can swap a 6 speed manual from them http://www.InfinitiScene.com/forum/threads/… . Then lower it some, so it looks more like a wagon.

Senna_ > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 19:40

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I drive a Volvo V50 with a AWD and a 6sp Manual

Love, Love, Love

Save the Stick!!

Makoyouidiot > cuts_off_prius 08/07/2013 at 19:51

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I actually think that sounds totally awesome.

ScootScoot > H4N5 GRU83R 08/07/2013 at 20:07

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Ok, i just found a 2003 BMW 525i wagon with 5-speed on AutoTrader for $6,995 with 132,468 miles. Just search BMW, any distance, more search options, manual. It's the tenth one down. Shoot add wagon.

MyHandsAreCats > H4N5 GRU83R 08/08/2013 at 18:46

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I guess no one likes Subaru Foresters, Outbacks, or Legacy Wagons? They're fairly common, do come in 5-speed, and are pretty robust.

clarkwgriswold001 > Senna_ 08/08/2013 at 19:54

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Great looking car and very practical, but even with a stick, it's wrong wheel drive. I've got the same problem on my Saab 9-5. Most anything you can buy off a dealer lot today will be FWD with a few notable, expensive exceptions (BMW, Mercedes, Cadillac).

boxrocket > Hoccy 08/08/2013 at 19:57

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Just about any RWD Volvo wagon is a good starting place. As mentioned, brickboard, swedespeed, turbobricks, etc., are great places to learn.

I personally have a 1990 765 Turbo and I love it. Easy to work on, more roomy and comfortable than the 200-series, room for my groceries, great visibility, and it flies under the radar. I'll admit it's not a manual (though it was a toss-up at the time of purchase between it and the dark gray '89 745 n/a with twice as many miles and a red interior) and an extra gear or two would be nice (maybe someday) but it doesn't suffer badly for being an autotragic, since there's only 4 gears to choose from.

Darko > JRapp: now as good as new again 08/08/2013 at 20:42

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This is so badass that I immediately went to motors.ebay to find an old Corolla. No such nice wagons but a really nice coupe at 11k

Awesome ride..... awesome

Vl2800 > H4N5 GRU83R 08/08/2013 at 21:26

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Has the buick roadmaster been mentioned yet?

I know it doesn't come with a manual, but I can't imagine it would be too expensive to swap in a manual from a different GM car

Comes with an LT1 V8, 7000lb towing, and a decent interior

Vl2800 > MyHandsAreCats 08/08/2013 at 21:30

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Great pick! especially in the XT form.

However, in my area, its become the go to car for many college kids. Now its hard to find, overpriced, and often in poor condition

Brewman15 > Hoccy 08/09/2013 at 09:04

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That (sorta) looks like mine! ...Just much better paint, wheels, headlights, bumpers, grille, etc...

I'm on my fourth Volvo and would highly recommend them. They are cheap to buy and cheap to work on. It's a huge engine bay for the 4 cylinder, so everything is easy to get to. However, the turbos were not available in the US with a manual from the factory. They N/A cars were, but even they are extremely rare. That being said, it is possible and relatively easy to swap the manual from an N/A car to a turbo car, and it is also pretty common to swap a T5 transmission out of nearly all 80/90s sports cars into a turbo Volvo.

brandondrums > H4N5 GRU83R 08/09/2013 at 09:30

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this is lame but Subaru Legacy GT wagon and convert it to rear wheel drive.

http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/powertr…

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr…

brandondrums > brandondrums 08/09/2013 at 09:35

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For that matter you can also easily convert a WRX to rear wheel drive. It's the same process as the Legacy.

1: remove driveshaft
2: unbolt Center Differential
3: weld clutch plates together
4: Re-Assemble
5: The tricky part depends on your front axles, the outer spindle holds the wheel bearing and hub together so you cut the boot and pull the CV joint out of that housing. The inner spindle can be male or female. If it's male (spindle from axle goes into transmission) you'll need to also cut the boot and leave the CV joint housing in the transmission. If it's female (output shaft comes out from the transmission and axle fits around it) then you simply remove the axle.

All of this can be done in a matter of a weekend or less. Very easy stuff.

H4N5 GRU83R > Brewman15 08/09/2013 at 10:10

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Thank you for this morsel of information!

Hoccy > Brewman15 08/09/2013 at 12:17

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Nice info, I don't know much about what was sold in the US or not. I live in Volvo-country (Norway), so almost every possible model, trim level, colour and engine/transmission choices are found within an hour of driving. The prices are higher than in the US though.

I love those Turbo-wheels you've got there, I think they're the best stock Volvo-rims to put on a 240/740/940. You should really change the headlights though, I think the other kind was sold in the US as well.

H4N5 GRU83R > H4N5 GRU83R 08/17/2013 at 20:35

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Ive just sold my ghia to make room/funds for my wagon. Currently shopping for a Volvo 740 Turbo Wagon. If anyone has any leads on a clean one in the socal area please let me know.

NinetyQ > H4N5 GRU83R 08/27/2013 at 02:46

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I know you've said you have already made your decision, but don't pass up an old-school Quattro wagon as "not fun" just because more than the rear wheels are driven. A five-cylinder turbo with a 5-speed manual would change your mind in a hurry.

H4N5 GRU83R > NinetyQ 08/27/2013 at 02:53

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Agreed. Ive got a bit of a limited budget at the moment but eventually id like to experience a quattro uberwagen.

charlessnellings1 > H4N5 GRU83R 02/24/2014 at 22:59

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Great discussion as I was just looking online for this exact thing. It is damn depressing. I just did a total US search on Autotrader, cars.com and edmunds for manual RWD wagon. Only Volvo, Caddy and BMW come up as anything made in the last 30 years. Cars.com has some old Chevys. It seems the Infiniti FX manual conversion is limited to one guy who has put a lot of custom effort into making it work.

H4N5 GRU83R > charlessnellings1 02/25/2014 at 10:15

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I ended up getting a 91 740 turbo wagon. Everything except the manual. Did some research and apparently swapping in a T5 is not very difficult. The current automatic is in good shape and drives well, so not in a huge rush to do the swap. Maybe in a couple of years once I have everything else fixed.